2822:
reporting the existing mainstream facts. Please DO NOT censor the facts and stay faithful to the goal of reporting facts. I wrote a comprehensive and neutrally written summary of the reaction from both sides of the political spectrum, the petitioners and
Dassault Aviation to the Indian Supreme Court verdict in a chronological order taking into account all the significant reactions. I also made sure all the important existing material remain preserved essentially in my write-up, yet it too was CENSORED in its entirety, and superseded by a blatantly lopsided write-up, which placed an undue emphasis on the reactions from the petitioners, whose petitions were quashed by the court, while shrugging off or outrightly erasing the reactions by other stakeholders.
2376:; I shall elaborate on some of these further on at some appropriate future time, for writing a proper lead should be the last thing on one's mind at this stage, given how in-comprehensive and incomplete the body of the article is. I'd submit that editors should first make efforts to develop the body to provide a neutral, balanced, and comprehensive information about the subject before jumping into the lead, which by its very nature, summarizes the most important content of the body of the article. If you still think otherwise, then work on it in your userspace instead of mainspace, taking into account the issues raised here. Thanks.
2880:
344:
which already exists there) would remove need to restate context of MMRCA, avoid problem of "Rafale deal controversy" hardly being coherent unique identifier for this topic (when that phrase could apply to many countries' purchase or non-purchase of Rafale jet - I came across this page looking for info re: Belgian non-selection of Rafale), and be natural location to engage with community of editors who are educated on the topic - the avoidance of some hypothetically problematic editors being author's self-admitted rationale for this page.
1780:. In 2007, the UPA government had released tenders for 126 MMRCA fighters for Indian Air Force. Dassault made the lowest bids and was selected in 2012. According to the conditions of the tender, 18 jets would be purchased in fly away conditions and the remaining 108 jets were to be manufactured in India by Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) in association with Dassault after the transfer of technology to produce the aircraft. The Congress stated that a deal with the price of
1472:. In 2007, the UPA government had released tenders for 126 MMRCA fighters for Indian Air Force. Dassault made the lowest bids and was selected in 2012. According to the conditions of the tender, 18 jets would be purchased in fly away conditions and the remaining 108 jets were to be manufactured in India by Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) in association with Dassault after the transfer of technology to produce the aircraft. The Congress stated that a deal with the price of
1336:
process, the role of the
Government is not envisaged and, thus, mere press interviews or suggestions cannot form the basis for judicial review by this Court, especially when there is categorical denial of the statements made in the Press, by both the sides. We do not find any substantial material on record to show that this is a case of commercial favouritism to any party by the Indian Government, as the option to choose the IOP does not rest with the Indian Government."
1797:
partner. Government of India denied the accusation and
Dassault Aviation issued stated that it was Dassault's decision to choose Reliance. The Congress accused the government of inflating the price of the deal and demanded a public disclosure of the negotiated pricing. The Indian government rejected the demand citing a secrecy clause in the deal. The French president Macron stated that the deal pricing can be shared with the opposition parties of India.
1801:
sealed cover. On
December 14, the Supreme Court declared that there was nothing wrong in the Rafale deal and the court did not doubt the process followed. The court dismissed all four petitions that had demanded a court monitored probe in the deal, adding in its final conclusion that its views are based on its standpoint on the courts jurisdiction under 29 Article 32 of the Constitution of India. The court in its verdict had mentioned that a report by
1488:
sealed cover. On
December 14, the Supreme Court declared that there was nothing wrong in the Rafale deal and the court did not doubt the process followed. The court dismissed all four petitions that had demanded a court monitored probe in the deal, adding in its final conclusion that its views are based on its standpoint on the courts jurisdiction under 29 Article 32 of the Constitution of India. The court in its verdict had mentioned that a report by
1484:
partner. Government of India denied the accusation and
Dassault Aviation issued stated that it was Dassault's decision to choose Reliance. The congress accused the government of inflating the price of the deal and demanded a disclosure of the negotiated pricing. The Indian government rejected the demand citing a secrecy clause in the deal. The French president Macron stated that the deal pricing can be shared with the opposition parties of India.
87:, except when some really exceptional claims are being made. The article could probably benefit from a "Background" section (between the lead and "Accusations") which goes into a little more detail regarding the events or circumstances which led up to the scandal. Many of the citations could most likely be moved there or to other parts of the article. Too many citations for a single sentence like is done in this article give the impression of
31:
1302:
thus, mere press interviews or suggestions cannot form the basis for judicial review by this Court, especially when there is categorical denial of the statements made in the Press, by both the sides. We do not find any substantial material on record to show that this is a case of commercial favouritism to any party by the Indian
Government, as the option to choose the IOP does not rest with the Indian Government
1140:
the official respondents claim there is a commercial advantage in the purchase of 36 Rafale aircrafts. The official respondents have claimed that there are certain better terms in IGA qua the maintenance and weapon package. It is certainly not the job of this Court to carry out a comparison of the pricing details in matters like the present. We say no more as the material has to be kept in a confidential domain.
620:
2548:
content" is misleading and disruptive. Third, we really shouldn't be adding content to the lead that isn't already in the body, but the current lead is also completely inadequate; it doesn't even say why the damn thing is a controversy in the first place. Finally, reverting content citing a lack of consensus is okay if and only if you also raise (or mention a discussion of)
2221:, Please provide the sources to back up the claims you made above. If they are verifiable there is no reason why they cannot be added into the Lead text. The article needs work no doubt, but that doesn't mean the Lead will be deliberately kept at a piss poor state like it is right now. I will respond once again after you provide the sources I asked above. regards.--
426:. In fact, if you bothered to read my first comment on this page, you'd see that I said very clearly that a "minuscule proportion of your edits might be productive on the face of it, it doesn't appear feasible to separate the wheat from the chaff at this moment." I even restored the "response" section you added promptly after making the revert...if you noticed
676:
603:
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2449:", while accusing me of having 'no regard for CONSENSUS or factual accuracy of the article or even WP:STATUSQUO.' These claims are absolutely incorrect as the page history which shows this editor was editing the page weeks before you even made your first edit. I am sorry but you should agree here with the obvious.
1164:
scrutiny by the Court." The court commented on the pricing stating it had examined the price details and added that "It is certainly not the job of this Court to carry out a comparison of the pricing details in matters like the present. We say no more as the material has to be kept in a confidential domain"
83:, the lead should basically summarize what comes later in the article; it shouldn't really be the only place where such content is covered unless you're the article is only a few-sentence long stub with a single section. Moreover, citations in the main body of article are preferable to ones in the lead per
2997:
BJP's Tamil Nadu unit president
Tamilisai Soundararajan, while lashing out at the Congress, demanded an apology from the Congress leaders "to the nation" in view of the SC findings. Union Home Minister Rajnath Singh, too, said: "The Congress President tried to mislead public for political benefit and
1301:
33.Once again, it is neither appropriate nor within the experience of this Court to step into this arena of what is technically feasible or not. The point remains that DPP 2013 28 envisages that the vendor/OEM will choose its own IOPs. In this process, the role of the
Government is not envisaged and,
3015:
The article has been locked out so that you guys can stop edit warring and join the talk page for discussion and not to make edit request to get back your own preferred version bypassing the discussion. I would suggest you to join the threads below or create more to explain your stand for improving
2821:
Why are the people are CENSORING the facts? I recovered the correct material TWO times, but page keeps getting censored again and again and now I can't edit it. Those are just the facts as reported by mainstream media, yet they are being repeatedly censored on
Knowledge, which, ironically, boasts of
2783:
all my diffs that you pointed above, please join the discussion there. If you are seeing problems in the article, then kindly point the diff of the problem, add link of the source that proves it is a problem and provide a solution (in the form of text that should be added into the article) that way,
2595:
can you guys stop filibustering and comment on the actual content that needs to be improved ? If you are objecting any line in the article that I added kindly point the diff of the problem, add link of the source that proves it is a problem and explain why it needs to be changed and changed to what,
2398:
above is completely sourced to reliable sources. if you are disputing the sources, you have to be specific and point the problem. If you have specific concerns about any content in the LEAD, then point out the concern with diff and your preferred version of the content and I will be happy to include
1787:
In April 2015, Prime Minister Narendra Modi announced a decision to purchase 36 Rafale fighters in a flyaway condition during his visit to Paris. Critical operational requirements were cited as the reasons for the decision. In June 2015, the tender for 126 aircrafts was officially withdrawn. In 2016
1479:
In April 2015, Prime Minister Narendra Modi announced a decision to purchase 36 Rafale fighters in a flyaway condition during his visit to Paris. Critical operational requirements were cited as the reasons for the decision. In June 2015, the tender for 126 aircrafts was officially withdrawn. In 2016
1139:
26. We have examined closely the price details and comparison of the prices of the basic aircraft along with escalation costs as under the original RFP as well as under the IGA. We have also gone through the explanatory note on the costing, item wise. Suffice it to say that as per the price details,
560:
for the kind reply, yes, I have removed the tag now. The latest updates from the SC verdict have been included, So there is no need of a major update to the article, the allegations section can still be expanded along with, but they can be handled with regular editing cycle. I am marking this thread
2727:
calling others edits as falsehood simply because you dont agree/like with it is wrong approach for consensus building, something that you have to stop right now. Even if you believe it is false why cant you pinpoint those "complete falsehoods" explaining with your source that proves it is false and
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and start discussing the actual issues that you have with the content instead of talking about editors. And it is interesting to note that even after achieving consensus as discussed in the these sections above which were marked resolved, you are reverting to your own preferred version and then you
2203:
The lead fails to accurately summarize the controversy, which is not surprising since the article as whole is quite incomplete. I suggest spending more time on expanding the article on specific allegations and the reply of the Indian government, French government, Dassault and the Indian Air Force.
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In 2018, four separate petitions were filed in Supreme Court, questioning the pricing, choice of Reliance as the offset partner, the process followed in Rafale deal. The details of the pricing and the process that was followed was kept secret citing national interest and shared with the court in a
1487:
In 2018, four separate petitions were filed in Supreme Court, questioning the pricing, choice of Reliance as the offset partner, the process followed in Rafale deal. The details of the pricing and the process that was followed was kept secret citing national interest and shared with the court in a
343:
Which speaks to broader question, why this deserves page of it's own, when by it's author's own admission the topic is extension of Indian MoD MMRCA tender? (albeit abandoning legal format of that) Embedding it within MMRCA page (as elaboration of the already existing "Fate of the deal" subsection
3052:
I am still can't see how that paragraph containing significant and much reported reactions from the leaders of the ruling party, against whom so called corruption charges were leveled, should be called 'nonsense'. It seems like you are only interested in promoting your agenda. Why their reactions
2426:
Problems exists with your lead as observed by others. Lead doesn't need 'reliable sources', it is just a summary of the content in the article. Labelling genuine concerns and suggestions as 'stonewalling your efforts' is not helpful. You had raised issues about the lead on 28 December and you had
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There are many sources here that are inappropriately used. The Telegraph article was written based on the complaint from Sinha, Shourie and Bhushan submitted to the SC and basically presents only a single side of the argument. The India Today's "explainer" is of very low quality and contains many
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about investment of 50% of the value of the deal into the defence ecosystem as per the Defence Procurement and Procedure (DPP). The French companies Dassault, Safran, Thales and MBDA that were the Part of Rafale project would carry out the offsets. Dassault Aviation announced a joint venture with
3043:
To conclude that your removal of the edit request which wanted an admin to moderate (who have 'special rights' to make edits to fully protected pages) constituted 'trolling' behaviour and that is not a personal attack even if you think it was offensive. You have not shown evidence how you are an
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by BJP that Congress was comparing the price of "fully loaded" aircraft with the price of "basic aicraft" without taking price escalation and currency variations into consideration. The lead also suffers from recentism, which is also true of the article as whole now, with the material related to
1796:
The Congress party had alleged favouritism by the Modi government in the selection of Anil Ambani's Reliance as offset partner. In 2018, former French president Francois Hollande revealed that Reliance was selected by the Indian side and France had no choice in the selection of the Indian offset
1483:
The Congress party had alleged favouritism by the Modi government in the selection of Anil Ambani's Reliance as offset partner. In 2018, former French president Francois Hollande revealed that Reliance was selected by the Indian side and France had no choice in the selection of the Indian offset
1335:
On the aspect of Indian Offset Partner (IOP), the court noted that "it is neither appropriate nor within the experience of this Court to step into this arena of what is technically feasible or not. The point remains that DPP 2013 28 envisages that the vendor/OEM will choose its own IOPs. In this
949:
22. We have studied the material carefully. We have also had the benefit of interacting with senior Air Force Officers who answered Court queries in respect of different aspects, including that of the acquisition process and pricing. We are satisfied that there is no occasion to really doubt the
2547:
I haven't had the time to review the sources yet, but I'll make a couple of observations on the interactions here. First, this article and the issue it covers are so new that the idea of a consensus version is meaningless. Second, removing a sourced lead with the edit summary "restoring sourced
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In its ruling, the court said it had carefully studied the material placed before it in sealed covers and stated that "there is no occasion to really doubt the process, and even if minor deviations have occurred, that would not result in either setting aside the contract or requiring a detailed
972:
In its ruling, the court said it had carefully studied the material placed before it and stated that "there is no occasion to really doubt the process, and even if minor deviations have occurred, that would not result in either setting aside the contract or requiring a detailed scrutiny by the
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which is not only different from what is in the source, but is basically what Congress is alleging. Many secondary sources disagree on the exact percentage of offsets that Dassault is planning to discharge through DRAL, but all of them agree that it is a fraction of the offsets, not the whole
3074:
If you are seeing problems in the article, then kindly point the diff of the problem, add link of the source that proves it is a problem and provide a solution (in the form of text that should be added into the article) that way, we all can work towards a consensus version for the article.
2453:
I don't see anything new in your additions to 'your threads' that has not been already responded and clarified umpteen times in this thread alone. You don't have to just keep arguing until you find someone to support your version which is itself not even interpreting the sources and giving
805:
The court’s ruling cannot be considered as a clean chit for the government. The Modi government’s decision to buy 36 Rafale aircraft from Dassault Aviation invited criticism because the government seems to have agreed to give a higher price for than was decided in an earlier UPA agreement
2574:. As to the lead, as many as 4 editors have expressed their disagreement over it, and specific concerns have been raised above. And like others, I'm not sure why are we even discussing the lead when the content in the body hasn't materialized and is thoroughly incomplete as is.
107:
I did it because of this concern -- this was needed initially because article was deleted once and government supporters dislike the article so i want it to be heavily sourced for some time, will remove sources later once article is developed and gets stable.. thanks
2641:
will show that DBigXray has been edit warring against multiple users since weeks to get rid of the content that he doesn't like, all the while stonewalling on this talkpage. In view of this fact, I'd recommend that you restore the status-quo version, which would be
485:
Which of these 8 references you want to delete and why? If problem was only with ref-bombing then discuss here that which references should be preserved and which ones needs to be deleted than removing the reliable references and then inserting your extreme POV.
1809:. It was pointed by the petitioners and the Congress that no CAG report on rafale exists and nothing had been shared yet. The government filed an application for correction in the verdict. The application will come up for hearing after the new year holidays.
2982:
An Admin here has no special rights to approve your controversial version. The only way forward here is to discuss the edits and make consensus. And not to edit war your own preferred version of the article which is controversial and factually incorrect and
2861:
Your concerns are noted, and I essentially agree with them, despite your rhetoric. Although not much can be done right now given the page will remain protected for the next two day before we can edit. Again, I agree that the said version should be restored.
1496:. It was pointed by the petitioners and the Congress that no CAG report on rafale exists and nothing had been shared yet. The government filed an application for correction in the verdict. The application will come up for hearing after the new year holidays.
774:
Senior CPI (M) leader Sitaram Yechury on Saturday asserted that no clean chit has been given to the Narendra Modi government in the Rafale deal by the Supreme Court, which has "merely stated" that it did not have the jurisdiction to intervene in the matter.
302:, etc. Keeping things consistent from the start will make it easier to keep them consistent as others edit the article and add more content and citations. My suggestion to you would be to use the "Day Month Year" for all the dates used in the citations per
1480:
an MoU was signed between India and France for 36 Rafale jets at a price of €7.87 billion. Dassault Aviation announced a joint venture with Indian businessman Anil Ambani's Reliance Defence for the compensation investment of 50% of the value of the deal.
2515:
If you have specific concerns about any article content, then point out the concern with diff and your preferred version of the content and I will be happy to include it in the draft version and the sections about other objections that I created above.
2363:
has said pretty much everything that I would have wanted to say at first; and he is spot on with the analysis of the proposed lead. There are simply too many major issues with it, foremost of which is a glaring non-compliance with core policies like
2908:
if you think a particualr line is relevant and must be added, please start a new section and explain why you feel it must be added to the article and then we can discuss on it. none is censoring anything but adding opinions as facts is not done.
196:
and end up frustrated and disappointed. I'm not posting this to discourage you from further editing or continuing to try and improve the article, but only just to explain how Knowledge works. Now, you can if you like, request that this article be
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the court dismissed all the petitions seeking a probe into the alleged irregularities in the deal, and gave a clean chit to the Union government on all three aspects: the decision making, pricing and selection of Indian offset partner.
91:
and actually detract from the article; 11 citations to sources saying basically the same thing are not needed to support a single sentence, so maybe pick out the best two or three and dump the rest if there's not other use for them. --
138:
that i am driven by some 'political agenda' haha, thats why I Am saying please let this article to be heavily sourced as of now... we can remove excess sources from lead once the article is developed and stable .. thank you
2193:) in parliament, while Macron stated that details can be shared with the opposition, which is quite different. The lead presents the Congress' assertion that it negotiated a price of 526 crore, but does not present the
2600:
as per your liking so that it can be discussed further. Everything that is in the lead will be in the article in a more expanded form so dont claim not in the article text as a reason to stonewall Lead improvements.
2427:
been clearly told that we have to keep neutral content on body. This is not to say that lead cannot be developed but it should be developed with neutral content reflecting the body. Your proposal fails to do that.
780:"There is no clean chit. It is a misleading propaganda by the BJP. The Supreme Court has merely said that a scam of this nature did not fall within its jurisdiction and hence, it could not entertain the petitions."
2845:
If the people of this page can't be expected to edit neutrally and without any hidden agenda, then I ask an independent moderator for keeping an eagle eye on the page and foil all attempts to suppress the facts.
2998:
maligned India’s image globally. He should apologize to the House and to the people of the country. He thought ‘Hum to doobe hain sanam tum ko bhi le doobenge’ (I have drowned so I will take you and drown),"
2391:
you are again attempting stonewalling here on my efforts, if you do not have time or are unwilling to engage in a constructive discussion to improve the page, you probably should avoid the page altogether.
1114:
21...However, by a subsequent order, to satisfy the conscience of the Court, it was directed that details regarding the costs of the aircrafts should also be placed in sealed covers before the Court.
2315:
I have included your points related to the offset clause and added some more sources about the secrecy clause please check. Regarding the juxtapositions, these facts are reliably referenced, see
294:
In addition, if you're going to copy-and-paste citations found in other articles into to this article, you should try and make sure the format being used is consistent throughout the article per
192:
and make sure everyone knows everything that can possibily be known about this controversly and feel that somehow it's Knowledge's duty to do so, then you're probably going to find out that this
2596:
provide a solution (in the form of text that should be added into the article) that way, we all can work towards a consensus version for the article. You can even go ahead and make changes to
2552:
issues with that content. "Fails NPOV" and "Misuses sources" isn't good enough if you're unwilling to discuss the specifics of why NPOV is being violated and how sources are being misused.
2194:
3056:
Since you have nothing better to say you can move on now and stop edit warring yourself. I have removed the request because I can now recover the version you are censoring. Thanks.
2298:
I have added the sources. Some tags were totally superfluous, I cannot present a source for saying that what you have written is different from what is in the India Today article. —
2188:
3044:
admin. Which admin discussion you are talking about if you claim that no admin would accept this request? Similarly you are trying very hard to hog the whole page with your absurd.
2158:
1175:
as mentioned in my edit summary what I have added is actually based on the verdict, If you think That I made a mistake you need to clarify what is the mistake and explain why --
2173:
In 2018, former French president Francois Hollande revealed that Reliance was selected by the Indian side and France had no choice in the selection of the Indian offset partner.
2191:
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When asked whether India had put pressure on Reliance and Dassault to work together, Mr. Hollande said he was unaware and “only Dassault can comment on this.”as reported by AFP
2713:
What you wrote is not only complete falsehood, but also something you cannot substantiate. When did I reverted to "to (my) own preferred version"? What are you even implying?
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1955:
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The former Rajya Sabha member said the Opposition has, therefore, been seeking a probe by Joint Parliamentary Committee, but the government appears to be wary of the same.
518:. Can you please clarify, what all information do you believe is lacking and needs to be updated ? I would like to remove the tag hence started this thread here. regards.--
2326:. Also update the lead with your other objections and then we can further discuss for a consensus version of the lead which should be the ultimate goal of this thread. --
1999:
977:
As mentioned in my edit summary what I have added is actually based on the verdict, If you think that I made a mistake you need to clarify what is the mistake and why --
2469:), (which we don't use for statement of facts), especially those by involved 'leader' of 'opposition parties' that you misrepresented as those by 'NDTV' in disregard of
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Dassault Aviation announced a joint venture with Indian businessman Anil Ambani's Reliance Defence for the compensation investment of 50% of the value of the deal.
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is required; otherwise, it's technically a copyright violation. There are a couple of ways for you attribute where the content originally came from, so please see
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In its ruling, the court said it has "studied the material carefully" and it is satisfied with the decision marking process and that it found no wrongdoing. ...
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process, and even if minor deviations have occurred, that would not result in either setting aside the contract or requiring a detailed scrutiny by the Court.
2268:, Let me add tags to mark what sources I requested. It would be best, if you could replace these tags with inline refs, so it is easier to discuss further.--
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since that seems to be the format commonly used in Indian/British English and get rid of the all numerical format currently used in some of the citations. --
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1977:
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so that you can continue to work on improving it as a draft.Then, when you think all problems with it have been sorted out, you can submit it for review via
1352:
and in spite of repeated request, in the threads above neither User:MBlaze Lightning or Shivkarandholiya12 have explained their problems with my edits. --
1251:
and in spite of repeated request, in the threads above neither User:MBlaze Lightning or Shivkarandholiya12 have explained their problems with my edits. --
1053:
and in spite of repeated request, in the threads above neither User:MBlaze Lightning or Shivkarandholiya12 have explained their problems with my edits. --
886:
and in spite of repeated request, in the threads above neither User:MBlaze Lightning or Shivkarandholiya12 have explained their problems with my edits. --
815:
If you think the courts mentioned clean chit in their verdict, then please point me to that line in the verdict and I will be happy to add clean chit. --
2319:
2161:) So, it is not that a single company is responsible for the entire 50% offset. More worryingly, that statement was used as a source for the statement
2021:
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It expressed its satisfaction on the pricing aspect, after investigating the details, which were provided to it in a sealed envelope by the government.
753:"No Chit was given, the mention of chit is opinion and not fact. moreover SC Has Not Given Modi Govt Clean Chit on Rafale Deal, Says Sitaram Yechury
3053:
should be treated any different from the petitioners' reaction that everyone else (except you) believe have been given undue weight in your version.
1325:
On the aspect of offset partner, the court noted that it did not find substantial material that shows if this is a case of commercial favouritism.
2637:, I just saw that you fully-protected the page. However, the version that you protected has no consensus whatsoever. Even a casual glance at the
2570:
That I'm not sure what are you saying. Dbig was reverted as he was removing bulk of reliably sourced content, among other things as discussed on
3049:
Stop making vague handwaves. No bits in my version are 'factually incorrect and misleading', everything was sourced nicely to reliable sources.
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Under the contract, Dassault was mandated to make compensation investments (offsets) in India worth 50 per cent of the value of the purchase.
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On the aspect of offset partner, the court rejected allegations of commercial favoritism, citing the lack of any substantive material.
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Hi MBL I see that you have twice Added and restoring 10 references in the lead. It appears to me as though you are completely ignorant of
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then we can discuss about how to improve. All you are doing on this talk page is returning every now and then and adding more & more
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Indian businessman Anil Ambani's Reliance Defence for Dassault's share of the compensation investment of 50% of the value of the deal.
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2646:, so as to encourage DBigXray to engage in a constructive discussion here and get support for his changes, which he currently lacks.
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2322:. If you have a better suggestion of representing this piece of information in the lead, please go ahead and update the sandbox at
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which doesn't summarize the controversy associate with his statement accurately and blatantly takes a side. The juxtaposition of
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at all, but rather some advices being given to you by an experienced editor trying to help you out. You need decide whether your
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and that other editors will try to improve the article to bring in up to Knowledge's standards, which sometimes means adding
2447:
If you look into the article history the controversial content was added by MBlaze Lightning just a day age before my edits
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which shows that MBlaze Lightning had added all these biased and disputed content into the articles. and has been reverted
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DBigXray I am not sure why this is being repeated because we have already discussed this earlier. You claimed above that "
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It is not within our policy to accept your interpretation of the primary material, or any of the dodgy opinion pieces (
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Fatsdominopizzeria removed had removed these controversial misrepresentations that were added with the edit summary
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I was actually about to remove them myself for the same reason, but you made a blanket revert before I could do it
2732:. do you believe that accusing me of falsehoods will resolve the content disputes that you are claiming here ? --
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444:. Please let me know if you have any other concern and I will be glad to discuss. I am marking this as resolved--
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an MoU was signed between India and France for 36 Rafale jets at a price of €7.87 billion. The deal included an
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referring to the false allegations you made about me ("you are reverting to your own preferred version", etc).
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and poor lead Please explain why you have removed the lead or agree to restore if you have no valid reasons.
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but many other sources show that the offset responsibilities are split between Dassault, Thales and Safran. (
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The French president Macron stated that the deal pricing can be shared with the opposition parties of India.
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The content that I had added was entirely sourced to reliable sources and you have removed it and restored
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https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Talk:Rafale_deal_controversy&diff=876001486&oldid=875983696
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There's doesn't seem any need to have 13 citations (including 11 for a single sentence) in the lead. Per
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without explaining what was the problem. A while later Shivkarandholiya12 joined making the same revert
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without explaining what was the problem. A while later Shivkarandholiya12 joined making the same revert
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without explaining what was the problem. A while later Shivkarandholiya12 joined making the same revert
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without explaining what was the problem. A while later Shivkarandholiya12 joined making the same revert
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The controversial and disputed line about clean chit was first added by User:MBlaze Lightning, in this
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If you've copied-and-pasted content directly from other Knowledge articles or sections of article like
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https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Rafale_deal_controversy&diff=875698049&oldid=875697420
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https://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Rafale_deal_controversy&diff=875288413&oldid=875288056
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Once that is done, a more neutral lead can be written that presents both sides of the argument. —
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when they're needed or removing content/citations when they're not needed. It might also mean
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I had removed this controversial text, since the verdict never talked about any "clean chit"
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2022:"Modi govt can share Rafale deal details with Opposition, France's Macron tells India Today"
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Modi govt can share Rafale deal details with Opposition, France's Macron tells India Today
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supreme court judgement taking up a disproportionately large amount of the article share.
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it in the draft version and the sections about other objections that I created above. --
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1902:"domain-b.com : MRCA RFP: India floats its biggest-ever global tender for jet fighters"
1594:"domain-b.com : MRCA RFP: India floats its biggest-ever global tender for jet fighters"
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This is looks fine now.Everything is upto dated.You can remove the tag now. Thank you.
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template. A lot of your edits in the response section was politicial mudslingings and
2000:"How Centre defended Rafale deal in Supreme Court: Key takeaways from today's hearing"
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inappropriate balance to a particular point of view. If you really want to us ignore
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This controversial line about this was first added by User:MBlaze Lightning, in this
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Accordingly based on the sources I had updated the the article with this text below.
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This controversial line about this was first added by User:MBlaze Lightning, in this
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This controversial line about this was first added by User:MBlaze Lightning, in this
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this controversial addition, since this was a clear misrepresentation of the verdict
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this controversial addition, since this was a clear misrepresentation of the verdict
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into parts of this article, then you need to make sure you do so in accordance with
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No admin in his right mind can approve un-encyclopedic content such as this above.
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The article needs to be updated, ADAG has already filed several lawsuits. e.g. on
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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the
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for three days. Please discuss at the talk page and try to come to consensus.--
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The Indian government rejected the demand citing a secrecy clause in the deal.
1956:"Reliance Defence corners offset contracts worth ₹21,000 crore on Rafale deal"
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for a price estimated to be worth Rs 58,000 crore (7.8 billion euros) by the
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for a price estimated to be worth Rs 58,000 crore (7.8 billion euros) by the
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among the 5 difs listed above You have pointed this diff twice (first here)
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This is someones cobbled together opinion and not what the court said at all.
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Cool, glad to know that you are ok with me removing these 8 references. per
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There are many other neutrality issues with the lead such as the statement
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inaccuracies that contradict other sources. For example, the source states
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In the section "French Government response", there is a line that states:
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283:. Knowledge's licensing allows content to be reused in a such a way, but
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it will be more helpful for the article if you respond to my last ping
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Copying and pasting content and citations from other Knowledge articles
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Now that's a complete misrepresentation of what I said; because I was
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526.1 crore per jet was negotiated. The UPA deal was never finalized.
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526.1 crore per jet was negotiated. The UPA deal was never finalized.
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No Clean Chit To Modi Government On Rafale From Court: Sitaram Yechury
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There is a missing space where the "as reported by AFP" line begins.
134:, see the attack on me is already started, one gentleman just said
2092:"What is the Supreme Court verdict in Rafale deal case all about?"
1717:"What is the Supreme Court verdict in Rafale deal case all about?"
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Click on the following link showing an old version of the page, '
1978:"Fact Check: Glaring flip flop in Rafale 'secrecy pact' revealed"
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Accordingly I had updated the article with this text below. diff
169:. If want to help improve Knowledge, then you need to understand
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Accordingly I had updated the the article with this text below.
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we all can work towards a consensus version for the article. --
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vitriolic accusations and comments on editor instead of content
1878:"F-16 maker Lockheed mounts an India campaign - Times of India"
1570:"F-16 maker Lockheed mounts an India campaign - Times of India"
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thanks for the inputs, didn't know this... will work on this --
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You are not an admin who is allowed to moderate this request.
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content when it's in the best interests of Knowledge to do so.
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as the Congress' demand was for the price to be made public (
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Content that I had added and was removed from the Lead. --
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Which you have immediately removed by blanket reverts on
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were adding nonsense such as this below into the article.
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1933:"Rafale Deal: Know all about the controversy 15 points"
1625:"Rafale Deal: Know all about the controversy 15 points"
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2979:. You should remove this attack or risk being blocked.
2044:"Supreme Court verdict on Rafale deal: Full judgement"
1669:"Supreme Court verdict on Rafale deal: Full judgement"
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en masse by User:MBlaze Lightning with a edit summary
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en masse by User:MBlaze Lightning with a edit summary
1217:"Supreme Court verdict on Rafale deal: Full judgement"
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en masse by User:MBlaze Lightning with a edit summary
1019:"Supreme Court verdict on Rafale deal: Full judgement"
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en masse by User:MBlaze Lightning with a edit summary
852:"Supreme Court verdict on Rafale deal: Full judgement"
205:. That might be one way of avoiding the article being
514:, I see that you had placed this tag on the article
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if that's something you're really worried about. --
2658:Nobody is going to die just because the page is at
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reverted by Shivkarandholiya12 with edit summary "(
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reverted by Shivkarandholiya12 with edit summary "(
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584:I agree, and have for that reason removed the tag.
2572:Talk:Rafale deal controversy#Supreme Court Section
2069:"Centre's plea for corrections in Rafale judgment"
1694:"Centre's plea for corrections in Rafale judgment"
1385:, I had updated and improved the article lead on
790:Below Quote is from the Article by Deccan Herald
2462:) sources, then that would really never happen.
277:Indian MRCA competition#Selection of the Rafale
1746:Draft version of the Lead based on suggestions
1341:My above edits that corrected the facts, were
1240:My above edits that corrected the facts, were
1042:My above edits that corrected the facts, were
391:Adding and restoring 10 references in the lead
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1329:and then expanded it to below mentioned para
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875:My above edits that corrected the facts were
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188:On the other hand, if you're here to try and
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2512:so kindly avoid using the word WP:STATUSQUO.
1847:"All you need to know about the Rafale deal"
1539:"All you need to know about the Rafale deal"
2817:Protected edit request on 30 December 2018
2090:Rajagopal, Krishnadas (22 December 2018).
1954:Ghaswalla, Amrita Nair (12 January 2018).
1805:(CAG) had been shared with parliament and
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1715:Rajagopal, Krishnadas (22 December 2018).
1492:(CAG) had been shared with parliament and
611:Protected edit request on 28 December 2018
2002:. The Financial Express. 14 November 2018
1094:After reviewing the sources and text the
929:After reviewing the sources and text the
727:After reviewing the sources and text the
2251:Which claims do you need a source for? —
1292:Below Quote is from the court verdict.
940:Below Quote is from the court verdict.
399:please read the policy and follow it. --
2932:I reverted your trolling you did here:-
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1761:in India related to the purchase of 36
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1453:in India related to the purchase of 36
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1105:Below Quote is from the court verdict.
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792:Rafale: SC ruling no clean chit to govt
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1822:"What the Rafale controversy is about"
1514:"What the Rafale controversy is about"
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44:Do not edit the contents of this page.
2973:reverted my reply on the edit request
1347:prior to disruptive edits by DBigXray
1246:prior to disruptive edits by DBigXray
1048:prior to disruptive edits by DBigXray
881:prior to disruptive edits by DBigXray
761:Below Quote is from the NDTV article
7:
2598:Talk:Rafale deal controversy/Sandbox
2396:Talk:Rafale deal controversy/Sandbox
2324:Talk:Rafale deal controversy/Sandbox
1737:Talk:Rafale deal controversy/Sandbox
2773:I have explained in sections below
2458:and these many reliable secondary (
2837:....it also contains my write-up:
24:
2071:. The Telegraph. 16 December 2018
1776:. Origin of the deal lies in the
1696:. The Telegraph. 16 December 2018
1468:. Origin of the deal lies in the
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1980:. India Today. 14 September 2018
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1935:. India Today. 14 December 2018
1803:Comptroller and Auditor General
1627:. India Today. 14 December 2018
1490:Comptroller and Auditor General
1845:K, Deepalakshmi (2016-04-16).
1537:K, Deepalakshmi (2016-04-16).
331:07:53, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
316:07:48, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
252:11:16, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
230:, Thanks for telling me about
219:09:27, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
149:09:09, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
118:07:51, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
102:07:24, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
75:Too many citations in the lead
1:
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3035:21:40, 30 December 2018 (UTC)
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2856:10:31, 30 December 2018 (UTC)
2766:17:19, 31 December 2018 (UTC)
2751:14:17, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
2720:14:09, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
2705:12:45, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
2672:12:40, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
2653:12:36, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
2394:Everything in the lead draft
1194:15:15, 30 December 2018 (UTC)
996:15:11, 30 December 2018 (UTC)
834:15:07, 30 December 2018 (UTC)
743:and then the same edit again
695:23:04, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
669:16:19, 28 December 2018 (UTC)
591:11:44, 26 December 2018 (UTC)
580:20:35, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
552:00:24, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
537:19:35, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
496:07:26, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
463:19:40, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
436:17:04, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
418:15:47, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
386:12:40, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
354:00:40, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
242:.. You are a true hero ..:-)
157:posted at the Teahouse is an
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1408:Clear consensus on talk page
194:isn't what Knowledge's about
18:Talk:Rafale deal controversy
3094:14:48, 6 January 2019 (UTC)
2803:14:48, 6 January 2019 (UTC)
2620:14:39, 6 January 2019 (UTC)
2584:15:58, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
2562:15:12, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
2535:14:26, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
2483:12:48, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
2437:15:58, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
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2383:13:53, 5 January 2019 (UTC)
2345:22:21, 4 January 2019 (UTC)
2308:19:49, 4 January 2019 (UTC)
2287:19:29, 4 January 2019 (UTC)
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2240:19:13, 4 January 2019 (UTC)
2214:19:07, 4 January 2019 (UTC)
2134:17:31, 4 January 2019 (UTC)
2024:. India Today. 8 March 2018
1649:. India Today. 8 March 2018
1440:17:31, 4 January 2019 (UTC)
1371:21:26, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
1270:21:26, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
1072:21:26, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
905:21:26, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
645:to reactivate your request.
633:has been answered. Set the
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2835:which should be recovered
1807:Public Accounts Committee
1494:Public Accounts Committee
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748:As I had mentioned in my
506:Update tag on the article
2825:See my write-up here:-
2778:#Decision making process
1958:. The Hindu Businessline
1398:restored sourced content
2977:blatant personal attack
2971:, Noting that you have
1778:Indian MRCA competition
1772:of India from France's
1755:Rafale Deal Controversy
1470:Indian MRCA competition
1464:of India from France's
1447:Rafale Deal Controversy
1383:User:Shivkarandholiya12
914:Decision making process
631:Rafale deal controversy
190:set the record straight
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2686:claim no consensus. --
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561:as resolved, cheers --
207:nominated for deletion
2771:User:MBlaze Lightning
2725:User:MBlaze Lightning
2679:User:MBlaze Lightning
2593:User:MBlaze Lightning
2389:User:MBlaze Lightning
2372:, and not to mention
1759:political controversy
1451:political controversy
1173:User:MBlaze Lightning
738:User:MBlaze Lightning
653:
175:maintenance templates
42:of past discussions.
2890:for this alteration
1377:Improvements in Lead
2886:please establish a
291:for more details.
153:I don't thing what
3009:Shivkarandholiya12
2864:Shivkarandholiya12
2589:Shivkarandholiya12
2576:Shivkarandholiya12
2508:Fatsdominopizzeria
2495:Shivkarandholiya12
2475:Shivkarandholiya12
2429:Shivkarandholiya12
2159:Reliance statement
1882:The Times of India
1574:The Times of India
1169:Shivkarandholiya12
734:Shivkarandholiya12
285:proper attribution
2497:Here is the diff
2155:Trappier statment
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429:. Thanks anyway.
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1023:Hindustan Times
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872:
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856:Hindustan Times
850:
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755:News 18 article
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675:
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619:
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512:User:Akhiljaxxn
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359:Lawsuit by ADAG
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2900:edit protected
2875:
2874:
2818:
2815:
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2565:
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2460:operative word
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2013:
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1102:
1098:I had removed
1079:
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1035:
1004:
1003:
999:
962:
961:
955:
954:
951:
947:
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933:I had removed
915:
912:
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907:
869:
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2238:
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2229:
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2207:
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2178:
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2001:
1995:
1992:
1979:
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1934:
1928:
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1883:
1879:
1873:
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1859:
1856:
1852:
1848:
1841:
1838:
1827:
1826:The Telegraph
1823:
1817:
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1804:
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1518:The Telegraph
1515:
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1467:
1463:
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1391:
1390:
1388:
1384:
1376:
1372:
1369:
1367:
1360:
1351:
1348:
1344:
1343:reverted here
1340:
1339:
1337:
1332:
1331:
1326:
1322:
1321:
1308:
1300:
1296:
1293:
1289:
1285:
1283:
1275:
1271:
1268:
1266:
1259:
1250:
1247:
1243:
1242:reverted here
1239:
1238:
1222:
1218:
1212:
1210:
1208:
1204:
1200:
1196:
1195:
1192:
1190:
1183:
1174:
1170:
1165:
1160:
1159:
1146:
1138:
1134:
1131:
1120:
1113:
1109:
1106:
1103:
1100:
1097:
1091:
1087:
1085:
1077:
1073:
1070:
1068:
1061:
1052:
1049:
1045:
1044:reverted here
1041:
1040:
1024:
1020:
1014:
1012:
1010:
1006:
1002:
998:
997:
994:
992:
985:
974:
969:
968:
956:
948:
944:
941:
938:
935:
932:
926:
922:
921:
913:
911:
906:
903:
901:
894:
885:
882:
878:
877:reverted here
874:
873:
857:
853:
847:
844:
840:
836:
835:
832:
830:
823:
804:
800:
797:
794:
793:
781:
778:
773:
769:
766:
764:
759:
758:
756:
751:
746:
745:
742:
739:
735:
730:
725:
724:
720:
714:
709:
708:
700:
696:
691:
687:
681:
673:
672:
671:
670:
666:
662:
656:
652:
644:
641:parameter to
632:
628:
624:
617:
616:
610:
592:
589:
583:
582:
581:
578:
576:
569:
559:
555:
554:
553:
549:
545:
541:
540:
539:
538:
535:
533:
526:
517:
513:
505:
497:
493:
489:
484:
483:
482:
481:
480:
479:
464:
461:
459:
452:
443:
439:
438:
437:
434:
428:
425:
422:
421:
420:
419:
416:
414:
407:
398:
390:
388:
387:
384:
382:
375:
366:
358:
356:
355:
351:
347:
340:
332:
328:
324:
320:
319:
318:
317:
313:
309:
305:
301:
300:MOS:DATEUNIFY
297:
292:
290:
286:
282:
278:
272:
263:
253:
249:
245:
241:
237:
233:
227:
222:
221:
220:
216:
212:
208:
204:
200:
195:
191:
187:
184:
180:
176:
172:
168:
164:
160:
156:
152:
151:
150:
146:
142:
137:
131:
125:
124:
123:
122:
119:
115:
111:
106:
105:
104:
103:
99:
95:
90:
86:
82:
74:
68:
65:
62:
58:
57:
49:
45:
41:
40:
35:
28:
27:
19:
3076:
3017:
2996:
2937:
2910:
2891:
2883:
2844:
2839:
2834:
2832:
2827:
2824:
2820:
2785:
2757:specifically
2756:
2733:
2687:
2639:page history
2633:
2602:
2549:
2517:
2471:WP:RSOPINION
2467:you provided
2464:
2459:
2456:WP:RSPRIMARY
2452:
2400:
2359:
2327:
2316:
2269:
2222:
2116:
2114:
2096:. Retrieved
2085:
2073:. Retrieved
2063:
2052:. Retrieved
2050:. 2018-12-14
2047:
2038:
2026:. Retrieved
2016:
2004:. Retrieved
1994:
1982:. Retrieved
1972:
1960:. Retrieved
1949:
1937:. Retrieved
1909:. Retrieved
1905:
1896:
1885:. Retrieved
1881:
1872:
1861:. Retrieved
1850:
1840:
1829:. Retrieved
1825:
1816:
1799:
1795:
1786:
1754:
1752:
1735:
1721:. Retrieved
1710:
1698:. Retrieved
1688:
1677:. Retrieved
1675:. 2018-12-14
1672:
1663:
1651:. Retrieved
1641:
1629:. Retrieved
1601:. Retrieved
1597:
1588:
1577:. Retrieved
1573:
1564:
1553:. Retrieved
1542:
1532:
1521:. Retrieved
1517:
1508:
1500:
1486:
1482:
1478:
1446:
1444:
1422:
1420:
1413:
1407:
1397:
1380:
1353:
1334:
1328:
1324:
1317:
1311:— SC verdict
1291:
1287:
1279:
1252:
1225:. Retrieved
1223:. 2018-12-14
1220:
1198:
1176:
1167:
1162:
1155:
1149:— SC verdict
1129:
1123:— SC verdict
1104:
1093:
1089:
1081:
1054:
1027:. Retrieved
1025:. 2018-12-14
1022:
1000:
978:
976:
971:
965:
959:— SC verdict
939:
928:
924:
917:
909:
887:
860:. Retrieved
858:. 2018-12-14
855:
846:
838:
816:
814:
795:
789:
779:
776:
760:
752:
750:edit summary
747:
726:
716:
711:
704:
679:
658:
654:
650:
642:
627:edit request
562:
519:
509:
488:202.69.11.23
445:
400:
394:
368:
362:
346:50.113.24.80
335:
304:MOS:DATETIES
293:
267:
78:
60:
43:
37:
2986:Your edits
2983:misleading.
2775:#Clean Chit
2317:India today
2098:23 December
2094:. The Hindu
2075:23 December
2028:28 December
1939:28 December
1723:23 December
1719:. The Hindu
1700:23 December
1653:28 December
1631:28 December
1416:WP:OVERCITE
442:WP:OVERCITE
397:WP:OVERCITE
323:Adamstraw99
271:Adamstraw99
244:Adamstraw99
183:redirecting
141:Adamstraw99
110:Adamstraw99
85:WP:CITELEAD
36:This is an
2896:using the
2054:2018-12-23
1911:2018-09-09
1887:2018-09-09
1863:2018-09-08
1831:2018-09-08
1679:2018-12-23
1603:2018-09-09
1579:2018-09-09
1555:2018-09-08
1523:2018-09-08
1501:References
1227:2018-12-23
1199:References
1029:2018-12-23
1001:References
862:2018-12-23
839:References
701:Clean Chit
661:Abequinn14
635:|answered=
558:Akhiljaxxn
544:Akhiljaxxn
296:WP:CITEVAR
236:WP:NOTHERE
199:draftified
167:WP:NOTHERE
155:Nick Moyes
89:WP:BOMBARD
2888:consensus
2884:Not done:
2664:Ymblanter
2635:Ymblanter
2554:Vanamonde
2370:WP:WEIGHT
2006:4 January
1984:4 January
1962:4 January
1858:0971-751X
1851:The Hindu
1763:multirole
1550:0971-751X
1543:The Hindu
1455:multirole
682:— Martin
339:Marchjuly
308:Marchjuly
226:Marchjuly
211:Marchjuly
130:Marchjuly
94:Marchjuly
67:Archive 2
61:Archive 1
3058:NavjotSR
3013:NavjotSR
2969:NavjotSR
2948:NavjotSR
2906:WP:UNDUE
2848:NavjotSR
2781:#Pricing
2550:specific
2374:MOS:LEAD
2294:DBigXray
2247:DBigXray
2185:WP:SYNTH
606:Resolved
476:Resolved
365:the wire
81:MOS:LEAD
2975:with a
2366:WP:NPOV
1096:verdict
1078:Pricing
973:Court."
931:verdict
729:verdict
556:Thanks
232:WP:HERE
179:merging
163:WP:HERE
39:archive
2893:before
2361:Gazoth
2313:Gazoth
2300:Gazoth
2266:Gazoth
2253:Gazoth
2219:Gazoth
2206:Gazoth
2166:share.
289:WP:RIA
281:WP:CWW
240:WP:OWN
203:WP:AFC
171:WP:OWN
159:attack
2179:with
1757:is a
1449:is a
639:|ans=
625:This
16:<
3062:talk
3011:and
2988:here
2952:talk
2868:talk
2852:talk
2683:here
2668:talk
2644:this
2591:and
2580:talk
2558:talk
2479:talk
2433:talk
2304:talk
2257:talk
2210:talk
2100:2018
2077:2018
2030:2018
2008:2019
1986:2019
1964:2019
1941:2018
1855:ISSN
1753:The
1725:2018
1702:2018
1655:2018
1633:2018
1547:ISSN
1445:The
1320:diff
1282:diff
1171:and
1158:diff
1084:diff
920:diff
736:and
707:diff
690:talk
686:MSGJ
680:Done
665:talk
548:talk
516:here
492:talk
350:talk
327:talk
312:talk
298:and
248:talk
238:and
215:talk
145:talk
136:here
126:and
114:talk
98:talk
3087:ray
3081:Big
3028:ray
3022:Big
2921:ray
2915:Big
2796:ray
2790:Big
2744:ray
2738:Big
2698:ray
2692:Big
2613:ray
2607:Big
2528:ray
2522:Big
2504:by
2411:ray
2405:Big
2338:ray
2332:Big
2280:ray
2274:Big
2233:ray
2227:Big
2127:ray
2121:Big
1433:ray
1427:Big
1381:Hi
1364:ray
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