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meet our inclusion standards. But that's the way society is (that athlete will also likely earn multiple times the income of even a top-level academic). WP cannot do otherwise than reflect society. So if their are sources on a supermarket novel, it gets an article and a journal (for which we have an essay, NJournals, to make it easier to pass the bar then GNG) does not get an article. --
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listed in its first few years. One of the criteria for consideration is "a publication history of at least two years" and even then it has to be proposed for inclusion and considered by a committee that can take another year. So not being in Scopus is exactly what should be expected, and is not an indication of lack of notability.
489:. And Scopus et al. only include a journal after it has shown too have some impact, their equivalent of our "notability". As this has only just started, there are no sources indicating any notability. This needs to be deleted and once (if ever) notability is clear it can be re-created, we don't do that the other way around. -- 832:- I've been watching this for a bit, and RandyKitty's most recent comment pushed me over the edge. If the journal is not indexed by even the most inclusive of sources, and cannot otherwise meet GNG (per GreenC's analysis), then it has not established notability yet. Perhaps one day, but it seems not yet. 368:
is not the strongest argument. Yes, it's irritating those supermarket novels. Compare it to an 18-year old athlete who's considered notable after even the most modest accomplishments whereas academics who spent their whole lives researching and publishing don't get any coverage and therefore don't
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In the section above, RandyKitty claims "If it's not in Scopus, you can pretty safely assume that it is not notable yet", and others have taken that comment seriously. However, Scopus does not operate that way. It isn't in Scopus because it is new, and it is very rare (or never) that a journal is
626:. I agree with Zero. This journal is indeed notable and certainly worthy of an article. The sourcing demonstrates its notability and legitimacy. I don't think we should have to wait years until a new journal from an important academic press is indexed by SCOPUS and others. 543:
All indications are that it's a legitimate enterprise, but without indexing in a selective database or in-depth coverage by secondary sources (say, if it had an innovative funding scheme or peer-review system that attracted attention), we don't have grounds for an article
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It should have an article because a peer-reviewed academic journal that has already published 21 papers is worthy of an article. If reflecting society was all that Knowledge was supposed to do, we should close up shop.
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I had this pegged as a No Consensus close and it still might end up there, but there are some unresolved discussion points in the debate which may allow a consensus either way to form. Relisting a second
905:? I think that GreenC has shown pretty clearly that none of the current sources satisfy GNG, and the Penn Arts article added since then is just a statement from the editor and obviously not independent. 548:. 21 papers is actually a very small number of papers as far as academic publications go, and we'd need many more than the handful of existing citations to them to argue that the journal is influential. 203: 130: 401:... Do you really think that instead of looking for independent reliable sources we should leave it to WP editors to decide what should get an article ("worthy") and what not ("unworthy")? -- 344:. This is a serious peer-reviewed academic journal published by a university press with an excellent editorial board. The reason that it is not indexed by resources like SCOPUS is that they 700:
I'm amazed at how much support Zero0000's arguments are getting. Classic don't do this in AfD arguments. Suggest those who want to keep find more and better sources. Of the current sources:
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https://academic.oup.com/journals/search-results?page=1&q=%22Capitalism%3A%20A%20Journal%20of%20History%20and%20Economics%22&fl_SiteID=5567&SearchSourceType=1&allJournals=1
281: 896:. If that means that we don't immediately have an article on every journal that will end up one day demonstrating notability as soon as it starts, then that's just part of the process. 778:- per the above policy based !votes of RandyKitty, Xoreaster, and David Eppstein. Doesn't meet notability criteria currently. Just because it exists, does not make it notable. 863:
What you write about inclusion in Scopus is not wrong, but your conclusion is. Scopus has not (yet?) decided whether this will be included. Apart from having a well-functioning
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journals. If it's not in Scopus, you can pretty safely assume that it is not notable yet, except for the extremely rare case that a journal meets GNG before it gets indexed.
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that I took to AfD) with reason "Announcement by IAS demonstrates notability". A brief press release is far from sufficient to meet GNG, so PROD reason still stands. Hence:
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Yes, it takes time for sources to properly assess a new publication. It is just the nature of the beast that we can't get ahead of our sources. As
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index journals in their first few years of operation. (I know this from my editorial experience with several journals.) A supermarket novel
430:,think this needs to be kept and re-addressed in a year or so time to see if it is being indexed. Articles are already being reference - 231: 66: 97: 90: 17: 197: 522: 869:
even large, well-established publishers produce the occasional dud that folds after a few years, without leaving much trace
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is not a database but an access platform ("aggregator") and as such not independent: it sells subscriptions. --
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lack of GNG or NJOURNALS pass. Can be recreated later if independent RS coverage is published in future. (
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1. ias.edu .. press release with a press contact (upper right side). Not independent in-depth coverage.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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with two reviews in trade review rags but an academic journal has to jump through hoops?
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as required by GNG? In the absence of those, how does your !vote differ from
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Note: This discussion has been included in the Article Rescue Squadron's
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Article PRODded with reason "Non-notable new journal. Not indexed in any
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Nobody says that this is not a serious journal, but at this point we
52:. After a pair of relists, I just really don't see a consensus here. 946:: which two sources cover the journal in-depth so that GNG is met? 752: 995:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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My question is what criteria you think it does satisfy from
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2. MUSE - database entry. Is every journal on MUSE notable?
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Currently there are zero sources that show notability per
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list of Academic journals-related deletion discussions
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it's well-sourced and reputably produced. It passes
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Never thought I'd see an admin argue that we should
813:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, 647:: Could you please tell us which 2 sources provide 575:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, 609:-level in-depth coverage in independent sources. — 244:databases, no independent sources. Does not meet 43:). No further edits should be made to this page. 1007:). No further edits should be made to this page. 487:don't even know whether this is going to survive 320:Note: This discussion has been included in the 300:Note: This discussion has been included in the 280:Note: This discussion has been included in the 302:list of Economics-related deletion discussions 127:Capitalism: A Journal of History and Economics 79:Capitalism: A Journal of History and Economics 230: 8: 322:list of History-related deletion discussions 118:Help, my article got nominated for deletion! 675: 453:: Agree with Zero and Davidstewartharvey. 319: 299: 279: 678:list of content for rescue consideration 890: 399:keep an article because it is "worthy" 713:3. Masthead - not indepedent coverage 7: 256:." Article dePRODded (by creator of 24: 103:Introduction to deletion process 950:is just so much hand waving. -- 893:lagging indicator of notability 18:Knowledge:Articles for deletion 460:09:25, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 1: 771:23:00, 28 February 2021 (UTC) 738:22:43, 28 February 2021 (UTC) 690:22:12, 28 February 2021 (UTC) 669:22:35, 28 February 2021 (UTC) 649:independent in-depth coverage 636:21:50, 28 February 2021 (UTC) 619:17:38, 25 February 2021 (UTC) 588:13:41, 21 February 2021 (UTC) 558:15:45, 20 February 2021 (UTC) 536:02:28, 17 February 2021 (UTC) 499:09:58, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 475:13:46, 21 February 2021 (UTC) 444:09:19, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 411:11:17, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 393:11:07, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 379:10:09, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 357:07:07, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 334:00:09, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 314:00:08, 14 February 2021 (UTC) 294:22:19, 13 February 2021 (UTC) 274:22:18, 13 February 2021 (UTC) 93:(AfD)? Read these primers! 1024: 988:22:18, 11 March 2021 (UTC) 73:20:14, 12 March 2021 (UTC) 960:22:40, 5 March 2021 (UTC) 935:19:21, 5 March 2021 (UTC) 915:22:15, 5 March 2021 (UTC) 881:09:46, 5 March 2021 (UTC) 855:04:29, 5 March 2021 (UTC) 842:02:46, 5 March 2021 (UTC) 823:14:13, 4 March 2021 (UTC) 790:21:24, 1 March 2021 (UTC) 997:Please do not modify it. 32:Please do not modify it. 258:another journal article 91:Articles for deletion 605:and no evidence of 252:. Article creation 807:Relisting comment: 465:: blocked sock. -- 436:Davidstewartharvey 366:WP:OTHERCRAPEXISTS 825: 692: 590: 586: 477: 336: 316: 296: 108:Guide to deletion 98:How to contribute 1015: 984: 812: 804: 802: 786: 783: 754:over 41 THOUSAND 735: 728: 585: 583: 576: 574: 572: 570: 534: 461: 235: 234: 220: 168: 150: 88: 69: 64: 57: 34: 1023: 1022: 1018: 1017: 1016: 1014: 1013: 1012: 1011: 1005:deletion review 982: 891:Knowledge is a 826: 797: 795: 784: 781: 731: 724: 591: 579: 577: 565: 563: 513: 511:WP:NOTINHERITED 177: 141: 125: 122: 85: 82: 67: 60: 55: 48:The result was 41:deletion review 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 1021: 1019: 1010: 1009: 991: 990: 965: 964: 963: 962: 938: 937: 920: 919: 918: 917: 898: 897: 883: 858: 857: 844: 811: 805: 794: 793: 792: 773: 741: 740: 716: 715: 714: 711: 708: 702: 701: 694: 693: 673: 672: 671: 639: 638: 621: 611:David Eppstein 573: 562: 561: 560: 538: 501: 479: 478: 447: 446: 420: 419: 418: 417: 416: 415: 414: 413: 382: 381: 360: 359: 338: 337: 317: 297: 238: 237: 174: 121: 120: 115: 105: 100: 83: 81: 76: 46: 45: 25: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 1020: 1008: 1006: 1002: 998: 993: 992: 989: 986: 985: 978: 974: 970: 967: 966: 961: 957: 953: 949: 948:WP:ITSNOTABLE 945: 942: 941: 940: 939: 936: 933: 929: 925: 922: 921: 916: 912: 908: 904: 900: 899: 895: 894: 888: 884: 882: 878: 874: 870: 866: 862: 861: 860: 859: 856: 853: 848: 845: 843: 839: 835: 831: 828: 827: 824: 820: 816: 808: 803: 800: 791: 788: 787: 777: 774: 772: 768: 764: 760: 756: 755: 750: 746: 743: 742: 739: 736: 734: 729: 727: 721: 717: 712: 709: 706: 705: 704: 703: 699: 696: 695: 691: 687: 683: 679: 674: 670: 666: 662: 658: 654: 653:WP:ITSNOTABLE 650: 646: 643: 642: 641: 640: 637: 633: 629: 625: 622: 620: 616: 612: 608: 604: 600: 596: 593: 592: 589: 584: 582: 571: 568: 559: 555: 551: 547: 542: 539: 537: 532: 528: 524: 520: 516: 512: 508: 505: 502: 500: 496: 492: 488: 484: 481: 480: 476: 472: 468: 464: 459: 458: 455:AnotherEditor 452: 449: 448: 445: 441: 437: 433: 429: 425: 422: 421: 412: 408: 404: 400: 396: 395: 394: 391: 386: 385: 384: 383: 380: 376: 372: 367: 364: 363: 362: 361: 358: 355: 351: 347: 343: 340: 339: 335: 331: 327: 323: 318: 315: 311: 307: 303: 298: 295: 291: 287: 283: 278: 277: 276: 275: 271: 267: 263: 259: 255: 251: 247: 243: 233: 229: 226: 223: 219: 215: 211: 208: 205: 202: 199: 196: 193: 190: 187: 183: 180: 179:Find sources: 175: 172: 166: 162: 158: 154: 149: 145: 140: 136: 132: 128: 124: 123: 119: 116: 113: 109: 106: 104: 101: 99: 96: 95: 94: 92: 87: 80: 77: 75: 74: 71: 70: 65: 63: 58: 51: 44: 42: 38: 33: 27: 26: 19: 996: 994: 980: 968: 943: 923: 907:MarginalCost 892: 865:crystal ball 846: 834:MarginalCost 829: 806: 796: 780: 775: 759:Project MUSE 753: 744: 732: 725: 697: 659:? Thanks. -- 648: 644: 623: 603:WP:NJOURNALS 594: 580: 564: 540: 503: 482: 462: 456: 450: 423: 345: 341: 326:MarginalCost 306:MarginalCost 261: 254:way too soon 246:WP:NJournals 241: 239: 227: 221: 213: 206: 200: 194: 188: 178: 84: 61: 53: 50:no consensus 49: 47: 31: 28: 932:User:Namiba 903:WP:NJOURNAL 426:Agree with 204:free images 952:Randykitty 873:Randykitty 763:Randykitty 661:Randykitty 657:WP:ILIKEIT 599:WP:TOOSOON 581:Sandstein 550:XOR'easter 507:WP:TOOSOON 491:Randykitty 467:Randykitty 403:Randykitty 371:Randykitty 286:Randykitty 266:Randykitty 1001:talk page 242:selective 62:Phightins 37:talk page 1003:or in a 944:Question 799:Relisted 645:Question 567:Relisted 515:Headbomb 171:View log 112:glossary 39:or in a 847:Comment 745:Comment 698:Comment 682:Thriley 628:Thriley 483:Comment 210:WP refs 198:scholar 144:protect 139:history 89:New to 983:buidhe 969:Delete 928:WP:GNG 830:Delete 815:Daniel 776:Delete 749:Scopus 720:WP:GNG 607:WP:GNG 595:Delete 541:Delete 504:Delete 350:passes 262:Delete 250:WP:GNG 182:Google 148:delete 889:says 810:time. 726:Green 722:. -- 346:never 225:JSTOR 186:books 165:views 157:watch 153:links 16:< 956:talk 924:Keep 911:talk 887:WP:N 877:talk 871:. -- 852:Zero 838:talk 819:talk 785:5969 782:Onel 767:talk 686:talk 665:talk 655:and 632:talk 624:Keep 615:talk 601:for 554:talk 495:talk 471:talk 463:Note 451:Keep 440:talk 428:Zero 424:Keep 407:talk 390:Zero 375:talk 354:Zero 342:Keep 330:talk 310:talk 290:talk 270:talk 218:FENS 192:news 161:logs 135:talk 131:edit 930:.-- 546:yet 457:144 248:or 232:TWL 169:– ( 979:) 975:· 958:) 913:) 879:) 840:) 821:) 769:) 747:: 688:) 680:. 667:) 634:) 617:) 597:. 556:) 529:· 525:· 521:· 497:) 473:) 442:) 434:. 409:) 377:) 332:) 324:. 312:) 304:. 292:) 284:. 272:) 264:. 212:) 163:| 159:| 155:| 151:| 146:| 142:| 137:| 133:| 56:Go 977:c 973:t 954:( 909:( 875:( 836:( 817:( 765:( 733:C 684:( 663:( 630:( 613:( 552:( 533:} 531:b 527:p 523:c 519:t 517:{ 493:( 469:( 438:( 405:( 373:( 328:( 308:( 288:( 268:( 236:) 228:· 222:· 214:· 207:· 201:· 195:· 189:· 184:( 176:( 173:) 167:) 129:( 114:) 110:( 68:!

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Capitalism: A Journal of History and Economics

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