Talk:List of automobile manufacturers

1131:

those models which are current and those that are defunct is not not a helpful distinction. What happens for instance when a manufacturer (as Rambler did) drops the name for 40 years and then picks it up again. Would it be a defunct manufacturer for a time and then we have to be alert to change it to a current? Does this not defeat the purpose of an encyclopedia? When I flip through a printed ency., I expect to find a list of all the US autos regardless of whether some are current or not. For instance, if I am restoring a Packard and my neighbor is restoring a Chev, wouldn't it be reasonable to look at the same page to see the basic info of when it was offered? In that way we could list a model as, "Super Jupiter (automobile):Jupiter" (1922-1967). Thereby indicating when it started production and when it became defunct.

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instruction of the parent comapny but with the blessing of the parent, that should immediately qualify the subsidiary to be listed seperately from the parent. For instance, Mercedes-Benz and BMW both have manufacturing plants in South Africa. To the best of my knowledge though, only BMW SA have produced a product not initiated by the BMW parent in Germany. At least 4 models were unique to BMW SA: the 325iS Evo I & II, the 333i and the 745i (not to be confused with the 745i available in Europe from BMW). I would argue that BMW SA deserves to be recognised as a bona fide manufacturer on these grounds, whilst Mercedes-Benz SA should not. There are of course many examples around the world - Volkswagen Brazil, Volkswagen Mexico, Renault Argentina, Fiat & Alfa in Brazil, etc.

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but was sold as a 1920 model. The difference in date should be made known in the write-up of that model. Also, some models have two or more dates. That is because a company began with that name for their cars, then quit producing. Later another company (or even the same company) started production and chose the same name. The prime example is that of the Monarch (1903 and 1905 and 1907 and 1913). I put the "and" between them to avoid thinking that the car was offered in 1903, then in 1905, then in 1907, and finally in 1913 by the same manufacturer. Others may be able to flesh these out to distinguish the different manufacturers. Also as much as possible, I used the convention "Manufacturer Name (automobile) | Short Name" —

1139:

alphabetical order. Under this "current" list could be a second list of all other marques that have existed in that country, but for whatever reason no longer market cars from that country. Next to each "old" company could be a tag explaining why it's no longer "current." This way, the fact that some companies have been bought out or merged, others own partial stakes in each other, etc. is of no relevance. If they are currently selling cars under their own marque, they go in the current list. If they are not, they go in the old list, with a tag that gives a reason why. Comments, questions, ideas? I definitely couldn't do much of the reorganizing myself, but I'd love to help.

528:"Heinkel" is listed here as "Heinkel (Heinkel Trojan). It suggests that "Heinkel Trojan" was a Heinkel model - but it wasn't. "Heinkel" and "Trojan" are separate makes,however, the first is German and the latter is British. This misunderstanding can be easily explained - Heinkel and Trojan are frequently mentioned together. In fact, Trojan bought the licence of Heinkel to build Heinkel's bubble car model - which was never marketed as Heinkel but Trojan 200. If nobody has any comments, I will correct the list (and the relevant entries) accordingly. Hi, -- 84: 1350:

to make it clear that the previous version was not US-centric POV. The only mistake was to list Lincoln as near-luxury- Lincoln is obviously a luxo brand, the TC which has been the best selling model costs over $ 42k, the average base MSRP if over $ 38k for this model year (just compare the Lincoln line-up to that of say, Audi), and Lincoln doesn't even sell cars as cheap as the Audi A4, BMW 2-Series, or MB B-Class. Regards,

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Mmmm... I haven't even noticed that. The list commonly states the manufacturer (e.g. Ford Motor Company) and then lists the marques belonging to that manufacturer (e.g. Lincoln, Mercury, Jaguar, Volvo, Land Rover, etc...). So, I guess either list of marques or list of manufacturers would be accurate.

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The one and only MINI factory is located in Great Britain (in Oxford) - but they are 100% owned by a German parent company. Does that make them a British manufacturer or a German manufacturer? I don't know. I would say British - but if you buy a car from them, the first letter on the VIN tag will

931:

5. I think that the official names of the manufacturers should be listed first, and their common name next. For example, Ferrari would be Societa per azioni Esercizio Fabbriche Automobile e Corse (Ferrari), FIAT should be FIAT Auto SpA (FIAT), Daihatsu would be Daihatsu Kogyo Company (Daihatsu) etc.

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I wonder why do you feel that people would be confused to know that Audi TT is produced only in Hungary by a factory owned by Audi of Germany. They won't be, I think. The clasification of manufacturers by countries is, by the way, very old fashioned, because under EC rules, the place of origin of the

1805:

I've rewritten the criteria to be consistent with other lists and removed all the entries without articles. A list should be to link to information, not a lack of unsourced and empty pages, so this should make it more useful. By all means, if any one has an issue, ping me and we can discuss it, but

1786:

The list has become an unsourced mess. I've modified the criteria and will start trimming. I left a message at WikiProject Automobiles with no objection. As notability is required to have an article on wikipedia, the same is true to be included in the list, so like most quality lists, I expect to

1740:

I've been through the Wikilinks of the Argentine section, corrected one, added a couple. I've included changing some links to replicate the 'es' entries in the hope someone else will translate them across. I hope someone with local knowledge will pick up whether the listing "IAMA" is actually "IAME"

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The 'classic' Mini (1959 to 2000) is a kind of car - but it was NEVER the name of a manufacturer - no more than a Ford Mustang is a manufacturer. They were made by Austin, Morris, BMC, Leyland, Rover, Authi, Innocenti and a bunch of other manufacturers - but there was NEVER a manufacturer or even a

904:

The South African entry looks "bleak" because all the S.A. motor factories are subsidiaries of international (overseas) companies! Still, S.A. has a notable role in world auto supply, e.g. Volkswagen Polo/Jetta export contracts to China and the only factory outside Germany to build the Mercedes-Benz

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Ford Motor Company is a name of a company but Maserati is not a company name only the distinctive element. Company names are colloquially simplified to brands. But what do you think about Subaru? It is not a company name at all, it is a trademark (the leagal aspect) and a brand (the trade aspect) at

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I think perhaps it would be a good idea to have separate pages for the separate topics. I personally would call "Ford Motor Company" a manufacturer, whereas I would call "Ford" a marque or a brand or something like that. This list appears to be overwhelmingly more about marques than manufacturers

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Yes the changes improve the article a great deal! But the former table I created was not POV. I did not mention Ford as the No. 2 based on nationalistic reasons. The reason Ford was No. 2 in the old table was becuase it was based on 2004 data! The update is definitely an improvement but I just want

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Woohookitty, I understand where you are coming from when you renamed the heading from "Other US automobiles" to "Defunct US automobiles" -- however, one of the models in that list is Cadillac (my "handle" too) :) and so far it is not defunct. -- So, for me, it seems as though having a split between

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Under "Other US automobiles" I have added quite a few other makes -- most of them no longer produced; but certainly had an influence upon those that did survive. Behind the model, I placed the date when that manufacturer produced the car. In some instances the car was introduced for example in 1919

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How about including the years of separate operation, who it merged with and current status (name no longer used, independent, owner, group) in parentheses. There seems to be some inconsistency. Lincoln and Oldsmobile are listed only as models, while Bentley and Humber are listed separately. These

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I don't think we should have two different articles for manufactuers and marques (a.k.a. makes, brands, copyrights) because it is useful to be able to relate manufacturers to their marques (eg. as we have done in the "Current automotive corporations" section of this article). However, I do think we

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This word is commonly used for distinguishing between "makes" and "models". (e.g. Toyota and Prius). The problem arises in cases such as Edsel. Edsel was - in fact - marketed in itself. No "Ford Edsels" used to exist! The word "make" is ambiguous in this respect. The situation of Edsel is commonly

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The column in the table showing main markets is silly. Aston Martin is "global" but Volvo is "Europe/North America" ?? Makes no sense. You are much more likely to see a Volvo in China or Taiwan or Australia than you are to see an Aston Martin in those places" . Furthermore, although Europe

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Thanks to whoever that updated this article as of recently. People, most likely Americans are flaming over the intention that Ford is number one and Toyota is number three. People need to look at the facts and reality and accept it and move on. There should be less time for America great, largest,

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That sound good, but how should merged and bought out brands be handled. I suppose the main thing is independent companies, but it might surprise people if common brands are marked as extinct because their ownership has changed. Then there is tha case of only part of the stock being owned by an

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Some of these subsidiaries have a rich history, that deserve its own article IMO, for instance Ford France was originaly a joint-venture with Mathis then became Ford France (producing it's own model differents from US/UK and German models) then was sold to Simca that was sold to Chrysler and then

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There are also lists of subsidiaries. I think the philosophy of the present list i.e. covering ownership and interest of some giants in others makes confusion since some manufacturer names appear twice such as Fiat. By the way, Fiat is not owned by General Motors (takover plans are over) but Fiat

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I notice that the page was moved from "List of automobiles" to "Car manufacturers". While the old title wasn't great, I'm not too fond of the new one either. This is still a list, rather than an article about car manufactuers, and the list just concerns itself with motorcar/automobile makers, not

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Millisits, you don't have to tell me about discrimination, as I'm from a country (Portugal) where we have a tremendous lack of self-esteem compared to other developed countries and we feel the need to hype ourselves in front of foreigners as much as possible, but I'd be against including Toyota,

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I'm sorry but the first Mini where branded either Austin or Morris but the last where branded Mini. Thus Mini was a brand (in fact we are listing brands not firms we are listing Chevrolet not GM). It's interresting to notice that Mini didn't produce only the Mini but also a later model the Metro

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This is quite untrue. While the Edsel was a product of Ford Motor Company, the Edsel was a stand alone marque, with its VIN numbering system, dealer network, etc. When first introduced, its was built by its own division within Ford (which was then reorganized into the Mercury-Edsel-Lincoln M-E-L

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The term "Motor Brands" is more widely known as a brand of muscle car t-shirts (search Google under "motor brands.") It is also a US Trademark name of a corporation. This page should not be re-directed since it is less used to describe a list of automobile manufacturers and is more notable as a

1138:

I like the idea of separating current and defunct marques. Perhaps not separating, but at least distinguishing with tags like (defunct), (merged with ), (moved to ) etc. For example, under each country, there could be a list of marques from that country which currently market cars, listed in

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I've noticed Audi, Opel and Suzuki have been added to the list of Hungarian manufacturers, obviously due to the existance of factories there. This addition is inviting disaster, allowing people to put manufacturers everywhere they please simply because they have factories in those countries. I

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Citroen, Opel, Mitsubishi and VW in the Portuguese brands listing. However, if we remove the "deadwood" (aka deceased brands), I'll be the one following you, including as many factories in as many countries I know of, as well as sub-contracted plants such as Valmet, Bertone or Pinin Farina. --

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A manufacturer of a car has a company name which is never identical with a "brand" because consists of a leading part (e.g. Renault), some words describing the activity (e.g. Motor) and a part indicating the legal form of the firm (e.g. S.A., AG, Ltd). Accordingly, this list is not a list of

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in that sense. Maybe someone should separate the two lists, if people can agree on this. If I knew absolutely nothing about car makes and I wanted to refer to an encyclopedia to find out more, I would be seriously confused if I saw both "Ford" and "Ford Motor Company" in the same list. --

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2. On the whole, merely having a subsidiary in a country different to the parent company should not get the subsidiary listed as a manufacturer in this other country. However, I do feel that should the subsidiary have produced models under the parent marque name that without doing so under

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but it redirects to this list of manufacturers - wouldn't it be best if these two were separate, so the manufacturers list could have GM, Ford, Honda, FIAT etc. and the marques could have GMC, Chevy, Cadillac, Buick, Aston, Volvo, Ford, Jag, Honda, Acura, Fiat, Ferrari, Maserati, etc? —

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Does anyone know if the Range Rover has ever been marketed as a brand, separate to the Land Rover brand, rather than a product of the Land Rover brand? I don't think it has but I'm no expert on the matter. If it hasn't then it would seem to me that it doesn't belong in this article.

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Is this a list of manufacturers only or is this a list of marques? Some comments above regarding the removal of the likes of Merkur, Mercury, Edsel, etc. lead me to believe that this is a list of marques. If that's going to be the case, the title of the article should reflect that.

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It isn't a brand. Nodody calls it the Land Rover Range or Land Rover Range Rover, not even Land Rover themselves, but there is a LR badge at the back. Plans are under way, though, to market Range as a separate brand, should the proposed Range Rover Sport model get off the ground.

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I've noticed that there seems to be no standard about how car brands should be disambiguated. It's about equally split between, for a car brand Thing, between using 'Thing (car)' and 'Thing automobile'. Is there a preferred form. Should this be altered to make a standard?

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a kind of car. MINI (the manufacturer) are 100% owned by BMW but operated as a separate company with their own dealerships (at least in the USA) and a factory that makes nothing but their own cars. Hence 'BMW MINI', or 'MINI (BMW)' - a manufacturer who belongs on this

747:. Why do not we use these lists to include some entries in this list? Why do not we restrict this list to existing manufacturers grouped by countries mentioned under its whole company names in English (if these are available). Brands like Subaru would be indicated " 473:

Trademarks refer to the legal protection of a name. Accordingly, no third party can use this name or confusingly similar names relating to cars, means or transport ( or for other goods or services, where the trademark is considered to be famous or well-known.)

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Big error number 2. Skoda and Seat are entery level manufactures and Fiat is main stream, Fiat Punto are much more expensive than Seat Ibiza and Skoda Fabia simply because they use defunct ancient Volkswagen platforms and motors and have cheaper interiors.

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I think discussion is not a disaster. To delete existing companies from a list just because the distinctive element of their company names are brands of a mother company is a clear discrimination of some nations. Who wants discriminate others? I personally

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Like before I took Tesla motors off of the list because they are not manufacturing cars yet. They are a company with a prototype and pre orders who plan on begining production soon. But until that production happens they cannot be labeled a manufacturer.

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Wrightspeed and Teslamotors both have prototypes and have not created production vehicles yet. A manufacturer creates production vehicles, and when these companies start producing their prototypes and selling them I will gladly add them back to the list.

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and think that the list should be merged with the list of cars in "Other US automobiles" The fact that a car is no longer produced does not mean that it should not be listed. The purpose of a list is to help the reader find the article about the item. -

1437:"Note!: Renault now owns controlling interest in Nissan Motors, And Ford now owns controling interest in Mazda. The above tables dont reflect this but this would make Ford, Mazda the #2 manufacturer and Nissan Renault would displace DamlerChrysler. " 371:

and made other changes. That Merkur was just the badge applied to German Fords sold in the US does not matter; what does matter is that it was a marque. It was not a 'Ford XR4ti' but a 'Merkur', no matter who actually built it. This page is really

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That is an excellent idea too. How did I not think of that? That was helpful when it was put on some of the defunct automobiles (ex: "Apal" was put in Belgium's list and it said in parentheses: Before 1995, now Germany). Thanks for the idea. -

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I don't have a problem with indicating the active presence of a company/brand in a country other than that of origin, especially when they have specific models, but under the current conditions it's not practical. The country lists are already to

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I've cleaned a lot of bad formatting and such, so lets not make any more radical changes or reverts before a discussion is had. I had already posted my intent on the project and this page and proceeded after a couple of weeks without objection.

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How about also separating aircraft manufacturers from the list, such as Heinkel and Messerschmitt? I do not understand why Heinkel and Messerschmitt were put in the list, because others like Airbus, Fokker, and Boeing were not in the list. -

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At least some of them are based on what the company called them, like "Hudson Motor Car". A standard form for comapanies that didn't use terms in their name but need to be diferentiated from just the company name might not be a bad idea. --

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What do people think about moving the list of international car manufacturers to the top ahead of the country-specific list? The international manufacturers make up the largest, most well-known companies and probably most useful articles.

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1. Zagato have produced cars branded as "Zagato". The list includes the Bambu, Zuma and Raptor. I think that the fact that they were not production cars is immaterial to this discussion - they were definitely released as Zagato cars.

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was to produce a list of models as well as manufacturers. This is clearly a hopeless task as the list would be enormous. Lists of models would be much better placed with each manufacturer's entry, as is often but not always done.

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1. I have deleted "Electrobat" from the list as it was the name of the vehicle manufactured by the Electric Carriage and Wagon Co. It seems the discussion here has ruled that this is list of manufacturers and not vehicle names.

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There are 3 Wiki articles about car manufacturers divided by country. There's this one, then there's List of current automobile manufacturers by country, and then there's List of car brands. Maybe we can merge these 3 into 1?

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Having read it's unclear to if they were any BSA car produced. I know BSA owned Daimler and produced Daimler cars (you can mount BSA motorcycle pistons and connecting roads in a Daimler V8). But was there BSA branded car ?

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I've read all of the comments, and I agree that defunct companies/brands should be moved to a page of their own. As for the question of separating brands and manufacturers, it isn't really necessary, as they are somewhat

948:

6. Perhaps listing manufacturers active per decade would be helpful in ordering the vast amount of information that is and will accumulate here? Perhaps even a list of only the currently active marnufacturers too?

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3. Mini - under British Leyland at the time - certainly was a seperate marque. The present-day MINI marque is also completely different from the original - BMW insist on it having all-capitals in the name too.

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Ah yes, that's a very good point. I guess the idea of separating defunct manufacturers with the others is a bad idea then. I don't think merged and bought out brands should be put in the defunct list. -

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but it is not. Manufacturers are companies having company names and having one or several brands. The present list is a mixture: generally only the distinctive element of company names is listed here. E.g.

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and North America are the largest markets for just about everything, I do not think that the percentage of Aston Martin sales outside those two markets is any larger than the percentage of Volvo sales.

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For these reasons, I'd like to merge the current models with the listing you have entitled "defunct." I notice that the models offered in other countries are not distinguished in those two categories.

986:, powered by BMW straight six engines. It was imported into the USA by California-based Laforza Engineering, with Mustang V8 power. Car production was phased out during the early 90s, I believe. -- 803:

Hi Rdmith4, thanks for your comment. I think the list of automobile marques is the same as List of automobile brands would be. I think a seaprate list of this kind would be advantagous but this

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For purposes of inclusion in this list, are racing car builders and aftermarket upfitters applicable, or should it be strictly for original manufacturers of road-going production automobiles? --

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Renault describe their relationship with Nissan as an alliance. Nissan is not a subsidiary of Renault. Indeed Nissan have a 15% stake in Renault. See the Renault website page on the subject.

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There are only two, well 2 1/2. GM, Ford and the Chrysler branch of Damiler-Chrysler are all among the world's largest automakers and are listed in the very first section, just below the index.

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needs being reformed. 1.I think this list would rather cover companies and not brands (trademarks, marques, as you like). 2. I think "deadwood"" should be removed from here to a subcategory of

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This words is overwhelmingly used in commerce since directly refers to the connection of a certain make and a certain product. "Mini" is a brand that has been used in various forms.

1787:

remove all the red links. Red links are fine for articles, but not taking up a large chunk of a list as it doesn't help the reader who is looking for articles not just raw data.

712:

Before judging whether adding existing automobile factories in countries where these really are is a disaster or not, I humbly draw your attention to my remarks above on this page.

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Renault-Nissan is one company so it must be on list as 4th world car company like in every normal economic magazine accept wikipedia! Ceterum censeo! Big error Number 1.!

562:(including Buick, Chevrolet, Pontiac etc. divisions). In addition, these divisions should be mentioned by their alphabetic order (or by their country, if applicable). 140: 177:

Removed the category "2005 cars" at the top of the list, since it had no following information and isn't really part of the "list of automobile manufacturers". --

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Several models of restructuring can be introduced such as copying the model of "List of companies" completed by lists of automobile manufacturers by country.

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As I have already explained "mini" is the name of a car not a manufacturer or a marque it does not therefore belong on this list, I am therefore removing it

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started "Riker Electric Motor Co." in 1898 to build electric motors, not cars. He formed "Riker Motor Vehicle Co." in 1898 to manufacture electric cars.

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There still seems to be a lot of reverting going on about Mini, MINI and BMW. Some of that is caused by the odd comments at the top of this talk page.

971:-badged SUVs. I suspect they're Italian, but I'm not sure. Googling for Laforza doesn't really bring anything up, but I did see one on eBay recently. 632:

here. Accordingly, a complete redoing of this list should be advisable. In strict sense, only a few automobile manufacturers are represented here by

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Porsche is not one of the world's largest automakers and thus is listed according to its national origin. Porsche is listed under Germany. Regards,

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The 'modern' MINI (2001-present, always written in CAPITAL LETTERS to distinguish it from the classic Mini) is most definitely both a manufacturer

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also be deleted because tthe company name is different? If you want to be consequent, only company names would be placed here. What do you think?

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Did Airbus, Fokker, and Boeing make cars? Boeing made furniture when airplane sales were down and they were still a woodworking companty. --

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appears here as a subsidiary. My proposal is: subsidiaries of automobile manufacturers such as General Motors should be mentioned as

1691:(as already mentioned earlier on this page). Compare for instance the list of Dutch manufaturers on this page (only Spyker...) with 716:

goods can be indication as 'Made in EEC'. Or: is Acura a Japanese car? Certainly not. This is a car marketed by an American company.

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Manufacturers sometimes use brands of other companies because of brand licensing or for corporate reasons. (It is commonly called "

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I took up the challenge at the bottom of the page and reordered the list of corporations by conglomerate. What do you all think?

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4. The Dino was most certainly marketed as just Dino initially. Later versions were brough back into the Ferrari stable though.

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The main problem is, I strongly feel, is in the philosophy of this list. As it stands, this intended to be a list of automobile

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Note that the new Mini removes all doubt about the previous, since it is definitely branded only Mini, no other names on it.

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If, Mitsubishi Motors Corporation is a multinational automaker headquartered in Minato, Tokyo. ¿Why is in Indian section?

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Could someone please separate defunct automobile manufacturers from the others, just like what has been done with the

621: 1256:- and feel free to verify what they say by reading the copious references in the first of those two articles. Now: 827:

etc. Eventual changes in name, mergers etc. would be redirected to the most popular version of the name. Thoughts?

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Morven is correct, Zagato only builds coachwork (i.e. the interior) and not the body or engine or anything else. —

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In that case the list is incomplete, we should include many Italian designers and all the race car constructors ?

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The practice in Knowledge (XXG) for separate entries for company names, car makes and models is to be followed.--

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I would suggest a major restructuring of this list because it becames more and more voluminous and unpractical.

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oops... I tried to fix it but accidentally deleted the article! Fortunatley, it was revirted. I'm such a noob

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as a category should cover the enumeration of lists only and particular manufacturers could be devided into

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or so. As far as I know there were several thousands of different manufacturers in automobile history. 3.

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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join

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I find it odd that Porsche is NO WHERE to be found... how did this happen ?? Can someone PLEASE FIX ??

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Did Heinkel and Messerschmitt make cars also? Why are they in the list if they made only aircraft? -

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need to make a clear and consistent distinction between manufactuers and marques in this article.

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factory called 'Mini' - so please stop putting that into this "List of automobile manufacturers".

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I think there is a huge need for a convention in the terminology. My contribution is as follows:

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Not a very good idea as many constructors changed the name of the company during their history.

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Let me summarize this discussion about the nature of the lis of automobile manufacturers.

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makers of rail cars or other types of cars... unless there are plans to add that here? --

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It looks to me like this page is obsolete. There already is a much more complete list at

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This word is sometimes used for "makes" or sometimes for "models" (e.g. Jaguar Type D).

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forever at top mentality. It was POV before, but now it's fact based. Hooray! Thanks

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Yes, that was a mistake I must have made. You're right they are mainstream. Regards,

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Karukera, if you're going to reorganize the page, please keep alphabetical order! --

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For your information, there is currently an Article for deletion vote regarding the

736:

One should should decide, further, why are companies grouped by portfolio of giants?

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Dino should be removed since it never has been a separate manufacturer of cars (see

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Should I delete the redirect? (this is my first day logged on so I don't know how)--

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Skoda aren't really entry level any more, so I have changed them to "mainstream"

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Who erased the section called "The Major Automotive Industries" and Why? --anon

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rather than the current title, but I think it's simpler if it stays where it is.

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Summarizing all, I feel that "The list of automobile makes" is still the best.

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I can't get to the article, it keeps redirecting to the automotive industry. --

1742: 939: 884: 820: 577: 304: 293: 278: 270: 242: 102: 79: 1372: 1075: 987: 859: 839: 693: 685: 402: 246: 73: 52: 1293:. Please feel free to argue about whether it counts as German or British. 379:

I did agree with their move of Britain to United Kingdom, and re-added it.

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2. I have changed the name of "Riker Electric" to "Riker Motor Vehicle."

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be a 'W' - which is Germany - not 'S' which would be British. Go figure.

1253: 642:(see: FSO of Poland (in brackets there are separate brands produced). Or 739:

I think, the concept of this list should be changed. We have a category

968: 512: 1741:(Argentina instead of Estado). Estado seems the correct option if so. 1248:

But before anyone changes it again, please read the articles entitled

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Does anyone know anything about the Laforza? It seems they produced

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A factory in a different country does not an automobile company make

1504:

Removal of Wrightspeed and Teslamotors from minor car manufacturers

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an automobile manufacturer but in strict sense, it is not a brand.

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Troll from Norway missing on your list. Have a nice weekend:)

624:? I would be happy to see these. I disagree that there is a 15: 300: 588:

so; all I've ever known about have been <something: -->

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were all originally separate but bought out or merged. --

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As you see, all possible variations have their problems.

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A few points in response to previous issues raised here

241:

Removed the Edsel, it was never a brand by itself, see

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Millisits - By "distinctive element" I think you mean

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is not an automobile manufacturer but a brand. Should

616:

OK,OK, I know that you are right. However, is there a

277:(Mini Metro) I know what I'm taking about I had one. 101:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 1066:They're in the list because they made cars. Duh! 576:Was there any car sold under the brand Zagato ? 412:I believe the manufacturers use the description 1471:http://www.autozine.org/Manufacturer/France.htm 461:called "a separate brand", "a separate make". 982:The Laforza was built by italian manufacturer 299:I answer to myself : There was BSA cars see : 1371:Where are all of the major US car companies? 8: 1163:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion/Fisker 1440:This more acuratly displays current stats. 47: 21: 19: 1693:List of Western European cars#Netherlands 1281:into this list - or erroneously confuse 1109:List of defunct automobile manufacturers 819:would cover short company names such as 813:List of defunct automobile manufacturers 664:, an Austrian car assembly plant. This ' 1764:regarding the criteria for this list. 1463: 115:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Automobiles 49: 1179:This page seems to be the similar to 1165:. You may wish to comment on this. -- 7: 759:would maintain a redirect to Subaru. 95:This article is within the scope of 995:Manufacturers/defunct manufacturers 38:It is of interest to the following 1897:Top-importance Automobile articles 684:believe they should be removed. -- 589:Zagato; Alfa, Aston, Lancia, etc. 14: 1011:other automobile manufacturer. -- 905:C-class (also mainly exported). 817:List of automobile manufacturers 805:List of automobile manufacturers 622:List of automobile coachbuilders 447:manufacturers, in strict sense. 367:I reverted the anon who removed 118:Template:WikiProject Automobiles 82: 72: 51: 20: 135:This article has been rated as 1892:List-Class Automobile articles 1183:. Possible to merge the two? 1072:here's the Messerschmitt Tiger 1: 1878:10:19, 13 December 2023 (UTC) 1819:23:33, 17 December 2016 (UTC) 1800:12:41, 13 December 2016 (UTC) 1777:16:27, 30 November 2016 (UTC) 1623:01:41, 11 February 2007 (UTC) 1481:Renault - Nissan relationship 1454:06:26, 25 December 2006 (UTC) 1445:06:25, 25 December 2006 (UTC) 1200:22:18, 24 November 2005 (UTC) 1190:I think the original idea of 182:19:52, 10 November 2005 (UTC) 163:certain brand of t-shirts. -- 109:and see a list of open tasks. 1730:03:59, 29 October 2011 (UTC) 1705:12:50, 11 October 2011 (UTC) 1591:20:38, 21 January 2007 (UTC) 1574:20:07, 21 January 2007 (UTC) 1525:20:37, 11 January 2007 (UTC) 1427:16:40, 26 October 2006 (UTC) 1397:16:38, 26 October 2006 (UTC) 1236:23:47, 21 January 2006 (UTC) 1170:09:00, 30 October 2005 (UTC) 618:List of automobile designers 1858:10:46, 6 January 2023 (UTC) 1499:14:20, 5 January 2007 (UTC) 1403:WOW Who did Porsche Upset ? 1376:19:40, 31 August 2006 (UTC) 1126:18:23, 12 August 2005 (UTC) 1117:15:17, 12 August 2005 (UTC) 1078:10:10, August 2, 2005 (UTC) 915:08:47, 24 August 2012 (UTC) 232:03:06, 30 August 2008 (UTC) 215:02:50, 30 August 2008 (UTC) 201:02:28, 30 August 2008 (UTC) 1913: 1762:WT:WikiProject Automobiles 1102:23:56, 9 August 2005 (UTC) 1056:16:25, 1 August 2005 (UTC) 788:List of automobile marques 426:List of major corporations 374:List of automobile marques 261:13:44, 29 March 2006 (UTC) 141:project's importance scale 1839:22:02, 28 June 2021 (UTC) 1760:There is a discussion at 1676:10:25, 5 March 2007 (UTC) 1648:10:21, 5 March 2007 (UTC) 1605:22:48, 5 March 2007 (UTC) 1564:Manufacturers or marques? 1557:18:03, 6 March 2007 (UTC) 1361:05:25, 20 July 2006 (UTC) 1344:05:02, 20 July 2006 (UTC) 1298:13:10, 7 March 2006 (UTC) 1187:19:49, 24 Nov 2005 (GMT) 1144:22:40, 5 March 2007 (UTC) 1068:Here's the Heinkel Trojan 1033:15:12, 27 July 2005 (UTC) 1016:21:32, 24 July 2005 (UTC) 978:00:44, 2005 Mar 13 (UTC) 688:09:28, 23 Aug 2004 (UTC) 675:01:32, 19 Aug 2004 (UTC) 657:17:31, 18 Aug 2004 (UTC) 626:List of automobile brands 593:20:36, Aug 15, 2004 (UTC) 580:20:24, 15 Aug 2004 (UTC) 572:21:00, 14 Aug 2004 (UTC) 532:01:02, 14 Jul 2004 (UTC) 519:19:45, 11 Jul 2004 (UTC) 414:Range Rover by Land Rover 396:09:52, 11 Jun 2004 (UTC) 383:09:10, Jun 5, 2004 (UTC) 345:15:59, 19 Nov 2003 (UTC) 338:15:54, 19 Nov 2003 (UTC) 315:00:10, 26 Aug 2003 (UTC) 307:21:51, 21 Aug 2003 (UTC) 301:http://www.bsafwdc.co.uk/ 296:21:49, 21 Aug 2003 (UTC) 288:08:58, 20 Aug 2003 (UTC) 281:21:27 Apr 15, 2003 (UTC) 134: 67: 46: 1751:05:07, 3 June 2015 (UTC) 1328:21:12, 27 May 2006 (UTC) 1312:09:14, 27 May 2006 (UTC) 1289:. Please do not remove 990:14:21, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC) 862:15:11, 24 Aug 2004 (UTC) 842:15:54, 23 Aug 2004 (UTC) 799:15:12, 23 Aug 2004 (UTC) 696:10:23, 23 Aug 2004 (UTC) 608:15:12, 23 Aug 2004 (UTC) 536:Dear savvy Wikipedians, 493:13:31, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC) 405:09:14, 23 Aug 2004 (UTC) 359:10:47, 1 Mar 2004 (UTC) 249:05:54 Feb 5, 2003 (UTC) 168:18:02, 1 July 2006 (UTC) 1277:So - please do not put 942:09:14, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC) 887:09:14, 6 Feb 2005 (UTC) 660:P.S. I have just added 419:18:19, 7 Oct 2004 (UTC) 98:WikiProject Automobiles 1825:Criteria for inclusion 1532:Removal of Teslamotors 1107:I chanced on the page 28:This article is rated 1666:comment was added by 1638:comment was added by 1543:comment was added by 1515:comment was added by 1449:also added reference 1241:Mini and MINI and BMW 757:Fuji Heavy Industries 749:Fuji Heavy Industries 32:on Knowledge (XXG)'s 1655:Skoda, Seat and Fiat 1334:Thank you to whoever 1216:Electrobat and Riker 1121:I very much agree.-- 901:sold to Peugeot.... 630:diferentia specifica 1863:Suggestion to merge 1303:Skoda? Entry level? 1062:posted by anonymous 1047:posted by anonymous 1040:posted by anonymous 1023:posted by anonymous 1005:posted by anonymous 743:, another category 121:Automobile articles 1367:Major US Companies 692:I strongly agree. 628:. This is not the 525:Dear Wikipedians, 443:A. "Manufacturer" 434:Dear Wikipedians, 273:15 April 03 21:18 34:content assessment 1844:Troll from Norway 1736:Argentina Section 1720:comment added by 1710:Mitsubishi Motors 1679: 1651: 1560: 1528: 1425: 1423:Now under review! 1395: 1393:Now under review! 1156:Fisker Coachbuild 1150:Fisker Coachbuild 809:Defunct companies 745:Defunct companies 552:Defunct companies 548:current companies 155: 154: 151: 150: 147: 146: 1904: 1732: 1661: 1633: 1585: 1538: 1510: 1473: 1468: 1421: 1416: 1391: 1386: 1355: 1322: 1159:car manufacturer 1001:list of airlines 123: 122: 119: 116: 113: 92: 87: 86: 85: 76: 69: 68: 63: 55: 48: 31: 25: 24: 23: 16: 1912: 1911: 1907: 1906: 1905: 1903: 1902: 1901: 1882: 1881: 1865: 1846: 1827: 1784: 1758: 1738: 1715: 1712: 1685: 1662:—The preceding 1657: 1634:—The preceding 1630: 1615: 1583: 1566: 1539:—The preceding 1534: 1511:—The preceding 1506: 1487:Renault website 1483: 1478: 1477: 1476: 1469: 1465: 1435: 1414: 1405: 1384: 1369: 1353: 1336: 1320: 1305: 1243: 1226:Andrew L. Riker 1218: 1207: 1177: 1152: 1123:David R. Ingham 1053:David R. Ingham 1030:David R. Ingham 1013:David R. Ingham 997: 961: 871: 681: 560:General Motors 428: 389: 365: 352: 331: 239: 234: 189: 175: 160: 120: 117: 114: 111: 110: 88: 83: 81: 61: 29: 12: 11: 5: 1910: 1908: 1900: 1899: 1894: 1884: 1883: 1864: 1861: 1845: 1842: 1826: 1823: 1822: 1821: 1783: 1780: 1757: 1754: 1737: 1734: 1722:186.106.34.128 1711: 1708: 1684: 1681: 1668:89.172.116.210 1656: 1653: 1640:89.172.116.210 1629: 1628:Renault-Nissan 1626: 1614: 1613:Main markets ? 1611: 1610: 1609: 1608: 1607: 1594: 1593: 1565: 1562: 1533: 1530: 1505: 1502: 1482: 1479: 1475: 1474: 1462: 1461: 1457: 1434: 1431: 1430: 1429: 1404: 1401: 1400: 1399: 1368: 1365: 1364: 1363: 1335: 1332: 1331: 1330: 1304: 1301: 1275: 1274: 1270: 1262: 1242: 1239: 1217: 1214: 1212: 1206: 1203: 1176: 1173: 1151: 1148: 1147: 1146: 1106: 1094: 1093: 1092: 1091: 1090: 1089: 1088: 1087: 1086: 1085: 1084: 1083: 1082: 1081: 1080: 1079: 996: 993: 992: 991: 984:Rayton Fissore 960: 957: 946: 945: 944: 943: 922: 921: 920: 919: 918: 917: 891: 890: 889: 888: 870: 867: 866: 865: 864: 863: 855: 851: 850:indessociable. 844: 843: 801: 800: 779: 778: 777: 776: 767: 766: 765: 764: 760: 737: 734: 733:the same time! 730: 720: 719: 718: 717: 713: 707: 706: 705: 704: 698: 697: 680: 677: 615: 613: 612: 611: 610: 609: 595: 594: 574: 534: 496:Dear Authors, 470:D. Trademarks 433: 427: 424: 423: 422: 421: 420: 407: 406: 388: 385: 364: 361: 351: 348: 347: 330: 327: 326: 325: 324: 303:Thanks Google 267: 266: 265: 264: 263: 238: 235: 221: 188: 185: 174: 171: 159: 158:"Motor Brands" 156: 153: 152: 149: 148: 145: 144: 137:Top-importance 133: 127: 126: 124: 107:the discussion 94: 93: 77: 65: 64: 62:Top‑importance 56: 44: 43: 37: 26: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 1909: 1898: 1895: 1893: 1890: 1889: 1887: 1880: 1879: 1875: 1871: 1870:Michieliosios 1862: 1860: 1859: 1855: 1851: 1843: 1841: 1840: 1836: 1832: 1824: 1820: 1817: 1816: 1811: 1810: 1804: 1803: 1802: 1801: 1798: 1797: 1792: 1791: 1781: 1779: 1778: 1775: 1774: 1769: 1768: 1763: 1755: 1753: 1752: 1748: 1744: 1735: 1733: 1731: 1727: 1723: 1719: 1709: 1707: 1706: 1702: 1698: 1694: 1690: 1682: 1680: 1677: 1673: 1669: 1665: 1654: 1652: 1649: 1645: 1641: 1637: 1627: 1625: 1624: 1621: 1612: 1606: 1603: 1598: 1597: 1596: 1595: 1592: 1589: 1588: 1586: 1578: 1577: 1576: 1575: 1572: 1563: 1561: 1558: 1554: 1550: 1546: 1542: 1531: 1529: 1526: 1522: 1518: 1517:66.182.15.218 1514: 1503: 1501: 1500: 1496: 1492: 1488: 1480: 1472: 1467: 1464: 1460: 1456: 1455: 1452: 1447: 1446: 1443: 1438: 1432: 1428: 1424: 1420: 1419: 1417: 1410: 1409: 1408: 1402: 1398: 1394: 1390: 1389: 1387: 1380: 1379: 1378: 1377: 1374: 1366: 1362: 1359: 1358: 1356: 1348: 1347: 1346: 1345: 1342: 1341:168.253.10.75 1333: 1329: 1326: 1325: 1323: 1316: 1315: 1314: 1313: 1310: 1302: 1300: 1299: 1296: 1292: 1288: 1284: 1280: 1271: 1267: 1263: 1259: 1258: 1257: 1255: 1251: 1246: 1240: 1238: 1237: 1234: 1229: 1227: 1222: 1215: 1213: 1210: 1204: 1202: 1201: 1198: 1193: 1188: 1186: 1182: 1174: 1172: 1171: 1168: 1164: 1160: 1157: 1149: 1145: 1142: 1137: 1136: 1135: 1132: 1128: 1127: 1124: 1119: 1118: 1115: 1110: 1104: 1103: 1100: 1077: 1073: 1069: 1065: 1064: 1063: 1059: 1058: 1057: 1054: 1050: 1049: 1048: 1043: 1042: 1041: 1036: 1035: 1034: 1031: 1026: 1025: 1024: 1019: 1018: 1017: 1014: 1009: 1008: 1007: 1006: 1002: 994: 989: 985: 981: 980: 979: 977: 974:Any ideas? -- 972: 970: 966: 958: 956: 953: 950: 941: 937: 936: 935: 934: 933: 929: 926: 916: 912: 908: 903: 902: 899: 898: 897: 896: 895: 886: 882: 881: 880: 879: 878: 874: 868: 861: 856: 852: 848: 847: 846: 845: 841: 836: 835: 834: 833: 828: 826: 825:Audi Hungária 822: 818: 814: 810: 806: 798: 794: 789: 786:. There is a 785: 781: 780: 775: 771: 770: 769: 768: 761: 758: 754: 750: 746: 742: 738: 735: 731: 728: 727:manufacturers 724: 723: 722: 721: 714: 711: 710: 709: 708: 702: 701: 700: 699: 695: 691: 690: 689: 687: 678: 676: 674: 669: 667: 663: 658: 656: 651: 649: 645: 641: 638: 637: 631: 627: 623: 620:?? Or even a 619: 607: 603: 599: 598: 597: 596: 592: 587: 583: 582: 581: 579: 573: 571: 566: 563: 561: 555: 553: 549: 545: 540: 537: 533: 531: 526: 523: 520: 518: 515:. Regards, -- 514: 510: 506: 502: 497: 494: 492: 487: 484: 481: 478: 475: 471: 468: 465: 462: 458: 455: 453: 448: 444: 441: 438: 435: 431: 425: 418: 415: 411: 410: 409: 408: 404: 399: 398: 397: 395: 386: 384: 382: 377: 375: 370: 362: 360: 358: 349: 346: 344: 339: 337: 328: 323: 318: 317: 316: 314: 308: 306: 302: 297: 295: 289: 287: 282: 280: 274: 272: 262: 259: 254: 253: 252: 251: 250: 248: 244: 236: 233: 229: 225: 220: 217: 216: 212: 208: 203: 202: 198: 194: 186: 184: 183: 180: 172: 170: 169: 166: 157: 142: 138: 132: 129: 128: 125: 108: 104: 100: 99: 91: 80: 78: 75: 71: 70: 66: 60: 57: 54: 50: 45: 41: 35: 27: 18: 17: 1866: 1847: 1828: 1814: 1809:Dennis Brown 1808: 1795: 1790:Dennis Brown 1789: 1785: 1772: 1767:Dennis Brown 1766: 1759: 1739: 1716:— Preceding 1713: 1697:Mark in wiki 1689:List of cars 1686: 1658: 1631: 1616: 1581: 1567: 1545:Ajgilbertson 1535: 1507: 1484: 1466: 1458: 1451:68.224.14.81 1448: 1442:68.224.14.81 1439: 1436: 1412: 1406: 1382: 1370: 1351: 1337: 1318: 1309:Duke toaster 1306: 1276: 1265: 1247: 1244: 1230: 1223: 1219: 1211: 1208: 1205:Deleted part 1192:List of cars 1191: 1189: 1181:List of cars 1178: 1153: 1133: 1129: 1120: 1105: 1095: 1061: 1046: 1039: 1022: 1004: 998: 973: 962: 954: 951: 947: 930: 927: 923: 892: 875: 872: 829: 802: 783: 726: 682: 670: 665: 659: 652: 647: 643: 639: 635: 634:company name 633: 629: 614: 585: 575: 567: 564: 559: 556: 551: 547: 543: 541: 538: 535: 527: 524: 521: 501:Ferrari Dino 498: 495: 488: 485: 482: 479: 476: 472: 469: 466: 464:C. "Brands" 463: 459: 456: 449: 445: 442: 439: 436: 432: 429: 413: 390: 378: 366: 353: 343:Infrogmation 340: 336:Infrogmation 332: 322:Infrogmation 309: 298: 290: 283: 275: 268: 256:Division). 240: 218: 204: 190: 176: 161: 136: 96: 40:WikiProjects 965:Pininfarina 741:automobiles 662:Magna Steyr 636:and not by 544:Automobiles 509:Pininfarina 457:B. "Makes" 387:Range Rover 173:"2005 cars" 165:frank stein 112:Automobiles 103:automobiles 90:Cars portal 59:Automobiles 1886:Categories 1850:89.8.222.8 1756:Discussion 1620:Eregli bob 1459:References 1433:added note 1295:SteveBaker 1175:Duplicate? 976:Milkmandan 907:Aliwal2012 821:Kia Motors 703:Dear Pc13, 565:Thoughts? 329:Page moved 243:Ford Edsel 187:Redirected 30:List-class 1584:Signature 1580:Regards, 1415:Signature 1385:Signature 1354:Signature 1321:Signature 1231:Thanks -- 832:Millisits 774:Millisits 673:Millisits 655:Millisits 570:Millisits 530:Millisits 517:Millisits 491:Millisits 477:E. Types 452:rebadging 1831:Sable232 1782:Criteria 1718:unsigned 1683:Obsolete 1664:unsigned 1636:unsigned 1571:Sable232 1553:contribs 1541:unsigned 1513:unsigned 1491:de Facto 1254:BMW MINI 1197:Malcolma 1185:Howard81 1167:Edcolins 1114:Cadillac 1099:Cadillac 967:-bodied 959:Laforza? 811:such as 584:I don't 522:- - - - 357:akaDruid 224:Black DS 207:Black DS 193:Black DS 1602:CBecker 1233:RedJ 17 1141:CBecker 969:Ferrari 755:)" and 591:—Morven 513:Bertone 381:—Morven 350:Reorder 258:Stude62 179:SatyrTN 139:on the 1161:here: 854:large. 784:marque 763:won't. 753:Subaru 648:Subaru 417:Andy G 369:Merkur 363:Revert 313:Morven 286:Morven 36:scale. 1743:L-Bit 1285:with 1269:list. 952:Ciao 940:Ericd 885:Ericd 751:(see: 640:brand 586:think 578:Ericd 305:Ericd 294:Ericd 279:Ericd 271:G-Man 237:Edsel 1874:talk 1854:talk 1835:talk 1747:talk 1726:talk 1701:talk 1672:talk 1644:talk 1549:talk 1521:talk 1495:talk 1373:Mrld 1291:MINI 1287:Mini 1283:MINI 1279:Mini 1252:and 1250:Mini 1076:Pc13 1074:. -- 1070:and 988:Pc13 955:Zak 911:talk 860:Pc13 840:SamH 797:Talk 694:SamH 686:Pc13 644:Lada 606:Talk 550:and 511:and 505:Fiat 454:"). 403:Pc13 247:Egil 228:talk 211:talk 197:talk 1497:). 1489:-- 1266:and 873:Hi 823:or 793:Dan 602:Dan 554:. 394:999 245:-- 131:Top 1888:: 1876:) 1856:) 1837:) 1815:2¢ 1812:- 1796:2¢ 1793:- 1773:2¢ 1770:- 1749:) 1728:) 1703:) 1695:. 1674:) 1646:) 1569:-- 1555:) 1551:• 1523:) 913:) 830:-- 795:| 772:-- 671:-- 666:is 653:-- 604:| 568:-- 507:, 503:, 401:-- 311:-- 230:) 222:-- 213:) 199:) 1872:( 1852:( 1833:( 1745:( 1724:( 1699:( 1678:. 1670:( 1650:. 1642:( 1559:. 1547:( 1527:. 1519:( 1493:( 909:( 226:( 209:( 195:( 143:. 42::

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