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707:) doesn't mention anything at all about being "racial nationalist". It merely says, in passing, this is a far-left nationalist party. This is not the same as "black nationalist" or "racial nationalist" or "fascist". This source is not about the EFF's ideology, and should not be abused to support an unrelated point in this way. It's also pretty funny that this source is from almost literally the opposite side of the globe of the issue it is covering, but since it was presumably a wire story I guess it doesn't matter for its reliability.
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sense for this party to have "black supremacism" listed under its ideology, just to keep the style consistent. This is another clear example of
Knowledge's editors racial bias. Purporting a black liberation movement as being "anti white racists". Admin "Drmies" is one of the racists forwarding white supremacy over Knowledge.
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money lending by the
Vatican. Strasserism also preached all human beings were equal. If they could integrate. But strasserism is by some reason considered far-right. Even thou it's clearly were socialist in its aims and goals. The only reason he is not considered at the same spectrum as Malema is because he is an European.
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This is not worth addressing as a personal matter, but since a claim is made on the talk page I'll address it, briefly: the IP editor has been edit-warring over content is clearly verified, and it's been pointed out to them that they should discuss the sourcing on the talk page. They haven't done so,
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1) The source on which the edits were based was "Genocide Watch", an advocacy group which among other things claims there is a genocide against whites going on in South Africa. While controversial sources in themselves might be useful if used in a balanced way (such as citing them alongside otherwise
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discussing what the sources here say. So that they make rather disgusting personal attacks is not very surprising: they're pissed at being prevented from disrupting the article, and thus have to resort to this childish behavior. The IP editor has probably not noticed that another disruptor, from the
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Antisemitism is very similar in its core to the ideas of
Strasserism. Which promoted an anti-capitalist, anti-imperialism jew sceptical ideology. Mainly due to the Jews overrepresentation in banks and idea of making more room for more germans. Because of the policies that restricted Christians from
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I agree with the other users that it is not really appropriate for the infobox. Mainly, "anti-white racism" isn't exactly an ideology, and isn't described as such in the cited sources. Since it is a new addition and is contested (with only one user I see supporting inclusion), it should be excluded
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I rarely see "racism" of any kind listed under the "ideology" heading of any political party on its wikipedia page. Even obviously racist parties such as an explicitly neo-Nazi party or something. Generally such parties have "white supremacism" listed under their ideology section. So it would make
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Two things. First, from what I can tell that is not the reason why the EFF's critics accuse the party of being "racist". I will let you read the article/relevant section to see what and why the party's critics make that allegation. The second is that
Knowledge simply reflects and distills what is
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page? The idea that somehow the EFF is the only political organisation with a page on
Knowledge that mentions its racism in the ideology section, is just patently inaccurate. 4.) Julius Malema himself has been convicted three times for hate speech alone. Why do you consider it an "allegation" of
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This article is grotesquely lacking in information. The likely reasons behind this seem to be related to the above criticism from
Pseudonym. There is no positive information about the party whatsoever -- meaning nothing affirmative. What is the party's platform? What are its stated aims? There's
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I've removed anti-white racism as ideology, since none of the sources stated support such claim. EFF does not porpose it's ideology as being such and there are no reports that sustain any type of systematic violence against whites being practiced or endorsed by the party. Henrique
Mirenda
544:, which would probably self-identify as white supremacist, whereas allegations the EFF is black supremacist would be rejected by the party. It is inconsistent and, less academically, "a bad look" that only a majority-black group gets this formal description (without even an "alleged").
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Should this really be in the wiki page at all? Especially under anti-black racism when it is from a relatively minor figure about something that may not even be motivated by racism (and if the person in question is Black, and I'm pretty sure they are, I think that is the case)?
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So the incident described there doesn't really seem like the EFF has Anti-Black racism as a part of its movement or philosophy. Rather, a relatively minor figure within the party impersonated someone else i assume to make it look like White people are racist.
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commonly understood to be fact, it is not the arbiter of fact. If you want to challenge the accusations of racism against the EFF then this is not really the best place to do it given the range, volume and quality of source material making that allegation.--
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Let's make a few things clear: 1.) We don't make a judgement of what takes place on this article, by what takes place on a different article, that's not how
Knowledge works. But if you believe that racism should be included in the ideological section of the
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At any rate, if it shows there have been instances of it within the party (i.e. 1 Black person who happened to be a member of the EFF) does not reflect actual EFF policy, especially if it is not sustained. This therefore, shouldn't be included.
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2) Even beyond its clear POV slant, the tone of the edits was totally unencyclopedic (e.g. "Malema ... has a red beret with the inscription on it which he doesn't know how to wear properly", etc.). The POV pushing wasn't particularly subtle;
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I'm no fan of Malema or the EFF, and I think the many criticisms of them should be included in this article, but it should abide by NPOV. And it should be in a "Criticisms" section, not take up the whole article, as it briefly
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Personally I think
Strasser was a left-winger like Malema. I have no problem labouring EFF left-wing many left-wing movements have had racial motives. I just have a problem with people like Strasser being labelled far-right.
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Community consensus has seemingly determined that it's worth mentioning some instances of racism by the EFF on the page. It's referenced by a number of sources, therefore I see no particular reason to remove it.
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slanted and/or balanced sources where the controversies are part of the article's subject matter), presenting information from such a source as undisputed fact, as 105.236.86.22's did, is a clear violation of
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There are more recent reports detailing not just opinion, but political insight into the EFF's ideology as both 'racialist' and 'nationalist' from the leading governmental party the ANC here
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ended up making personal attacks also--and that I blocked that editor. So I guess that editor could have claimed, just as validly, that I am "forwarding" Black supremacy over
Knowledge.
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deeceevoice(talk) If you think the article lacks something,simply ad it.Clearly the editor thinks it's well constructed but if you have a differing opinion,add it.It's that simple🤔
700:, but certainly not in the lede. There would have to be some specific reason to include this weakly-sourced opinion, and this reason should be connected to a more reliable source.
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I think an RfC on the tag of 'anti-white' is maybe needed, but if this article is that contentious, editing sanctions might be an idea as well, if they're not in place already.—
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Malema himself has been convicted for anti-White and anti-Indian racism and many commentators have described him as a racist. Perhaps you'll explain why we should ignore these
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It would be worth mentioning it somwhere, but the heading anti-black racism implies that this is a part of the EFF's movement, and this incident doesn't exactly show that.
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Someone recently reinstated "anti-white racism" in the infobox after it had been removed. The citations are simply opinions from opposing parties, and are not NPOV.
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The Huffington Post article is from their "blog" which undergoes very little editorial oversight or fact-checking, making it unreliable as a source. This
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3) Most of the information added was about the various controversies surrounding Julius Malema, a subject already covered in a more neutral way in his
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say. 3.) I'm not sure I buy the 'bigotry is not ideology' argument in the slightest, why do you complain about racism in the ideology section on
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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paints a slightly different picture, but "why is there nothing"--well, why didn't you put it in there if it's so important to you?
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and put it in. 2.) It is not legitimate to make changes based upon your opinion of "a bad look", we go by what the
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Why is there nothing about the tendency of their elected officials to dress as maids or laborers in Parliament?
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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Being opposed to whites owning 80% of land and 70% of farms in a black majority country is not racist.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Economic_Freedom_Fighters&diff=857353833&oldid=857353425
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found reference to prove the change, also clarifies the current status of the previous spokesperson.--
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and doesn't mention the EFF, nor would one opinion article be sufficient for such a claim anyway.
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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between
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recently added a lot of material to this article, which I have removed for the following reasons:
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https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=User_talk:Notfrompedro&diff=prev&oldid=1033587098
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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
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This article is by far the most consistently vandalized one on this site and a NPOV violation.
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The party is fascist or racial nationalist its been well sourced. somebody has wrongly Revert
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833:" party I wonder if it is not now time to list it as such in the infobox and introduction? --
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https://www.sapeople.com/2018/06/06/anc-calls-out-the-blatant-racist-nationalism-of-the-eff/
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The spokesperson(s) needs to change from Vuyani Pambo to Sinawo Thambo (and Lee-Ann Mthys)
439:"anti-white racism" under the ideology section would make more sense as "black supremacism"
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Can you explain how you make such a claim given the sources that are listed to support it?
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I disagree, I think it just shows that there has been instances of it within the party.
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https://www.politicsweb.co.za/opinion/anc-rejects-effs-racist-nationalism--jessie-duarte
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and they're still not doing it: talking about what other articles have makes sense only
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https://web.archive.org/web/20130812200344/http://effighters.org.za/structure/officials/
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virtually nothing of substance to the piece -- just a few names and then criticisms.
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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
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The ideology section of this article is an absolute mess and should be reworked
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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the
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the party is well known to have racial hate against white people and Indians.
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The info box is broken and I have no idea why, it looks okay in the code.--
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Given the large number and wide range of sources describing the EFF as a "
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and also a stern review by Dawood of the Centre for Unity and Diversity
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Read the sources before making statements like this, also engaging in
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https://web.archive.org/web/20140918100051/http://effighters.org.za/
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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There are more telling sources coming out in support of
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Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment
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The sources used for these claims are far too weak.
200:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
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298:Opinion articles being promoted as fact
880:2600:1702:130:2230:D846:78DC:B87A:5150
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858:what is your opinion on this?--
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18:Talk:Economic Freedom Fighters
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1138:I forgot to reply, apologies.
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655:fascist or racial nationalist
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703:The Alaska Dispatch source (
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577:Afrikaner Weerstandsbeweging
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1103:22:37, 3 January 2023 (UTC)
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944:to reactivate your request.
932:has been answered. Set the
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217:(last update: 5 June 2024)
137:Hello fellow Wikipedians,
930:Economic Freedom Fighters
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805:01:33, 14 July 2020 (UTC)
705:live link for convenience
178:http://effighters.org.za/
142:Economic Freedom Fighters
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259:Exceedingly weak article
128:19:38, 10 May 2014 (UTC)
575:but not anglophobia on
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42:of past discussions.
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546:Zellfire999
269:deeceevoice
36:This is an
934:|answered=
815:MrPreamble
518:this range
284:Queen mash
267:Typical.
249:Report bug
971:Not done:
563:page, be
328:sources?
232:this tool
225:this tool
61:Archive 1
1060:}} me!)
1015:Ideology
849:Grayfell
823:contribs
811:unsigned
793:unsigned
750:unsigned
727:unsigned
709:Grayfell
641:PrimeBOT
525:itsJamie
470:against
448:unsigned
406:AnonMoos
363:unsigned
326:reliable
306:unsigned
238:Cheers.—
1144:Genabab
1109:Genabab
1079:Genabab
1035:FF toho
1001:Discott
896:Discott
860:Discott
835:Discott
831:fascist
696:of the
146:my edit
120:Inayity
82:WP:NPOV
39:archive
1123:Alssa1
1095:Alssa1
590:Alssa1
504:Drmies
476:Alssa1
472:Drmies
425:Drmies
419:Well,
383:Alssa1
330:Alssa1
1056:) ({{
997:Done:
938:|ans=
924:This
775:point
690:might
491:after
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1148:talk
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1083:talk
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864:talk
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619:and
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565:bold
550:talk
523:OhNo
508:talk
480:talk
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371:talk
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314:talk
288:talk
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97:did.
936:or
928:to
639:by
581:NDP
573:EFF
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206:RfC
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214:}}
210:{{
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99:—
84:;
50:.
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