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bunch of corpsepainted characters, rumoured to be drawn from such acts as
Mutiilation, Torgeist and Vlad Tepes named themselves the 'Black Legions' as a tribute to the so-called 'Black Mafia' Norwegian BM heroes Darkthrone and Burzum, who were supposedly ready to terrorize innocent Christians a couple of years before. Even though it didn't go any further, the gentlemen of the Black Legions devoted their energy to a war of words that is still talked about today. They sent death threats to Anchoiade for not being true enough and presents like dead rats to French death metal, or as they called it, "life metal" outfits like Crusher." The article then moves on to talk about French NSBM; the section on French underground BM in
748:...is worthless as a source. Aside from the fact that it's not currently being used to confirm any of the contentious facts in the article, it's not clear if the character being interviewed was part of the LLN in the first place; he may be, in which case it can probably be correctly incorporated into the article, but if he isn't (which bands was he playing with?) then it can't. Either way, it's a terrible source owing to the LLN being trivially mentioned.
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have missed the point that the LLN weren't after "recognition" in the slightest, and that we only have any of their releases beyond the Vlad Tepes demo, the
Muetiilation and Torgeist albums, and the March to the Black Holocaust split, because Beleth'Rim stole all of the masters of their demos and sold them to record labels without the bands' or the circle's consent.
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1061:. Notice how the resemblance between Ozlvarv's logo and Dapnom's album title is uncanny. Considering the name of Dapnom's release, the supposed "d" in "Dzlvarv" is actually an "o" in "Ozlvarv". Of course, since the two names are both widely used, there should be a note that Ozlvarv is often mistaken as Dzlvarv.
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Also, potentially of interest (and may provide a reference for LLN influence), later in the same issue (p.44; written by Nathan T. Birk)), when talking about the current black metal underground: "One should never count out France, primarily as the home of the inscrutably influential Black
Legions of
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s Black Metal
Special, in its overview of the French scene, in which it suggests they were directly influenced by the Inner Circle (p.38, #128, written by Guy Strachan): "But sadly, the only way most proud French BM warriors found to get some recognition abroad was to use the genre's worst habits. A
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An anonymous user reverted the list of bands to include all of those for which we have no evidence of existence (i.e. a Google search hit this page and others that are C&P from this page). I have as such removed them again. If a source can be found for any of them, we could consider reinstating
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I would also add that following this logic we should also remove Amaka Hahina from the list (also active only since 2001) -- BUT Amaka Hahina is featured in the 1995 LLN fanzine "The Black Plague"... Does this make sense? Having an inclusionist mindset I would rather keep
Vermeth in the band list,
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Why not simply use the only legitimate sources, i.e. interviews with LLN members and the Black Plague zine? You get a sizable amount of information from the Black Plague zine on its own, and you don't have to make baseless assumptions like the bloke who wrote that
Terrorizer article, who seems to
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A suggestion: a rare "public" interview with an LLN band back from when the cirle was active exists in
Unhallowed zine Issue 2 (ironically - its cover featured in Lords of Chaos, but there is no mention of LLN). The band in question is Vlad Tepes, whose demo the creator of the zine released on his
558:...is ridiculously long. Knowledge (XXG) is not a repository for unsourced information about non-notable groups. Almost all of the bands do not have articles, presumably because almost nothing is known about them and as such, they have no place in an encyclopedia. I'm removing all of the redlinks.
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hi. a lot of the bands metnioned in the list at the bottom are meely rumoured to exist and demos of theirs have not surfaced in hard-copy or mp3 form. if anyone is very familiar with the Les legions noire and knows for sure that music of a certain band has not surfaced, please delete them from the
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I agree that some of this references only marginally mention the LLN, but I thought that this is better than nothing -- until now there were no references at all. The point of the
Celestia interviews is that frontman "Noktu" is/was the main publisher of the LLN through his Drakkar label (to which
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question is to define whether the Black
Legions actually refers to the bands / projects involved, or to the members themselves. I am comparing this to circles like the Norwegian Black Metal Mafia or "Inner Circle" and the Swedish True Satanist Horde. A brief mention of the Black Legions occurs in
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for his work on this so far), we need to look at what we can do to make this a decent looking article. Sources are going to be difficult if not impossible to find, but I recommend a step-by-step, even line-by-line, approach to improvement. So to start with the lead... I think a reasonable first
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ridiculous rawness during the mid-90s It gets even crazier with such grim and weird nutters as Nuit Noire, Svest, Spektr, Arkham and
Diapsiquir injecting some defiant art into that Black legions archetype." I hope some of this is useful; I'll keep trying to dig out more
795:
offers a global overview of the LLNs history and in-depth description of the different projects and their musical spectrum. The article is well written and Metal1.info appears to have an editorial board, so I believe it qualifies as an acceptable source. The article on
713:. Should I integrate it in the article? The sources come mainly from metal-archive. I took only the projects who have releases listed on that site (that eliminates a few that are currently listed in this article). Please comment, and don't hesitate to improve it...
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is a more valuable reference, since Noktu describes how he founded the Drakkar label in order to publish the LLN material. Also the interviewer mentions the "legendary status" that the LLN publications have aquired 10 years later. The German article on
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them, but to be honest if they don't even have a Metal Archives page you're going to be struggling, and I hesitate to call that a reliable source anyway (though all bands with such pages are already listed in the current version of the article).
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the music on the two Vermeth albums is very close to Torgeist's style, it's published by LLN-homebase Drakkar Productions, and the Drakkar website describes it as "a new manifestation of the Black Legions anti-human
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So, since some anonymous users are undoing my edit, let's discuss this here rather than engaging a senseless edit war. Question: should Vermeth be listed as one of the LLN projects? Arguments for inclusion:
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I believe that Dzlvarv is actually called "Ozlvarv". Apparently this has been in discussion for a while in the metal community, but there's some evidence I found that seems solid. Ozlvarv's logo looks like
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stating that Vermeth is part of the LLN. Two things: this should apply to every band on the list, and the reliable source does not necessarily have to be from the LLN themselves, as we are relying on
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So...a Terrorizer article, a decent German article, some stuff on Chronicles of Chaos, isn't that enough to remove the reference and notability tags? I think they don't look good on this page.
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Tragic Empire Records seems to be inofficially linked...). Therefore he should be considered an interesting source of information, as he had private contact with the LLN members. I agree the
599:, as in this case I really feel the rumour-mill online cannot be regarded as reliable. Even the usually decent Metal Archives has been infected with rumours that couldn't be used under
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Almost all of this is rumor. Absolutely needs to be erased or at least cut down to a few paragraphs. There's no denying the subjectivity and personal bias that exists throughout!
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not "truth". This article has always been problematic on this front, as the LLN refuses to speak to print magazines, by and large, and webzines can never be reliable sources.
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is rather trivial as there is only one sentence about the LLN, but I think it's interesting enough to be used as a footnote when rewriting the article. The French interview on
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LLN themselves are hugely influential. I can think of at least 3 "circles" here in Australia that have consciously tried to emulate the ethos and in some cases the very sound.(
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Given that it looks likely that the article will survive AfD (and I've come round to the point of view that this is reasonable if given a sensible re-write - thank you to
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In order to have a more clear overview of WHO is involved in WHICH project, i designed the following table that you find temporarily on my user page:
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Sure, he's even in a Black Metal band with some other American BM musicians called Twilight. But what exactly does this have to do with the article?
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The biggest problem with this article is that "Les Legions Noires" is spelled incorrectly in the title, so searching for it doesn't work properly.
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Unless LLN specifically states that Vermeth is part of them, then I would not consider it. Being related to Torgeist isn't enough for me.
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is interesting insofar that it mentions the LLN as "the most significant scene" to emerge after the second wave of Norwegian black metal.
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references in the section "Improving the article" above; I'm afraid I don't have time to properly integrate them at the mo, though...
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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the table is now integrated in the article, so apply any modifications directly there (in place of the "bands and projects" list)
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The "Street Metal Forum" is now closed, if it does not open up in a few days, it will be removed for good (or until it opens)
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label Full Moon Productions. If somebody could locate a copy and scan it - this will probably be quite a useful.
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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it is a solo-project by Beleth'Rim, member of LLN band Torgeist, also leading the Amaka Hahina side-project.
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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There is another band called Chambre Noir which has been supposedly been confirmed as an official band.
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
1091:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit
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42:. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to
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Second ref may be decent; my German isn't good enough and I'm not familiar with the site... is it a
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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
1057:. There's another group called Dapnom that released an album called "0", and a picture of it is
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similarly talks exclusively about NSBM, with (unfortunately) no mention of the Black Legions.
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Towards the bottom of this thread, there appears to be a Vlad Tepes fanzine interview:
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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
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listens to the LLN, "especially Mütiilation and Torgeist". read the interview
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the cover art of the albums esthetically differs from the LLN symbolism.
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The Vermeth logo is clearly designed similarly to the Torgeist logo.
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Actualy, they have only 2 demos released, can somebody change this?
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Oh, it's the fanzine published by the LLN itself; rest of it here:
154:. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the
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but I won't enforce this issue if other editors oppose .... --
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from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially
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Ha, would you believe that: Sonic Youth vocalist/guitarist
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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http://www.metal1.info/artikel/kolumne.php?kolumne_id=53
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793:Metal1.info
641:—Preceding
627:—Preceding
584:Terrorizer'
517:—Preceding
422:Black Metal
385:Black Metal
72:Start-class
1189:Categories
1176:Report bug
816:Terrorizer
491:discussion
484:discussion
477:discussion
1159:this tool
1152:this tool
161:Biography
106:Musicians
101:Biography
40:libellous
1165:Cheers.—
997:Irina666
970:Irina666
914:Irina666
891:spirit".
802:Irina666
730:Irina666
715:Irina666
661:Go read
643:unsigned
531:contribs
519:unsigned
506:Untitled
461:deletion
416:inactive
390:inactive
1089:my edit
629:undated
623:VragMoj
1026:Moevot
858:Drmies
601:WP:BLP
514:list.
269:France
260:France
219:France
78:scale.
837:Edit:
667:WP:OR
663:WP:RS
351:Metal
317:Metal
1067:talk
1059:here
1055:this
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1016:talk
1001:talk
995:. --
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29:BLP
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