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Talk:Jordanian annexation of the West Bank

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recognizes something, it says so expressly. As a matter of U.S. domestic law, the Supreme Court has held that “the power to recognize foreign states and governments and their territorial bounds is exclusive to the Presidency.” Zivotofsky v. Kerry, 135 S. Ct. 2076, 2094 (2015). (For example, when the USA legally recognized Israeli annexation of the Golan Heights in 2019, it did so by Presidential Proclamation (9852). Both Trump and Biden said so officially. Not some minor diplomat.) If you can find me a single official statement by then-President Truman or his office or any other White House that unambiguously says the US legally recognized Jordanian annexation of the West Bank, show it. You can't. It didn't happen. And dozens of pro-Israeli and pro-Palestinian sources expressly say it didn't happen. See, e.g.,
1846:– More than a renaming, I propose an expansion of the scope of this article. It was previously named "Jordanian occupation of the West Bank", which didn't make sense since the occupation lasted 1948-1950, but the entirety of Jordanian presence lasted 1948-1967, so it was renamed "Jordanian annexation of the West Bank". However, this also doesn't really make sense, as it limited the scope of the article to the 1950 annexation act. So, instead of creating a new article dealing with the scope of the Jordanian 1948-1967 presence, why not just rename this article to "Jordanian rule of the West Bank", where the 1950 act of annexation would have a dedicated and detailed section. It should be noted that this would prove a controversial renaming/repurposing, as it would lent arguments to rename 2218:
League made two decisions regarding the annexation, and the sentence is a fair summary of the second one. (3) The USA informed Jordan through diplomatic channels that it did not usually give formal recognition to border changes but the annexation met its approval. This is documented in both primary and secondary sources. (4) "more than 600,000 of them (about 1/4 of the Palestinians in Jordan) rendered stateless with no citizenship and no rights"--two problems. The source this comes from does not say they were
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stateless. This 600,000 refers to the Palestinian refugees from the Gaza Strip who were not given citizenship when the West Bank was annexed. Also the source says "rights of citizenship" not "rights". That part of the article needs revision from better sources. (x) "legal or illegal" in another place
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4) The official UN source shows Israel objected to Jordan's admission in 1955. When a contemporary official source says something, it doesn't matter how many uninformed commentators claim the fact didn't happen. There is no source of credibility equal to the contemporary United Nations account as to
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can you elaborate? The citizenship and state book is reliable and I think this is an important aspect that should be elaborated on as annexations usually involve a degree of animosity and discrimination between the occupied population and the occupying state, which isn’t applicable here between two
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2) The USA never officially legally recognized Jordan's annexation of the West Bank. That one minor diplomat said the de facto status quo was "accepted" while expressly denying the USA gave official legal recognition to it does not make an official legal recognition. When the USA officially legally
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1) In fact, as the sources clearly show, King Abdullah carefully invited selected leaders that he knew would endorse him and Jordanian rule. The Conference result was pre-ordained. When an authoritarian monarch who occupies your land invites a selected group of local leaders to endorse him, that is
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I haven't spent time on that part. If there are irrelevant sources, remove them. The citizenship and state book is fine. If you can find a book of Plascov called "The Palestinian Refugees in Jordan 1948-1957" it has a lot more detail and you can find there that the situation was a bit more complex
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included in its close "Although I do not agree that the no-consensus outcome of a requested move discussion in April 2020 should affect our word choices, editors do prefer "annexation" over both "occupation" and "rule"." Nothing has changed since then. There is already a location for the items nom
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2) In fact, as the sources clearly show by their own records, The Arab League censured Jordan for its "illegal and void annexation" and decided to treat Jordan's status in the West Bank (including East Jerusalem) as no more than that of a "trustee" pending a future settlement. The trusteeship was
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I'm away from home and won't have time to do much for a few days. Most of these things are not my text but were restored by me after they were removed without adequate explanation. Anyway... (1) More on the Jericho conference, including the various views about it, could be included. (2) The Arab
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I have went through the book. Aside from discrimination in the development policy towards the two banks, which does not specify if it had indeed been a major component of that period since the book only concerns itself with 1948-1957, the conclusions agree with the citizenship and state book in
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says country names generally shouldn't be linked. I think there's a strong case for making an exception for Jordan, which could easily be misinterpreted as a person, the river, etc. However, given that it's in the title of this article it might be reasonable to assume that readers are familiar.
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The Jordanians immediately expelled all the Jewish residents of East Jerusalem. All but one of the 35 synagogues in the Old City were destroyed over the course of the next 19 years, either razed or used as stables and chicken coops. Many other historic and religiously significant buildings were
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They might be some alternative terms to play with. While rule carries certain sovereign connotations, a word like 'governance', for instance, does not - on the contrary, a word such as 'governance' might be truer to the sense of the meaning that is being angled towards here - that is political
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3) The Arab League unanimously agreed Jordan's annexation was illegal. According to the sources (Benvenisti and two contemporary NYT articles), they censured Jordan and almost expelled it before agreeing to a "long-term postponement" of the problem. Please do not revert to an unsourced POV.
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The title of this article is the "Jordanian annexation of the West Bank" which was an administrative mission completed in 1949, impacted in 1967 and abandoned in 1988. Why do you think information belonging to after 1988 relates to 1949-1988? Also your recent changes are in violation of
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I have clarified the US position in the lead which was misrepresented by omission. The US did approve, just not officially, that is what they themselves say and that is what secondary sources say. Israel objecting to Jordan UN admission is undue for the lead and anyway out of scope.
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Here are the main differences: 1) Zero claims at the Jericho Conference, "hundreds of Palestinian notables in the West Bank gathered and accepted Jordanian rule." This makes it seem like a bunch of Palestinians decided among themselves spontaneously to accept Jordanian rule.
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with non-RS sources, and other sources have since been added. But they don’t quite say what it says here. And the “Letter Dated 68/03/05 from the Permanent Representative of Israel to the United Nations Addressed to the Secretary-General” is certainly not WP:RS in wikivoice.
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Non-extended-confirmed editors may not create new articles, but administrators may exercise discretion when deciding how to enforce this remedy on article creations. Deletion of new articles created by non-extended-confirmed editors is permitted but not
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2) Zero claims that the Arab League "having received assurances from Jordan, resolved to treat the annexed area as being held in trust until the Palestine question was resolved." It sounds like the Arab League was OK with the annexation. That is false.
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1950 period. (Then it jumps straight to post-1967.) I can see the case for an article on the period of Jordanian administration (and its aftermath), but at the moment I lean to disagreeing that repurposing this article is the best way to go about it.
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Just to point out that the POV tag was inserted due to the change from the sourced "The naturalized Palestinians enjoyed equal opportunities in all sectors of the state without discrimination, and they were given half of the seats of the
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stating that all avenues were opened to the Palestinians on an individual citizen level. The other mentions of discrimination seems to be attributed to complaints, rather than endorsed and accepted by the book.
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1) The Jericho Conference was convened by King Abdallah of Transjordan. Does anyone seriously dispute this? Because the entire wikipedia article on the Jericho Conference says so and cites sources.
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4) Claim of no discrimination against Palestinians under Jordanian-rule of West Bank is simply not reflected in contemporary sources. There were many documented claims of discrimination.
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Clear vandalism of whatever origin may be reverted without restriction. Also, reverts made solely to enforce the extended confirmed restriction are not considered edit warring.
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Understood. I cut it to a bare minimum and removed the tag, but please review what is there and consider in particular the quality and relevance of the sources.
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Too many details to be added to a subsection, needs either a renaming here, or another standalone article; and if it's the latter then what would it be called?
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Ah, I see that "administration" was already discussed further up. Yes, it does seem like simply starting a new article along these lines may be simpler.
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hardly a spontaneous outpouring of support. It should be mentioned in the article that Abdullah convened and chose the participants at the conference.
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Also the two recently added sources of Amnesty and minority rights do not relate to the sentence or the scope of the article and can be removed.
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Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/martinkramer/files/the_west_bank_was_annexed_once_before._it_ended_in_regret._.pdf
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If you are unsure if your edit is appropriate, discuss it here on this talk page first. When in doubt, don't revert!
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beauty pageant; maybe also 1988 Jordanian disengagement. Basically a unified history of Jordan and the West Bank.
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3) Zero says the USA accepted the annexation. 3) Sources show the USA never accepted the annexation.
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never a "resolution" of what the Arab League unequivocally considered illegal and void annexation.
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after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.
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It might be absent because there is a link in the infobox and the infobox comes before the lead (
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There are many things that could be included in such article. 1948 Abdullah-Meir collusion, 1953
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As you have inserted disputed content, you are required to demonstrate consensus for them per
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is an editorial comment not present in the source. (y) Probably more stuff but I have to run.
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Knowledge talk:WikiProject Israel Palestine Collaboration#Change "rule" to "occupation"
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Four edits follow the sources. Please do not revert without any source to back it up.
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You may not make more than 1 revert within 24 hours on any edits related to this topic
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what happened at the United Nations on that day. Does anyone seriously dispute this?
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A couple of years ago a good exchange of sources on part of the above was held at
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which yielded a consensus for the current title instead. Then in 2020, the RFC at
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https://arabcenterdc.org/resource/the-jordan-is-palestine-idea-resurfaces-again/
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Day to Mark the Departure and Expulsion of Jews from the Arab Countries and Iran
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I have undone four edits by Zero that do not reflect the cited sources.
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Talk:Islamization of Jerusalem#Evacuations and Destruction of Synagogues
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control and policy setting regardless of the legal guise of the setup.
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The current structure of the article is very focused on the 1948-: -->
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Jordanian occupation of the West Bank and East Jerusalem
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Jordanian occupation of the West Bank and East Jerusalem
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Jordanian occupation and annexation of the West Bank
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1072:David Bar-Hayim 880:Rami Kleinstein 864:Ayala Procaccia 816:Participate in 746: 686: 683: 680: 677: 676: 654: 649: 647: 627: 598:High-importance 581: 578: 575: 572: 571: 564:list of members 533: 528: 526: 507:High‑importance 506: 478: 475: 472: 469: 468: 396: 393: 390: 387: 386: 353: 324:on Knowledge's 321: 311: 270: 259: 249: 248: 243: 220: 132: 127: 126: 125: 102: 72: 23: 22: 15: 12: 11: 5: 2606: 2604: 2596: 2595: 2590: 2585: 2580: 2575: 2570: 2565: 2560: 2555: 2550: 2545: 2540: 2535: 2530: 2525: 2520: 2515: 2510: 2505: 2500: 2490: 2489: 2486: 2485: 2484: 2483: 2482: 2481: 2480: 2479: 2478: 2477: 2476: 2475: 2363: 2310: 2307: 2306: 2305: 2248: 2247: 2230: 2177: 2174: 2173: 2172: 2171: 2170: 2112: 2111: 2092: 2081: 2078: 2077: 2076: 2014: 2011: 2003: 2002: 2001: 1982: 1981: 1980: 1966: 1965: 1964: 1866:Qibya massacre 1835: 1824:Colonestarrice 1809: 1808: 1794:requested move 1788: 1786: 1783: 1780: 1779: 1778: 1777: 1759: 1741: 1723: 1705: 1679: 1665: 1664: 1661: 1660: 1656: 1650: 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discussion 369: 357: 356: 354:Mid‑importance 348: 336: 335: 329: 307: 293: 292: 287:now serves to 263: 251: 250: 241: 239: 238: 235: 234: 192: 191: 129: 128: 124: 123: 118: 113: 104: 103: 101: 100: 93: 88: 79: 73: 71: 70: 59: 50: 49: 46: 45: 39: 24: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 2605: 2594: 2591: 2589: 2586: 2584: 2581: 2579: 2576: 2574: 2571: 2569: 2566: 2564: 2561: 2559: 2556: 2554: 2551: 2549: 2546: 2544: 2541: 2539: 2536: 2534: 2531: 2529: 2526: 2524: 2521: 2519: 2516: 2514: 2511: 2509: 2506: 2504: 2501: 2499: 2496: 2495: 2493: 2474: 2470: 2466: 2459: 2454: 2453: 2452: 2449: 2444: 2443: 2442: 2438: 2434: 2430: 2429: 2428: 2424: 2420: 2413: 2408: 2407: 2406: 2403: 2397: 2392: 2391: 2390: 2386: 2382: 2379: 2376: 2369: 2364: 2362: 2358: 2354: 2350: 2344: 2343:GreekParadise 2339: 2338: 2337: 2336: 2332: 2328: 2324: 2317: 2316:GreekParadise 2308: 2304: 2300: 2296: 2291: 2290: 2289: 2288: 2284: 2280: 2279:GreekParadise 2275: 2271: 2267: 2266: 2263: 2260: 2254: 2251: 2246: 2242: 2238: 2235: 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1774:discussion 1756:discussion 1738:discussion 1720:discussion 1702:discussion 1338:Nabataeans 1288:by quality 1080:Guy Oseary 872:Edna Arbel 1813:not moved 1762:Not moved 1645:, or any 1618:required. 1582:, or any 1076:Guy Bavli 915:See also 771:Rate the 573:Palestine 548:Palestine 504:Palestine 320:is rated 281:this edit 99:if needed 82:Be polite 32:talk page 2458:Zero0000 2412:Zero0000 2368:Zero0000 2220:rendered 2160:Jamedeus 2137:maybe... 1609:only to 1328:Copyedit 961:Maintain 828:Copyedit 554:and the 197:Archives 67:get help 40:This is 38:article. 2349:WP:ONUS 2122:דג ירוק 2017:Thanks 1985:Comment 1880:, 1967 1868:, 1956 1346:'Umayri 1311:Cleanup 1296:Harrana 1223:history 1196:on the 944:Infobox 789:Cleanup 732:history 705:on the 600:on the 415:on the 322:C-class 285:history 226:90 days 165:WP refs 153:scholar 2323:WP:BRD 2118:Jordan 2019:Shrike 1910:-: --> 1904:Oppose 1772:, see 1754:, see 1736:, see 1718:, see 1700:, see 1482:Wikify 1453:Update 1353:Expand 1282:Assess 1169:Jordan 1160:Jordan 1116:Jordan 1078:, and 1046:Update 858:Expand 766:Assess 678:Israel 669:Israel 625:Israel 328:scale. 137:Google 2104:|ans= 2094:This 1498:Other 1420:Stubs 1405:Dabke 1382:Merge 1233:purge 1228:watch 1058:Other 1029:Stubs 1012:Photo 742:purge 737:watch 309:This 279:with 180:JSTOR 141:books 95:Seek 2469:talk 2448:Zero 2437:talk 2423:talk 2402:Zero 2385:talk 2357:talk 2331:talk 2299:talk 2283:talk 2241:talk 2232:See 2225:Zero 2208:talk 2164:talk 2145:talk 2126:talk 2070:talk 2055:talk 1995:talk 1974:talk 1958:talk 1944:talk 1929:talk 1894:talk 1856:talk 1828:talk 1726:Move 1708:Move 1543:The 1399:NPOV 1290:and 1218:edit 1034:See 999:NPOV 966:See 801:and 777:and 727:edit 592:High 173:FENS 147:news 84:and 2102:or 1991:CMD 1768:to 1750:to 1732:to 1714:to 1696:to 1188:Mid 978:Map 697:Mid 407:Mid 269:of 187:TWL 2494:: 2471:) 2439:) 2425:) 2387:) 2359:) 2333:) 2325:. 2301:) 2285:) 2243:) 2210:) 2166:) 2147:) 2128:) 2108:no 2072:) 2057:) 2044:. 1997:) 1976:) 1960:) 1946:) 1931:) 1923:. 1896:) 1858:) 1840:→ 1830:) 1815:. 1796:. 1490:, 1473:, 1469:, 1465:, 1461:, 1444:, 1440:, 1436:, 1432:, 1428:- 1411:, 1407:, 1390:, 1373:, 1369:, 1365:, 1361:, 1344:, 1340:, 1336:, 1319:, 1302:, 1298:, 1294:- 1269:, 1265:, 1074:, 910:, 906:, 902:, 898:, 894:, 890:, 886:, 882:, 878:, 874:, 870:, 866:, 224:: 216:, 212:, 208:, 204:, 167:) 65:; 2467:( 2460:: 2456:@ 2435:( 2421:( 2414:: 2410:@ 2398:: 2394:@ 2383:( 2370:: 2366:@ 2355:( 2345:: 2341:@ 2329:( 2318:: 2314:@ 2297:( 2281:( 2239:( 2206:( 2162:( 2143:( 2124:( 2068:( 2053:( 1993:( 1972:( 1956:( 1942:( 1927:( 1892:( 1854:( 1826:( 1821:) 1817:( 1776:. 1758:. 1740:. 1722:. 1704:. 1500:: 1485:: 1456:: 1423:: 1402:: 1385:: 1356:: 1331:: 1314:: 1285:: 1260:: 1200:. 1082:. 1069:: 1060:: 1049:: 1040:. 1032:: 1023:. 1015:: 1002:: 993:. 981:: 972:. 964:: 955:. 947:: 938:. 930:: 921:. 861:: 852:. 844:: 831:: 822:. 814:: 805:. 792:: 783:. 769:: 709:. 604:. 570:. 467:. 419:. 334:: 218:5 214:4 210:3 206:2 202:1 199:: 183:· 177:· 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