1416:- the initial case. And while it's true that some of the Turpin's children were adults and still undergoing abuse when it came to light, they were of course children when it began (and are still the Turpin's children - their adult children). I can see how it might not be the best title because of that, but I think that it needs a more descriptive title. Knowledge (XXG) naming conventions suggest that the sources should be consulted to find a common name. A few of the sources do call it the "Turpin case". One refers to the "California torture house". Several refer to the "House of Horrors". I don't think the latter two are very helpful. A few of the sources call it the "Turpin captivity case", which is clearer about what kind of "case" the article is about but without being overly long or potentially confusing to readers. Would this be an acceptable article title? --
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757:). It's information that editors believe is relevant to the article, it's been added or re-added by four editors thus far (the original, two more, plus me). That's a good signal any consensus discussion would probably go for inclusion. And we'd get more attention to improve and expand the article which is currently woefully brief, given the amount of sourcing available. I could see it being expanded to featured content. Look forward to working with you on that. --
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1273:. Louise Turpin shows up, but he does not. (In my opinion, the public has a right to know; after all, we're paying for his rent, meals, and medical care.) He either died or his record has been hidden for some reason. It would not surprise me if the INMATE table has a HIDDEN (y/n) field. That's possible. --
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I readded those details. The police raided the house, based in part on the physical evidence of the pictures shown to them by the escapee. There they found three things: the condition of the house, children and parents. Our article listed the first two but you deleted the third. It has been restored.
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1) When it was moved without discussion you don't a formal consensus 30 day discussion to move it back, particularly when the move back is non-controversial. 2) There was a proposal that rather than "Turpin case" it be "Turpin family" which would require a consensus discussion. I am going to move it
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It's complicated because while they were the children of the Turpin's, they were not all legally children for the case. And while the case included six counts of child abuse, it also included twelve counts of torture, twelve counts of false imprisonment, seven counts of abuse of a dependent adult. I
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A single sentence "There was intense media coverage of the event" is about as minimalistic as one could achieve, and goes a long way to obfuscate the reality of how intense the media coverage actually was. I added a clarification tag to better understand, what does that mean exactly. The best way to
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I guess you decided to do it anyway without a RFM despite the concerns above raised. I wonder if the seven adults who were imprisoned and tortured would object to being a "child" on
Knowledge (XXG)? At best you might call it the "Turpin children abuse case". Then is "abuse" even an appropriate term
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The consensus is very clear that a secondary source is required in almost all cases. A tertiary source is even better, if available. In the rare case that a primary source is judged to be sufficient, it should be properly cited. The source(s) cited should not only establish the verifiability of the
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Exactly if someone wants to rename it from Turpin case to something else they should discuss and/or start a RM. This article has always been called Turpin case and the recent rename to Turpin child abuse case was done without consensus, without an RM and was controversial. I am renaming it back to
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This section was so gutted it no longer made sense, reading it raised more questions than it answered - what exactly happened? The events of that night are factually dramatic, stating what happened might even sound dramatic, but that is what happened and we can report what reliable sources say. --
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By presenting the edits I made in two gigantic, conglomerated diffs you obscure the fact that they were a series of careful â and mostly small and surgical â edits accompanied by edit summaries. Instead of reviewing the individual edits and undoing (with explanation) any individual ones you found
736:
Why, are you planning to visit them or help them break out? David Turpin was in X prison and then he was in Y prison and now he's in Z prison. So what? What does the reader learn from that? If one of them was transferred because of, say, some kind of interesting misbehavior, that might be worth
578:
I think there needs to be more detailed information on the
Education/Work/Unemployment/Financial histories of all members of the Turpins (grandparents to children). I believe there is more to this story and this would tie this case to several other articles dealing with economics and scarcity.
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Not an excuse for child abuse but an indicator that should have been investigated. There is a connection between economic difficulties and hoarding which some news reports mention was being practiced by the
Turpins. I believe there is room to mention their other serious problems.
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the defense attorney is being quoted (attributed) and it was reported in a secondary source, it is acceptable even encouraged to provide multiple POVs on
Knowledge (XXG) for NPOV purposes, and it helps reinforce the extraordinary amount of media attention the case received. --
1487:- Please do not alter a comment that I signed. What I wrote did not make sense in the context of the new RM. An RM is 7 days, not 30. At a minimum, you should close my RM, then start a new one. Even so, it says not to move the page during an RM. This became a problem for
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Yes they will also graduate college. And get a job. And married. And have children. All will be followed and reported on for years and decades. The attorney statements were made as part of the case the topic of this article. The case is over, their normal lives begin. See
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There are 13 children (some adults) and they will each have varied and extensive lives. It is beyond the scope to keep reporting their college choices, etc.. this article is about the Turpin case which has concluded. The children themselves are probably protected by
692:(names were already posted). If there are not many sources that should tell us something. We do include some information but rolling news updates about their ongoing lives? I'm ok with a short paragraph the problem is it will be expanded upon with no end. --
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Riverside County law enforcement officials now are combing through those journals. District
Attorney Mike Hestrin said he believes they will be very significant to the coming court case and will provide âstrong evidence of what occurred in that
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I actually didn't realize there was an ongoing(ish) discussion on the subject; my move of the article was a WP:BOLD edit. For the sake of the discussion I'll self-revert once I'm no longer on mobile. Anyone is free to revert me sooner.
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It's clear that all involved have been careful about what is released to the media. I've seen very little written about the minors, and the public statements from the attorney and two older siblings don't seem to raise BLP concerns.
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Large portions of this article appear to have been revised with unnecessarily snarky edit summaries. I haven't noticed them all, but I don't see why their current prison locations aren't relevant and can't be included the article.
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You can change what you wrote, no one has voted yet. There is no controversy to rename back to the original Turpin case, an RM is not needed. Except for the family proposal. I can't close your RM you would need to do that. --
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Hard to image that would go without public notification. I could believe he might be so notorious for his own protection he is incognito within the system (sort of like witness protection), but that's pure speculation. --
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problematic, you simply mass-reverted to your preferred version, thus throwing away another editor's careful work. That's not OK. And because you did that in a single edit, the resulting diff is completely uninterpretable
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There's no dispute that there was intense media interest, and the article says that. That a defense attorney agreed (a) adds nothing and (b) is completely unsurprising because they always say that in high-profile cases.
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Go ahead and find sources on that information. However, trying to pretend there's a tie between economics and scarcity with child abuse is quite a reach. Don't try to politicize this case of remarkable child abuse.
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information about the affects of the abuse and the children's recovery. Maybe a short paragraph mentioning that some of them are going to college and learning basic life skills, without turning it into 13
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I hope the case against the Olguin family -- the family alleged to have abused the Turpin children who were placed in their home via the foster care system -- is updated as it makes its way through the
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so it's impossible to know exactly what you did. That's also not OK. And you did all this twice (first with edit summary "restore relevant" and then with edit summary "disagree with these deletions").
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I don't understand the question, "What does the reader learn from that". There's nothing in policy that says we only include things that readers need to learn for the purpose of taking action (
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One unanswered question is, "Who were the Olguin family and how were they approved as a foster family?" Another question is, "What is the status of the case against the Olguin family now?"
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instead of "case". At this point they have exceed concerns about one event as they have continuing coverage including some members who have gone high profile seeking press attention. --
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You've misinterpreted the source, which doesn't say the case was a media circus, merely that the street outside the Turpin home became a media circus after the rescues. The article says
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A January 14 article from USA today points out a few items that will likely lead to further evidence of the alleged crimes, here is some of the content from the USA Today article:
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1533:- uPeople can make suggestions about which title they would like to see instead of Turpin case. You can make your title suggestion below, and we'll see how things play out. --
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privacy guidelines and not individually notable. It remains to be seen maybe they will publish books that are made into TV specials, that kind of stuff is re-portable. --
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869:. In the meantime, to the extent your mass-reversions added details (though it's impossible to tell because of the meaninglessness of your diffs), keep in mind that the
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including, but otherwise this article is about the what these parents did to their children, not unexplained actions taken by the
California Department of Corrections.
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This section is relevant as these are major media appearances and help to demonstrate how widespread the media attention was on this story. --
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Additionally, if either of the parents were to testify in their own defense, prosecutors could use the journals to cross-examine them.
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They got abused again by foster family, what happened to that Foster family? Where are those 3 children? Are children in safety now?
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Yes, I agree this is one of the most remarkable aspects of the case. The journals will lead to books, papers, documentaries etc.. --
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think just "Turpin case" is fine as it's short and easy per the naming guidelines which prefers shorter over longer titles. --
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Sorry, as mentioned in my post at the top of the thread, somehow that post didn't... well... didn't post last night. Long day.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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review the individual edits and (possibly) undo (with explanation) any individual ones you find problematic
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I checked the CDCR public Inmate
Locator for David Turpin and he is nowhere to be found in the database.
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I would say that the scope doesn't need to be strictly limited to the court case. We could also include
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on
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yes I did review the talk page and see zero comments. See why it was restored immediately above. --
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after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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what it always was, Turpin case, any changes from Turpin case need to go through a RM process. --
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back to Turpin case, and change the discussion to be about the family. --
854:(Apologoes, the following was composed last night but somehow not posted.)
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the source does confirm there was intense media coverage, that is what
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Is it crazy for me to ask who was 29 years old on
January 14, 2018? --
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the subsequent events, though. It is about the thing which obtained
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Any thoughts on creating a separate section regarding the journals?
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Should this article be called "Turpin child abuse case" instead? --
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Hundreds of journals found in home with 13 captive children,
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goes into more specifics and explains why it's 25 years. --
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I found Louise, but not David. Did something happen to him?
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No such sources are cited. I've removed the section again.
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section â which includes someone's appearance on Dr. Oz, a
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Is that
January 14, 1988 you're talking about right now? --
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David Turpin still not in the California inmate locator
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are you planning to visit them or help them break out?
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What you will need to do is, well, what I just said:
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1438:- I have just filed a move request below. --
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1651:Turpin case
1614:move review
832:cycle. --
791:many others
688:. There is
1764:Categories
1275:CousinJohn
1013:means. --
888:provides:
690:WP:BLPNAME
663:mini-bios.
339:California
329:California
324:U.S. state
274:California
716:Revisions
669:dlthewave
612:Septagram
597:Natureium
581:Septagram
155:Biography
101:Biography
40:libellous
1655:Jax 0677
1577:Jax 0677
1535:Jax 0677
1493:Jax 0677
1457:Jax 0677
1440:Jax 0677
1436:Comment
1418:Equivamp
1370:Equivamp
1332:Equivamp
1235:contribs
1223:unsigned
686:WP:BLP1E
1733:courts.
1623:Invalid
1295:Jennica
1288:Rename?
871:WP:ONUS
535:Vwanweb
366:on the
249:on the
72:C-class
1684:, the
1573:Reply
1531:Reply
1485:Reply
1363:GreenC
830:WP:BRD
635:WP:BLP
519:home.â
478:Hello,
78:scale.
1696:Green
1629:Green
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1466:Green
1410:about
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1751:talk
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818:Some
789:and
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660:some
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144:and
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1202:Eng
1157:Eng
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358:Low
326:of
241:Low
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