Talk:George Wallace - Knowledge (XXG)

2843:“I say then I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in any way the social and political equality of the white and black races, -- that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of Negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race.” 3355:

These sentences seem to conclude a passage on Mrs. Wallace's cancer so it seems page 309 would be the one to review but it also is not available. Pages 317-320 deal with the last stage of her illness with her passing away on page 320. Since the book is discussing her cancer on the given pages, I think Carter's book is indeed meant to be the source of the sentence we are questioning. However, since the dubious sentence gives the year 1961 and all of these pages deal with events occurring in 1967 and 1968, I wouldn't think seeing the unavailable pages would help. If something about Mrs. Wallace not being advised of her precancerous cells is actually in Carter's book, I think it's in other pages, possibly earlier in the book.

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Hitler and his cronies took over that party, they didn't bother to change the name, with the result that they have always been known by the name of that party, "nazi" being short for "national socialist" ("nationalsozialistische"). But that's merely a word. There was and is actually nothing socialist about Nazis. Much less is there anything left-wing about them. Hitler actually tried to change the name to Social Revolutionary Party, but his proposal was nixed.

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potentially misleading. If read quickly, it could give the impression that Wallace's attitudes gained the passage of civil rights legislation. It would even be pushing it to say that the legislation was a reaction to his stand against integration. I am therefore removing the reference to the legislation and replacing it with the things for which he is best remembered: the 1963 inaugural address and the Stand in the Schoolhouse Door.

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something, or suggest that it can be classified, in terms of its position on a scale between two extreme or opposite points" This means we have defined points. The political spectrum is the space between total freedom and no freedom. Wallace's views would not be towards the right of total freedom. There is no spectrum justification that works to define his believes as being of the "right".05:29, 30 October 2018 (UTC)

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and never got it back. Desegregation after that was always advanced by Northeastern *LIBERAL* Democrats, who were willing to lose the South and therefore their political supremacy in order to bring about racial equality. What did Republicans do? They picked up the racist vote and sold out Lincoln's ideals for a chance at political supremacy. Give yourselves a hand, boys.

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is messed up and unclear. The reference given is Carter 1995, but a. there is no bibliography and b. there is no "Carter 1995" in the notes, not that I can see. There is a Carter 1996, and a few references to it (but it's not cited in the first occurrence, very sloppy), but no 1995. There is a poorly cited Carter 1998, in note 36.

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I do not think that the Faustian line should be removed if the sourcing is good; the line is clearly given as an opinion, and if that opinion, which is highly relevant, is made by a respectable scholar in a respectable publication, it should stand. But there's the problem. The system of documentation

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I am taking out the sentence saying Wallace ""earned the title 'the most influential loser' in 20th century U.S. politics." It is not something that can be "earned;" it is a cheap shot when referring to someone who won a major office four times; it is merely the opinion of two people; and it does not

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I'm a bit confused about a section in this article. In the "Early life" section, it states "...he entered pilot cadet training in the United States Army Air Corps. He failed to complete the course, however, and as a staff sergeant flew B-29 combat missions over Japan in 1945." I am not any expert on

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Wallace was a Democrat, during the last days in which the Democratic Party still counted ultra-conservative white Southerners among their coalition. Shortly after his departure, Nixon's 'Southern Strategy' brought about the realignment that sorted all the conservatives into the GOP, and most of the

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The sourced pages from Dan Carter's book are given as 310-312 and 317-320. Page 311 and 312 are apparently unavailable on google while page 310 only has three pertinent sentences ending with Mrs. Wallace remarking that the doctors may have gotten rid of the cancer for now but that it would return.

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As a cancer patient myself, I find the following sentence troubling in several ways: "In 1961, in keeping with the custom of the time to shield patients from the emotional impact of discussion of cancer, Wallace had withheld information from her that a uterine biopsy had found possibly precancerous

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The article seems to say that Terry Branstad is the only person who served longer as a governor than Wallace's 16 years. But that doesn't seem to be true. George Clinton was governor of New York for 21 years (1777-1795 and 1801-1804). I'm not sure if there are others, but this ought to be checked

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One reason the Alabama Black community cannot and will not forgive Wallace is that they had very good indications when he was a young man and even in his years as a judge that he was not the bigot he turned out to be. He persecuted Blacks, not out of ignorance and hatred learned at his mother's knee

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It's not only speculation but there is good reason to believe that such a "change of heart" was not necessary. Wallace's early background and his close association with Big Jim Folsom seems to indicate a very moderate attitude on racial matters, for the time and place, and only opportunism and total

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The real problem here is that Democratic Party flip-flopped it’s viewpoint on race, being the party that spearheaded is eugenics in the early part of the 20th century. He was also very much a part of the Democratic Party, which is on the left of the political spectrum, and was also for segregation.

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It has some organization issues that affect the quality of the article. The section titled "Presidential Ambitions" for example, seems out of place for the flow of the article. There are other issues in organization as well that interupt the flow and make it hard to follow in places. (Early Life

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So according to you, desegregation was a Republican idea all along? It wasn't Truman who desegregated the military, it wasn't Johnson who passed the Civil Rights Act, oh no, none of that ever happened, did it (personal attack removed)? The GOP dropped racial equality from its platform around 1900

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He was a Democrat for his entire political career, except in 1968 when he was apart of the American Independent Party. After finishing his term as Governor of Alabama, he later revealed he supported George H.W Bush over his two Democratic opponents (1988,1992). However, he was a solid Democrat for

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A black lawyer recalls, "Judge George Wallace was the most liberal judge that I had ever practiced law in front of. He was the first judge in Alabama to call me 'Mister' in a courtroom." Later, when a supporter asked why he started using racist messages, Wallace replied, "You know, I tried to talk

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would need their support. Also, if "Republicans" were so much in favor of civil rights, explain this: At the time the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was passed, there were 11 Southern Republicans in Congress: 1 in the Senate, and 10 in the House. All eleven of them voted against the Civil Rights Act.

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He was a Southern Democrat or a Dixiecrat. He left the Democratic Party over race and civil rights, when he ran as a member of the American Independent Party in 1968. He briefly sought the Democratic nomination in 1972, but I guess that was because he realized the black people could vote, and he

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Oh, another question; where the FUCK was the pro-rugged individual, pro-personal freedom Republican Party at the time when the Nazis actually existed, and actually were a threat to mankind? Oh, that's right. Using every ounce of political power they had left to keep the country out of war, lest

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NOT SO AT ALL. The Nazis were neither socialist nor left-wing. Not by a long shot. The Nazi party was originally a small working-class party with a vaguely socialist agenda; that's why it was called the National Socialist German Workers Party (Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei). When

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What Wallace was in during WW II technically wasn't the U.S. Air Force, which didn't formally begin until 1947. He was in either the 'Army Air Corps' or the 'Army Air Force', which were certainly the predecessors to the USAF. Also, did he "enlist" or was he a commissioned officer (like most but

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No, Wallace was not a Dixiecrat. In fact, to the contrary, Wallace refused to walk out on the Democrats when Thurmond's delegation left the convention. Any such labellings are probably due to Wallace having similar goals and, indeed, leaving the Democrats later to run as a third-party candidate.

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Ah yes, the shameless GOP "everybody who disagrees with me is a NAZI! thing. Here's a question; if the Nazis were socialist, why the hell was private property both respected and encouraged (Mussolini called it "a right and a duty") in Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy? Why were all their economic

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Saw this was in the revisions. the sentence "far-right democrat" is not factual. This is blatant propaganda this "far-right" descriptor needs to be removed. This is a historical revision. Also it advances an inaccurate use of political spectrum. A spectrum, must be a spectrum, "used to classify

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Having been alive in 1961 and having had surgery in 1964, I find it impossible to believe a doctor would withhold critical information from an adult patient but would tell her husband unless there were very extenuating circumstances such as the final days of a terminal illness. This is a very

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The sentence, "He is remembered for his Southern populist and segregationist attitudes during the mid-20th century period of the Civil Rights Movement and activism, which gained passage of federal civil rights legislation in the mid-1960s to enforce constitutional rights for all citizens", is

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Trilobright's mythology of Nixon and the "southern strategy" does not sit well with the fact that apart from in 1976 when Carter won, carried by votes of Southern Democrats, Republicans got 426 or more electoral votes from 1972 until Clinton, who himself continued to win Southern states as a

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Google Books finds, for me, a preview of a relevant passage based on the ISBN I gave. The preview indicates that the book says (1) the uterine biopsy indicated the "definite" presence of cancer; (2) the doctor informed her of this "shortly after he received the lab report". The short passage

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The language had been changed in something I added to the lede ("....with unforgiven sin" to "...his sins unforgiven"). I just thought it was better to stick with the phrasing that's in the cited source, as the sincerity of Wallace's "change of heart" is such a contested issue. Anyway, I was

3628:"influential loser" No it is not "merely the opinion of two people." It represents analysis by leading scholars based on years of research. Knowledge (XXG) reports what the RS discover. The statement is not insulting -- it puts him in the ranks of William Jennings Bryan, Eugene Debs, etc. 2218:

I'd think it's also speculative that he ever truly believed he'd done anything wrong. His "turnaround" happened later in life after he'd lost close friends...and he could well have just been trying to tie up loose ends and improve his image as the end of life approached. You could say his

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that he did make formal, public declarations repudiating his earlier stances (and got a lot of black votes by doing so). So the word "ostensibly" has the effect of smearing him as a potential liar, when in fact, we cannot ascertain that without being able to read his mind or heart.

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found a WALLACE FOR PRESIDENT white foam bowler hat this weekend, not sure if a historian may want it...but i haven't been able to find anything else like it in any pictures or even on ebay... if its really THAt rare, i'd like to see it in hands that would like to have it. Brian

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went nutso after they gave it to him and tried to kill himself in the hospital. So maybe that's where Wallace's nerve damage come from? Can somebody find out? "Brain fever" is pretty vague. Lots of politicians who never heard a shot fired in anger seem to have that disease ;)

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The description of Wallace's portrait on the infobox dates the image to 1962, on Wikimedia it is undated. However looking at images of Wallace at the time as well as late images of him, it is clear the image was taken at a later date, likely as his gubernatorial portrait in 1971.

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Generally speaking, the most important criteria for a lede/infobox photo is high quality clearly showing the subject's face. For living subjects, it's usually preferable to use the most recent high-quality photo. For deceased subjects, there is a broader lattitude for that.

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It's Texas oil tycoon H.L. Hunt. He was a vocal opponent of the Democrats and certainly had the money and conservative/southern ties to fund such a campaign. Hunt and his son Bunker were visible supporters of Wallace in '68. I'll see if I can edit that into the paragraph.

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people - can you imagine? A problem that was compounded when Truman desegregated the military and the party slid slowly more and more towards racial liberalism. Which was when the Southern Democrats slowly started distancing themselves from liberalism and the New Deal

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do what follows, implies that Wallace was still a segregationist. Now I personally think that leopards don't change their spots; Wallace either was a racist until the day he died or he was a non-racist in 1960 who just wanted to get elected. But the point is, it is a

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You mean the picture of him standing in the doorway? I don't think you've got to be a right wing nazi to want to read the article, I found the fact that he renounced his previous views and his candid admission that he used racism as a means to election very moving.

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It certainly seems to be true (most of my family on my father's side lives in Alabama), but it is certainly a matter of perception and speculation, not of fact, and I would suggest that it should be removes unless someone come up with documented evidence very soon.

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While I highly doubt that Neo-Nazi, right-winger racist types who look up George Wallace biographies probably have no idea who I'm talking about (they probably write him off as a "faggy Brit", the pic at the top of the article looks like Morrissey. Just a thought.

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Fourth paragraph currently reads: "Wallace retracted the invitation, and chose Air Force General Curtis LeMay instead. LeMay was chairman of the board of an electronics company, and the company would dismiss him if he spent his time running for vice president;

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You can’t revise history. This edit needs to be removed as it is an obvious attempt at slandering today’s conservatives. You can say his views on segregation were hateful but they didn’t come from the political right. He was clearly on the political left.

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things pertaining to this, so I'm curious how Wallace flew combat missions when he did not complete his pilot cadet training? Was the cadet training for something else? Is there another explanation? I'm just writing this so the article can be clarified. --

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I’ve been noticing that there has been much discussion of which portrait should be used for George Wallace. Any chance we can come to some sort of agreement? I personally find the 1983 portrait to be ugly and the 1962 one to be nicer but that’s just me.

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Well, I guess someone didn't like "publicly renounced," even though that's at least what we KNOW happened. It got reverted back. I wonder why someone would possibly object to that? I don't think it's in dispute that he publicly renounced his former

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The segregationists *were* leftists throughout FDR's administration. And why shouldn't they be? The South benefited more than any other region from the New Deal. But then they found out that their hard-earned tax money was also going to (shudder)

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In the edit history of the page, some users have edited the infobox section to include incorrect dates of Wallace's last term as governor. The dates of Wallace's last term as governor was from January 17, 1983 until January 19, 1987. Please see the

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Was Wallace ever officially in the Dixiecrat Party of Strom Thurmond? From what I know, he was a Southern Democrat, but nothing really beyond that. If that's the case, there's really no point in listing his affiliation as 'Democratic (Dixiecrat)'.

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but racism is not a political ideology - today's Communist China and yesterday's Communist USSR were just as racist in their ethnic cleansing campaigns. I would say he was a segregationist Democrat, but otherwise on the normal political spectrum.

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Lincoln may have possibly changed his views somewhat, but nothing I've ever seen has indicated more than ambivalence on his part. His issue was that slavery was wrong, not discrimination and inequality before the law, as based on race.

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Gov. George Wallace's legacy will be forever tarnished. He along with Bull Connor, are true symbols of bigotry in U.S. History. The actions of racist like this man and others brought about the very change they fought so hard to avoid.

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He was not forgiven for his racist actions. He is still held in high contempt in the Black community. His actions as well as others during the civil rights movement will never be forgotten. A true symbol of bigotry in U.S. history.

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I am also taking out the statement that Wallace "sold his soul to the Devil." Would anyone allow that sentence to exist for other politicians like Hillary Clinton, Jeb Bush, John F. Kennedy, Chester A. Arthur or Abraham Lincoln?

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I practiced law in the South from 1982 to 2000. Once a judge got to know a lawyer, he called him by his first name. If a judge referred to a lawyer as "Mister," it indicated a begrudging acceptance of the status and nothng

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This seems to be to be entirely speculative -- it's not obvious that paralysis would lead to an understanding of racial oppression -- so unless anyone can justify it (e.g. with something Wallace said) I will remove it soon.

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page lists Wallace as only the 45th Governor of Alabama. If an Alabama Governor serves for multiple non-consecutive terms, as Wallace did, he is still considered to fill only one spot in the list of governors. For example,

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belong in the lead paragraph. People often use Knowledge (XXG) to insult those that cannot defend themselves, as a way to feel good about themselves, but applying 21st century standards to 1960's society is inappropriate.

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The article states in "Change of views before final term" that Emory Folmar would have been the first "Republican to be elected Alabama governor for the first time in the state's history" but this is contradicted by the

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Relying on personal experience won't help us much - I was born well after the 60's, but I can give you a much later anecdote from personal experience that has some similarities. Strange things happen sometimes.

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serious allegation being made against the doctor and George Wallace. Also, just how would someone find out about what amounts to a felony if true. I would like to hear some discussion about this matter.

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There's nothing in the article about this - just the similar standoff in June of that year. It looks like it should be mentioned but I don't know enough about the events to add to the article myself. --

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I am not, by any stretch of the imagination, an expert on Wallace, and I do not feel equipped to correct these issues per sé, but they do need to be addressed to improve the quality of the article.

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set up a million-dollar fund to reimburse him for any losses." (emphasis mine) - who or what is Hunt? This bit is quite confusing without that piece of information, could someone clarify it please?

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ticket), he was a loser. However his impact on American politics was enormous. he was given the appellation "the most influential loser" in 20th century U.S. politics, according to biographers....

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their sponsors in the business sector be forced to stop trading helium to Germany, or oil to Japan. Remind me again, who are the "traitors" who would sell America out for a second cup of coffee?

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You may very well be right - the book may be wrong, the book may not say that, the book may have been misinterpreted in good faith by the person or people writing this Knowledge (XXG) article. --

1206:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join 2840:

Anyone attempting to use Lincoln for a contrasting comparison to Wallace on views about race and segregation would be best be advised to look at the fourth Lincoln-Douglas debate of 9/18/1858.

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This statement is technically correct, as the electoral vote given to the Hospers/Nathan Ticket in 1972 was from a faithless elector, and originally pledged to vote for the Nixon/Agnew Ticket.

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Democrat. In fact it wasn't until Democrats nominated a Northerner (Gore) against a Southerner (Bush) that they lost the South. Also Nixon supported desegregation and even affirmative action.

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Biographies I've seen say that Wallace was a Methodist. See, e.g., Jeff Frederick, Stand Up for Alabama: George Wallace, at pp. 113, 355, 429 n.33 (Tuscaloosa: Univ. Alabama Press, 2007).

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Read an article called "Against Presentism" by Lynn Hunt. It makes excellent points, something that Knowledge (XXG) doesn't get a grasp of in its historical analysis of the page you shared.

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electoral college votes from any state”, pledged referring to the electoral college votes going to the winner of the state, which Wallace won 5 of the 50 states in 1968, those being:

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about good roads and good schools and all these things that have been part of my career, and nobody listened. And then I began talking about niggers, and they stomped the floor."

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section separate from the Wives and Children section? Maybe a unified personal life section would be better... )Also, some section titles have irregular capitalization. See

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Therefore, the statement is correct and "as of the 2020 Election, remains the most recent third-party candidate to receive pledged electoral college votes from any state.”

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The article has some serious referencing issues. Large sections of text, which make assertions of facts, are unreferenced as to where those facts come from. For example:

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Wallace was more than just a Democrat during his career. While a series of IP editors are edit warring over the first sentence of the article, the second sentence says, "

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What, no way, ask any historian what George Wallace is best remembered for, it's not the 1968 election. He is the most legit public figure bigot in U.S. modern-history.

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The Nazis were socialist and thus left wing. Nearly all segregationists were democrats and also advocated increased welfare and social programmes making them left wing.

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Good catch. Those were Reconstruction-era Republicans, when many former Confederates were disenfranchised, briefly breaking Democratic hold. I've corrected the article.

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This entry currently gives Wallace's religious affiliation (in a box under his photo) as follows: "Religion Born-again Christian (after 1964) / Baptist (before 1964)"

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Seriously? The latter part was sourced, the former part was easily sourceable. Considering that the tag was only placed there this month, this removal is unacceptable.

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He is best known for his Southern populist, pro-segregation attitudes during the American desegregation period, convictions he ostensibly renounced later in life.

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prior views, which leaves what he felt inside out of the equation. We have no way of knowing what his true feelings on race were at that later time, either way.

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certainly not all college-educated personnel were)? His rank would be a nice detail – and if he were actually a pilot, then he was almost certainly an officer.

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Far right is a commonly used term to describe politicians and others who profess views such as ""segregation now, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever."

3332:) in these discussions, and specifically says the doctor told Mrs Wallace directly. I'll add some appropriate tags to the disputed sentence in the article. -- 2814:) 21:35, 26 June 2008 (UTC) Amen to the above post. So he is was racist? Who cares! I dont. I like him, but, I guess that makes me a bigot. Keep it neutral. 4810: 4695: 1530: 1296: 4935: 4840: 1597: 1577: 210:. Feel free to try to improve the article, but don't take it personally if your changes are reversed; instead, come here to the talk page to discuss them. 1733: 4835: 4825: 4780: 2659: 1520: 4680: 2351: 2170:

It was perhaps because of the constant pain from his injuries that Wallace realized the harm his racist rhetoric and views had caused African Americans.

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reforms in favor of the business sector (abolishing unions, requiring workers to get the consent of their previous employer before finding a new job)?

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Bill Cosby was talking about BLACK COMEDIAN GEORGE WALLACE. Not WHITE FORMER GOVERNER OF ALABAMA GEORGE WALLACE. Sheesh, the internet is dumb.

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After Wallace was shot, was he completely paralyzed, or paralyzed from the waist down, or what? The article should be more clear on this. --

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Agreeing that this one appears to be higher quality. There is something about the mouth on the other option that makes it look weird.

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Now I'm no George Wallace fan--the man was a complete demagogue, in my opinion. But this sentence is a bit POV, I believe. Why? To

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but out of sheer opportunism. He knew better. That made him worse, in the opinion of many, than mad-dog imbeciles like Lester Maddox.

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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

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because the "black lawyer" quote is unsourced, and the "good roads" quote is not found anywhere on the page linked in the citation.

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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions.

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at the time. There may be suggestions below for improving the article. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be

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The Brown v. Board article given as a reference is incorrectly linked, at least for accessing it today. A correct link would be

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After you spewed all that vitriol, I have to ask: you do know that Wallace, whom this web page concerns, was a Democrat, right?

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I mixed up what the original wording was. The latest edit is still there, so I didn't change anything, big or small. Carry on.

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Under Governor Wallace's picture on the top-right side of the page, it should say, "47th, 50th and 52nd Governor of Alabama"

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https://web.archive.org/web/20080423030934/http://www.al.com/specialreport/huntsvilletimes/index.ssf?separateagain%2Fsa4.html

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Governor), the list numbers Governors by individual (only) even though a governor may have served non-consecutive terms.

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Towards the bottom, it says "This page uses Creative Commons Licensed content from Knowledge (XXG) (view authors)." --

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The article in question does not substantiate the facts stated in any useful way, hence I have not amended the link.

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comparing the edits, and now it looks like the original phrasing is back (good) but what else did I do (bad)? Ugh.

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Fellas, the first picture on the information listing for Knowledge (XXG) is George Wallace, Jr. Not the Governor.

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https://web.archive.org/web/20110718093952/http://dspace.wrlc.org/doc/bitstream/2041/52940/b19f19-1026zdisplay.pdf

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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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What is this "brain fever" the article talks about? It sounds like he had malaria. Maybe he was treated with

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Having no way of knowing what his true feelings on race were, we must defer to what the reliable sources say.

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good point. Carter, Politics of Rage, p 137 quotes Wallace on national TV calling himself a Methodist in 1963.

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Far right is not the same as a normal conservative, and the democratic party has not always been left wing.

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as the 21st and 23rd governors of Alabama, both republicans, can some one please clarify this discrepancy?--

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The "our troops" suggest that this is possibly a direct citation from somewhere, but it is not clear where.

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Can anyone clarify what basis there might be for identifying Wallace as a Baptist rather than Methodist?

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they deleted the original Option B Image which was higher quality and not the one mentioned at the moment

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Fair use problems with the image "Wallace button.gif", which does not have an adequate Fair Use Rationale.

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Erm... Southern Democrats, or Dixiecrats, were Democrats purely because Abraham Lincoln was a Republican.

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also served non-consecutive terms as Governor but is still only considered the 42nd Governor of Alabama.

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