1213:
defection was illegitimate, because
Yurchenko was awarded the Order of the Red Star from the Soviet government for the successful "infiltration operation."UNQUOTE There are two problems with this text, the first of which is that it contradicts the entire subsection titled "Theories" which provides MANY possible scenarios (not all consistent which each other) in which a person would TRULY defect from the Soviet Union and then TRULY defect back. Nothing listed under "Theories" is rendered implausible by the fact of Yurchenko being awarded The Other Of The Red Star after undefecting. The second problem with the quoted text is that it cites in support of its assertion that the initial defection was illegitimate a fact that, even if true, does NOT support the assertion that the first defection was a ruse. It's entirely possible that the defection to the U.S.A. was sincere, that the undefection was also sincere, and that the Soviets awarded The Order Of The Red Star despite the fact that the first defection was sincere. One explanation is that the first defection was sincere but Yurchenko managed to gull them into thinking that it wasn't, that he was executing some master operation so tricky he couldn't tell his superiors about it. Another explanation is that the first defection was sincere and the Soviets knew it, but awarded the Order Of The Red Star (when Yurchenko undefected) to retroactively make it seem, for the public record, that the defection had NOT been sincere. A third explanation is that the Order was awarded in order to convince the Americans/NATO/"the West" NOT to believe anything that Yurchenko had told them during a defection that the Soviets knew was sincere. The fact that the Soviets awarded him The Order Of The Red Star upon his return to their side does not in any way shape or form support the contention that his defection to the U.S.A. "was illegitimate". I'm not, here, impeaching the notion that his defection was a ruse. I'm impeaching the notion that the Red Star award is evidence that the defection was a ruse.
323:
302:
764:
234:
213:
428:
407:
830:
809:
333:
438:
748:
780:
119:
95:
732:
64:
617:
689:
678:
667:
181:
575:
539:
1017:
656:
645:
129:
928:
But taking one side of the story at the expense of the other is exactly what a double agent does. And
Yurchenko was a master. This man is a great embarrassment to US intelligence. He defected to the US and outed certain KGB agents, but kept Aldrich Ames under the radar and left the US-- "kidnapped by
913:
This article claims that
Yurchenko voluntarily defected but notes that, upon returning to the Soviet embassy, Yurchenko claimed that he'd been drugged and coerced by the CIA. As there are no sources at all, what is supposed to be the truth? There ought to be some references, the competing claims, and
1212:
I'm going to infuriate everyone again by complaining again about
Knowledge contradicting itself (which commits the cardinal heresy of using Knowledge as a source for Knowledge). At the time of my typing this comment, this article's first paragraph contains the text QUOTE:It is clear that his initial
1233:
I'm not scholarly enough to track it down right now, but I believe evidence exists that
Yurchenko, when he undefected to Russia, worked until retirement-age as a security-guard in a bank. That supports the idea that his defection was sincere, that his bosses knew it, and that they'd never trust him
960:
I'm not sure I understand the complaint about "no sources". I'd agree that there needs to be a source for a statement "Yurchenko claimed he'd been drugged". Yes, it should be documented that he made that claim. But there's no need to go into whether he REALLY WAS drugged or not if all that's being
771:
557:
961:
reported is that he CLAIMED to have been drugged. If I give sworn testimony that someone told me they'd been drugged, and they were not drugged, but they did tell me that they'd been drugged, then my testimony is correct.
1358:
1363:
755:
553:
1333:
1235:
1214:
962:
787:
561:
468:
1278:
195:
43:
1273:
485:
1239:
1218:
966:
630:
587:
1283:
1343:
1328:
1154:
1150:
1136:
521:
511:
1313:
616:
389:
379:
1263:
48:
1338:
1323:
475:
31:) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or
1373:
1348:
1318:
1308:
891:
881:
1353:
1298:
284:
274:
739:
549:
480:
190:
105:
1368:
1288:
1268:
355:
147:
23:
914:
a discussion of what to think and for what sorts of reason – because it is meaningless to take one side of the story at the expense of another.
1293:
582:
544:
1303:
591:
857:
151:
451:
412:
250:
463:
346:
307:
155:
1132:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
1012:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
146:, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Knowledge's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to
853:
840:
814:
322:
301:
142:
100:
241:
218:
459:
on
Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions.
1112:
1002:
1197:
1061:
75:
1024:
An editor has determined that the edit contains an error somewhere. Please follow the instructions below and mark the
919:
1153:
to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
934:
63:
1188:
1104:
1052:
994:
763:
586:. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a
32:
1100:
990:
233:
212:
930:
354:(USSR) on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
1172:
If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
1160:
1036:
If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
915:
849:
81:
1103:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit
993:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit
949:
1077:
443:
42:. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to
338:
1122:
945:
249:
on
Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
46:.If you are a subject of this article, or acting on behalf of one, and you need help, please see
1157:
before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
427:
406:
1173:
1037:
1096:
986:
134:
1180:
1044:
1073:
39:
829:
808:
1139:, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by
1113:
https://web.archive.org/web/20130424005418/http://dcist.com/2004/09/an_obituary_yur.php
1003:
https://web.archive.org/web/20130424005418/http://dcist.com/2004/09/an_obituary_yur.php
1179:
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
1043:
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
1257:
456:
747:
351:
1146:
779:
1116:
1006:
731:
118:
94:
1145:. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than
433:
328:
124:
845:
455:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the
1243:
1222:
1202:
1081:
1066:
970:
953:
938:
923:
246:
574:
538:
154:. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the
852:, and related topics. If you would like to participate, visit the
180:
1123:
https://web.archive.org/web/20111111013305/http://foia.cia.gov/
57:
38:
from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially
15:
1359:
Start-Class
Russian, Soviet and CIS military history articles
1364:
Russian, Soviet and CIS military history task force articles
778:
762:
746:
730:
615:
179:
1107:
for additional information. I made the following changes:
997:
for additional information. I made the following changes:
1126:
350:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the
245:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the
929:
the KGB"-- with the most haunting smile on his face.
1334:
Start-Class United States articles of Low-importance
628:
This article has been checked against the following
1149:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors
772:
Russian, Soviet and CIS military history task force
713:
627:
844:, which aims to improve Knowledge's coverage of
1135:This message was posted before February 2018.
944:Fixed a little. No, he was drugged by the KGB.
8:
1279:Low-importance biography (military) articles
1117:http://dcist.com/2004/09/an_obituary_yur.php
1007:http://dcist.com/2004/09/an_obituary_yur.php
909:Neutrality Issues, Verification, and Sources
61:
985:I have just modified one external link on
803:
710:
624:
533:
401:
296:
207:
89:
1274:Start-Class biography (military) articles
1095:I have just modified 2 external links on
1234:with a real intelligence-job ever again.
580:This article is within the scope of the
1236:2600:1700:6759:B000:1C64:8308:33BC:E2D6
1215:2600:1700:6759:B000:1C64:8308:33BC:E2D6
963:2600:1700:6759:B000:1C64:8308:33BC:E2D6
805:
535:
403:
298:
209:
91:
1284:Military biography work group articles
1025:
600:Knowledge:WikiProject Military history
590:. To use this banner, please see the
1344:Start-Class military history articles
1329:Low-importance United States articles
603:Template:WikiProject Military history
7:
1314:Low-importance Soviet Union articles
1208:Article should not contradict itself
449:This article is within the scope of
344:This article is within the scope of
239:This article is within the scope of
140:This article is within the scope of
1264:Biography articles of living people
496:Knowledge:WikiProject United States
352:Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
80:It is of interest to the following
1339:WikiProject United States articles
1324:Start-Class United States articles
499:Template:WikiProject United States
364:Knowledge:WikiProject Soviet Union
14:
1374:Low-importance Espionage articles
1349:Start-Class intelligence articles
1319:WikiProject Soviet Union articles
1309:Start-Class Soviet Union articles
1099:. Please take a moment to review
989:. Please take a moment to review
367:Template:WikiProject Soviet Union
191:the military biography work group
1354:Intelligence task force articles
1299:Low-importance Cold War articles
1015:
828:
807:
687:
676:
665:
654:
643:
573:
537:
436:
426:
405:
331:
321:
300:
232:
211:
127:
117:
93:
62:
21:This article must adhere to the
886:This article has been rated as
866:Knowledge:WikiProject Espionage
516:This article has been rated as
384:This article has been rated as
279:This article has been rated as
164:Knowledge:WikiProject Biography
1369:Start-Class Espionage articles
1289:WikiProject Biography articles
1269:Start-Class biography articles
869:Template:WikiProject Espionage
259:Knowledge:WikiProject Cold War
167:Template:WikiProject Biography
1:
1294:Start-Class Cold War articles
939:06:34, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
740:Military biography task force
358:and see a list of open tasks.
262:Template:WikiProject Cold War
253:and see a list of open tasks.
188:This article is supported by
24:biographies of living persons
1304:Cold War task force articles
1203:23:14, 13 January 2018 (UTC)
1082:03:15, 4 November 2017 (UTC)
1067:10:10, 3 November 2017 (UTC)
973:Christopher Lawrence Simpson
583:Military history WikiProject
152:contribute to the discussion
36:must be removed immediately
1390:
1244:03:59, 13 April 2023 (UTC)
1223:03:59, 13 April 2023 (UTC)
1166:(last update: 5 June 2024)
1092:Hello fellow Wikipedians,
982:Hello fellow Wikipedians,
971:03:59, 13 April 2023 (UTC)
954:18:40, 24 March 2010 (UTC)
924:23:56, 26 April 2009 (UTC)
892:project's importance scale
648:Referencing and citation:
522:project's importance scale
390:project's importance scale
285:project's importance scale
1072:Failed. Not dead yet. --
885:
823:
786:
770:
754:
738:
709:
606:military history articles
568:
515:
452:WikiProject United States
421:
383:
316:
278:
227:
187:
112:
88:
457:United States of America
347:WikiProject Soviet Union
1225:Christopher L. Simpson
1088:External links modified
978:External links modified
856:, or contribute to the
838:is within the scope of
756:Intelligence task force
714:Associated task forces:
659:Coverage and accuracy:
1246:Christopher L. Simpson
783:
767:
751:
735:
692:Supporting materials:
620:
502:United States articles
184:
70:This article is rated
841:WikiProject Espionage
782:
766:
750:
734:
619:
370:Soviet Union articles
183:
143:WikiProject Biography
1147:regular verification
1127:http://foia.cia.gov/
558:Russian & Soviet
444:United States portal
242:WikiProject Cold War
1137:After February 2018
790:(c. 1945 – c. 1989)
788:Cold War task force
681:Grammar and style:
634:for B-class status:
470:Articles Requested!
339:Soviet Union portal
1191:InternetArchiveBot
1142:InternetArchiveBot
1055:InternetArchiveBot
872:Espionage articles
784:
768:
752:
736:
621:
588:list of open tasks
185:
170:biography articles
76:content assessment
1167:
906:
905:
902:
901:
898:
897:
802:
801:
798:
797:
794:
793:
705:
704:
661:criterion not met
650:criterion not met
592:full instructions
532:
531:
528:
527:
400:
399:
396:
395:
295:
294:
291:
290:
265:Cold War articles
206:
205:
202:
201:
56:
55:
1381:
1201:
1192:
1165:
1164:
1143:
1097:Vitaly Yurchenko
1065:
1056:
1027:
1022:
1019:
1018:
987:Vitaly Yurchenko
916:PasswordUsername
874:
873:
870:
867:
864:
836:Vitaly Yurchenko
832:
825:
824:
819:
811:
804:
721:
711:
695:
691:
690:
684:
680:
679:
673:
669:
668:
662:
658:
657:
651:
647:
646:
625:
608:
607:
604:
601:
598:
597:Military history
577:
570:
569:
564:
545:Military history
541:
534:
504:
503:
500:
497:
494:
446:
441:
440:
439:
430:
423:
422:
417:
409:
402:
372:
371:
368:
365:
362:
341:
336:
335:
334:
325:
318:
317:
312:
304:
297:
267:
266:
263:
260:
257:
236:
229:
228:
223:
215:
208:
172:
171:
168:
165:
162:
148:join the project
137:
135:Biography portal
132:
131:
130:
121:
114:
113:
108:
97:
90:
73:
67:
66:
58:
44:this noticeboard
16:
1389:
1388:
1384:
1383:
1382:
1380:
1379:
1378:
1254:
1253:
1210:
1195:
1190:
1158:
1151:have permission
1141:
1105:this simple FaQ
1090:
1059:
1054:
1020:
1016:
995:this simple FaQ
980:
911:
871:
868:
865:
862:
861:
817:
719:
693:
688:
682:
677:
671:
666:
660:
655:
649:
644:
605:
602:
599:
596:
595:
547:
501:
498:
495:
492:
491:
490:
476:Become a Member
442:
437:
435:
415:
369:
366:
363:
360:
359:
337:
332:
330:
310:
264:
261:
258:
255:
254:
221:
169:
166:
163:
160:
159:
133:
128:
126:
103:
74:on Knowledge's
71:
12:
11:
5:
1387:
1385:
1377:
1376:
1371:
1366:
1361:
1356:
1351:
1346:
1341:
1336:
1331:
1326:
1321:
1316:
1311:
1306:
1301:
1296:
1291:
1286:
1281:
1276:
1271:
1266:
1256:
1255:
1252:
1251:
1250:
1249:
1248:
1247:
1209:
1206:
1185:
1184:
1177:
1130:
1129:
1121:Added archive
1119:
1111:Added archive
1089:
1086:
1085:
1084:
1049:
1048:
1041:
1010:
1009:
1001:Added archive
979:
976:
975:
974:
957:
956:
931:Nannygoatstrut
910:
907:
904:
903:
900:
899:
896:
895:
888:Low-importance
884:
878:
877:
875:
833:
821:
820:
818:Low‑importance
812:
800:
799:
796:
795:
792:
791:
785:
775:
774:
769:
759:
758:
753:
743:
742:
737:
727:
726:
724:
722:
716:
715:
707:
706:
703:
702:
700:
698:
697:
696:
685:
674:
663:
652:
638:
637:
635:
622:
612:
611:
609:
578:
566:
565:
542:
530:
529:
526:
525:
518:Low-importance
514:
508:
507:
505:
489:
488:
483:
478:
473:
466:
464:Template Usage
460:
448:
447:
431:
419:
418:
416:Low‑importance
410:
398:
397:
394:
393:
386:Low-importance
382:
376:
375:
373:
356:the discussion
343:
342:
326:
314:
313:
311:Low‑importance
305:
293:
292:
289:
288:
281:Low-importance
277:
271:
270:
268:
251:the discussion
237:
225:
224:
222:Low‑importance
216:
204:
203:
200:
199:
196:Low-importance
186:
176:
175:
173:
139:
138:
122:
110:
109:
98:
86:
85:
79:
68:
54:
53:
49:this help page
33:poorly sourced
19:
13:
10:
9:
6:
4:
3:
2:
1386:
1375:
1372:
1370:
1367:
1365:
1362:
1360:
1357:
1355:
1352:
1350:
1347:
1345:
1342:
1340:
1337:
1335:
1332:
1330:
1327:
1325:
1322:
1320:
1317:
1315:
1312:
1310:
1307:
1305:
1302:
1300:
1297:
1295:
1292:
1290:
1287:
1285:
1282:
1280:
1277:
1275:
1272:
1270:
1267:
1265:
1262:
1261:
1259:
1245:
1241:
1237:
1232:
1231:
1230:
1229:
1228:
1227:
1226:
1224:
1220:
1216:
1207:
1205:
1204:
1199:
1194:
1193:
1182:
1178:
1175:
1171:
1170:
1169:
1162:
1156:
1152:
1148:
1144:
1138:
1133:
1128:
1124:
1120:
1118:
1114:
1110:
1109:
1108:
1106:
1102:
1098:
1093:
1087:
1083:
1079:
1075:
1071:
1070:
1069:
1068:
1063:
1058:
1057:
1046:
1042:
1039:
1035:
1034:
1033:
1032:
1031:
1013:
1008:
1004:
1000:
999:
998:
996:
992:
988:
983:
977:
972:
968:
964:
959:
958:
955:
951:
947:
943:
942:
941:
940:
936:
932:
926:
925:
921:
917:
908:
893:
889:
883:
880:
879:
876:
859:
855:
851:
847:
843:
842:
837:
834:
831:
827:
826:
822:
816:
813:
810:
806:
789:
781:
777:
776:
773:
765:
761:
760:
757:
749:
745:
744:
741:
733:
729:
728:
725:
723:
718:
717:
712:
708:
701:
699:
694:criterion met
686:
683:criterion met
675:
672:criterion met
664:
653:
642:
641:
640:
639:
636:
633:
632:
626:
623:
618:
614:
613:
610:
593:
589:
585:
584:
579:
576:
572:
571:
567:
563:
559:
555:
551:
546:
543:
540:
536:
523:
519:
513:
510:
509:
506:
493:United States
487:
484:
482:
479:
477:
474:
472:
471:
467:
465:
462:
461:
458:
454:
453:
445:
434:
432:
429:
425:
424:
420:
414:
413:United States
411:
408:
404:
391:
387:
381:
378:
377:
374:
357:
353:
349:
348:
340:
329:
327:
324:
320:
319:
315:
309:
306:
303:
299:
286:
282:
276:
273:
272:
269:
252:
248:
244:
243:
238:
235:
231:
230:
226:
220:
217:
214:
210:
197:
194:(assessed as
193:
192:
182:
178:
177:
174:
157:
156:documentation
153:
149:
145:
144:
136:
125:
123:
120:
116:
115:
111:
107:
102:
99:
96:
92:
87:
83:
77:
69:
65:
60:
59:
51:
50:
45:
41:
37:
34:
30:
26:
25:
20:
18:
17:
1211:
1189:
1186:
1161:source check
1140:
1134:
1131:
1094:
1091:
1053:
1050:
1029:
1023:
1014:
1011:
984:
981:
927:
912:
887:
854:project page
850:intelligence
839:
835:
629:
581:
554:Intelligence
517:
481:Project Talk
469:
450:
385:
361:Soviet Union
345:
308:Soviet Union
280:
240:
189:
141:
82:WikiProjects
47:
35:
28:
22:
670:Structure:
72:Start-class
1258:Categories
1198:Report bug
1074:Pemilligan
1062:Report bug
858:discussion
1181:this tool
1174:this tool
1045:this tool
1038:this tool
1026:|checked=
863:Espionage
846:espionage
815:Espionage
550:Biography
161:Biography
101:Biography
40:libellous
1187:Cheers.—
1051:Cheers.—
631:criteria
562:Cold War
256:Cold War
247:Cold War
219:Cold War
106:Military
1101:my edit
991:my edit
946:Biophys
890:on the
520:on the
388:on the
283:on the
486:Alerts
78:scale.
1240:talk
1219:talk
1078:talk
1030:true
967:talk
950:talk
935:talk
920:talk
150:and
1155:RfC
1125:to
1115:to
1028:to
1005:to
882:Low
512:Low
380:Low
275:Low
29:BLP
1260::
1242:)
1221:)
1168:.
1163:}}
1159:{{
1080:)
969:)
952:)
937:)
922:)
848:,
720:/
560:/
556:/
552:/
548::
198:).
104::
1238:(
1217:(
1200:)
1196:(
1183:.
1176:.
1076:(
1064:)
1060:(
1047:.
1040:.
1021:N
965:(
948:(
933:(
918:(
894:.
860:.
594:.
524:.
392:.
287:.
158:.
84::
52:.
27:(
Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.