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Talk:Armenian genocide denial

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massacres would incur enormous moral liability; tarnish the self-styled claim to national innocence, benevolence and self-reputation of the Turkish state and the Turkish people; and blemish the course of Turkish history. Apparently, this would also be tantamount to casting doubt on the credibility of the foundational axioms of Kemalism and the Turkish nation-state." This is already quoted in the footnotes, so I'm not sure why you think there is OR. Please feel free to propose a different word choice if you think there is another word that summarizes the sources better. (
1576:" While there is a citation at the end of that sentence, none of it discusses a founding "myth", and it would seem strange to use that term here in this type of context. False information, "foundational crime", "genocide denial" and similar concepts have a relation to the concept of a "founding myth", but they are not the same, and I am not able to find any sources that talk about genocide denial as part of the "founding myth" of Turkey or even explaining what that would mean. There are some sources that use the phrase in relation to old myths, such as 997: 460: 1593:. I also was not able to find the use of the phrase "founding myth" in the sources cited for those edits. I think it would be appropriate for Buidhe to revert their change until consensus is reached on the talk page, as per the additional Arbirtation Committee rules for editing the page, especially since its content the was added directly by them in the past. In any case, there needs to be support for the actual term "founding myth", or else this seems to be 610: 589: 253: 1315: 698: 1092: 514: 1071: 493: 451: 286: 1580:, and some more metaphorical use relating to the 2016 coup that I found. While Archives908 left no edit summary, Buidhe said in their edit summary that the use of the phrase was "entirely sourced". Could someone please point out where they are seeing the support for this in the sourcing? The material quoted in the current citation seems to clearly support the immediately preceding, currently unsourced sentence: 896: 872: 1500: 620: 388: 307: 223: 1405: 1181: 1160: 987: 966: 1870: 1277: 1249: 804: 783: 1533:“We are of the firm opinion, … that the single most important reason for this inability to accept culpability is the centrality of the Armenian massacres for the formation of the Turkish nation-state … any move toward acknowledging culpability will put the very foundations of the Turkish nation-state at risk ” 1584:
However, I am not seeing where the support for the use of the phrase "founding myth" comes from, or how that sentence adds anything useful to the preceding sentence, especially since it is not discussed or even used anywhere else in the article (which is also a problem because everything in the lead
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I'm convinced that the meaning of the addition is supported by the article and the cited sources. For example see Gürpınar 2013, p. 420. "...the official narrative on the Armenian massacres constituted one of the principal pillars of the regime of truth of the Turkish state. Culpability for these
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I think the material better summarized in the preceding sentence, but honestly this is not a big deal, and you wrote so much of the article and improved it a lot. I don't object to the content anymore, and I apologize for wasting your time. Thanks for the work you have done. –
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That was the reason for my edit - though I am happy to admit that I don't have detailed knowledge either of the genocide, nor its denial, nor the sources. It simply seemed a clearer summary of the 6 sources and I'm not wholly persuaded that I was wrong.
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in the 2nd paragraph of 'denialism in academia' a sentence includes '...none of the original signitories besides Justin Mcarthy...'. would that read better if 'besides' were replaced with 'except'?
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A common objection made by new arrivals is that the article presents Ottoman and Turkish claims in an unsympathetic light and that criticism of it is too extensive or violates Knowledge (XXG)'s
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is supposed to be repeated in the main body of the article as well). Indeed, Buidhe was actually the one to insert the phrase into the lead in January 2021
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There are numerous sources for Azerbaijan's denial of the genocide in this article (look in the "International relations" paragraph).
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One of the most important reasons for this denial is that the genocide enabled the establishment of a Turkish nation-state.
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I deleted that part because that's obviously not true, but that was reverted and I was told to start a discussion.
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There's no source for Azerbaijan, you're welcome to find one if it has actually denied it for a century?
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Knowledge (XXG):Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 January 4 § Deny the Armenain genocide
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as key enabling events. Only one of the 6 says that the 'key event status' is a primary
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ie a largely ethnically based state. They pretty consistently describe the genocide
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I said they haven't denied it for a whole century, not that they never denied it.
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In short, there are certain topics and fringe viewpoints we should not be giving
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What is with Pakistan? It is not mentioned at all; meanwhile the sister article
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policy. The sections of the policy that apply directly to this article are:
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It is the state that spends the most time and effort denying genocide. (
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lists it along Turkey and Azerbaijan from a position in 2021. ...
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Did you know ... that Turkish schoolchildren are taught that
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have recently restored the following sentence to the lead
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and instead, Armenians committed genocide against Turks?
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This article appeared on Knowledge (XXG)'s Main Page as
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to determine whether its use and function meets the
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Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject International relations
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