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Could somebody explain the basis for the current selection? We have a number of mainstream papers (which may have been widely cited and considered important in the relevant field), along with Tiller's esoteric papers which from what I can tell have no importance at all. I think this selection gives a
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Tiller is a premier investigator in his field. To call him a pseudoscientist is cheap shot. It would be like dismissing all
Christians that do science research because they believe in Virgin Birth. Stanford University thought it fit to make him a professor emeritus, not merely a professor. Criticisms
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There's no source for the book list, though. If it can be soucred (and the bar's fairly low, admittedly, for relatively uncontroversial information), then sure. The problem is that the keep votes are based on claims of notability that have nothing to do with the lack of sources, so about all we can
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I undid the pseudoscience text about lacking sufficient plausibility. To label a well-known scientist as a pseudoscientist, you better actually be able to show his methodology is bogus. I've read his papers. They are not easy to understand. He's a terrible writer. But to dismiss them any more
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EPadmirateur, I think you misread my statement above. I was not arguing that this information should be excluded from the article, only that we should mention his most notable works in the introductory paragraph. Are you suggesting that his entire scientific career is less notable than the very
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Currently it reads: "William A. Tiller, Ph.D. is the author of
Science and Human Transformation, which proposes the existence of subtle energies" - this seems bizarre to me. Surely he is most notable for his early work which received wide citation in peer-reviewed journals. The book
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Doing some legitimate scientific work does not exclude one from being a pseudoscientist, just as being a dentist does not exclude one from being an author. Tiller is both. It would be more accurate to leave the "Pseudoscientists" categorization, but also add "Scientists".
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is a grant of around $ 40k awarded to around 200 people a year based on around 4k applications. Hardly something that would be mentioned in a biography unless you can get a secondary source to mention it and give it some due weight.
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729:, provided they are not unduly self-serving or "exceptional" in nature. Everything you have removed meets these criteria to be included, for the very reason that you have used to justify removing them. --
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Tiller has been tagged :Category: Pseudoscientists but surely he is only half of one. His career work in
Materials Science at Stanford is not pseudo, only his work in pseudoscience is pseudoscientific.
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I think the lack of notable, reliable sources which cite his work is very telling. It's plainly clear that he is not a notable researcher and that the field of his research is not notable. --
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I think we can use the self-published sources to establish what the subject has said. We cannot use these self-published sources to establish credentials or scientific "facts". Given that
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It turns out there he actually two books on crystallization, both on www.cambridge.org. The indicated publication dates refer to the dates as printed in the book, see the Google preview.
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I saw soneone has re-inserted the books list. I'll add the second one on crystallization. For the rest (the "what the bleep" source), I intend to keep out of the debate. --
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I've tried to tidy up this article, however I'm also left with the conclusion that there are no valid sources for this subject which meet the WP:BLP standards. --
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misleading impression of the importance of Tiller's later publications by including them in a list alongside publications which arguably are important. --
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Yep, by all accounts he's not notable for his esoteric papers and no reliable sources discuss them. Until reliable sources discuss them they seem undue.
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of any scientist's work belongs in the commentary section of the journals they have published in, not from the peanut gallery of cyberspace.
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seems to exist for no purpose other than to promote the idea and career of the subject we should be be very cautious about how it is used--
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I note with some dismay that links to tillerfoundation.com have been re-added. It is never acceptable to use self-published sources in a
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than one would dismiss another obscurely dense scientific writer is nothing more than imposing one's personal POV against the topic. --
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
471:(with edit comment: "WP:UNDUE. This is not the mainstream view."): a referenced statement by theoretical physicist Amit Goswani, and
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guidelines is for non-contentious information, not for links to fringe claims which aren't directly related to the individual.
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We have a complete lack of secondary sources. Put any secondary sources you find in this section and I will integrate them in.
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This reasoning also fails because notability applies only to the article topic itself, not the content of the article, per
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In my view, to include at least that one book again should be a no-brainer; for the rest it is somewhat of a gray zone. --
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related articles on
Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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of 28 March 2012, the article text was radically shortened by two editors on the following day. The deletions included:
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832:. Actually this book did and does receive recognition, namely in the book on parapsychology noted earlier and in the
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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received no such recognition. I propose that we make the introduction lead with is most notable works. --
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I undid user
Stacyshaelo again. She did not make any effort to respond to the concern I raised here. --
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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the field of psychoenergetics which will very likely become an integral part of "tomorrow’s" physics
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427:: "Stanford University thought it fit to make him a professor emeritus, not merely a professor")
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These, as well as his books on non-mainstream topics, can also be found for ex. on Amazon:
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Self-published and questionable sources may be used as sources of information
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The material in the source is unduly self serving, such as claims that "
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Science of Crystallization: Microscopic Interfacial Phenomena
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Unknown-importance biography (science and academia) articles
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Notability guidelines do not limit content within an article
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Agree, it is POV. Any objections to delete this catagory?--
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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Please do not restore sources which are not reliable.
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Start-Class biography (science and academia) articles
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A professor emeritus is merely a retired professor. (
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limited coverage his parapsychology has received? --
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160:contribute to the discussion
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563:Books by William A. Tiller
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