2511:, Japanese ゴミ箱, also used in Hong Kong sometimes) is the collection of nominal factoids, whether trivial or significant, which populate the parenthesised portion following the noun phrase, or sequence of alternative noun phrases identifying the topic of the article . There is a very long tradition of starting an article on a person with their name followed by parenthesised dates, but this has plainly got out of hand, and I recall reading at least one WP:essay on this. Search engines typically produce a "summary" for identifying a topic, by removing all parenthesised bits from the WP:lead, sometimes with disastrous results. So apart from the dates, all of this information is best presented not in linear text form, and the obvious existing place to put it is the infobox. Precisely because information in tabular form is easily scanned, people who are not interested in pronunciation (for example) can easily ignore it.
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1799:(XXG) article where it is given with the spelling "Judeophobia) to "anti-Semitism/antisemitism", and I think it in all respects more suitable. He writes, "as regards anti-Semitism I seek to limit use of this word to its strict late-nineteenth-century sense, when indeed the word was coined by Jew-haters to give a respectable, quasi-scientific cover to their reformulation of traditional Judaeophobia as a political movement dedicated to rescinding the civil rights that Jews had received..." –
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german speaking majority at the time (so called
Jihlava language island), so he felt as an intruder almost only because of his jewish origin as in the whole world. Bohemia didn't very contribute to it (it was the first country in the world who acknowledged Jew nationality in the census, the situation of Jews was always above average compare to the rest of Europe). On the contrary in Vienna was a strong antisemitism and he was seen as a some czech Jew here, so twice intruder.
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including
Akkadian, Arabic, Aramaic, Ethiopic, Hebrew, and Phoenician, the spelling anti-Semite falsely implies prejudice against all of the diverse groups of people who speak any of these languages. However, that is not how antisemite is used. Rather, the “Semite” in antisemitism is a euphemism for “Jew,” meant to lend a scientific air to the racial grouping of all Jewish peoples based on an outdated pseudoscience of race
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unpopular Jewish minority within the
Austrian one. Throughout his life, he felt a sense of exile. He once said: 'I am thrice homeless, as a native of Bohemia in Austria, as an Austrian amongst Germans, as a Jew throughout the world. Always an intruder, never welcomed.'" I think the relevant section of the article accurately and succinctly represents the source.
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The original quote is "I am thrice homeless, as a native of
Bohemia in Austria, as an Austrian among Germans, and as a Jew throughout the world. Everywhere an intruder, never welcomed." I think the text using the part of the quote is changing the meaning of his words. He lived in Jihlava, where was a
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The closed and lowercase spelling antisemitism is now the preferred form. Jewish groups have long preferred the single word spelling, and many style guides, including those of major publications, have also adopted it. While
Semitic is a current linguistic term for a subfamily of Afroasiatic languages
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A waste of time and space. You can't put anything useful in an info-box for a composer. You could put conducting posts held by Mahler, but that's not what he's famous for now. You could say he wrote symphonies and songs but that's not helpful to the reader. The majority of composer FAs don't have an
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to point out that the hyphenated and capitalised form is prescribed by the only other two dictionaries on my shelves: the
Bloomsbury and Chambers. A distinguished Jewish musical scholar with whom I have had the privilege of working prefers the term "Judaeophobia" (capitalised as in our own Knowledge
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Everybody is allowed an opinion which should be considered equally with others (even if they are opposed to your views...) Or if they have history. Respect is the word! I will respect the consensus here after a decent respectful debate. Other people may want an infobox. We are however at an impasse
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I think you might not think so if you knew what G. Arendt has put those who disagree with her through over the years on this point. Cautioned for bullying by the
Knowledge (XXG) authorities and nearly barred. She always promises not to intervene in discussions about i-boxes and then invariably does
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We are dropping the hyphen and lowercasing the S, which is now the style of The
Associated Press and is preferred by many academics and other experts. Those who favor antisemitism argue that the hyphenated form, with the uppercase S, may inadvertently lend credence to the discredited notion of Jews
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composers' signatures. I just fished out a couple of cherished scores: "Beethoven, Sonaten-Album" pub. Bosworth & Co. Leipzig early 20C, with the composer's signature under the growling portrait, and "Valses Nobles & Sentimentale" pub. Durand, with
Maurice Ravel's signature in an otherwise
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Quite so, and to repeat a point made previously with regard to Shmuel Almog's objection that there is no noun "Semitism", there certainly is an adjective "Semitic". Moreover, in rendering the attitude of
Judaeophobes as a hyphenated and capitalised "anti-Semitism", the Oxford English Dictionary is
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if it was shorter. It also seems to "sum up" his achievements as a composer best. If "compositions" looks too neutral (but I like it exactly for being neutral and not an editor's choice of favourites), we could be more specific and name groups of works (symphonies, song cycles) or even individual
2165:. I am not against mentioning other key facts from his life, such as occupations and organizations; "conductor" and "director of the Vienna Hofoper" for example should show in parameter-value pairs where readers may expect them and search, and not in the image caption. Iadmc: very few people are
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I note the old discussions about an infobox from 2012 and before. However things have changed at Knowledge (XXG) and the old editors have moved on. Is it time we had a debate about adding an infobox? The usual way is to get consensus one way or the other, now, on the talk page rather than simply
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I really think you guys are out of step with the modern Knowledge (XXG). Infoboxes, when used well, are now part of the culture. I'll hang around a while to see if others turn up to voice an opinion. Btw, writing someone off just because "we are all very, very aware of" their views is bad form.
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The source says: "Bohemia was then part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire; Mahler's native tongue was German, and he ranked as an Austrian subject of Jewish descent. He was thus from the beginning affected by racial tensions: he belonged to an unpopular Austrian minority among Bohemians, and to an
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This is pedantic pettifoggery. The words antisemitism, antisemite and antisemitic quite clearly relate to the same phenomenon, share the same etymology, and are covered by the same multiple discussions - both on Knowledge (XXG) and in the world. To suggest that we need separate discussions and
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Edit warring without discussion is pointlessly aggressive. Trying to explain to someone that different spellings are used by different countries or groups isn’t aggressive. Even after you were asked to stop edit warring and discuss, you continued reverting. Even after you were told of the edit
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Pointlessly aggressive? This from an editor who has been persistently edit warring! Please! Passive aggression, anyone? And if you deign to read the article, FreeStateCosmos, you will see that "anti-Semitism" (or antisemitism) is not mentioned. The phrase in question is "anti-Semitic" and the
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One of those discussions ended with no consensus, and the other is another discussion to do only with the title of the article on the topic. Conversely, your arguments seem to be in favour of preferring one over the other across Knowledge (XXG) - this simply isn't the venue for that kind of
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I also agree. FreeStateCosmos prays in aid an article that asserts that there is no such word as Semitism, which is doubtless true, but there undeniably is a word "Semitic", and the phrase under consideration here is "anti-Semitic". One of our leading authorities in Knowledge (XXG) is
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of the many lengthy discussions I mention (and there are several others), which I think clearly show a strong consensus in favour of use of the unhyphenated form. I would add that, since these discussions, many other bodies have changed their usage to drop the hyphen - notably
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I have never seen any rational reason given for removing an infobox. I know that there are people, who it is not necessary to name, who have a passionate hatred of them, apparently based on personal taste. But I do know a rational reason to include an infobox: the dustbin
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We changed our style in 2021 to antisemitism, not anti-Semitism. The past style was based on common usage. But some say that could give credence to the idea that Jews are a separate race. A growing number of Jewish organizations and others have moved to the style
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But the term Semitic refers to a group of languages. It was the 19th century Jew hater Willhelm Marr who established the use of the term as a signifier for Jews (most of whom actually spoke the European language Yiddish rather than the Semitic Hebrew).
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Again, so? WP is written in many varieties of English, and this article in British English used the spelling of the OED. If you could respond in sentences, rather than pointless URLs, it may improve the standard of discourse somewhat. -
1099:, rather than edit war, you need to discuss the matter here and explain why this article—written in British English—should ignore the spelling supported by the OED? Please discuss here, rather than continue to edit war. Thank you -
2189:. Technical suggestions: Vienna - as a current capital - needs no link, and the repetition of his name in the works parameter is not needed. - I wrote this far in reply to Tim riley, but to you as well, Iadmc. --
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This is pointlessly aggressive. Please do click the URLs, and read the compelling arguments for using "antisemitism". That's all I can say. I had no idea this minor edit would lead to so much hostility.
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There is a case for the signatures that artists use on their works being included, but none for composers. If you are interested in seeing them, fine, but (this may seem a shocking suggestion)
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I STRONGLY agree that an infobox is warranted. Basically every other category in WP uses them, and the arguments for why this tiny corner is somehow different are unpersuasive in the extreme.
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Happily, the preceding editor's failure to point to a consensus is of no matter as the word to which s/he objects does not appear in the article, as has been pointed out several times. –
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Has there been a consensus established to prefer one over the other across Knowledge (XXG), or was the consensus you referenced solely to do with the title of the article on the topic?
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reverts on this article. Do you think your editing career is going to last long if you continue to ignore the norms of behaviour, particularly after thy have been pointed out to you? -
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OED uses anti-Semitism too. Given the article is in BrEng, it seems sensible to keep to the spelling of that. Either way, that user has broken 3RR and been reported. -
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It is what was agree to by the composer group, assuming there is consensus at the talk page. I'm feeling no love for infoboxs here though so I'll probably move on —
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While researching this, I came across an apparently relevant book "Seeing Mahler: Music and the Language of Antisemitism in Fin-de-Siècle Vienna" by K.M. Knittel
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The problem with that is that it doesn't do what an info-box is intended to do: to sum up the main points of the article. It even (bizarrely) takes the reader
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The rest of the world is finally catching up with the usage by academics and activists involved in this field, and Knowledge (XXG) should not lag behind.
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This is incorrect. JVL, like most activists and scholars actually involved with this subject, uses the unhyphenated form. See, for instance, the
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text only cover: his Slonimsky rating is "great French", but surely his Adjective would be "meticulous" and that shines through his signature.
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Yes, as has been discussed above, just because some sources have changed their spelling does not mean everyone has or that everyone has to. -
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I'm sure you aren't, but there those who do, emphatically and brooking no opposition. By all means look in at the Schumann PR and also the
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The word anti-Semitism/antisemitism does not appear in the article. You two were going back and forth about anti-Semitic/antisemitic.
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There have been so many discussions about this, that I can't find the specific one in which I participated. But for example, see
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at the moment and need new blood. I have asked over at the composers group and will ask at WP classical music and WP musicians —
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As you can see it is simply the image with some biographical info added in. It won't damage the FA status as far as I can tell —
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I didn't say we need separate discussions, I simply answered your question. I would like to see an answer to mine though.
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True that few are only composers but most are primarily composers or at least known as such. I see your point though —
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consensuses for each of these words is so mind-boggingly ridiculous that I refuse to give it serious consideration.
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Just a personal note to Tim Riley: no, I really don't need evidence that either Ludwig or Maurice could write.
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Just checking: can you actually read? The word "antisemitism" is not used, as you have repeatedly been told.
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warring report, you continued reverting. If that isn’t pointlessly aggressive, then I don’t know what is. -
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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Ooh. Worked on Stravinsky some years ago... Will pop in. I have commented on the PR at Schumann, too —
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is the place to talk about technical and editorial issues and exchange ideas. New members are welcome!
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And? Just because some sources spell it differently, it doesn't mean all uses have to follow suit. -
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or often actually failing to identify the actual topic because of confusion between topics and names
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I'm asking for opinions and yours is noted. Thanks. Others' opinions may differ. It is telling that
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there is a consensus on this issue; could you please link to where that consensus was achieved?
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for writing and maintaining articles. To participate, you can edit this article or visit the
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I'm not insisting on anything. Merely opening discussions as required by Knowledge (XXG) —
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Which word does not appear in the article? Are we taking part in the same discussion?
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Don't let's do this. You will (eventually) discover that nothing much has changed.
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from the article to another article altogether. Not helpful to the poor reader!
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has an info box, though, along with a large number of other composer articles. —
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shoot the idea out of the water as one editor did in 2020. Thoughts welcome —
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The composer infobox would be used which is minimal. Here's what I propose:
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1519:. Other outlets which have adopted this usage in recent years include the
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Articles created or improved during WikiProject Europe's 10,000 Challenge
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Would you STRONGLY say what you would put in an info-box for a composer?
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https://www.holocaustremembrance.com/antisemitism/spelling-antisemitism
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https://www.holocaustremembrance.com/antisemitism/spelling-antisemitism
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There seems to have been a bit of a too-and-fro over this recently.
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https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/anti-semitism-or-antisemitism
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argument that there is no such word as Semitism is irrelevant.
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please
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Just an observation: you didn't remove the infobox, but you
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Facts from this article were featured on Knowledge (XXG)'s
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A personal taste reason for composer infoboxes is that I
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After much searching through archives, I have found two
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There are currently 5 "anti-Semitic"s in the article.
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2037:18 May 1911
2019:7 July 1860
2005:Moritz Nähr
351:Peer review
332:Peer review
148:free images
31:not a forum
2605:Categories
2508:/ˈdʌstbɪn/
2495:problem...
2465:changed it
1775:Nikkimaria
1714:Nikkimaria
1616:Nikkimaria
1514:style book
1492:Nikkimaria
1023:guidelines
397:column on
264:identified
2425:Tim riley
2396:Tim riley
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2256:Tim riley
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1962:Tim riley
1877:Tim riley
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1660:Tim riley
1486:You have
1444:Tim riley
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1212:Tim riley
645:Composers
615:Composers
557:Biography
502:Musicians
497:Biography
466:is rated
387:Main Page
88:if needed
71:Be polite
21:talk page
2338:PianoDan
1794:. It is
1392:SchroCat
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1172:SchroCat
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468:FA-class
375:Promoted
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186:Archives
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2586:Johnbod
2568:Forlane
2521:Samples
2500:dustbin
2157:works (
2023:Kaliště
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768:Austria
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389:in the
315:Process
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2040:Vienna
1936:Mozart
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421:, and
318:Result
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169:JSTOR
130:books
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