Knowledge (XXG)

:Articles for deletion/Elana Amsterdam - Knowledge (XXG)

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300:. I'd like to note that the links provided in the article cannot be considered to be reliable sources. The first original link (which I removed) only listed one of Amsterdam's recipes, so it's not considered to show notability. The second link is a list of cookbooks and Amsterdam is only briefly mentioned. The third link was a link to an almond website and I'm a little concerned that the article over-stated the implications of the link. It states that she was selected as an "almond expert", but the phrasing of the link was pretty vague. Not sure if that would constitute as a reliable source. A search brought up a lot of links to sale sites and blog entries, but nothing that would be considered a reliable source. 31: 520:. That Washington Post article is also unhelpful in establishing notability as it's not even about her; there's just one spare sentence about her. It's possibly a review of her book but mostly it's just a reprint and discussion of one of the recipes. You'd have a better case arguing that the article makes her olive-rosemary bread notable. No way does this clear the hurdle for 601:"The barometer of notability is whether people independent of the topic itself (or of its manufacturer, creator, author, inventor, or vendor) have actually considered the topic notable enough that they have written and published non-trivial works of their own that focus upon it – without incentive, promotion, or other influence by people connected to the topic matter." 593:"Every article on Knowledge (XXG) must be based upon verifiable statements from multiple third-party reliable sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy. A third-party source is one that is entirely independent of the subject being covered, e.g., a newspaper reporter covering a story that they are not involved in except in their capacity as a reporter." 1193: 855: 1188: 788: 1181:. The subject has written a couple cookbooks and she apparently has a publicist, so of course she's gotten a few mentions. But if the bar is merely a few mentions of her cookbook, then we'd need an article on pretty nearly anyone who ever wrote any book that got reviewed anywhere. It's supposed to take more than that. 648:
The subject does not seem to have sufficient notability. I agree that the interview is a primary source, and would make a good back-up reference for the article, but is not enough to establish notability. The WaPo article is, indeed, better at establishing notability of the cookbook or the recipe
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are enough to change my mind. These are the first articles I've seen that really feature the subject of this article instead of one of her books or recipes. I still have a bad feeling about this, due to COI concerns, but I have to agree that policy supports the assertion she is notable.
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reports that she and her 3-yo son are both celiac; the rest of the article is about her book and about almond flour. More to the point, it would be hard to find a publication that more succinctly fits the definition of small town newspaper than the Vail Daily with a circulation of only
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but this article is a mess. The references section is for listing where the information used to create the article came from, it's not a bullet list on what make the subject notable or a place to save it from deletion. This article's scant 2 sentences are "referenced" with 6 sources.
393:. The videos are what we call primary sources because the subject was involved in producing them. Primary sources can be use, with care, to fill in detail once notability has been established but not to establish notability, which is the only issue we consider at an AfD. 649:
than the author, as the article's coverage of the author is trivial at best. Finally, the editor who started the article (and to date is the main contributor) is the owner of a Public Relations company, who has the article subject as a client (see
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article so we have to depend on Google's snippet to tell us that she's an "ingenious celiac" (that's someone who can't digest gluten) who's done something (we don't know what) with sandwich bread. No one has seen the
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If a reliable source does an interview with you, it counts towards your notability. Had this discussion a few times before. Whether they write about you, or decide to interview you themselves, its the same thing.
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Quote (from Google search summary): "In her Gluten-Free Almond Flour Cookbook (Clarkson Potter, 2009) the ingenious celiac Elana Amsterdam offers another possible approach, a sandwich bread..."
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article says she's a "Boulder cookbook author" and that "Her neighbor and her neighbor's children the recipes"; the rest of the article isn't about her, it's about her recipes.
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article either, so all we have to go on there is that it also mentions that she's from Boulder and her book has lots of recipes (hardly surprising given it's a cookbook). The
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Quote (from Google search summary): "'The Gluten-Free Almond Flour Cookbook' by Elana Amsterdam...Elana Amsterdam of Boulder, Colo., offers dozens of wheatless recipes..."
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has to say about the subject is that "Local hero Elana Amseterdam (straight out of Boulder) offers dozens of wheatless recipes." No one here has ever actually seen the
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Amsterdam is without a doubt an authority on gluten free living. Here are several more sources for you to check out including two appearances on local news stations:
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Okay, apparently the consensus is going heavily toward keep, but I'm appalled and I have to say something. These are truly meager mentions being accepted as
1215:. They aren't covering her because she's notable cookbook author or because they would even know. They're covering her because she's local interest. 1217:
Personally, I'll believe the subject is a notable cookbook author when someone who actually writes about cooking full-time says she is, someone at
1058: 814:"Classic (gluten-free) cupcakes: Elana Amsterdam's latest book, 'Gluten Free Cupcakes,' includes 50 recipes that use almond and coconut flour" 127: 122: 370: 616:
Now I'm confused. Surely one way in which a newspaper shows that they consider a person notable is to conduct an interview with them.
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I don't know who discussed this with, but it wasn't me; I'd have told you you're wrong. From
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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YouTube videos of the subject are not useful in establishing notability. As explained at
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is an interview, which makes it primary and unusable for establishing notability. The
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Notable author, covered in reliable sources added, and important to those who need a
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It doesn't matter where an interview is published, it's still an interview and still
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to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.
232:. Subject certainly doesn't meet the hurdle for presumed notability under 224:
Lacks reliable independent sources to establish notability as required by
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microscope than usual. The end result is that it doesn't measure up.
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Of the bunch, the Vail Daily articles are probably the best, but
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
25: 928: 884: 856:"Holiday Gifts Wrap up one of these big, beautiful cookbooks" 743: 972: 817: 1158:. Coverage is sufficient, per our notability standards.-- 144: 140: 136: 200: 1082:Notable person, covered in reliable sources found. 969:"Vail Valley: Breaking bread — gluten free and all" 424:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, 385:, sources offered in support of notability must be 254:
list of Food and drink-related deletion discussions
214: 494:) 10:26, 3 January 2012 (UTC) as is this from the 472:source and unhelpful in establishing notability. 322:http://www.celiac.com/authors/211/Elana-Amsterdam 72:). No further edits should be made to this page. 1252:). No further edits should be made to this page. 736:A book review reference already in the article: 690:- The 2 Vail Daily and Camera articles found by 729:- Per significant coverage in reliable sources. 925:"Career Confidential: Food allergies at work" 8: 276:list of Authors-related deletion discussions 274:Note: This debate has been included in the 252:Note: This debate has been included in the 1043:Because of the significant coverage of her 330:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsSttzpbo14 326:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xkpk6F3iKqI 273: 251: 1179:significant coverage in reliable sources 740:"Causing a STIR: Best cookbooks of 2009" 45:For an explanation of the process, see 997: 996: 985: 954: 953: 942: 909: 908: 897: 842: 841: 830: 768: 767: 756: 468:That's an interview, which makes it a 1045:The Gluten-Free Almond Flour Cookbook 18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion 7: 450:seems to be detailed and from a RS. 780:References I added to the article: 24: 812:Schnell, Caramie (May 11, 2011). 738:Shaw, Tucker (December 2, 2009). 41:deletion review on 2012 January 9 967:Pence, Cassie (March 23, 2010). 29: 47:Knowledge (XXG):Deletion review 879:Sutter, Cindy (June 1, 2011). 486:It's also a newspaper article. 1: 403:20:31, 27 December 2011 (UTC) 352:19:31, 27 December 2011 (UTC) 310:07:23, 27 December 2011 (UTC) 290:00:42, 27 December 2011 (UTC) 268:00:42, 27 December 2011 (UTC) 246:23:22, 26 December 2011 (UTC) 1231:17:54, 8 January 2012 (UTC) 1168:12:19, 8 January 2012 (UTC) 1151:14:05, 7 January 2012 (UTC) 1127:00:48, 5 January 2012 (UTC) 1106:23:05, 4 January 2012 (UTC) 1075:19:54, 4 January 2012 (UTC) 1028:09:20, 4 January 2012 (UTC) 718:02:27, 5 January 2012 (UTC) 679:03:01, 4 January 2012 (UTC) 626:10:58, 5 January 2012 (UTC) 612:05:58, 5 January 2012 (UTC) 563:23:05, 4 January 2012 (UTC) 534:17:00, 3 January 2012 (UTC) 512:10:29, 3 January 2012 (UTC) 482:08:51, 3 January 2012 (UTC) 460:00:11, 3 January 2012 (UTC) 433:22:56, 2 January 2012 (UTC) 97:13:52, 9 January 2012 (UTC) 1284: 524:of the subject herself. 1268:Pages at deletion review 1241:Please do not modify it. 61:Please do not modify it. 1047:(see links provided by 873:(subscription required) 806:(subscription required) 860:St. Paul Pioneer Press 1189:Philadelphia Inquirer 793:Philadelphia Inquirer 371:few or no other edits 1061:)), Amsterdam meets 522:significant coverage 373:outside this topic. 1183:The only thing the 862:. 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Index

Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
deletion review on 2012 January 9
Knowledge (XXG):Deletion review
talk page
deletion review
non-admin closure
Armbrust, B.Ed.

about my edits?
13:52, 9 January 2012 (UTC)
Elana Amsterdam
Elana Amsterdam
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