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IP did not cite a source, nor attempt to explain why (s)he thought the addition was notable, despite numerous requests to do so. Edits of this type -- where the editor simply adds the material back repeatedly without explanation, refusing all invitations to discuss it -- tend to be reverted on general principle; the community dislikes that sort of arrogance, even if the material is notable and sources are available. So, thank you for initiating a discussion of the point, and for trying to cite a source; unfortunately, IMdB is specifically rejected as a
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event has ever achieved that. That was when the USA defeated
England at the 1950 World cup. The only nation that didn't sit up and take notice of that event was the United States themselves. It made the front pages of national newspapers in over forty nations. That's a true shot heard around the world. A few soldiers a long way from home, listening on their own armed forces station because the broadcasters in the countries they were stationed in didn't care about the event is hardly a shot heard around the world.
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1176:, which clearly isn't the case here. The surrounding text suggest it's some kind of spying on the opposing team, though what for, how it might be useful, or why it is controversial is left unsaid. There are unexplained references to 'finger signs' and 'unprotected signs' without any explanation. These terms all appear to be jargon only understandable to experts in baseball. There should be some kind of explanation for the general reader; I've therefore restored the tag.
715:"Brooklyn finished the season on a 26–22 clip". I have looked in a number of dictionaries and encyclopedias at various types of clips; the bulldog clip, paper clip, hair clip and others but I can find no mention of a 26-22 clip. I'm thinking this is possibly some reference to the size of the clip but I'm also having difficulty imagining how the whole Brooklyn Dodgers baseball team can get onto one clip or how that would affect the result of the game. Please explain.
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718:"a complete-game shutout by rookie hurler Clem Labine." I am familiar with athletics in which a discus thrower is a person who throws the discus and a shot putter is a person who putts the shot, so I imagine a rookie hurler is a person who hurls rookies but I'm having trouble working out what part of a game of baseball would require him to do this. Please explain.
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In other words, he wanted to hear how the game ended as it happened, whether the Giants won or lost, whether it was a blowout or not, whether "something happened" or whether it didn't. But in that case, he would have told his mother to start recording with the top of the ninth, not the bottom. I know
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In the 2001 article used as a source, Richard
Sandomir says Goldberg "told his mother to hit the record button reached the bottom of the ninth inning." But the game could have never reached the bottom of the ninth inning if the Giants had won after the top of the ninth. What exactly was it Goldberg,
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in WP guidelines. There are notability issues as well: the Shot game was, in fact, mentioned during a M*A*S*H episode, but so what? If the game influenced the episode's plot, you could probably make a case for including it; but lots of "current events" were mentioned in passing during that series,
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By "clip", the writer implies "pace" or "run" or "streak." He means that thee team won 26 and lost 22 over a 48-game span. I suppose that "clip" refers to a piece clipped out of a whole season. U.S. sportswriters use it frequently. I don't agree with the choise, as 26-22 is hardly clipping. It's
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Can you add a line at the top pointing to other pages with the phrase "Shot Heard Round the World"? I had never known this phrase related to baseball and was looking for it's original meaning regarding the battle of
Lexington & Concord. Not having a way to get to that from here doesn't make any
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The way the tape-recording by
Goldberg's mother is described doesn't make sense. "…asked his mother to tape-record the last half-inning of the radio broadcast…" assumes his mother would know when the game was going to end before it happened. The game could have ended after the top half of the ninth
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The edit has not been "proposed by many"; a perusal of the article's edit history reveals that all of the edits in question (before yours) were made by two IPs, both of whom geolocate to the same city in South
Australia, and are therefore likely the same person. The edits were reverted because the
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I reverted that IP address' comments due to the unsubstantiated editorial shot against baseball. If someone wants to add in the presumably factual details about the term being used in the 1950 World Cup, they could do that. I'll try to refrain from taking an equally unsubstantiated editorial shot
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The commenter immediately above is, with all respect, being too literal. Americans have a way of assuming that everything that happens here is of significance and concern to the entire world. For many years, it was "the World Series" when there were no baseball teams South of the Ohio River or,
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With the greatest of respect Bugs, the term a shot heard around the world, in sports terms, is to signify an event of such magnituted that sports fans from Buenos Aires to Sydney huddle around their radios or read it on the front page of the national press the next day. In my experience only one
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A nagging problem with "in popular culture" sections is that they often degenerate into lists of unsourced trivia, and I'm sure that the numerous editors who have reverted this particular addition would tell you that they are trying to avoid seeing that happen here.
857:, it would seem that simply reverting an edit that, in the opinion of another editor, doesn't belong on a page is not seeking consensus. It is suppressing the contribution of more than one person who think that this edit should be included on the page.
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Epithet is not a good term. As per the
Knowledge entry on epithet, "In contemporary use, epithet often refers to an abusive, defamatory, or derogatory phrase, such as a racial or animal epithet." Alternate terms might be "labeled" or "nicknamed".
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I essentially agree with what Joe said above. Most in IPC sections are unreferenced. What some editors are trying to add here has been unreferenced also or they have been using
Knowledge for the source. For the latter case, per
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The article says it was the first game broadcast nationwide. Reading about the three-game series, they were the first MLB games broadcast nationwide, so this game would be the *third* game broadcast nationwide
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Well, the "what for, how it might be useful, or why it is controversial" aspects are not left unsaid; but those unfamiliar with baseball do deserve a more detailed explanation, which I have added.
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found in the Season 6 M*A*S*H episode. Since the edit has been proposed by many, and backed out just as many times, it would seem there is a disagreement that has supporters on both sides. Under
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What it should actually read is "The race for the 1951 National League
Pennant was projected to be a battle between the New York Giants, Brooklyn Dodgers, and Philadelphia Phillies." ˜˜˜˜
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Italics can easily be confused with parenthetical descriptions, which is why bold is usually preferred for highlighting specifically noteworthy phrases. It should therefore be considered
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There is a wealth of precedent across
Wikimedia for bolding the most notable portion of a block quote, or the most notable quote from a volume. Examples are as follows:
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Not so, IP address. Read what it says. It was played on Armed Forces Radio, and many
Americans overseas, such as those fighting in the Korean War, would have heard it.
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who thinks the meaning is clear. As requested, I'm explaining the problem on the talk page. I cannot simply fix the issue myself, as I do not understand the meaning.
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I finally found time to research the above assertions, and I could find nothing to support this alleged "wealth of precedent". Quite the contrary, actually: The
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Section starts: "The 1951 Major League Baseball season was projected to be a contest between the New York Giants, Brooklyn Dodgers, and Philadelphia Phillies."
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the story's been retold that way thousands of times, but it just doesn't ring true. It's the way somebody who doesn't understand baseball would tell it.
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Isn't "The Shot Heard Round The World" the euphemism to describe the start of the U.S. Revolutionary War? (Or so says old School House Rock clip. See
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Ernest Hemingway's old fisherman and his pals down in Cuba probably would have heard it on the radio! Not exactly around the world, but far-reaching.
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The first nationally televised game was game 1 of this series, not the final game. See Jules Tygiel, "The Shot Heard Round the World," in his book
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I knew something was going to happen. It was the third game of the playoffs. That kind of game had to be climactic, even if it was a blowout.
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He didn't use that phrase during the broadcast. He might have done so at a later time, or it might have been a sportswriter's inspiration.
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775:"Hurler" is just used as a synonym for "pitcher." What he hurls is the baseball. If he's a rookie, he's in his first season of hurling.
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There are no sources citing this. Take a look, for instance, at the Knowledge page for "Major League Baseball Television in the 1950s":
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To seek a consensus, there needs to be discussion and possible compromise. So, to foster that discussion I ask the following question:
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Oddly, even when I included a proper citation to DeLillo's book in my contribution, the addition was rejected. I am puzzled by this.
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Even after all games of August 11 Brooklyn led by 13 games, after the first game of the doubleheader that day it were 13.5 games.
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Is there a reason, other than personal opinion, why the reference to the M*A*S*H episode should not be included on this page?
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Well, as the comic strip B.C. once said, the world does not revolve around the sun, it revolves around the United States. :)
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Further clarifications added. Please let me know if it is now adequately explained, and if not, what remains unclear.
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472:-related articles on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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The first two games were not televised nationally, according to cited sources, so content is correct as it stands.
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Who coined this phrase ? None of the commentators appear to have said that and the article makes no mention of it.
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There's no explanation whatsoever, not even a link, as to what 'sign stealing' is. To me that phrase means the
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Uhhh, this would be referring to the National League only, not the Major League Baseball season.
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Just curious, as it seems there has been some disagreement about including the reference to the
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Would've thought it was particularly inapt, as no-one outside the US would have known or cared.
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inning, the bottom half of the ninth inning, or after any half-inning during extra-innings.
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to emphasize words in sentences, boldface is normally not used for this purpose." (See
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In the future, please explain your edits in the edit summary the first time. Thanks.
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My edit has been reverted, and yet there is no citation here to support this claim.
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and almost all such mentions fall into the category of trivia, from WP's standpoint.
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sense, as the latter meaning would have far more relevance than this meaning.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/Major_League_Baseball_on_television_in_the_1950s#1951
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I'm having some trouble understanding what this article says, for example:
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a life-long Giants fan, wanted to hear? Sandomir quotes him as saying:
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How could the article possibly NOT mention Don Delillo's major novel
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to bold the four (or one) famous sentences from Russ Hodges' call.
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The Play (Stanford vs. California)#Joe Starkey's call of The Play
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The biggest margin was 13.5 games, 12.5 games was brought
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Look up the term in a real dictionary. It's appropriate.
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In the case of Thomson's home run, it was particularly apt
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tag to the phrase 'sign stealing', but it was repeatedly
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except for St. Louis, West of the Mississippi River.
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A fact from this article was featured on Knowledge's
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1139:'sign stealing' clarification
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1409:— Preceding
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19:This is the
1318:talk to me!
1271:talk to me!
1225:talk to me!
1202:talk to me!
1109:talk to me!
1066:talk to me!
1025:Rowsdower45
922:WP:CIRCULAR
906:talk to me!
723:Cottonshirt
657:—Preceding
234:section on
231:On this day
148:free images
31:not a forum
1495:Categories
1309:DoctorJoeE
1262:DoctorJoeE
1216:DoctorJoeE
1193:DoctorJoeE
1174:road signs
1161:DoctorJoeE
1143:I added a
1100:DoctorJoeE
1057:DoctorJoeE
1021:de rigueur
999:Jesus wept
942:Underworld
926:...William
897:DoctorJoeE
791:Background
1286:"Epithet"
1077:TV Firsts
1048:sparingly
930:the roof?
827:Junior390
563:Wahkeenah
226:Main Page
88:if needed
71:Be polite
21:talk page
1423:contribs
1415:Jedimmel
1411:unsigned
1155:reverted
967:Purslane
948:unsigned
835:contribs
823:unsigned
802:unsigned
659:unsigned
555:contribs
543:unsigned
354:Baseball
345:baseball
295:Baseball
186:Archives
56:get help
29:This is
27:article.
1293:Pollira
1148:clarify
1052:WP:ITAL
1044:WP:BOLD
855:WP:CONS
777:WHPratt
761:WHPratt
757:Clipper
743:WHPratt
682:carrots
637:WHPratt
506:on the
381:on the
300:Dodgers
266:C-class
228:in the
154:WP refs
142:scholar
1474:Sorry
1458:BilCat
1329:Margin
531:Tintin
272:scale.
242:, and
126:Google
1170:theft
169:JSTOR
130:books
84:Seek
1480:talk
1462:talk
1447:talk
1419:talk
1393:talk
1361:talk
1343:talk
1335:here
1297:talk
1129:talk
1088:talk
1029:talk
980:Bold
971:talk
956:talk
873:talk
869:Mgg4
831:talk
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667:talk
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551:talk
373:High
162:FENS
136:news
73:and
1172:of
1157:by
498:Low
176:TWL
1497::
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