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614:). It's very common to see this footnote mark used outside religious context and I don't think it's to be identified with Christianity here. Nevertheless I decided to use the more neutral looking asterisk in its place to prevent a possible revert war because of seeing a connection between the religion of Turkic peoples and the used footnote symbols. I now see the reverting started the other way and my attempt has not been successfull.
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784:Äynu has been classified as a Siberian Turkic language here, which is incorrect. I don't want to start a revert war. If you read Johanson (2001), Äynu is clearly modern Uyghur grammar with a Persian vocabulary. Tooru and the other sources I've consulted agree. I wouldn't consider Glottolog to be a very reliable source when it comes to internal classification.
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article, and I realize that there are some differences in this respect with the previous template. I think it is best to stick to the classification tree and group names mentioned there, and if there are any misplacements or mistakes with the group names, these should first be discussed on the Turkic
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I strongly dislike the pipes (|) as separators. For one thing they look too similar to the † symbols. I think each group should start on a new line. Or if not, use something like "•" (centre dot?). Is there any reason this template has to be this width? Just make it wider... (it goes at the bottom of
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I've always heard Uyghur & Uzbek referred to as Karluk. I know there's no entry on Karluk languages in
Knowledge (XXG), but there isn't one for any of the other groups either. Whenever those are linked, they either go to a specific language or an ethnic group. I'd be cool with changing Karluk
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I was not very sure about the linguistic validity of putting it there as an extinct member of the family. Doesn't the concept of a "language family" directly imply that, sometime in the past, there was a common ancestor to the whole family, an actual, living language which later became extinct? I
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Hm. That other one looks better over all, because it is more populated by blue links. It also doesn't have these "† Extinct | * Mixed language" markers. There's just too many different marks - four types - for such small text. I think we should improve this one so much that they also convert the
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article. There, the
Chagatay subgroup is listed under the western branch. But obviously, that could also be wrong. If you are more knowledgeable on this, could you please fix that article and then the change could be mirrored here. I do not know whether the Ethnologue is a trustable source for
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I would disagree with changing it to this new one, because instead of making it simpler for readers navigating this actually makes it far more confusing and complicated. 1. There's way too many show/hide tabs, and 2. There's a lot of
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Hi, having a template for the Turkic languages is a very good idea. I propose a new design for this template and I hope you do not feel offended by this sudden change. I think the main requirements for such a template are:
482:
is also a good example of what I mean by not trying to put the classification details into the template. I think the template should just be a navigation tool between related articles, not a full-scale classification
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I'm not sure it is a good idea to add Proto-Turkic. It gives the impression that Proto-Turkic was a real language when "proto-languages" are rather theories. It would be like addding Common Turkic to the list.
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languages talk page, fixed there, and then incorporated into this template. Note: I am also adding the template to the related articles with the hope that it will get more attention and contributions. Regards,
682:. We can't really say there were actual speakers of a reconstructed language. Common Turkic is a term for a proto-language which means basically z-Turkic, all the Turkic languages minus Chuvash. --
296:, which uses the same formatting, width, etc. I don't know how important you think consistency is, but I agree that the current template isn't too attractive or user-friendly.
665:, but extinct members aren't included in that template. In any case, please feel free to remove it if you think it doesn't make sense. What's Common Turkic? Kind regards,
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I don't know if it's really accurate to call languages like
Ottoman Turkish extinct. They're simply an older form of an existing language, just like
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The entries should be listed alphabetically whenever possible. This gives the list a neutral look and provides a certain ease for browsing entries.
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I see, I think it's perhaps better not to have it on the list. Chuvash is really interesting by the way, and thanks for the explanation.
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It should not try to include all the details of classification (the place for the detailed classification tree should be the
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It says
Ottoman Turkish is extinct (italics), however there are still several hundred speakers of the language still alive--
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Well yes and no. I found this on
Knowledge (XXG) that puts the words on the idea I'm thinking about together better...
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for the extinct languages footnote in this template, I just want to point out that the footnote symbol used by
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I think you should link the classifications, even if they're redlinks - it will encourage them to get written.
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says it is Altaic, Turkic, Eastern. I would like to see a source for classifying it as western Turkic. :/
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on
Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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Why is Uyghur a Karluk language? Where did that classification come from anyway? Have you noticed
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I prefer if it uses the blue color scheme widely established for templates of this type, like
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other one. ;) What about using different types of differentiation, like italics or underline?
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to replace the astreisks is not called a "Christian cross" but rather a "dagger" (please see
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What do you think of the current note? Thanks, BTW, for all of your help with this project
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How about italicizing the extinct ones and ignoring that Aini is mixed? I'll test it out.
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Please note that I based the Turkic language groups in my edit to the current tree in the
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Hi, the categorization in this template was directly derived from the list on the
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Can we please use the new version of this template with some edits, like in
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Thank you! I'm very glad that you liked it. My regards to
Chicago, IL!
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Modern Uyghur is a Turkic language of the
Eastern or Chaghatay branch
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article) and sacrifice some detail for the sake of cleanness.
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Your edits look great! Thanks for getting the template up.
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Comparative_method#Non-uniformity_of_the_proto-language
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584:classification (I guess it should be). Regards,
109:does not require a rating on Knowledge (XXG)'s
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45:New to Knowledge (XXG)? Welcome!
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40:Click here to start a new topic.
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500:16:25, 10 September 2006 (UTC)
476:Template:Official EU languages
464:Template:Finno-Ugric languages
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813:NA-importance Turkey articles
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261:, that's all. It seems weird.
187:and see a list of open tasks.
37:Put new text under old text.
818:All WikiProject Turkey pages
794:14:11, 3 November 2022 (UTC)
589:09:49, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
574:07:03, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
562:(p4). They are synonyms...?
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663:Template:Germanic languages
472:Template:Germanic languages
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598:"Christian cross" / Dagger
480:Template:Romance_languages
468:Template:Romance_languages
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75:Be welcoming to newcomers
684:Stacey Doljack Borsody
648:Stacey Doljack Borsody
70:avoid personal attacks
226:is about a ship?????
657:don't see a link to
268:articles, right?) --
244:to Eastern, though.
701:Atilim Gunes Baydin
667:Atilim Gunes Baydin
616:Atilim Gunes Baydin
612:Dagger (typography)
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19:This is the
762:WP:REDLINKS
720:24.171.6.27
802:Categories
569:translate?
545:translate?
536:Ethnologue
386:translate?
325:translate?
275:translate?
233:translate?
626:Old Norse
83:if needed
66:Be polite
27:template.
21:talk page
786:Straughn
604:asterisk
558:) says:
507:Straughn
421:Straughn
352:Straughn
298:Straughn
246:Straughn
218:Comments
107:template
51:get help
757:Oppose
554:Hahn (
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483:tree.)
224:Karluk
190:Turkey
177:Turkey
136:Turkey
113:scale.
741:? --
632:Peter
105:This
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