22:
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617:) is not in the general cantata navbox: navboxes are not suited to elucidate such relations between compositions: roughly half of the relations that apply to a limited subset of the secular cantatas are to church cantatas, the other half are to compositions not in the cantata navbox. The split has the advantage of reducing the number of links in the general cantata navbox (still over 200 links remain in that box in case of split).
148:
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85:, an effort to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to Lutheranism on Knowledge (XXG). This includes but is not limited to Lutheran churches, Lutheran theology and worship, and biographies of notable Lutherans. If you would like to participate, you can edit the template attached to this page, or visit the
605:. As these are an entirely different subset I suppose I'd still prefer to keep these out of the general cantata navbox (which would then be a church cantatas only navbox as I had already implemented before it got reverted). The arguments in favour of keeping them in the general box are easily dismissed, e.g.
750:
Re. motets and oratorios: note that there was already one motet (BWV 118) and one oratorio (BWV 11) in the navbox, so either remove those, or include them all (in each case the header of the navbox should be appropriate to its content, e.g. also not saying it are cantatas by J. S. Bach, when some of
330:
The association of the BWV numbers to the first line of the
Cantata they refer to (e.g. 106 = "Gottes_Zeit_ist_die_allerbeste_Zeit") functions well only for uniquely indentified works, but, unfortunately, JSB used the same texts for multiple works, so that for example BWV 3 and 58, as well as 61 and
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I disagree that the spurious should be removed. I never quite understood why some people seem to want to make navigation templates so small they cease to be useful as nav templates. If there's enough info on them they they'll have ok articles, then there's no reason a line with the spurious ones
538:
on wider picture: the BWV numbers for cantatas are pretty meaningless, as well in general (there was no logic of any kind in their assignment) as, I'm sure, even more they would be meaningless for an average reader. I propose that meaningful groups of Bach cantatas get their own navbox, for the
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either (although the first is the base for the second) – and dozens of other examples of that kind (I hope one doesn't have to go to the box at the bottom of the page to see such links between compositions: the links should at least be in the body of the article). Why split: apart from the more
293:
shouldn't be there. Definitely seperate into three catagories (sacred, secular, spurious) though. As for the 147/147a issue -- well I'm not so sure there, because someone who finds they have "147a" might wonder where it is...eh I'm not knowledgeable about this music to be sure there.
383:
on 31 July 2011, the template shows each work preceded by a sequential number which makes it unreadable. I can't quite get the previous appearance: the last item will then appear on its own line. Can someone more versed in navigation templates please fix this urgently? --
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I answered once before. (Why is this discussion two places?) I'd rather read a list article than a navbox. The list article would have exactly the same links. For whom would the navbox be? Point at the list articles in the general navbox: that would avoid duplication.
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to the "numbers only" box, so that an article on a church cantata by Bach would usually have two boxes: the general box with the numbers, and the box for the subset the cantata belongs to (the last one presenting the links in a logically structured
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elegant box size, it focusses on groups of compositions that belong together (compare NBA grouping them the same way), and so is more helpful to the reader than what most of them would perceive as just a random list of over 250 numbered links. --
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I removed the bogus link to cantata 191. There's no point in having a link to an unrelated article. We SHOULD have an article on cantata 191 though since it is an important source of the B minor mass material.
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I read "looks nice" (your comment 14:11, 7 August 2016 above) as being support for what I had produced in the sandbox, I waited a week (didn't want to rush, see above), and then implemented the sandbox.
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I won't, it's not "my" template. I inherited it - with more than hundred red links - in 2010. Please take such a request to
Classical music, but best just leave it alone and simple as it is/was. --
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I reverted the 31 July change. Looks like they're enhancing the base templates so that less work has to be done by us, but they didn't check to see if the refactoring actually worked.
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more or less developed I was thinking it might be a good idea to split off the secular cantatas in a separate navbox (this one only retaining the church cantatas)? --
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That's it. Let me know if you have any feedback. Because I generated the page with a script, it wasn't as time-consuming as it looks, so feel free to be critical.
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Yes, all of this takes some time to develop (e.g. a separate article on the first cantata cycle would be welcome), but "it wasn't there before" is just stolid
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357:. It would be best to ask that question on the talk page there as the editors that monitor that page are the actual authors of the cantata articles.
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You split the secular cantatas, but added motets and oratorios, and claim a support. Where is that support? Please restore a template with all
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should have the cantatas, not more, not less. If you need something else, you can create additional ones, Bach's sacred music, you name it. --
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That looks nice. Gave me the sudden idea if we could simply differentiate types of cantatas by giving the numbers different colours? --
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The giant list of BWV numbers make for quick and easy navigation, but they might be unsightly for some. Should the default be "hide"?
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466:. With a secular cantata being the base for a church cantata, why split? - Would you please wait a week before making changes? --
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733:(not some other sacred works but not all) simply by number, and restore it to the articles in question. I have no time. --
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A couple of links (191 and 192) point to generic hymn-pages and not Bach cantata articles. Is that OK for now?
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The spurious ones could be split off or even removed. Again, just getting all the links in on the first pass.
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62 will be undistinguishable in the future. Couldn't the pages actually be titled by the BWV number, as in
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on
Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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Knowledge (XXG) talk:WikiProject
Classical music#Bach's secular cantatas: navbox and category
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The secular ones could be split off. My goal the first pass was to get all the links in.
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Talk:Entfernet euch, ihr heitern Sterne, BWV Anh 9#Spacing between "BWV Anh" and number
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Here's a navigation template for the Bach cantatas. Because I culled the links from
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I answered in the other place. Navboxes aren't for reading but for navigation. --
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Please remove these from the box, or change name and header of the template. --
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So I'll be reverting the edit that removed these from the cantata navbox. --
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Knowledge (XXG) talk:WikiProject
Classical music#Genre - subtitle - form
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are secular cantatas. The related church cantata (the first version of
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is an arrangement, and it isn't even a cantata, it's a motet. Finally,
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Some links show up twice (e.g. 147/147a). The were listed twice in
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List of compositions by Johann
Sebastian Bach#Motets (225–231)
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755:, where I wrote something about this regarding the motet. --
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them are clearly by other composers). See also discussion at
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is an aria. As thus, I have removed them from the template.
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church cantatas four navboxes with each around 50 cantatas:
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565:(I proposed a layout for that navbox in the discussion at
335:? Or should we create pages "(1)" and "(2)" for homonyms?
89:, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the
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Sorry if I wasn't clear. It looks nice, but a navbox
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446:List of secular cantatas by Johann Sebastian Bach
353:I culled the information for this template from
32:does not require a rating on Knowledge (XXG)'s
818:" should not contain links to the following:
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542:Cantatas composed before the Leipzig period (
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326:Direction to titles rather than BWV numbers
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600:Secular cantatas by Johann Sebastian Bach
355:List of cantatas by Johann Sebastian Bach
248:List of cantatas by Johann Sebastian Bach
240:List of cantatas by Johann Sebastian Bach
338:Opinions/advice would be great. Thanks!
189:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Christianity
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38:It is of interest to the following
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572:Other church cantatas: incomplete
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675:Template:Bach cantatas/sandbox
213:This template is supported by
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936:04:11, 15 February 2017 (UTC)
409:15:51, 15 November 2011 (UTC)
394:13:07, 12 November 2011 (UTC)
183:and see a list of open tasks.
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303:11:53, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
287:05:11, 2 February 2008 (UTC)
898:10:43, 16 August 2016 (UTC)
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440:Split off secular cantatas?
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348:20:12, 7 January 2009 (UTC)
264:. That doesn't look right.
216:WikiProject Christian music
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981:is listed as a cantata at
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419:Please see my query at
82:WikiProject Lutheranism
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906:Explanation of removal
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983:List of Bach cantatas
816:Johann Sebastian Bach
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979:BWV 1127
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952:BWV 1045
942:BWV 1040
812:Cantatas
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611:BWV 249b
607:BWV 249a
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859:BWV 219
853:BWV 218
847:BWV 160
841:BWV 141
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615:BWV 249
536:Comment
486:BWV 236
482:BWV 179
401:DavidRF
359:DavidRF
279:DavidRF
835:BWV 15
823:BWV 11
506:Oppose
464:Oppose
377:Since
333:BWV 58
36:scale.
444:With
135:Music
28:This
995:talk
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924:1127
920:1083
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912:1040
894:talk
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659:talk
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609:and
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Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.
