843:. You simply cannot defend notability by saying that Google smothers good sources with lots of links to porn video pages!" Go find the sources if you want to assert someone's notability, and don't hide behind your feeling that they're there, but hidden. Try Google News, or Google Books, for example, where you might find they have (or haven't) been written about in detail and in depth by
659:, can you please provide a link to the Teahouse discussion on AVN? Furthermore, like I already said, the sources appear within the article itself. You can find them if you press "CTRL+F" and type in the name of the publication. If you really need me to type them all out, I can, but they appear right within the article.
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simply not sufficient to show that one particular maker of drainpipes is 'Notable'. Same applies here. So, to save everyone the trouble of wading through your multitude of insider citations, please just link to just the three topmost ones which you feel clearly demonstrates this person's notability per
551:
separate sources which could reasonably be considered reliable with regards to LGBTQIA subjects, all of which have
Knowledge articles of their own, used in the article, two of which specifically refer to Rizzo as being an especially important figure in modern gay pornography. He has also appeared in
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Did you read the thread? I’m not hiding behind anything. I listed each of the sources which I thought qualified as reliable earlier, all of which appear in the article and are independent. You don't have to sift through all 29 to find them, you can just use CTRL+F, but since no one seems to want to
947:
claimed that a search of Armond Rizzo's name only yielded porn videos, which was used as a rationale for deletion, to which I replied that that is the case with virtually any porn star, which is true. A before search for most porn stars on the main Google page, regardless of notoriety, would yield
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is akin to using press releases and business magazine articles used to promote a manufacturer of earthenware drainage pipes. There may be lots of them out there, but these self-promoting, pat-on-the-back news stories and pseudo-award pages like " sluice and drainpipe manufacturer of the year" are
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of course I’d be more than willing to explain, on adult movie actors, awards such as “Best gay sex scene” “Best lesbian scene” & the lot are not notable awards. It’s akin to receiving a Domino Pizza staff of the year it doesn’t make the recipient automatically notable. Since PORNBIO has been
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shouldn't be considered a reliable source for music articles because all of their articles are focused on music. Just because most of the articles used are from publications with a focus on queer culture doesn't mean that they are in any way less reliable, especially considering
1092:, you need to trust the process a bit more, use the article’s talk page (lightly) to suggest edits/corrections/sources. The awards BTW, are not meaningless as they represent significant recognition in the industry, like almost every industry award, hello Emmy’s and Oscars.
432:: Obviously I'm going to say "keep", since I created the article, but I have my reasons. For starters, I'm not sure where your assessment of these sources being unreliable comes from, since none of them have been deprecated or even deemed generally unreliable in the
409:, can you point me to where on here that it was determined that awards for porn scenes were non-notable? The only other type of award I can think of for porn would be awards on an individual basis, which he has been nominated for and won several times.
952:, articles on popular culture, while still requiring reliable sourcing, "due to the subject matter...may not be discussed in the same academic contexts as science, law, philosophy and so on." I also see nothing about so-called "insider" sources on
1326:. Gleeanon409's lists of award coverage in RS and Benmite's list of coverage regarding the subject's thoughts on an industry issue seems more than enough to satisfy GNG. Benmite reports one description of Rizzo, from the magazine
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Please read my comments before replying, I never mentioned source analysis anywhere, all I said is awards such as “best gay scene” & the lot are no longer considered reliable & for porn actors, they have to satisfy either
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with editorial oversight & reputation for fact checking & as I have said almost innumerable times now, awards such as “best gay scene” aren’t notable anymore & porn movie actors are now tested under either
676:, another thing: The reason that you are only finding porn videos when you search up a porn star is because that is usually what Google shows you when you look up any porn star, regardless of their notoriety. Take
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as well. You can find these in the article because they are cited in the article. You also didn't respond to any of the other points I made, nor did you explain how awards for pornography are akin to winning a
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per nominator, lacks indepth coverage in reliable, secondary independent sources. We have decided to stop using industry specific publications that exist to drive hits not to provide actual reliable coverage.
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1096:, he has a point about finding sources, google news, for instance, filters not only anything about gay porn but also mainstream LGBTQ news sites. So finding sources for gay porn takes detective work.
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coverage. Porn awards count for little without independent RS acknowledgemnt, but he seems to get it. Holding off on a !vote for a closer look. There is lots of ref bombing to sort through.
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Staff of the Year Award". Those awards are clearly very different because these pornography awards are national or international awards, all of which have articles on
Knowledge as they are
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as such subject fails to qualify as they lack in-depth significant coverage in reliable sources. Almost all all awards won by subject are all in house awards hence also doesn’t satisfy
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undoubtedly meets GNG/BASIC, has numerous mentions in mainstream LGBTQ publications which is somewhat rare for porn stars, and one of few paths to notability besides legal problems.
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also. A before search only redirects me to his porn scenes if you have three reliable sources that proves subject of article is notable please bring them forward. It used to be
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Take a look at the sources in the aforementioned articles you just provided & take a look at the type of sources used in this article, for example you tried to say this
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is met. There are no articles for the 17th Annual Podunk Domino's Pizza Awards because those apply to a single business in a single town, and they are not industry-wide.
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1411:: There's a point where nitpicking over every single source just encourages people to add more low-quality sources. This is counter-productive. There are plenty. —
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similar results, as I illustrated earlier. Also, if the issue is that these publications are not scholarly or peer-reviewed, then I will remind you that, as per
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said it best, go to the
Teahouse & read the section titled AVN. Perhaps that would enlighten you better. Furthermore, don’t just say they appeared on
460:. There are definitely less reliable sources throughout, but those can be removed without the entire article being removed in the process (in other words,
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864:, please. (Note that I have removed the CSD template as it was quite inappropriately placed by the same editor who previously AFD-ed this page).
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Logo News is generally reliable and certainly a valid source for non-exceptional claims. NewNowNext is the company’s news division.
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that validated such awards like ”best gay seen” but unfortunately it is no longer in use & porn actors are now subject to
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for the past two years, and, as you pointed out, has been nominated for and won several awards for his work as a performer.
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is not self-published, it's not user-generated, and it's not sponsored. I really need you to start being more specific.
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the process, it’s an unreliable source because they do not possess a reputation for fact checking. Again, if you read
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for example. She is certainly notable on her own as a porn star, but when you look her up almost every result is of
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of which a before search like I have said over & again only leads me to porn websites. Do not forget to read
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There’s more but these should help satisfy GNG, and note in at least four languages from as many countries.
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He is in reliable secondary sources, and mainstream publications do write about the gay porn awards:
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1389:. Per the sources provided by other user to keep, my suggestion is keep with maintenance tags. (
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1341:. Seems enough RS deem his awards noteworthy, and enough deem him, specifically, noteworthy. --
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
893:; "One of the night’s big winners was Armond Rizzo, a massively popular gay porn actor..."),
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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241:. A review of all the ref bombing & a before search doesn’t show subject being notable.
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749:, again, you are not actually providing an explanation for any of this. What exactly makes
436:. Plenty of the sources included are long-standing LGBTQIA-focused publications, including
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You said: "...such subject fails to qualify as they lack in-depth significant coverage in
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1287:"Find Out Which of Your Favorite Gay Adult Performers Grabbed a 2019 Grabby Award: VIDEO"
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Would benefit from.source analysis of those sources brought in late to the discussion
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of which a before search on the article's subject turns up nothing substantial.
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1134:"L'attore porno Armond Rizzo rivela: «I bottom sono pagati meno dei top»"
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have been discussed enough to end up on the perennial sources list, but
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623:, you need to actually provide the sources so we could see if they are
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of which the subject of your article fails to satisfy either. Look at
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I've not yet found the time to wade through all 29 citations here.
1191:"Sind Bottoms weniger wert? - Porno-Star Armond Rizzo deckt auf"
1501:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
1211:"Los actores porno gay más buscados en lo que llevamos de 2017"
684:. The same happens when you look up other porn stars, such as
571:
the most prominent awards in the industry in which Rizzo works
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
305:
list of United States of
America-related deletion discussions
355:, how does an "in-house" award differ from any other award?
261:
list of Actors and filmmakers-related deletion discussions
1478:, per the research done by Gleeanon409, above. Also, per
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list of
Sexuality and gender-related deletion discussions
1055:. Lots of chaff here, but this performer may scrape by
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1153:"Gay Porn Star Demands Bottoms Get Paid Equal to Tops"
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1173:"Here's who came TOP in the European Gay Porn Awards"
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referred to that I made at the
Teahouse can be found
1481:"Rizzo — as an established, award-winning performer"
1268:"Voici le palmarès des "Golden Globes" du porno gay"
1249:"Voici le palmarès des "Golden Globes" du porno gay"
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has been confirmed as reliable. I provided you with
1374:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
1230:"Here's Who Won the 'Oscars of Gay Porn' for 2020"
43:). No further edits should be made to this page.
1513:). No further edits should be made to this page.
1031:Note: This discussion has been included in the
325:Note: This discussion has been included in the
303:Note: This discussion has been included in the
281:Note: This discussion has been included in the
259:Note: This discussion has been included in the
503:because PORNBIO is no longer used. Please read
726:was a reliable source. Did you actually read
327:list of Illinois-related deletion discussions
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8:
847:reliable sources. Using insider websites as
107:Help, my article got nominated for deletion!
1428:as the above sources establish notability.
462:don't throw the baby out with the bathwater
283:list of Mexico-related deletion discussions
229:The notability criteria for porn actors is
1339:as an established, award-winning performer
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1008:Note: This debate has been added to the
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787:you won’t be asking me that question.
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499:& you’d observe it redirects to
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753:an unreliable source? I did read
700:). That's just how Google works.
92:Introduction to deletion process
1457:(since the latter made it onto
18:Knowledge:Articles for deletion
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1494:19:53, 21 October 2020 (UTC)
1471:15:09, 20 October 2020 (UTC)
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1132:Parente, Luca (2020-01-29).
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82:(AfD)? Read these primers!
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1335:additionally describes him
1209:dice, Juan (2017-07-04).
434:list of perennial sources
1503:Please do not modify it.
956:. It's like saying that
32:Please do not modify it.
1274:(in French). 2019-05-27
1255:(in French). 2019-05-27
1010:WikiProject Pornography
1330:, above. The magazine
80:Articles for deletion
1195:www.schwulissimo.de
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1291:Towleroad Gay News
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1295:. Retrieved
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1236:. 2020-01-21
1233:
1219:. Retrieved
1217:(in Spanish)
1215:Revista Zero
1214:
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1159:. 2020-01-31
1156:
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1140:(in Italian)
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1197:(in German)
862:WP:BLUDGEON
845:independent
835:the thread
781:WP:BLUDGEON
193:free images
1486:Right cite
1343:Pinchme123
1297:2020-10-12
1278:2020-10-12
1259:2020-10-12
1240:2020-10-12
1221:2020-10-12
1201:2020-10-12
1182:2020-10-12
1171:Newsdesk.
1163:2020-10-12
1144:2020-10-12
990:Nick Moyes
866:Nick Moyes
617:Pink Paper
613:Nick Moyes
611:, I think
509:WP:PORNBIO
497:WP:PORNBIO
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1507:talk page
1413:Toughpigs
1387:weak keep
1069:• Gene93k
1065:Pink News
1059:with the
1037:• Gene93k
1017:• Gene93k
970:confirmed
959:Pitchfork
936:Logo News
759:Logo News
751:Logo News
724:Logo News
678:Asa Akira
640:as well.
621:Logo News
575:WP:ANYBIO
561:Logo News
505:WP:INDENT
239:WP:ANYBIO
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1509:or in a
1455:PinkNews
1394:F5pillar
1360:Relisted
1138:NEG Zone
1057:WP:BASIC
988:Pinging
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926:Instinct
906:PinkNews
698:see here
690:see here
682:her porn
591:Pinging
545:PinkNews
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457:PinkNews
451:Instinct
160:View log
101:glossary
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1053:Comment
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941:article
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825:Comment
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187:scholar
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128:history
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555:Paper
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175:books
154:views
146:watch
142:links
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1453:and
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150:logs
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