Talk:PlayStation 4/Archive 2

4402:, I was in the process of updating the entire article through a series of edits. One such edit was going to be in the Reception section addressing that very point about higher resolutions. I think you'd agree that this has been widely reported in media dating back to pre-launch. I halted those edits after the changes to the lead were reverted to focus on having a discussion first. I'll reiterate that I made the mistake of not adding and moving content first to the body of the article before I made changes to the lead. I was "trigger-happy" I suppose. Despite the way the events unfolded, it's still a valid concern that content in the lead must summarize content in the body. I agree that addressing content in the body, especially the Reception section, would be the best place to focus our attention first. 4510:

system more accessible (exactly the same transformation is described in our introduction to Xbox One). I'm not sure how to convey this information in entirely non technical terms, but we can try. Secondly, the reception section is undeveloped, particularly when compared to similar articles. This seems like a good place to describe the capabilities of Sony's system, notable performance differences, and what reliable sources say of them. We should start a new talk page section to help determine what general points to express. Afterward, we can select what elements should be represented in the lede. Paragraphs 3 and 4 could be merged together. I'm confident we can do this without losing essential information. —

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software at least for PSX games and probably for PS2 (for example x86 emulators of PSX exist at least from late 1990s/early 200s, and in PS3 emulation of PSX was by software, despite later models excluded hardware/software emulation of PS2). In fact even with planned software support it is not the solution for everyone - e.g. people lacking broadband connection, or living in areas without option of cable/fast radio Internet(example connecting usually by fast satellite, which despite this have big "pings").

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the secondary reliable sources that call it a console just to show there is an open debate over it. Console is just such a broad term. Also, I didn't "interpret" the definition. I simply listed it. Don't read so much into every little thing people say. That is how you miss the core argument. All I am saying is that the term "console" is EXTREMELY broad, covering a wide range of devices, and the way this article had a certain sentence worded, was very misleading.

4264:. Please understand that you cannot justify deleting material from the lede section because the information does not appear in the body of the article, then proceed to make the same error. The information you added regarding resolution differences, and how they might be perceived, was similarly nowhere to be found in the article body, which seems to undermine your explanation that this is partly what motivated you to make alterations in the first place. 4623:

comes to raw graphics power, and thus higher output resolution and smoother frame rates. In reality, due to commercial restraints, I expect most cross-platform games will look virtually identical across the two consoles for their entire lifecycle. PS4 exclusives that take full advantage of the console’s superior hardware, though, such as masterpieces produced by Naughty Dog, will probably look significantly better than anything on the Xbox One.

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resolution and framerate; better to "castrate" the PS4 version and release near-identical games to avoid ruffling any feathers. This claim was later countered by a contact at a different studio. "It would be totally fine for us to make one version prettier without any political difficulties but it usually doesn't make financial sense," they said, "unless it’s a very simple tweak."

1793: 1586:, you should note that I have stated, hours ago in fact, that the PlayStation 4 is to be known in Japan as "PlayStation 4" and not "プレイステーション4". So there is no need to have "プレイステーション4" on this article, nor is "プレイステーション" to be used on any PlayStation article, except maybe the main PlayStation page, because in Japan none of the consoles' names are written in Japanese.— 4854:

which "will probably look significantly better than anything on the Xbox One.". However, they expect third-party games to look "virtually identical" across the two consoles because the extra power would only be used to gain nearly imperceivable frame rate or resolution improvements, rather than making major enhancements to a single version of a multi-platform game.

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make sense to only remove it in the PS4 article. We need a consistent approach across all PlayStation articles, so that those looking after them know how to respond. If we agree that a broader consensus has already been established, then perhaps those wanting to change it should initiate an RFC, or at the very least, readdress it at the

1367:. Was this PS4 (game?) originally released with a Japanese title? Apart from this and all the above objections, my problem with with including a foreign language translation is that it makes the first sentence extremely difficult to read. If this is useful information (which I don't think it is), It could go in the body of the article. 4169:(which by the way I noticed you recently did). In retrospect, I probably should have moved the content first before removing it from the lead, which I'll be sure to do in future edits. I honestly never expected it would be reverted entirely without at least a notice on my talk page or here, and certainly not within a mere half hour. 1162:

internationally, does not preclude the fact that it was developed by a Japanese company. And saying "This is the English Knowledge (XXG)" doesn't mean shit when we have so many other articles that discuss and include text from languages other than English. So I have restored the Japanese language text to the lede of the article.—

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simply because it came out in the US first. The arguments that it's "international" have no merit under Knowledge (XXG) policy or guidelines. However, what I am discovering is that in Japan the console is not known as "プレイステーション4" but is called the "PlayStation 4" when described in Japanese text on Sony's official website.—

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identical. In other cases, designers may tap some of PS4's additional power in a straightforward manner, to boost frame rate or output at a higher resolution, whereas games from Sony's own first-party studios that take full advantage of the hardware "will probably look significantly better than anything on the Xbox One."

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magazine, numerous game developers have described the performance difference between the PlayStation 4 and Xbox One as "significant" and "obvious". ExtremeTech says the PS4's graphical processing unit offers a "serious advantage" over the competition, and while many third-party game designers may use

4638:

Excellent job of compiling excerpts from several reliable sources on the subject. It is much appreciated. All are good candidates for inclusion. I would like to clarify that "slight" was one of the many word choices in my proposal that can be accepted, changed, or dropped altogether. Just saying that

3954:

I think it's high-past time we cleaned up the lead. It has many issues including inline references, content that doesn't exist in the body of the article, and absolutely zero mention of the console's reception. My goal here is to make this a more interesting introduction that summarizes the article's

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The information regarding United States dollar game pricing has been removed for the following reasons: 1) The information is outdated (some games already retail higher than $ 60 due to inflation). 2) English Knowledge (XXG) covers more than just the United States, so focusing on a single currency is

3218:

And yet, in your preceding response, you argue the opposite, that company representatives are prone to making assertions irrespective of their accuracy (an issue compounded by journalistic sources who mindlessly repeat their PR spin). Interesting. So when a Sony rep makes a statement, we must proceed

3011:

This statement is just not accurate, regardless of sources. The average journalist doesn't take into consideration the Steam Machine and Alienware Alpha, both of which are significantly more powerful than the PS4, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. They are classified as games consoles, and that

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article as well. Either way, both consoles do currently support it, just not for games. For example, the Xbox One and PS4 could not play Blu-Ray movies until an update was installed. Even without the update, the support was still there, it just required the update to function. Remember, it "supports"

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that seems to be in contention here. If the PlayStation 4 was to be released in Japan in 2 months under a name written in one of the various Japanese scripts, because Sony is a Japanese company, I would argue that it the Japanese language text should be included on the page, regardless of the release

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I just don't see any benefit. Ryulong speaks of backround info and a "worldview", but in practice, its not really doing much of that. Its a direct translation, providing no sort of insight, and a vast majority of readers here don't know Japanese to begin with. Nothing against Japanese, its just not a

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Correct, for first party games I don't dispute that. However I feel that something along the lines of "Multi-platform titles that share the same development assets will often appear the same" should be mentioned as well, as currently it seems to imply otherwise and might give people the wrong idea.

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The "significant and obvious" article is outdated and not relevant anymore. The last year and a half has shown that games look exactly the same on both consoles and even that article states that the difference would probably be negligible on multiplats. I feel the article is old, and misrepresents

4242:

The point about unnecessary citations is a good one. The one exception is the paragraph concerning Sony's own pronouncements, and those of independent game developers, regarding the capabilities of the system. These claims were challenged in the recent past, hence the carefully added footnotes. This

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articles, so I respect your opinion. I can understand the knee-jerk reaction of reverting what appears to be a massive change. However, I feel that a closer inspection of the proposed lead changes will reveal that they are in fact an improvement over what was there before. I am certain that any kind

3608:

Big parts of this article read like an advertisement for the PS4. E.g.: "A dedicated SHARE button allows players to upload videos from their gameplay experiences." "When a title is selected online, only a portion of the game data has to be transferred to the system before it can be started (e.g. the

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A primary source, the Alineware website, calls the Alienware Alpha a "CONSOLE". That is all that matters, really. Regardless of what a couple journalists report, the Alienware Alpha is a console. Can you find a source that says it isn't? NO. Can you find one that says it is? YES, there are hundreds.

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It's not surprising Valve are targeting traditional consoles with some of the more affordable Steam machines, but this reflects pliable marketing language than anything else. More to the point, how do a preponderance of secondary sources depict Steam machines? It's easy to find opinion that describe

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I agree with the fact it is at greater risk standing vertically (without a stand, of course). My argument is that the picture located at commons represents the PS4 better. It gives a more close up view of both the console and the DS4. Not only that, but Sony represents it vertically in all the ads I

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Secondly people were angry because of the money that they spend, some cited it literally: "That's probably not going to sit well with gamers. Why would anyone want to repurchase titles they've spent hundreds of dollars on already? This probably won't be as much of an issue with PS3 titles since most

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does not hold any power here. And the fact still stands is that this is a Japan-related article considering Sony is a Japanese company, which means that the Japanese language text should be included. There is no reason to treat this differently from the PSX, the PS2, the PS3, the PSP, or the PS Vita

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This is a probably a learning process for a lot of us who haven't been a part of the older discussions, or for those who have, perhaps it will provide further clarification. It doesn't matter much to me either on what the outcome ends up being, but I share the same concern as Ryulong that it doesn't

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This I believe is the dominant viewpoint. With regard to architecture, the two systems are remarkably similar (it really is striking when you consider neither competitor knew what the other was planning). But PS4's faster memory and GPU is said to offer Sony a significant advantage. It's not final,

4643:

a performance advantage without describing the amount (e.g. dropping "slight") may very well end up being the least controversial choice. Regardless, I'm sure we won't have a problem reaching an agreement. Let's continue the process you started to improve the reception section, and then contemplate

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In short, the PS4’s GPU is — on paper — 50% more powerful than the Xbox One. The Xbox One’s slightly higher GPU clock speed might ameliorate some of the difference, but really, the PS4’s 50% higher CU count is a serious advantage for the Sony camp. I think the PS4 will always have the edge when it

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are unnecessary and belong in the technical sections of the article. A non-technical reader gains nothing by their inclusion in the lead, especially when there's no comparison or context to what they mean. Also, the paragraph about the console's interactivity needs to be summarized, more so that it

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Prior to its release, the PlayStation 4 received widespread praise for engineering choices that went into the design, including high-end graphics memory that gave the console a slight edge over the competition in terms of performance capabilities. The PS4 was well-received by critics and led global

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not to make the claim at all, but just to say "Sony calls the PlayStation 4 the world's most powerful console.". We can avoid the muddy definitions of "console" and "power" by just quoting Sony directly. Although not explicit, what they're clearly trying to say is "The PS4 is more powerful than the

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I didn't mean to sound like I was using a double-standard. I was just saying that Dell classifies its Alienware Alpha as a console. I am not arguing the opposite. I am arguing that many reps do tout their product. Whether it be Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, or even Sega did with the Dreamcast. I added

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Steam Machines are basically just another type of PC, so it’s not surprising that Valve was showing off a line of Steam Machines developed by gaming PC manufacturers like iBuyPower, Falcon Northwest, Alienware, and Gigabyte. These are more like PCs than consoles, offering a wide variety of hardware

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It’s too early to tell if Steam Machines will take off, but one thing is for certain: people are confused about the Steam Machine. Today, we’re going to attempt to answer any questions you might have about the Steam Machine and explain why it may (or may not) be your next gaming PC. What are Steam

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PS2 and PS3 could be safely operated vertically or horizontally with or without a stand. You'd be taking a greater risk with PS4, wouldn't you agree? In any case, what is your evidence that "most people" have their PS4 standing vertically? I really don't see anything wrong with our present image at

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Lack of backward compability and require of internet was fairly criticized by PS playes and media. It is first situation in the console series without any off-line, and on premiere compability with older games. Despite other architecture, there were probably no problem, with straight compability by

2506:

I see what youre saying my point was it doesnt have support/content for it right now and in the way it's listed like that under video output format in my opinion makes it look like it supports it right now like its currently an option which it isn't because games and movies etc can only go to 1080p

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I don't see anyone saying that. There doesn't seem to be any support for this. You still haven't actually explained why this is noteworthy either, other than being an exception. How did this affect its design? Why is this worth noting that it was lead by an American? You still haven't explained why

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But surely there's some margin of error in any sales figures. It's not like any manufacturer has real-time data from every retailer in the world. The only difference here is that SCEI happened to use that word in their statement. It seems like a weird technicality to prevent showing more up-to-date

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Whether or not it is not a Japanese product is really irrelevant. The PlayStation 4 was developed by Sony. Sony is a Japanese company. Therefore this article is a Japanese subject, even if it has come out around the world. These are the same arguments that were put forward when someone tried to say

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magazine, multiple game developers have described the difference as "significant" and "obvious". ExtremeTech says the PS4's graphics processing unit offers a "serious advantage" over the competition, but due to the nature of cross-platform development, titles that share the same assets will appear

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Paragraph 2 we agree is problematic and needs immediate attention. There are two distinct elements here. Firstly, SCE's past development troubles are central to understanding their engineering choices. Adopting the familiar x86-64 instruction set found in most home computers is key to making their

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We don't come near to describing every single aspect of the system. The few we do make reference to are summarized because they fundamentally define the console and set it apart from what Sony has done before. Most importantly of all, these social features have received significant coverage by the

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I don't know if it's literally accurate, and I don't know if just that one source says "most powerful games console" — in which case the statement would still be wrong. I just spat on the ground and gave it a stab, rather than follow my first urge to delete it! ;) I should have included that one

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But neither the PS3 (especially the squared slim model) or PS2 included a vertical stand in the box yet both of them are pictured vertically. I just felt it would be more consistent especially seeing as how most people have the PS4 standing vertically regardless of it including a stand or not. The

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entry calls out the amount of ram reserved for the Xbox OS and the amount usable by game developers (5GB available to developers). In the interest of accurate comparisons I recommend the memory distribution mentioned in the Playstation 4 entry be updated to reflect the same information. This would

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I think the point being made here is whether or not the PlayStation 4 applies to the consensus that Ryulong is trying to follow. It seems like a unique situation, and a unique consensus needs to be made of whether or not it does apply. Yes, it is developed by Sony, which is a Japanese company. But

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That's funny, I don't recall hinging my argument on "I don't like it". I was pretty certain my argument was that it was a globally released item and name, announced as such, so a translation wasn't really beneficial or accomplishing anything, its not like its a Japanese name that got translated in

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Just a quick note that I don't believe we need to be completely non-technical. Your statement about the x86-64 instruction set is spot on clear, concise, and provides context. If we could add some form of that to the lead, I wouldn't see a problem with keeping x86-64 in there. My concern was with

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magazine, numerous game developers have described the differences as "significant" and "obvious". ExtremeTech hypothesised that the PS4's graphical processing unit offers a "serious advantage" over the competition but noted that the advantages would likely only be noticeable in first-party games

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One source even suggested that enforcing parity across consoles could become a political issue between platform holders, developers and publishers. They said that it could damage perceptions of a cross platform title, not to mention Xbox One, if the PS4 version shipped with an obviously superior

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features an interview with the chairman of Sony Computer Entertainment China, Takehito Soeda (添田武人), regarding the official release of the PS4 and Vita in mainland China scheduled for the start of 2015. I'll leave a summary here, if anyone wants to incorporate the information within the article.

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And I apologize for that. It just seems that considering the previous discussion that we particpated in, it appeared to me that that was the only reason for such. The reason it should be there is because it provides readers with more information that some may find interesting, and it cements the

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to the predominant ones, much like we do in other topics such as film. Then the predominant ones will help us form the best wording in the lead. It would probably help to differentiate between the developer's perspective and that of the gamer or consumer (described by experts in the industry of

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Richard Leadbetter was one of the earliest people to argue that most third-party developers would use PS4's extra power in the most mundane way possible, with simple framerate and resolution improvements. External developers, he suggested, are not going to invest considerable time and resources

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A lot has been been written about this topic and, the truth is, we can cherry-pick sources that say the performance gap is small and we can handpick sources to say the gap is large. People who say the performance gap is "slight" appear to base their findings on a single metric. That standard of

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Only one of the sources claimed it was the most powerful, and it was a statement from a Sony representative, and every rep for any company will claim something about their console. Even if it was from an actual secondary source, doesn't make it true. Like I said, some journalists think Elvis is

3223:) PR blurb can indeed be misleading. Nor are we interested in hearing your personal interpretation of Webster dictionary. Knowledge (XXG) policy is very clear on this point. As editors, we defer to reliable secondary sources. Not merely one or two, which could present a distorted picture, but a 3128:

Question: What are Steam Machines? Answer: Steam Machines are specialized gaming PCs made by a variety of manufacturers. They run on SteamOS, a unique operating system based on Ubuntu Linux and produced by game developer Valve. Steam Machines are generally optimized as living-room entertainment

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And while I'm at it let me clarify that piece of the guideline that you quoted ViperSnake151. If a game is known as FOOBAR in Japan then that means we only need to refer to it as such in English without any katakana accompaniment. Should the game be known as フーバー in Japan, even if it is clearly

433:

I thought the same a long time ago. What is probably meant is, that it is more complicated to program for (actually the hardware is in some ways simple (the SPEs) that makes programming complicated). I'm not sure how these edit requests work, but people can probably agree on new wording to this

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where it was revealed, among other things, that the PS4 would not have Audio CD playback, MP3 audio or DNLA capability, features present in its predecessor the PS3 for years. In addition, Blu-ray and DVD playback must be enabled by a System 1.50 update, which must be downloaded by the user upon

4143:

I appreciate the feedback. Let me address some of those concerns while we're waiting for other editors to weigh in. First of all, if you review featured articles, you will find that the tendency to exclude unnecessary citations in the lead is a common practice. Only in rare situations when the

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Are you displeased with the prose, or the mere fact these features are given attention at all? The install mechanism, social connectivity and general ease with which you can share media on Sony's new platform is something that has received considerable third-party coverage by reliable sources.

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The whole premise of the statement is preposterous and wrong. Not only is the definition of a game console not absolute, but the definition of powerfulness is not absolute. The number of FLOPs in your GPU is not the last word on power. And finally, the nature of the prose is non-neutral. I

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I understand removing sales figure comparisons to competitors in order to avoid fanboy wars, but a single raw sales figure on its own doesn't really mean much to the average reader: is that figure in five weeks considered "good" by sources? How does that compare to the market as a whole, or to

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The raw power gap will never be "outdated", no matter what API/SDK improvements are made. The same point is underscored again. Multi-platform titles that share the same development assets will often appear the same, "but the real advantage will likely come from the Playstation 4’s first party

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In summation, quality sources who are familiar with the hardware describe PlayStation 4's extra power as "serious", "significant" and "obvious", but say this advantage won't always be fully apparent in third-party, cross-platform titles. I would like to know if editors agree with this line of

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Why should it read "dedicated"? If I have a new car that boasts being the world's "fastest production vehicle", I wouldn't say world's "fasted production vehicle dedicated to racing". Whether or not it is dedicated to racing is irrelevant, it is still the world's fast production vehicle which

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Aside from some of the issues I addressed above, the phrasing/grammar in the lead also needs work, which was actually the main driving force behind my intentions to improve it. And regarding the length of the lead, we can approach that too when ready. Preferably trimming down to two or three

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But you see, that is where you are wrong. The PlayStation 4 does support 4K. You can check the reference. Regardless of whether any material is out that is in 4K is irrelevant to whether or not the system can support it. Just because my car's gas tank is empty doesn't mean it doesn't support

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The reception section is underdeveloped and requires more attention. Perhaps that should be our starting point if we wish to address the performance/resolution differences more thoroughly before summarising such viewpoints in the introduction. I have started collecting quality sources. —

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I think the fact is important enough to be put in a place were the average reader will see it as soon as they start looking through the article. PlayStation has been a console by a japanese company with a lot of japanese support at launch. It also usually launches in Sonys home territory

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states that items created by Japanese companies must include the Japanese language name of the item in the lede. The arguments put forth in that 4 month old discussion do not bear any weight. Simply because it was released in an English speaking nation first, or that it is being released

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If it's widely accepted that our introduction is excessively long, we can make minor adjustments until everyone is happy, but at the present time I do not believe that size is a problem. In fact, PlayStation 4's lede section is smaller than most other 8th generation consoles and their

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Under the multimedia section it states that PS4 no longer has DLNA support which it now does. it was implemented shortly after the E3 event in the form of an application called 'Media Player' which allows users to stream videos, music and images fro a media server such as a PC etc.

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more powerful? If not, there's no need for the additional qualifier. I think I know what you're getting at - that there are gaming PCs more powerful than the PS4 - but these aren't consoles so there's nothing to clarify. If it said "the PS4 is the world's most powerful video games

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Our figure simply omits 2 digits. It's a widespread practice ($ 99 sounds better than $ 100). You can argue whether this is fair or unfair but that is how reliable sources print the sum. However, the edit by Rounding Bhny introduces a clear factual error, as PS4 is priced $ 399.99

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Its a little redundant, but it doesn't really strike me as "silly". The way it is now, is how it is across all the video game system articles, so if it were to be changed, the discussion is probably bigger than just the ps4 article talk page. Might be something to be brought up at

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previous generations? There needs to be some element of context, perhaps finding sources that explicitly detail its sales rank amongst its competitors for the time periods being discussed (thus avoiding direct mention of specific competitors, or including specific numbers).

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measurement is multi-platform titles with straightforward resolution differences. The vast majority of PlayStation 4 games run in full HD whereas a considerable number of Xbox One games do not. This divergence has been labelled "resolutiongate". One of the sources added by

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It appears to be a new feature of the PS Vita to perform the capability of the PocketStation for the original PlayStation. This will mean that original playstation games downloaded from PSN to PS4 will be able to be used along with the PSVita (PocketStation functionality).

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with the statement that "still images and movie content is in consideration". So perhaps mentioning it briefly in prose with the sources that are out there is fine, but we shouldn't have it listed in the infobox or any other specifications table without better sources.

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A 4K TV is obviously already capable of playing 4K content and considering the XBONE struggles with full hd i doubt it will ever support 4K the thing is neither console is capable right now so it just seems like false information or vaporware to me thats all im saying.

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some of the additional power in a straightforward manner, to boost frame rate or output at a higher resolution, titles from Sony's own first-party studios that take full advantage of the hardware "will probably look significantly better than anything on the Xbox One."

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4K for pictures and video. From Webster, support means "the act of being able to enable." The PS4 is able to enable 4K, regardless of when Sony chooses to allow it. Also, if it is decided it should be removed, it would not only need to be done on this article and the

1580:'s umbrella of "video game titles", realizing that I was wrong in bringing it up here in the first place, but it was one of the various prior discussions on this topic. Arguments that "it's an international product" have no basis in policy or guidelines, really. 853:

You haven't provided any source to your strange method of rounding down. I actually added the wikipedia rounding function and your removed it. As an extreme example would you round something that costs $ 1.99 down to $ 1, or something that costs 99c down to $ 0?

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Sony has announced 18.5 million sold but with their recent financial report have shipped 19.9 million. Since all other consoles use shipped numbers even though it's 'sold' on the actual pages so which number will we use here instead of starting an edit war.

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consoles (e.g. from Hong Kong, Japan, United States). SCE China is expecting to entice consumers to purchase Chinese PS4s instead of grey market PS4s on the basis that the warranty coverage would provide greater consumer confidence for legal PS4s over import

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alive, does that mean we don't need a death date at his article? Video games console is way too broad of a category which covers a wide arrangement of devices which does include Steam Machines. A misleading quotation should not be in an encyclopedic article.

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have seen. I won't argue it, because obviously it is my opinion (and another user according to the page edit history) versus yours. My better may be different from your better. It is just more consistent, I believe to have it standing vertically like in the

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magazine is a high quality source. You'd be hard-pressed to find one better. Its editors spoke with "multiple high-level game development sources" who all described PS4 as having a "significant" power advantage. This paragraph was deleted and replaced

2525:. It was speculation that 4K support would eventually be added for still images and video, but as of today, I'm unable to find any confirmation that this was ever implemented. The closest Sony ever got to officially addressing the feature was in their 4583:

The problem is that even the resolution difference is functionally irrelevant across PS4 and Xbox One The difference between 1080p and 900p or even 720p on home consoles is not nearly as noticeable as it is on PC the power difference is largely

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I'm find with removing too. I think it was only added because someone was concerned about discrepancies between shipped and sold at that given time. It can always be re-added if future shipped figures are released and seem to be of importance.

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The "Share button" feature on the Chinese region PS4 will differ to that of other regions, in that while it will involve the use of social media, they will need to comply with national regulations (as China has specific laws regarding internet

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already is. There's no reason to list every single feature that pertains to the interactive nature of the console. My proposed change does exactly that. It narrows it down to the most recognizable features (there's wiggle room here of course).

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magazine was vanished. The text was replaced with a new formulation that says the console only has "a slight edge over the competition". I immediately became suspicious because the whole thing looked like a stealth edit to remove unfavourable

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sales among video game consoles in 2014. Some have criticized the lack of meaningful software updates to the console, while others have praised its ability to play some games at higher resolutions than its primary counterpart, the Xbox One.

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providing a translation of "PlayStation" in Japanese, so if there is consensus to remove it here, it would also need to be removed in the other articles as well. So first and foremost, has consensus already been established? If so, where?

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doesn't apply but it used to apply until it was pointed out that if it was released first outside of Japan then the article should use the English name, but anyway in Japan it is known by the English name, so we should only have English.

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XOne" - they're not considering Steam boxes, either because they're not games consoles or because (if they are) Sony don't see them as the PS4's main competitor. The very fact that they make this claim (and Microsoft don't) is notable.

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interpretation is valid and should be kept in the article in some form. The problem is that the definition of a "games console" has become very fuzzy with the introduction of Steam machines and the like. It seems like a "games console"

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comment was a bit over the top, I admit. Part of the issue I had when I posted that was the timeliness of your reversion and the somewhat vague comment in your edit summary. I'm over that now and willing to move forward. In regards to

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The release and sale of first-party games for the Chinese region will be easier to facilitate, and this covers localisation into Chinese. SCE China will also make use of existing resources such as localisation teams from Hong Kong and

3143:

It appears that it is just be a small form factor PC. It will, according to Newell, be Linux-based. It will not be a closed system like a console. It will also be possible to change the hardware, install your own software run another

418:"Moving away from the complicated Cell architecture of PlayStation 3, PlayStation 4 features a simpler AMD processor" seems biased. Being complicated is an opinion not a fact. At least it should have sources of who thinks that way. -- 3635:

Other publications have identified PS4's immediacy as one of the possible reasons why it's one of the fastest selling systems of all time. I think the writing style is just fine. The sentences are short and straight to the point. —

1818:

Last I checked, this article was using the Month, Day, year format. Now there's a mix of the two with the majority being Day, Month, Year. As far as I know, MDY was the format on this article first and should have stayed that way.

3992:

by a number of editors here on the talk page, but you also deleted perfectly referenced information and replaced it with unsourced text. For example, the lede section previously summarised PS4's technical aspects in the following

2249:

The amount of RAM has not been officially confirmed by Sony to my knowledge. The article provided is old (July 2013) and speculates on an unconfirmed report by Digital Foundry. Best to wait until an official figure is released.

3132:

What is a Steam Box? Or a Steam Machine? Are they gaming consoles or innovative spa treatments? Let's clear up some of the confusion... It's a new type of gaming PC that looks like a console. Simply put, a Steam Box is a Steam

3058:

Regardless of what a few journalists may "think" about technology, the PlayStation 4 is not the most powerful games console on the market. There are journalists who claim that Elvis is still alive. Is there a death date at his

1201:. The fact that it was released internationally is not a reason to omit the information from the article, nor is the fact that it for some reason got released in the US first and Japan isn't going to get it until February. 3476:

Is this section essential? Is it possible to hide (or collapse) this section, allowing visitors to expand these details if necessary? It's excessive and not encyclopaedic having every release date recorded in a table. —

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If true, it could be something worth mentioning, but I don't think it needs to be put as the second sentence in the article. It keeps being placed as an awkward, random sentence, that breaks flow, and kind of sounds like

1517:"スーパーマリオブラザーズ" must be used on the page, and it doesn't matter if "スーパーマリオブラザーズ" is just the Japanese way to write the English phrase "Super Mario Brothers". I think I know what the meaning of the guideline is because 3087:

to mean an unmodifiable, out-of-the-box computer with a specific SDK whose games must be certified by the manufacturer. Obviously Steam Machines don't fit that definition but they're still falling under the "console"

4868:"Hypothesised" is a little too uncertain. ExtremeTech come straight out and say PS4's GPU is more capable. I'm also not sure about "nearly imperceivable" resolution improvements. It depends on who you ask I suppose. 1256:

because the arguments there for video game titles hold the same as names of hardware. In addition, the Japanese language text is included on every other article on a PlayStation console (it was previously removed on

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its such a gamechanger". (I'm not sure the article body even really covers that at the moment.) It doesn't need to be a random sentence that breaks flow and sounds like little more than unexplained, vague trivia.

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When asked whether the Chinese version PS4 and Vita will have region lock, he replies with a rather vague answer. "We will release products that are unified globally, while complying with Chinese regulations."

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that "I am legitimately telling you the PS2 emulation is real, if you want local disc playback, make noise.", which shows that technically it is easily possible, and no option maybe only by company decision.

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like I was removing sourced information and replacing it with unsourced statements, but on the contrary, it is a typical process of cleaning up the lead as the article evolves towards the goal of achieving

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Is this really a necessary metric to include in the infobox? It is out of date, and unit sales have already exceeded it. With Sony unlikely to ever give another Unit Shipped number, do we really need this?

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Valve has revealed the Steam Box, now known as Steam Machines, in an effort to take over so-called living room gaming. Steam Machines are “a powerful new category of living room hardware,” according to the

2120:. In any introduction, readers want the most important aspects mentioned only. Even if true, I'm not so sure this would be one of them. Certainly, it wouldn't be important enough to be the 2nd sentence. -- 684:

but somehow even that isn't good enough for you. Where do you get the idea that everything should be rounded down? Do you understand the rounding template? Do you understand "round to nearest integer"? -

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i found it on some article though no timeline for when it will arrive was listed. please find that article for me and use it as a source.(it is too hot for me these days for me to do that kind of work.)

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Done. Sebastian Anthony is now quoted directly saying many cross-platform titles will appear "very similar", everything else is the same. Other areas of the reception section now need attention. —

1428:, it is not necessary to include the name of the game in any other writing system." (Emphasis mine) Because the PS4 was launched in North America first, the logic of this page would suggest that we 648:

The price of the PS 4 is $ 399.99. The when it is displayed as a whole dollar amount the price is $ 400. This is using the wikipedia roundpad function. It is also basic notation that 99c rounds up.

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You are missing the point. Rounding is unnecessary and introduces a factual error. You have been prompted to support this contentious change by adducing relevant MOS or guideline. Kindly do so. —

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New PS4 CUH-1200 appears to use consistently slight over 80% of the power of older (original) version - this would be consistent with die shrink to 20nm - so keep an eye out for confirmation.

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They refer to it as a console. The sentence is completely inaccurate. The PlayStation 4 is NOT the most powerful games console, unless someone chooses to make their own definition of a console.

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when that's clearly not what any of them said. Most of the opposition said they didn't really get the purpose of it being there, something I'm still not sure of. You've made it very clear it

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It's better to provide a picture that is representative of how the device appears out of the box. Unlike its predecessor, PS4 is not designed to stand on its side without an accessory. —

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articles. That being said, I could care less what an infobox picture is (people don't come to Knowledge (XXG) for pictures). I was just seeing what others thought. Thanks for the input.

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However, look at the changes, the console was released in Japan after NA, where it was released first. An American man designed the console, and the console launches in all territories

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Should 4K really be listed under video output formats ? it seems kind of odd considering the console doesn't support it at all right now and may never support it especially 4K gaming.

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My point was it just makes it look like it currently supports it which it doesn't so maybe it should be changed to 4K (maybe) or 4K (one of these days) to be a little more accurate.

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As for the other points you raised, I think it's important to keep in mind the true purpose of the lead introduction, which is a summary of the article's most important aspects (

387:

Why does the following console attribute say: "Generation: Eighth generation". It seems really redundant and reads silly too, may I suggest this convention: "Generation: Eight".

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Yes, I agree that controversial statements in the lead should retain their references. Also, I'm glad we agree to work on reducing unnecessary citations. Where are we regarding

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https://translate.google.de/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gazeta.ru%2Ftech%2F2013%2F11%2F27_a_5773341.shtml

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I agree; personally, I think the Japanese names should only be included if they are noticeably different from the English name (or if there is no English name at all). Can

3092: 5258: 3499:). This confirms that the sales figures for the third quarter are sell-through numbers, and not shipped-to-retailers numbers. I will add the official source to the page. 3381: 4644:

later the best way to summarize its contents in the lead section. I'm beginning to think this part of the lead is going to look very different from my original proposal!

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Just in case this is still in question for some editors, the official "Sony Corporation Q2 FY2014 Consolidated Financial Results" slideshow is online, and can be found

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and this article include this because both consoles are capable of the output regardless of whether a game is out in that format. The 4K capability is not a dependent.

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advocates for inclusion of the text. A three-person !vote here does not overrule a guideline set forth by the project that is supposed to be looking after these pages.—

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So you are saying PS4 was originally released in Japan under a Japanese name? Yet when I check the article it says that it won't be released in Japan until next year-

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that because Pokémon X and Y were released around the world simultaneously that Japanese text shouldn't be included on the page. The only thing now is that I hate the

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I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not.

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The bit about the Edge story also helps clarify that "console" (in this context) refers to PS4 and XOne and doesn't include Steam boxes and the like. Any objections?

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with caution, to the point of discounting what they say; but when Valve issues a press release, we suddenly suspend our disbelief because "that's all that matters". (

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The introduction states that the PS4 is the world's most powerful games console. I'm not here to dispute that, but I think it should read "dedicated games console".

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So should a 4K TV be called a 4K TV even though no movies were being released in 4K when it came out? Yes, because regardless, it still has the capability. Both the

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due to its global release and other factors, it seems like the translation isn't necessary as it isn't necessarily a Japanese product from a certain point of view.

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community would agree that there is a lot of unnecessary bloat in the introduction, as well as some points surrounding the console's reception that are missing. --

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Please change the release date for indian market from 18th december 2013(was just a rumour) to 6th january 2014 which is the official date declared by Sony India.

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Not in this case? because you say so? Many publications make mathematical errors. That doesn't justify us doing it. Puting the price as $ 399 is a factual error.

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this is a "game changer". Also, stop re-adding it into the article until there's consensus on how to handle it. Its pretty clear discussion is still on going.

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are rounding the figure. The problem is that it is incorrect to round down 99, it should be rounded up. I used the standard wikipedia function for rounding

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specifications... There’s no standard Steam Machine hardware like a console offers. Instead, you’ll find a wide range of hardware like you would on a PC.

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My recommendation is to wait and let other edits have some input. And if something is badly wrong and needs tweaking, we can discuss it here first. —

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Please add to Criticism section following(despite backward compability section, similary most other sections have also a double with criticism sign):

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Guerrila Games announces a robot apocalypse-survival game called "Horizon Zero Dawn". (Kinda looks like you're playing Turok with robotic dinosaurs.)

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Retailers are selling the console at $ 399.99 though. I think we should just add that to the article and infobox and stop all this useless whining.--

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status. Until you reverted the changes, I was in the process of moving some of the removed content to the body of the article, which is evident in

2874: 897:. Plenty of websites reported the price without .99c following the announcement of the price and the press release, here are just a few examples: 3125:

Machines? Steam Machines – which are sometimes mistakenly referred to as Steam Boxes – are PCs designed specifically to run SteamOS and PC games.

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PS4's advantage lies with its faster memory and beefier GPU. Do you seriously dispute this? If so, please take a look at the following article:

3364:"Multiple high-level game development sources have described the difference in performance between the consoles as 'significant' and 'obvious'." 4941: 4077:, a feature that enables users to activate the PlayStation 4 from a distance away, in order to continue playing on a secondary screen, such as 1914: 4596:

Multiple high-level game development sources have described the difference in performance between the consoles as "significant" and "obvious."

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I have said nothing of the sort. I have simply described a hypothetical situation and a practical situation for the employment of the part of

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I found your edit summary ("clean up") to be somewhat misrepresentative of your actual edit. You not only altered a paragraph that had been

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Yeah, I appreciate you bringing it up. I didn't even read the sources though! I just saw the titles! I don't even have a PS4... in fact,

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Media Molecule announces "Dreams"...a creative game allowing animations of objects in a painting like environment...(I've got even less.)

2745:. Some of the others are though. My 2 cents - if someone wants to add it, sure, but as a sentence or paragraph in the reception section. 5171: 5151: 5106: 5049: 4945: 3613: 3448: 2726: 2522: 2508: 2478: 2464: 2430: 2289: 629: 116: 5259:

http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/03/17/new-ps4-commercial-calls-it-the-worlds-most-powerful-console-boasts-exclusive-games-and-content/

3176:

From Google/Webster: Video Game console: n. Noun. A video game console is a device that outputs a video signal to display a video game.

544:

Hi, would you please change the release date for the PlayStation 4, in South Africa, from December 2013 to 13 December 2013. Source :

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magazine, numerous game developers described the performance difference between the PS4 and Xbox One as "'significant' and 'obvious'".

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magazine, numerous game developers described the performance difference between the PS4 and Xbox One as "'significant' and 'obvious'".

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has a list of planned launch titles and system prices. Would there be anything worth shoehorning into this article at this stage? --

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Well, I am not 100% sure how VG/JP applies or does not, but the issue is that in February it won't be called "プレイステーション4" in Japan.—

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by Bhny but it was restored by other users and myself on multiple occasions) so its omission here leaves this page the odd one out.—

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If you have any issues with the proposal, or if you see any other areas that need to be modified, please let me know. Thank you. --

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Release date: 28.11.2013. Sales start at- 10.00 PM Moscow time (UTC+4), in Moscow & Saint-Petersburg City's "M-Vidio" stores.

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Articles consisting solely of details surrounding a game console's operating system, software, and changelog have been declared

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reasoning, before trying to develop these points in article main space. I'm also open to hearing arguments to the contrary. —

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includes racing and others. It is still the world's fastest production vehicle. Why point out that which is already included?

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Only the Wi-Fi version of the PlayStation Vita will be released in China, there are no plans for the 3G model to be released.

3403:

I love the new wording. The word console is far too broad. That new wording is way more clear and concise, therefore better.

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is all that matters. I know plenty of journalists that call one TV or BR player the best ever, etc. That doesn't mean it is.

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http://www.vg247.com/2014/03/27/ps4-psone-ps2-emulation-has-mixed-results-disc-based-backwards-compatibility-possible-rumour/

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Numerous industry professionals have acknowledged the PlayStation 4's performance advantage over the Xbox One. Speaking to

4849:

Numerous industry professionals have acknowledged the PlayStation 4's performance advantage over the Xbox One. Speaking to

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These and other passages may be correct, but are formulated in a way, it just looks like a Sony PR guy wrote this article.

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says the difference is notable in their tech reviews. This is what I drafted last night, with some of your text worked in:

3821: 5023:"At present the PS4 cannot store media files onto its hard disk. This feature is being worked on along with DLNA support" 2146:

I don't know if it is true, but I have heard it before although I agree that even if true, it shouldn't be in the intro.

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designed the console, it does not mean the consoles was "Made in America", which is how you are trying to represent it.

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The console is able to interact online and with other devices using a variety of applications and services such as the

820:

Not because I say, no, but because reliable sources say so. 399 is merely an omission; 400 is outright fabrication. —

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World of Final Fantasy, shares the art style of thetarythm (whatever it was called). A timed exclusive for PS4/Vita.

5226: 4247:. But I agree that fewer citations are preferable. This is one area of agreement where we can rapidly move forward. 4066: 3309: 3273: 2584:

The infobox is just listing the specs on the systems itself. Unless they start locking out 4k, it's there to stay.

2521:

After looking through the sources and searching for more updated ones, I have to admit I'm beginning to agree with

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article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

5135: 4182:). It needs to introduce the topic in a fashion that appeals to the general public. Throwing in elements such as 3511: 3035:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2360739/meet-alienwares-alpha-console-a-steam-machine-without-steamos-for-now.html

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I don't think you understand what rounding is. "399" is a rounding down from 399.99 (to 3 significant figures) .

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exploiting one systems full power to the detriment of the other. Indeed, an almost identical point is raised by

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English. I don't really care that much, so its not like I'm going to really fight for this or not, but come on,

4262:"the current lead is full of garbage and contains content that isn't even mentioned in the body of the article" 4004:

can perform 1.843 teraflops. Sony calls the PlayStation 4 "the world's most powerful console" and, speaking to

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http://www.pushsquare.com/news/2013/10/want_to_play_psone_games_on_ps4_sorry_youre_gonna_need_your_old_consoles

2414: 2173: 2059: 997: 349: 150:'s orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for 4830: 4705: 3919:

If anyone is interested, I'm gathering up information regarding the latest PS4/Vita controversy in China. See

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http://www.theverge.com/2014/8/12/5992547/alienware-alpha-console-will-steam-to-your-living-room-this-november

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in support of his proposed lede changes, saying the PS4 offers only a "slight edge" over the competition, is

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Nothing here about the connectors, whether it works on an older 720 screen, HDMI...very basic info missing.

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It's not true. Mark Cerny was lead designer, working in-house with Sony technicians in Japan and the US. —

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http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/playstation4-sales-surpass-53-million-units-worldwide-245922801.html

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In their technical breakdown of both systems, ExtremeTech expressed the same point but in a different way:

4421: 3809: 3756: 3444: 2722: 2406: 2285: 1772: 1450: 1382: 1055: 625: 169: 112: 94: 5191: 3885: 3773: 3462: 3216:"A primary source, the Alineware website, calls the Alienware Alpha a "CONSOLE". That is all that matters" 2754: 2385: 2310: 2189: 2079: 2035: 1954: 1925: 1892: 1721: 1410: 1241: 1187: 1009: 917: 707: 463: 402: 5208: 5021:

Multimedia features also requires updating in light of DLNA support announcment. Article currently reads

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Talk:PlayStation Vita#Regarding "region-free" Vita consoles in mainland China, and the larger controversy

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Like I said, if its true, that's fine, but the sentence should be in place that makes sense, and explain

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to at least be somewhat neutral, as a component of critical reception instead of a statement of fact. —

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I understand the counter-point, but if it is removed from this article, it needs to be removed from the

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I am not going to endlessly argue this issue with you, Sergecross, or with Masem, again, as we did at

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Agreed. Regardless of whether or not the systems are currently doing it, the support is still there.

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article in an international world view. Again, I really do not want to rehash everything I stated in

681: 5230: 4944:- lower weight/watts, changes to system LED, mechanical button replaces touch sensitive disc eject. 4279:"the paragraph about the console's interactivity needs to be summarized, more so that it already is" 898: 367:

The source gives 17 December for HK but only December (no day) for KR. The article is up to date. --

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foreign language titles should only be included if the game was originally released with that title

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foreign language titles should only be included if the game was originally released with that title

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Well, I plan on working on this at some point so expect all the dates to be MDY once I'm through.

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Para 2: Sony's past difficulties, new design choice, plus brief remarks concerning its capability

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http://venturebeat.com/2014/08/16/heres-what-the-alienware-alpha-console-can-do-and-what-it-cant/

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Knowledge (XXG) talk:WikiProject Video games/Article guidelines#"Translations" of Japanese titles

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Knowledge (XXG) talk:WikiProject Video games/Article guidelines#"Translations" of Japanese titles

1112: 993: 47: 17: 4283:"no reason to list every single feature that pertains to the interactive nature of the console." 3304:

template that warns someone to verify the quotation. Please do verify and refine, or delete. —

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https://support.us.playstation.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/5096/~/ps4-dlna-media-server-support

4649:

We should include a variety of performance gap viewpoints in the reception section giving more

3457:... please mension that the light bar is made for Sony's VR? It won't let me, using a phone. -- 2770:

stated, you need some reliable sources, but it is not enough to have its own section, I agree.

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It doesn't need rounding because the price is not $ 399.99, it is $ 399 according to sources.

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concision, so why drastically change it and delete well publicized features like Remote Play?

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I agree with you, and I don't mind the new re-wording of the statement near as much. Thanks.

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week that PS4 launched, the PS4 vertical stand was number 6 on the Amazon best sellers list.

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Warranties in China will only cover legally purchased China version PS4s and Vitas, and not

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It is more close-up and provides a better oriented at the PlayStation 4. What do you think?

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read "8GB (4.5GB minimum reserved for developers, 5GB potentially available to developers)"

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Its there in black and white. "Number of retail sales to consumers is estimated by SCEI." -

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Also note, the page says "These foreign language titles should only be included if the game

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http://mygaming.co.za/news/playstation-4-news/58847-ps4-in-sa-new-launch-date-confirmed.html

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Para 3: Emphasis on social gameplay and how 'sharing' is an integral part of the new system

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http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/dell-s-steam-machine-becomes-alienware-alpha-console/0137023

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http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/07/26/35gb-of-playstation-4-ram-reportedly-reserved-for-os

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include a Japanese translation, because it was originally titled using the Latin alphabet.

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Black Ops III (and apparently CoD games going forward) will get timed exclusive map packs.

4104: 4070: 4058: 4006: 3712: 3632:'s 1 year PS4 review, published only yesterday, highlighted both elements in their piece. 3609:

opening level), with the remaining parts downloading during play, reducing waiting time."

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What Are Steam Machines Anyway? Steam Machines, like ultrabooks, are a class of computers.

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Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Video_games/Archive_99#Category:Game_console_operating_systems

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misplaced. 3) No other game system cares to list individual game prices or inflation. —

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http://www.joystiq.com/2014/01/07/playstation-4-sales-reached-4-2-million-by-end-of-2013/

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most important aspects while leaving out details that are unnecessary in the lead (per

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I guess we have resolved this issue. If I may summarize, because the PS4 is not a game

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No amount of searching will help you with this. They've never confirmed such a thing.

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Para 1: Name of the console, launch date(s), and it's position in the gaming landscape

4073:, a cloud-based gaming service that offers streaming video game content; and wireless 2863: 2830: 238: 5083: 4655: 4572: 4541: 4425: 4221: 4036:

A widely cited performance benchmark was removed (1.843 teraflops). All reference to

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How would you guys feel about changing the infobox picture to the one located here:

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Three people saying "I don't like it" does not make a consensus at all. The current

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http://www.businessinsider.com/you-can-play-old-playstation-games-on-the-ps4-2014-1

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on the PlayStation Japan website, with very little information but references the

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The console enables interactivity with other services and devices, by way of the

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translated as "Foobar" the katakana and hepburn romanization should be included.—

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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the

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to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for

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By definition, the PlayStation 4 is NOT the most powerful video game console.

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i read that offline backwards compatibility for playstation 1 and 2 is coming

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article's subject is highly-controversial should citations typically remain (

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very common second language, compared to something like Spanish or French...

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is fine, I'm much more bothered that you cited the opposition as just saying

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Yeah, that was going to be my follow-up statement if this went any further.

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PS4 has sold through to consumer 4.2 million units as of December 28, 2013.

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Ryulong- you are making up your own rules. The only policy you pointed to-

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of video games consoles, which seems to be defined as Wii U, XOne and PS4?

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so even if it has the power to output 4K its not going to do it right now.

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dates, mainly because it is not a video game and doesn't really fall under

1337:. It makes everything unnecessarily longer which is one of the things that 187: 4486:

Para 4: A description of how PS4 interacts with other services and devices

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Sounds good. In addition to Sony, we can attribute the performance gap to

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of sources. How do reliable sources that tackle the issue head-on, how do

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https://commons.wikimedia.org/File:Sony-PlayStation-4-PS4-wDualShock-4.jpg

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PS4 was released in 28 November in Russia not 29 like the rest of europe

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Other fact is that according to "insiders" some of them stated on the

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have mostly American owned game franchises. It's a real game changer.

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were designed to be..." The correct plural of "policy" is "policies".

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so detested in the first place when I participated in the drafting of

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I listed that "actual retail prices will vary" and this is the case.

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PS Vue will offer ala carte TV networks (I think I heard that right).

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There is nothing estimated about it. Those are the sales of the PS4.

894:. An article on the PlayStation website lists the price without 99p: 1513:

was released first in Japan as "スーパーマリオブラザーズ" so in order to follow

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http://ro.playstation.com/news-and-features/ps4announsero/index.html

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I think this wording matches the overall sentiment of the sources.

188:"IGDA Lifetime Achievement Award for Mark Cerny - News at GameSpot" 549: 1139:

The archive consensus was to remove it (3 removes and no keeps).

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as you assert. Rounding has a function, but not in this case. —

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I don't think that warrants mention on this particular article.

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Please For January 4, 2015 and Angry Birds Transformers on PS4.

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Sony calls the PlayStation 4 "the world's most powerful console"

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them in terms "like" or "similar" to consoles (but not consoles

4165:. The next piece I was going to move was the excerpt regarding 5067: 4654:

course). Eagerly waiting to see how others feel about this. --

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I remain puzzled by the note you left on my talk page, saying

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Some of your sources, like neogaf and emulation zone, are not

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its dishonest to misrepresent the oppositions stance so poorly

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The prices were announced without the .99c. Here is the video

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It doesn't need its own criticism subsection dedicated to it.

89:

purchase, or can be requested via a mailed disc to activate.

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The Last Guardian...exists...still...2016...(I got nothin'.)

4721:

Playstation 4 Vs Xbox One GPU. Understanding the Differences

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I agree that this probably needs re-wording but I think the

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OFFICIAL Alienware website calling the Alpha a "console":

891:. The press release also lists the MSRP without the .99c: 4046:

I also don't agree with removing the following paragraph:

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in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of

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Rigs...a mech combat game...that's it. Went by too fast.

3441:...please change release date for Croatia to 29.1.2014 1426:

if a game was originally titled using the Latin alphabet

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talk page to give it the wider audience it deserves. --

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PlayStation 4 release date in Russian Federation + price

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Retail prices aren't consistent though. It says in the

5229:) per assumed consensus. Please discuss this action on 4162: 3968: 3963: 3265: 3220: 2004: 1099: 1095: 4540:

tossing around technical terms without any context. --

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kickstarter announced. (Site is currently overloaded)

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New Hitman game just titled "Hitman". (Not Exclusive)

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business magazine contributor Paul Tassi, who writes

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If anything needs clarification, feel free to ask. --

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http://www.emulationzone.org/consoles/ps/emulator.htm

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can be upgraded to PS4 games for an additional fee."

4694:the actual truth about the power of both consoles. 4566:

The performance gap, who to believe and what to say?

3967:Here is the current (at the time of this posting): 2967:

this point. We have a picture and it looks fine. —

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Does it need to be mentioned like that, in the lead?

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it be there? What's the net gain in it being there?

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This is in response to a recent removal of content (

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http://www.gazeta.ru/tech/2013/11/27_a_5773341.shtml

4669:So how about this, pending flow and grammar fixes. 4114:The original version had the benefit of expression 2864:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=747893

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http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2427228,00.asp

1799:The figures have already been updated on the page. 4988:Final Fantasy VII Remake...Also a timed exclusive. 577:; I see no reason for doubting these two sources. 4600:The two sources are not necessarily in conflict. 3301:how are you talking to me through this magic box? 2555:History of video game consoles (eight generation) 1910:http://scei.co.jp/corporate/release/140218_e.html 1000:, are selling the PlayStation 4 at £349.00, yet 4891:I think we're moving in the right direction. — 4216:article review by another editor outside of the 1102:). Every PlayStation article currently uses the 4877: 4847: 4671: 4620: 4611: 4594: 4581: 4097: 4051: 4026: 3998: 3526:Semi-protected edit request on 14 November 2014 3360:, after talking with numerous game developers. 3129:centers rather than comprehensive gaming rigs. 3113:) while other sources make clear distinctions: 1920:PS3 sales have reached 5.3 million worldwide. 1878:In the sentence: "...going on to say that the 4203:, I know you are a heavy contributor here in 3833:We always clearly state both if available. - 3153:It's not black or white, that's for sure. — 3051:Secondary Source for console classification: 3045:Secondary Source for console classification: 3039:Secondary Source for console classification: 3033:Secondary Source for console classification: 1505:Yes, and my example just spells out what the 604:PlayStation 4 release date in Romania + price 8: 4904:I'm going to move this over, if it's ok. — 1363:you gave for justifying Japanese even says- 454:Not sure what to make of this, but Sony has 140:Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting 5064:Semi-protected edit request on 28 June 2015 3417:I went ahead and re-added the new wording. 912:. These are the source I was referring to. 462:. Expect an announcement soon, most likely 5215:, and have been deleted and redirected by 5043: 4820: 4695: 3754: 3651:Both systems launch January 11, 2015, and 1999:First American PlayStation Console content 508:PlayStation 4 release date in South Africa 84:On October 31, Sony Entertainement posted 5150:suggests the above claim is now correct. 4779:2 Asynchronous compute units (16 queues) 4776:8 Asynchronous compute units (64 queues) 4333:244 words 1508 characters - PlayStation 3 4329:315 words 1971 characters - PlayStation 4 4277:I also disagree with the suggestion that 3231:categorize and define steam machines? — 3091:Maybe the statement should reference the 4732: 4061:, designed to enhance gameplay by using 3029:http://www.alienware.com/landings/alpha/ 2168:Ok so we should put in within the body. 1769:Please update this information. Thanks 5251: 5233:if you have any comments or concerns. 4819:I'm sure you could quote the article. 4420:paragraphs would be in accordance with 2804:was invoked but never defined (see the 2790: 1422:was originally released with that title 615:Killzone™: Shadow Fall Bundle: 1999 RON 4942:PlayStation 4 technical specifications 2335:Or, to put it another way, is there a 44:Do not edit the contents of this page. 4400:"seems to undermine your explanation" 3682:Interview with president of SCE China 2679:for this alteration before using the 2365:That is my point exactly. Well said. 1509:states so let me use a real example. 170:"Borderlands 2 opens up September 18" 7: 4317:372 words 2414 characters - Xbox One 4313:373 words 2364 characters - Xbox 360 3915:PS4 mainland China delay controversy 1715:I agree, I was fine with your edit. 1050:http://spb.mvideo.ru/playstation-4/# 239:"The Greatest Easter Eggs in Gaming" 5007:And that's it team blue. Have fun. 3342:Perhaps it would be better for the 2796: 207:Kasavin, Greg (December 12, 2005). 2907:Possible change to infobox picture 1487:contradicted what you are saying " 726:what source? price here is 399.99 383:Generation X Generation? Redundant 257:Hirohiko Niizumi (1 August 2005). 24: 4325:351 words 2158 characters - Wii U 4057:, through the following methods: 3785:US-centric prices & inflation 1978:information in the encyclopedia. 1519:I was instrumental in drafting it 209:"Final Fantasy IV Advance Review" 5121: 5071: 4588:This is in stark contrast to an 3760: 3580: 3533: 2667: 2634: 1791: 1658: 568: 515: 359: 299: 29: 4321:363 words 2208 characters - Wii 2339:-dedicated games console which 1638:Change of release date in india 609:Release date : 29 ianuarie 2014 434:effect (and find refs for it). 4592:magazine editorial which says 2007:which keeps getting re-added. 550:http://za.playstation.com/ps4/ 292:Edit request, 15 November 2013 1: 4909:01:08, 27 February 2015 (UTC) 4896:17:46, 20 February 2015 (UTC) 4863:14:30, 20 February 2015 (UTC) 4835:22:50, 18 February 2015 (UTC) 4806:20:36, 17 February 2015 (UTC) 4710:15:58, 17 February 2015 (UTC) 4688:21:24, 16 February 2015 (UTC) 4664:23:41, 12 February 2015 (UTC) 4633:22:56, 12 February 2015 (UTC) 4550:23:13, 12 February 2015 (UTC) 4515:22:48, 12 February 2015 (UTC) 4434:16:40, 12 February 2015 (UTC) 4352:21:14, 11 February 2015 (UTC) 4230:17:45, 11 February 2015 (UTC) 4128:22:15, 10 February 2015 (UTC) 3983:21:36, 10 February 2015 (UTC) 3779:02:00, 30 December 2014 (UTC) 3742:13:14, 18 December 2014 (UTC) 3677:02:08, 12 December 2014 (UTC) 3641:13:18, 16 November 2014 (UTC) 3622:11:37, 16 November 2014 (UTC) 3598:05:06, 14 November 2014 (UTC) 3575:04:56, 14 November 2014 (UTC) 3467:06:23, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3455:) 20:26, 1 October 2014 (UTC) 3427:22:56, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3413:22:51, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3399:11:27, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3371:10:37, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3352:07:48, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3332:05:13, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3317:02:35, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3295:01:52, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3281:01:16, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3251:22:50, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3236:09:45, 2 September 2014 (UTC) 3199:18:39, 1 September 2014 (UTC) 3158:09:52, 1 September 2014 (UTC) 3100:07:33, 1 September 2014 (UTC) 3073:03:47, 1 September 2014 (UTC) 3022:03:35, 1 September 2014 (UTC) 3007:"Most Powerful Games Console" 2304:To distinguish it from what? 2223:Playstation 4 Reserved memory 2213:02:38, 27 February 2014 (UTC) 2195:00:45, 27 February 2014 (UTC) 2178:23:03, 26 February 2014 (UTC) 2156:19:43, 26 February 2014 (UTC) 2130:18:56, 26 February 2014 (UTC) 2102:18:22, 26 February 2014 (UTC) 2085:18:10, 26 February 2014 (UTC) 2064:17:51, 26 February 2014 (UTC) 2041:17:28, 26 February 2014 (UTC) 2014:Does it need to be mentioned? 1987:12:35, 19 February 2014 (UTC) 1973:08:50, 19 February 2014 (UTC) 1959:07:32, 19 February 2014 (UTC) 1945:08:55, 18 February 2014 (UTC) 1930:08:43, 18 February 2014 (UTC) 1898:21:31, 12 February 2014 (UTC) 1689:16:24, 20 December 2013 (UTC) 1652:10:31, 20 December 2013 (UTC) 964:23:28, 30 November 2013 (UTC) 922:22:14, 30 November 2013 (UTC) 864:19:38, 30 November 2013 (UTC) 825:19:33, 30 November 2013 (UTC) 796:19:27, 30 November 2013 (UTC) 766:19:21, 30 November 2013 (UTC) 740:19:13, 30 November 2013 (UTC) 712:10:45, 16 November 2013 (UTC) 698:22:44, 14 November 2013 (UTC) 638:16:12, 29 November 2013 (UTC) 598:09:41, 24 November 2013 (UTC) 562:08:29, 24 November 2013 (UTC) 503:17:49, 21 November 2013 (UTC) 444:19:58, 18 November 2013 (UTC) 428:08:00, 18 November 2013 (UTC) 408:14:38, 18 November 2013 (UTC) 396:if you really feel this way. 377:15:08, 15 November 2013 (UTC) 354:08:38, 15 November 2013 (UTC) 287:19:32, 11 November 2013 (UTC) 3962:Here is a proposed update: 3950:Proposed changes to the lead 3843:12:17, 5 February 2015 (UTC) 3826:02:11, 5 February 2015 (UTC) 3795:14:54, 1 February 2015 (UTC) 3647:PS4 and Vita launch in China 3521:18:02, 2 November 2014 (UTC) 3482:19:01, 30 October 2014 (UTC) 1868:04:47, 24 January 2014 (UTC) 1841:09:25, 19 January 2014 (UTC) 1630:16:26, 5 December 2013 (UTC) 1616:16:25, 5 December 2013 (UTC) 1596:15:34, 5 December 2013 (UTC) 1548:15:11, 5 December 2013 (UTC) 1531:15:00, 5 December 2013 (UTC) 1501:14:48, 5 December 2013 (UTC) 1479:03:55, 5 December 2013 (UTC) 1464:03:46, 5 December 2013 (UTC) 1446:19:05, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1416:17:31, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1399:17:20, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1377:12:49, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1355:09:07, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1318:05:47, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1303:05:29, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1271:03:48, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1247:03:28, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1215:03:23, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1193:03:16, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1172:03:09, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1149:02:23, 4 December 2013 (UTC) 1131:23:12, 3 December 2013 (UTC) 1124:archived request for removal 1117:22:14, 3 December 2013 (UTC) 1072:22:30, 1 December 2013 (UTC) 1014:10:42, 1 December 2013 (UTC) 668:22:37, 7 November 2013 (UTC) 658:21:54, 7 November 2013 (UTC) 488:05:45, 1 November 2013 (UTC) 125:22:38, 2 November 2013 (UTC) 99:05:38, 2 November 2013 (UTC) 5098:to reactivate your request. 5086:has been answered. Set the 3560:to reactivate your request. 3548:has been answered. Set the 2657:to reactivate your request. 2645:has been answered. Set the 1935:Its an estimated figure. - 1904:Updated Sales Figures no. 2 1808:08:34, 8 January 2014 (UTC) 1785:08:24, 8 January 2014 (UTC) 1752:00:03, 4 January 2014 (UTC) 1727:04:03, 2 January 2014 (UTC) 1710:02:51, 2 January 2014 (UTC) 1667:. Thanks for the heads-up. 1219:Your comment on it being a 538:to reactivate your request. 526:has been answered. Set the 322:to reactivate your request. 310:has been answered. Set the 259:"FFXII producer steps down" 158:Reference named "gamespot": 5277: 4926:17:47, 15 April 2015 (UTC) 4845:How about something like: 3945:03:59, 21 March 2015 (UTC) 3905:19:57, 19 March 2015 (UTC) 3891:13:15, 19 March 2015 (UTC) 3874:13:07, 19 March 2015 (UTC) 3864:06:43, 19 March 2015 (UTC) 2419:00:07, 31 March 2014 (UTC) 2391:14:47, 18 March 2014 (UTC) 2375:14:44, 18 March 2014 (UTC) 2361:13:51, 18 March 2014 (UTC) 2331:15:07, 17 March 2014 (UTC) 2316:11:03, 17 March 2014 (UTC) 2298:08:35, 17 March 2014 (UTC) 2272:00:32, 13 March 2014 (UTC) 2244:00:06, 13 March 2014 (UTC) 2026:when presented like that. 5247:16:16, 24 July 2015 (UTC) 5140:15:28, 28 June 2015 (UTC) 5130:Please provide a source. 5115:03:08, 28 June 2015 (UTC) 5058:15:23, 27 June 2015 (UTC) 5030:12:16, 24 June 2015 (UTC) 5014:02:33, 16 June 2015 (UTC) 4954:11:54, 24 June 2015 (UTC) 4755:46 Texture mapping units 4752:72 Texture mapping units 3761:an unspecified IP address 2995:21:15, 14 June 2014 (UTC) 2972:19:20, 14 June 2014 (UTC) 2954:17:22, 14 June 2014 (UTC) 2939:11:35, 14 June 2014 (UTC) 2929:23:23, 13 June 2014 (UTC) 2780:04:18, 12 June 2014 (UTC) 2760:01:00, 12 June 2014 (UTC) 2735:00:49, 12 June 2014 (UTC) 2696:13:03, 12 June 2014 (UTC) 2621:03:00, 4 April 2014 (UTC) 2606:02:53, 4 April 2014 (UTC) 2567:02:34, 4 April 2014 (UTC) 2540:18:55, 3 April 2014 (UTC) 2517:07:22, 3 April 2014 (UTC) 2502:07:01, 3 April 2014 (UTC) 2487:06:18, 3 April 2014 (UTC) 2473:05:56, 3 April 2014 (UTC) 2458:04:13, 3 April 2014 (UTC) 2439:02:10, 3 April 2014 (UTC) 2348:" (or something) then it 1874:Spelling error in "Games" 1045:Prise: 18990 RUB (~572$ ) 5203:Removal of software info 5197:15:47, 4 July 2015 (UTC) 5180:14:45, 4 July 2015 (UTC) 5160:17:19, 2 July 2015 (UTC) 3748:Angry Birds Transformers 414:Edit request November 18 138:I check pages listed in 4940:Minor changes noted at 1886:Good call. I fixed it. 1157:consensus set forth at 1004:is selling at £349.99. 131:Orphaned references in 4886: 4856: 4680: 4625: 4616: 4598: 4586: 4109: 4092:to be replaced with... 4087: 4031: 4012: 3391: 2553:article, but also the 4723:. Here is a breakdown 4683:but it's a start. — 3990:carefully agreed upon 3487:13.5 million in sales 3378: 1757:Updated Sales Figures 1385:apply in a way here? 86:PS4: The Ultimate FAQ 42:of past discussions. 4763:16 Raster operators 4760:32 Raster operators 4083:tablet or smartphone 4000:The PlayStation 4's 3923:for more details. -- 3869:Agree to remove. — 2800:The named reference 2702:Backward compability 2352:need clarification. 1537:JP February 22, 2014 1079:Japanese translation 644:99c rounds up to $ 1 450:PocketStation teaser 4101:PlayStation Network 4055:PlayStation Network 3604:Advertisement Text? 3093:"eighth generation" 2683:edit semi-protected 2675:please establish a 2199:Also, just because 990:PlayStation article 144:orphaned references 4963:And now for Sony. 4148:). So it may have 3495:(and specifically 2399:Incomplete article 1359:Ryulong, the link 1231:be there. But why 495:Bibliophile scribe 456:made a teaser page 190:. www.gamespot.com 186:Calvert, Justine. 18:Talk:PlayStation 4 5102: 5101: 5060: 5048:comment added by 5012: 4982:available on PS4. 4837: 4825:comment added by 4791: 4790: 4771:12 Compute units 4768:18 Compute units 4712: 4700:comment added by 4602:Digital Foundry's 4395:"full of garbage" 4286:mainstream press. 3829: 3812:comment added by 3763: 3759:comment added by 3713:parallel imported 3564: 3563: 3519: 3447:comment added by 3383:and, speaking to 3315: 3279: 2853:http://pcsx2.net/ 2725:comment added by 2661: 2660: 2627:Criticism section 2602: 2594: 2409:comment added by 2288:comment added by 2270: 1864: 1856: 1837: 1829: 1775:comment added by 1687: 1511:Super Mario Bros. 1221:WP:LOCALCONSENSUS 1075: 1058:comment added by 962: 628:comment added by 542: 541: 340:December 17, 2013 326: 325: 237:Gouskos, Carrie. 219:on August 6, 2011 115:comment added by 77: 76: 54: 53: 48:current talk page 5268: 5261: 5256: 5245: 5243: 5238: 5194: 5189: 5129: 5125: 5124: 5093: 5089: 5075: 5074: 5068: 5011: 4801:developers." — 4733: 4243:is supported by 4142: 4079:PlayStation Vita 4069:mobile devices; 3929: 3888: 3883: 3828: 3806: 3776: 3771: 3726: 3661: 3584: 3583: 3555: 3551: 3537: 3536: 3530: 3509: 3507: 3497:here on slide 11 3456: 3308: 3272: 2899: 2894: 2888: 2883: 2877: 2872: 2866: 2861: 2855: 2850: 2844: 2839: 2833: 2828: 2822: 2817: 2811: 2810: 2809: 2803: 2795: 2757: 2752: 2743:reliable sources 2737: 2694: 2686: 2671: 2670: 2652: 2648: 2638: 2637: 2631: 2600: 2592: 2588: 2421: 2388: 2383: 2357: 2313: 2308: 2300: 2260: 2258: 2192: 2187: 2082: 2077: 2038: 2033: 1983: 1895: 1890: 1862: 1854: 1850: 1835: 1827: 1823: 1804: 1795: 1787: 1724: 1719: 1677: 1675: 1666: 1662: 1661: 1444: 1442: 1437: 1413: 1408: 1397: 1395: 1390: 1336: 1330: 1326: 1244: 1239: 1190: 1185: 1104:nihongo template 1093: 1074: 1052: 960: 950: 948: 640: 590: 581: 576: 572: 571: 533: 529: 519: 518: 512: 472: 405: 400: 363: 362: 339: 317: 313: 303: 302: 296: 284: 273: 271: 269: 253:Hiroshi Minagawa 248: 246: 245: 228: 226: 224: 215:. Archived from 198: 196: 195: 177: 165:Gearbox Software 127: 80:Missing Features 68: 56: 55: 33: 32: 26: 5276: 5275: 5271: 5270: 5269: 5267: 5266: 5265: 5264: 5257: 5253: 5241: 5236: 5234: 5205: 5192: 5187: 5168: 5132:Datbubblegumdoe 5122: 5120: 5091: 5087: 5072: 5066: 5040: 4961: 4938: 4787:1.32 Teraflops 4784:1.84 Teraflops 4568: 4454:Okay, to recap: 4374:1.843 teraflops 4188:1.843 teraflops 4136: 4105:PlayStation Now 4071:PlayStation Now 4059:PlayStation App 3952: 3943: 3925: 3917: 3886: 3881: 3851: 3807: 3802: 3800:Shipped or sold 3787: 3774: 3769: 3751: 3740: 3722: 3684: 3675: 3657: 3649: 3606: 3581: 3553: 3549: 3534: 3528: 3504:Trut-h-urts man 3501: 3489: 3474: 3442: 3439: 3358:Edge (magazine) 3009: 2909: 2904: 2903: 2902: 2895: 2891: 2884: 2880: 2873: 2869: 2862: 2858: 2851: 2847: 2840: 2836: 2829: 2825: 2818: 2814: 2801: 2799: 2797: 2792: 2755: 2750: 2720: 2704: 2688: 2680: 2668: 2650: 2646: 2635: 2629: 2586: 2427: 2404: 2401: 2386: 2381: 2355: 2311: 2306: 2283: 2280: 2255:Trut-h-urts man 2252: 2225: 2190: 2185: 2080: 2075: 2036: 2031: 2001: 1981: 1906: 1893: 1888: 1876: 1848: 1821: 1816: 1802: 1770: 1759: 1735: 1722: 1717: 1697: 1672:Trut-h-urts man 1669: 1659: 1657: 1640: 1440: 1435: 1433: 1411: 1406: 1393: 1388: 1386: 1334: 1328: 1324: 1316: 1242: 1237: 1188: 1183: 1083: 1081: 1053: 1032: 952: 944: 682:Template:Rndpad 646: 623: 612:Price: 1799 RON 606: 584: 579: 569: 567: 531: 527: 516: 510: 486: 468: 452: 416: 403: 398: 385: 360: 346:175.141.117.103 343: 330: 315: 311: 300: 294: 282: 267: 265: 256: 243: 241: 236: 222: 220: 206: 193: 191: 185: 168: 136: 110: 106: 82: 64: 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 5274: 5272: 5263: 5262: 5250: 5204: 5201: 5200: 5199: 5167: 5164: 5163: 5162: 5143: 5142: 5100: 5099: 5076: 5065: 5062: 5039: 5036: 5035: 5034: 5033: 5032: 5005: 5004: 5001: 4998: 4995: 4989: 4986: 4983: 4977: 4974: 4971: 4968: 4960: 4957: 4937: 4936:CUH-12 version 4934: 4933: 4932: 4931: 4930: 4929: 4928: 4914: 4913: 4912: 4911: 4899: 4898: 4888: 4887: 4874: 4873: 4843: 4842: 4841: 4840: 4839: 4838: 4827:69.115.124.149 4811: 4810: 4809: 4808: 4795: 4794: 4793: 4792: 4789: 4788: 4785: 4781: 4780: 4777: 4773: 4772: 4769: 4765: 4764: 4761: 4757: 4756: 4753: 4749: 4748: 4745: 4741: 4740: 4737: 4727: 4726: 4725: 4724: 4714: 4713: 4702:69.115.124.149 4667: 4666: 4646: 4645: 4567: 4564: 4563: 4562: 4561: 4560: 4559: 4558: 4557: 4556: 4555: 4554: 4553: 4552: 4526: 4525: 4524: 4523: 4522: 4521: 4520: 4519: 4518: 4517: 4498: 4497: 4496: 4495: 4494: 4493: 4492: 4491: 4490: 4489: 4488: 4487: 4484: 4481: 4478: 4464: 4463: 4462: 4461: 4460: 4459: 4458: 4457: 4456: 4455: 4443: 4442: 4441: 4440: 4439: 4438: 4437: 4436: 4410: 4409: 4408: 4407: 4406: 4405: 4404: 4403: 4384: 4383: 4382: 4381: 4380: 4379: 4378: 4377: 4359: 4358: 4357: 4356: 4355: 4354: 4339: 4338: 4337: 4336: 4335: 4334: 4331: 4330: 4327: 4326: 4323: 4322: 4319: 4318: 4315: 4314: 4306: 4305: 4304: 4303: 4302: 4301: 4292: 4291: 4290: 4289: 4288: 4287: 4270: 4269: 4268: 4267: 4266: 4265: 4253: 4252: 4251: 4250: 4249: 4248: 4235: 4234: 4233: 4232: 4195: 4194: 4193: 4192: 4173: 4172: 4171: 4170: 4131: 4130: 4120: 4119: 4111: 4110: 4094: 4093: 4089: 4088: 4048: 4047: 4043: 4042: 4033: 4032: 4023: 4022: 4014: 4013: 3995: 3994: 3966: 3951: 3948: 3931: 3916: 3913: 3912: 3911: 3910: 3909: 3908: 3907: 3850: 3847: 3846: 3845: 3801: 3798: 3786: 3783: 3782: 3781: 3762: 3750: 3745: 3728: 3718: 3717: 3706: 3703: 3700: 3696: 3683: 3680: 3663: 3653:this reference 3648: 3645: 3644: 3643: 3605: 3602: 3601: 3600: 3562: 3561: 3538: 3527: 3524: 3488: 3485: 3473: 3470: 3438: 3437:Can someone... 3435: 3434: 3433: 3432: 3431: 3430: 3429: 3415: 3392: 3376: 3375:So, this then? 3373: 3340: 3339: 3338: 3337: 3336: 3335: 3334: 3261: 3260: 3259: 3258: 3257: 3256: 3255: 3254: 3253: 3206: 3205: 3204: 3203: 3202: 3201: 3182: 3181: 3180: 3179: 3178: 3177: 3169: 3168: 3167: 3166: 3165: 3164: 3151: 3150: 3149: 3145: 3141: 3138: 3134: 3130: 3126: 3117: 3116: 3115: 3114: 3103: 3102: 3089: 3056: 3055: 3049: 3043: 3037: 3031: 3008: 3005: 3004: 3003: 3002: 3001: 3000: 2999: 2998: 2997: 2959: 2958: 2957: 2956: 2908: 2905: 2901: 2900: 2889: 2878: 2867: 2856: 2845: 2834: 2823: 2812: 2802:IGNAsiaPacific 2789: 2788: 2784: 2783: 2782: 2763: 2762: 2703: 2700: 2699: 2698: 2659: 2658: 2639: 2628: 2625: 2624: 2623: 2582: 2581: 2580: 2579: 2578: 2577: 2576: 2575: 2574: 2573: 2572: 2571: 2570: 2569: 2426: 2423: 2411:184.147.122.14 2400: 2397: 2396: 2395: 2394: 2393: 2377: 2333: 2318: 2279: 2276: 2275: 2274: 2224: 2221: 2220: 2219: 2218: 2217: 2216: 2215: 2170:John Mayor ERS 2165: 2164: 2163: 2162: 2161: 2160: 2159: 2158: 2137: 2136: 2135: 2134: 2133: 2132: 2109: 2108: 2107: 2106: 2105: 2104: 2090: 2089: 2088: 2087: 2056:John Mayor ERS 2048: 2019: 2018: 2015: 2012: 2000: 1997: 1996: 1995: 1994: 1993: 1992: 1991: 1990: 1989: 1918: 1917: 1912: 1905: 1902: 1901: 1900: 1875: 1872: 1871: 1870: 1815: 1812: 1811: 1810: 1777:121.222.221.79 1758: 1755: 1734: 1731: 1730: 1729: 1696: 1693: 1692: 1691: 1639: 1636: 1635: 1634: 1633: 1632: 1569: 1568: 1567: 1566: 1565: 1564: 1563: 1562: 1561: 1560: 1559: 1558: 1557: 1556: 1555: 1554: 1553: 1552: 1551: 1550: 1466: 1310: 1286: 1285: 1284: 1283: 1282: 1281: 1280: 1279: 1278: 1277: 1276: 1275: 1274: 1273: 1225:WP:IDONTLIKEIT 1134: 1133: 1080: 1077: 1047: 1046: 1037: 1036: 1031: 1028: 1027: 1026: 1025: 1024: 1023: 1022: 1021: 1020: 1019: 1018: 1017: 1016: 975: 974: 973: 972: 971: 970: 969: 968: 967: 966: 931: 930: 929: 928: 927: 926: 925: 924: 879: 878: 877: 876: 875: 874: 873: 872: 871: 870: 869: 868: 867: 866: 838: 837: 836: 835: 834: 833: 832: 831: 830: 829: 828: 827: 807: 806: 805: 804: 803: 802: 801: 800: 799: 798: 775: 774: 773: 772: 771: 770: 769: 768: 747: 746: 745: 744: 743: 742: 719: 718: 717: 716: 715: 714: 671: 670: 645: 642: 617: 616: 613: 610: 605: 602: 601: 600: 540: 539: 520: 509: 506: 474: 451: 448: 447: 446: 420:186.136.86.228 415: 412: 411: 410: 384: 381: 380: 379: 342: 341: 327: 324: 323: 304: 293: 290: 275: 274: 249: 229: 199: 178: 135: 129: 108:¥38,980 =: --> 105: 104:Price in Japan 102: 81: 78: 75: 74: 69: 62: 52: 51: 34: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 5273: 5260: 5255: 5252: 5249: 5248: 5244: 5239: 5237:ViperSnake151 5232: 5228: 5225: 5222: 5218: 5214: 5210: 5202: 5198: 5195: 5190: 5184: 5183: 5182: 5181: 5177: 5173: 5172:84.213.45.196 5165: 5161: 5157: 5153: 5152:83.100.174.82 5149: 5145: 5144: 5141: 5137: 5133: 5128: 5119: 5118: 5117: 5116: 5112: 5108: 5107:86.45.251.152 5097: 5094:parameter to 5085: 5084:PlayStation 4 5081: 5077: 5070: 5069: 5063: 5061: 5059: 5055: 5051: 5050:83.100.174.82 5047: 5037: 5031: 5028: 5024: 5020: 5019: 5018: 5017: 5016: 5015: 5010: 5009:Zero Serenity 5002: 4999: 4996: 4993: 4990: 4987: 4984: 4981: 4978: 4975: 4972: 4969: 4966: 4965: 4964: 4958: 4956: 4955: 4951: 4947: 4946:83.100.174.82 4943: 4935: 4927: 4924: 4920: 4919: 4918: 4917: 4916: 4915: 4910: 4907: 4903: 4902: 4901: 4900: 4897: 4894: 4890: 4889: 4885: 4882: 4876: 4875: 4871: 4867: 4866: 4865: 4864: 4861: 4855: 4852: 4846: 4836: 4832: 4828: 4824: 4817: 4816: 4815: 4814: 4813: 4812: 4807: 4804: 4799: 4798: 4797: 4796: 4786: 4783: 4782: 4778: 4775: 4774: 4770: 4767: 4766: 4762: 4759: 4758: 4754: 4751: 4750: 4746: 4744:1152 Shaders 4743: 4742: 4739:Xbox One GPU 4738: 4735: 4734: 4731: 4730: 4729: 4728: 4722: 4718: 4717: 4716: 4715: 4711: 4707: 4703: 4699: 4692: 4691: 4690: 4689: 4686: 4679: 4676: 4670: 4665: 4661: 4657: 4652: 4648: 4647: 4642: 4637: 4636: 4635: 4634: 4631: 4624: 4619: 4615: 4610: 4608: 4603: 4597: 4593: 4591: 4585: 4580: 4578: 4574: 4573:User:GoneIn60 4565: 4551: 4547: 4543: 4538: 4537: 4536: 4535: 4534: 4533: 4532: 4531: 4530: 4529: 4528: 4527: 4516: 4513: 4508: 4507: 4506: 4505: 4504: 4503: 4502: 4501: 4500: 4499: 4485: 4482: 4479: 4476: 4475: 4474: 4473: 4472: 4471: 4470: 4469: 4468: 4467: 4466: 4465: 4453: 4452: 4451: 4450: 4449: 4448: 4447: 4446: 4445: 4444: 4435: 4431: 4427: 4423: 4422:WP:LEADLENGTH 4418: 4417: 4416: 4415: 4414: 4413: 4412: 4411: 4401: 4396: 4392: 4391: 4390: 4389: 4388: 4387: 4386: 4385: 4375: 4371: 4367: 4366: 4365: 4364: 4363: 4362: 4361: 4360: 4353: 4350: 4345: 4344: 4343: 4342: 4341: 4340: 4332: 4328: 4324: 4320: 4316: 4312: 4311: 4310: 4309: 4308: 4307: 4298: 4297: 4296: 4295: 4294: 4293: 4284: 4280: 4276: 4275: 4274: 4273: 4272: 4271: 4263: 4259: 4258: 4257: 4256: 4255: 4254: 4246: 4241: 4240: 4239: 4238: 4237: 4236: 4231: 4227: 4223: 4219: 4215: 4211: 4206: 4202: 4199: 4198: 4197: 4196: 4189: 4185: 4181: 4177: 4176: 4175: 4174: 4168: 4164: 4160: 4156: 4151: 4147: 4140: 4135: 4134: 4133: 4132: 4129: 4126: 4122: 4121: 4117: 4113: 4112: 4108: 4106: 4102: 4096: 4095: 4091: 4090: 4086: 4084: 4080: 4076: 4072: 4068: 4064: 4060: 4056: 4050: 4049: 4045: 4044: 4039: 4035: 4034: 4030: 4025: 4024: 4019: 4016: 4015: 4011: 4009: 4008: 4003: 3997: 3996: 3991: 3987: 3986: 3985: 3984: 3980: 3976: 3971: 3970: 3965: 3960: 3958: 3949: 3947: 3946: 3942: 3938: 3934: 3930: 3928: 3922: 3914: 3906: 3902: 3898: 3894: 3893: 3892: 3889: 3884: 3877: 3876: 3875: 3872: 3868: 3867: 3866: 3865: 3861: 3857: 3849:Units Shipped 3848: 3844: 3840: 3836: 3832: 3831: 3830: 3827: 3823: 3819: 3815: 3811: 3799: 3797: 3796: 3793: 3784: 3780: 3777: 3772: 3766: 3765: 3764: 3758: 3749: 3746: 3744: 3743: 3739: 3735: 3731: 3727: 3725: 3714: 3711: 3707: 3704: 3701: 3697: 3693: 3692: 3691: 3688: 3681: 3679: 3678: 3674: 3670: 3666: 3662: 3660: 3654: 3646: 3642: 3639: 3634: 3631: 3626: 3625: 3624: 3623: 3619: 3615: 3614:14.139.128.11 3610: 3603: 3599: 3595: 3591: 3587: 3579: 3578: 3577: 3576: 3572: 3568: 3559: 3556:parameter to 3547: 3546:PlayStation 4 3543: 3539: 3532: 3531: 3525: 3523: 3522: 3517: 3513: 3508: 3506: 3505: 3498: 3494: 3486: 3484: 3483: 3480: 3472:Release dates 3471: 3469: 3468: 3464: 3460: 3454: 3450: 3449:93.138.27.210 3446: 3436: 3428: 3424: 3420: 3416: 3414: 3410: 3406: 3402: 3401: 3400: 3397: 3393: 3390: 3389: 3386: 3382: 3377: 3374: 3372: 3369: 3365: 3362: 3359: 3355: 3354: 3353: 3350: 3345: 3341: 3333: 3329: 3325: 3320: 3319: 3318: 3314: 3311: 3307: 3302: 3298: 3297: 3296: 3292: 3288: 3284: 3283: 3282: 3278: 3275: 3271: 3267: 3262: 3252: 3248: 3244: 3239: 3238: 3237: 3234: 3230: 3226: 3225:preponderance 3222: 3217: 3214: 3213: 3212: 3211: 3210: 3209: 3208: 3207: 3200: 3196: 3192: 3188: 3187: 3186: 3185: 3184: 3183: 3175: 3174: 3173: 3172: 3171: 3170: 3161: 3160: 3159: 3156: 3152: 3146: 3142: 3139: 3135: 3131: 3127: 3123: 3122: 3121: 3120: 3119: 3118: 3112: 3107: 3106: 3105: 3104: 3101: 3098: 3094: 3090: 3086: 3081: 3077: 3076: 3075: 3074: 3070: 3066: 3062: 3054: 3050: 3048: 3044: 3042: 3038: 3036: 3032: 3030: 3026: 3025: 3024: 3023: 3019: 3015: 3006: 2996: 2992: 2988: 2984: 2983:PlayStation 3 2980: 2979:PlayStation 2 2975: 2974: 2973: 2970: 2965: 2964: 2963: 2962: 2961: 2960: 2955: 2951: 2947: 2942: 2941: 2940: 2937: 2933: 2932: 2931: 2930: 2926: 2922: 2917: 2916: 2912: 2906: 2898: 2893: 2890: 2887: 2882: 2879: 2876: 2871: 2868: 2865: 2860: 2857: 2854: 2849: 2846: 2843: 2838: 2835: 2832: 2827: 2824: 2821: 2816: 2813: 2807: 2794: 2791: 2787: 2781: 2777: 2773: 2769: 2765: 2764: 2761: 2758: 2753: 2748: 2744: 2740: 2739: 2738: 2736: 2732: 2728: 2727:89.74.109.107 2724: 2717: 2712: 2708: 2701: 2697: 2692: 2684: 2678: 2674: 2666: 2665: 2664: 2656: 2653:parameter to 2644: 2640: 2633: 2632: 2626: 2622: 2618: 2614: 2610: 2609: 2608: 2607: 2603: 2598: 2595: 2589: 2568: 2564: 2560: 2556: 2552: 2547: 2543: 2542: 2541: 2537: 2533: 2528: 2524: 2523:74.103.250.78 2520: 2519: 2518: 2514: 2510: 2509:74.103.250.78 2505: 2504: 2503: 2499: 2495: 2490: 2489: 2488: 2484: 2480: 2479:74.103.250.78 2476: 2475: 2474: 2470: 2466: 2465:74.103.250.78 2461: 2460: 2459: 2455: 2451: 2447: 2443: 2442: 2441: 2440: 2436: 2432: 2431:74.103.250.78 2424: 2422: 2420: 2416: 2412: 2408: 2398: 2392: 2389: 2384: 2378: 2376: 2372: 2368: 2367:MrAdaptive343 2364: 2363: 2362: 2359: 2358: 2351: 2347: 2342: 2338: 2334: 2332: 2328: 2324: 2323:MrAdaptive343 2319: 2317: 2314: 2309: 2303: 2302: 2301: 2299: 2295: 2291: 2290:124.178.37.45 2287: 2277: 2273: 2268: 2264: 2259: 2257: 2256: 2248: 2247: 2246: 2245: 2241: 2237: 2236:Majinpunisher 2233: 2230: 2222: 2214: 2210: 2206: 2205:MrAdaptive343 2202: 2198: 2197: 2196: 2193: 2188: 2181: 2180: 2179: 2175: 2171: 2167: 2166: 2157: 2153: 2149: 2148:MrAdaptive343 2145: 2144: 2143: 2142: 2141: 2140: 2139: 2138: 2131: 2127: 2123: 2119: 2116:I agree with 2115: 2114: 2113: 2112: 2111: 2110: 2103: 2100: 2096: 2095: 2094: 2093: 2092: 2091: 2086: 2083: 2078: 2071: 2067: 2066: 2065: 2061: 2057: 2053: 2049: 2045: 2044: 2043: 2042: 2039: 2034: 2027: 2025: 2016: 2013: 2010: 2009: 2008: 2006: 1998: 1988: 1985: 1984: 1976: 1975: 1974: 1970: 1966: 1962: 1961: 1960: 1956: 1952: 1948: 1947: 1946: 1942: 1938: 1934: 1933: 1932: 1931: 1927: 1923: 1916: 1913: 1911: 1908: 1907: 1903: 1899: 1896: 1891: 1885: 1884: 1883: 1881: 1873: 1869: 1865: 1860: 1857: 1851: 1845: 1844: 1843: 1842: 1838: 1833: 1830: 1824: 1813: 1809: 1806: 1805: 1798: 1794: 1790: 1789: 1788: 1786: 1782: 1778: 1774: 1767: 1766: 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