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people visit daily, what do you expect Indira Gandhi to do? Sit there and eat
Biryani? The entire notion that Bhindranwale was some sort of hero or martyr is just a myth. I know this is unrelated, but my grandfather was a Sikh living in Punjab during the 80s, and he was kidnapped by Bhindranwale's goons. I'm not supporting Indira Gandhi or the Congress, but remember, there's two sides to every story. The militants weren't innocent either. Hindus and Nirankaris were relentlessly persecuted by these people.
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To me as a Sikh it appears that in its present form "Islam and
Sikhism" article is of very low scholarly value .The main aim of this article should be to compare the Philosophy of our Guru Sahib with that of Islamic Philosophy , there is no need to mention in very first para how many Victoria
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OK, now let's do this in a civilized manner. I have gave you my argument many times as to why it should be "Sikh militants" instead of "Khalsa", and have now gave you my argument as to why "high civilian casualties" should be removed from the "results" section in the infobox. Do you have any logical
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I partially agree with you. The operation was poorly executed, and the army mistreated and killed civilians on numerous occasions. That's understandable. But let's be honest now, when a group of individuals have a full military-level weapons cache hidden in a holy place of worship that thousands of
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i also feel there is no need to mention complete the sakhi of
Bhikhan shah ji ,just link is sufficient , Bhai Mardana might have born as Muslim but he Was NOT MUSLIM ,as in Same way Guru Nanak was not a Hindu and how Ahmadiyas who themselves are considered as non muslims in islamic countries can
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hello, i recently changed the def. of the term "sikh" pointing that it means to learn in literal terms and while sikh as a noun means a student/disciple. How did I arrive at this? I didnot, Giani Sant Singh
Maskeen did. Know the name? NO? then find out. Yes? well okay then you must be knowing all
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as you mentioned assume good faith and contribute constructively, but in an article related to history has to have facts and it cannot be used to showcase individual views, Mughals were the rulers of India for almost 300 years, they cannot be called as tyrant and no one historian will agree to it,
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Regardless of whether or not it was an operation is irrelevant. Even if you type in "operation" on the
Knowledge (XXG) search engine, and individually check every operation, none of them have any mention of casualties in the infobox. That's all that matters. The Iranian embassy siege did not have
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Secondly, I removed "high civilian casualties" because #1 The number of civilian casualties in this battle is not clear. #2 . Civilian casualties and the death of belligerents is ubiquitous in virtually every war/battle. It need not be included in the "results". Take the Battle of
Stalingrad, for
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though, as yet, you have not really explained what that concern is. Please do not use excuses such as referencing to delete content that you have a concern about. As a general principle, a lack of citations is not a valid reason to delete content. In general the "citation needed" template is the
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Hi Sikh-history, I have read and admired some of your contributions to
Sikhism and other related articles in the past. I recently got back on WP and would like to try improve these articles. Would be great to collaborate if you have some time. I just added some content today on the "Liberation"
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Concerning the civilian casualties, it's ironic that the example you gave me of the
Iranian Embassy siege does NOT have civilian casualties in its "results" section. There's not a single battle on Knowledge (XXG) that has it, regardless of how many human rights organizations consider it a major
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example. Even though there were 40,000 civilian casualties, it was still not included in the results section. Even the Battle of Saipan, where the ratio of civilian-to-soldier casualties was nearly one(27,000 soldiers dead, 22,000 civilians dead), it was still not included.
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Closing this, I've redirected and deleted the content, too much was copyvio and as you said, we have the article already. I think we have a problem with the article creator. But thanks for your AfD. I redirected just seconds after you added it and didn't even notice it!
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I'm curious as to way you posted told me that I'm "engaged in an edit war" but not Jujhar or The Devil's Advocate? I'm not vandalizing the page. I have a well-substantiated reason for every edit I make. Jujhar is the one editing without any sort of logical reason.
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4)"These included teachings of saints of the Hindu and Muslim faith also. Jahangir, the fourth Mughal Emperor, was angered by the number of Muslims who converted to Sikhism, so he had Guru Arjan Dev imprisoned in Gwalior fort, and then later boiled alive"
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appropriate way to raise a citation concern. Removing content is only appropriate if there is good-faith reason to believe that the content is inaccurate or misplaced or if a reasonable amount of time has passed where the content has lacked referencing.
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issue. Not a single one. It's unfortunate that so many civilians died, but Operation Blue Star can't be an exception to this. Now, there should be a civilian casualties section on the page itself, but NOT on the infobox's results section.
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left this on your user page, and presumably meant to put it here. Please note that if you wish to reply, you should do so on the his user talk page, because he is blocked for a month for edit warring and sanctions violations.
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I have reverted your edit for now. If you continue to have a real concern, please state it (preferably on the Talk page). Regardless, please feel free to adjust the writing or propose changes to address your concerns.
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No problem :) To be honest, I'm rather following a few vandal contribution logs so any further editing of mine beyond what I have done so far will have to wait on other items on my to-do list. In any case, I've added
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do you feel its Ok to mention in very first para how many Sikhs served under british ,or won battle honors ? if yes we need mention musilm conquest also .their achievements are much bigger than us in this regard .
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regarding the use of specific words in the info box. I think we should discuss this case on the one place (talk page of article) rather than talk page(s) of individual editors. Hopefully, we will find solution via
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I suggest you read General Brars book (Operation Blue Star: The True Story). He addresses many of your complaints, including the reason they did the operation on the celebration of the birthday of a Sikh Guru.
1768:. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose
1680:. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose
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1417:. It has the authority to impose binding solutions to disputes between editors, primarily for serious conduct disputes the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the authority to impose
1286:
let me tell you Muslims donot believe that "GOD is inside Kaaba " and over emphasis on this sakhi of Guru Nanak in Mecca indirectly strengthen the nonsence claim that "Guru Nanak was a Muslim".
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Casualties are reported in the "casualties" section. Not the results section. This is the same for *every single military battle* on Knowledge (XXG), and if not, please find an exception.
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I see your from the UK and an academic, are you a professor ?-could we meet up as im interested in jatt and sikh history but dont know how to find or where the body of literature sits.
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2)"the Sikhs made up to 25% of the soldiers in World War I and World War II. The Sikhs were awarded 14 Victoria Crosses for their bravery and over 27 battle honours (a record)"
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First of All Sikhism is not an 'Indian religion' ,its Universal having root in Dharma ,having Panenthiestic theology ,and introduction needs to be abstact and short .
1292:"While many historians and theologians argue that his philosophy was influenced by other faiths" anyone can claim whatever he/she wanna claim ,its far from truth .
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mention of casualties in the results section of the main infobox. That is what we're discussing. Independent accounts are generally regarded as anecdotes and aren't
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and nowhwere in the article you mention the basic Philosophy/theological difference bw Islam and Sikhi ,which to me is atmost important and very much required .
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cross Sikhs have won or how many sikhs served under British ,Muslims also claimed that "Islam is against forced conversion and Mughals do not represent Islam " .
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1) very first line "Islam is a Abrahamic religion, believed to descend from Abraham, whereas Sikhism is a Indian religion founded in the Indian subcontinent"
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So what do you think, Even in everyday living sikh (as a noun means ) desiciple BUT as a word it means " (to) Learn" Please correct this or put your point
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I undid your edits. There is no need to shorten the page. The more you shorten it at this point the more you lose. See the other religious pages such as
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1282:"Then he lifted his eyes seeing the Kaaba standing in the direction of the Guru's feet" just read this line , how shallow and childish it sounds .
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By the way, with something so obvious you could have made the redirect. I've just undone a page move by the editor who changed (without discussion)
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1298:"The Sikh rebellion against Mughal rule" title of this section portray Sikh Guru Sahiban as rebels ,that why i combined above two sections .
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next "Differences between Islam and Sikhism" here you are comparing 5 pillars of Islam with 5 Ks of Khalsa , its beyond logic .
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section in the Sikhism article. Would you mind doing a quick review and sharing any feedback when you get a chance ? Thank you.
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its absurd to use word "Sometimes" ,it shows sikhs have no clear cut stance, its like Sometime this ,sometimes that ......
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I've reverted a page move but this needs tidying up and work, can you fix it? I started an SPI as this is of course a sock.
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in short our main focus should be on comparing Guru Granth Sahib ji with Quran and here lies the strength of Sikhi .
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that there's needed to know. He himself descirbes it and could be found in one of his kathas if you want me to give a link?
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684:. You've made the article worse. I really do not know whether to laugh or cry. I've never come accross an editor who lacks
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I understand you're Sikh and this is a particularly sensitive issue to you, but on Knowledge (XXG), you cannot be biased.
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Muslim also claims the same , i think there is a verse in quran related to it "there is no compulsion in religion ..."
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Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. Knowledge (XXG) appreciates your help. We noticed though that when you edited
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The Islam-Sikhism article on Wiki is total Messed Up . its biased , absured ,low standard. needs to be clean up .
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Akbar was called "Akbar the Great", so if I correct this and that is reverted back how do we respond to that ?
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if Sikhi is Indian religion then Islam should be an Arabic religion , "believed to " is also inappropriate .
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again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on
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When you revert multiple edits, could you mention in the edit summary what version you are reverting to.
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and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a
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I will try my best. At the moment I'm busy preparing course work for my students, but keep me posted.
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Asia Books | author=Singh, Nirbhai | year=Dec 1990 | location=New Delhi | pages=111–112}}</ref: -->
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objections to these arguments? May I edit the page now without risking getting blocked from it?
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Also I see you have something about indo scythian and arayans, what does that mean?
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Have a look at the edit now I am 80% sure you should be happy with it now?
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i can provide you any type of "refereces" ,this is not a big issue .
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Hello, I see the that you continue have a concern about the article
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Your from haryana and ethnicity is English / British same as me.
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Regarding the use of specific words on Operation Blue Star article
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sources. The amount of civilian casualties is ultimately unknown.
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Shaheedi of Guru Arjan dev is again mentioned in below sections
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3)"Sikhism is opposed to the concept of forced conversions "
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as i already said your article has number of issues ,
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by modifying 1 "()"s. If you have, don't worry, just
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please. I'm concerned that it may be a hit piece. -
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I'm in the uk next, could call or meet after work?
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1324:14.139.34.2
1067:subst:Xmas2
999:blessings
437:Hello, I'm
428:August 2013
343:Re: Warning
271:WP:Reliable
1774:topic bans
1686:topic bans
1608:topic bans
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1423:topic bans
1368:. Thanks,
1190:Dougweller
1171:Dougweller
1149:Saturnalia
1109:Dougweller
934:Dougweller
898:Dougweller
875:Dougweller
851:. You can
801:thanks .
566:OccultZone
551:. You can
541:OccultZone
483:BracketBot
439:BracketBot
365:. You can
170:learn more
1770:site bans
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1352:Read the
1241:sometimes
1125:Christmas
1050:Christmas
776:Dracontes
594:Arqum.beg
443:your edit
330:Theman244
328:. Thanks
321:talk page
295:. Thanks
289:WP:LAWYER
86:if needed
69:Be polite
29:talk page
1320:unsigned
1145:Festivus
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481:Thanks,
415:Jattnijj
384:Qwyrxian
152:Archives
97:Archives
54:get help
23:This is
1797:NoACEMM
1709:NoACEMM
1370:DPL bot
1076:Diannaa
1039:Diannaa
964:Bgwhite
890:Tarkhan
774:to it.
764:Sikhism
678:WP:Lead
644:WP:Lead
507:Sikhism
1348:Dangal
1141:Lenaia
1129:Diwali
750:Sitush
690:WP:AGF
517:-- MC
451:syntax
275:JDiala
253:JDiala
222:JDiala
1158:subst
1047:Merry
619:Islam
102:Index
82:Seek
1807:talk
1760:The
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396:Hey
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71:and
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