182:(see at the top and then the long post immediately after the arbitrary section break). I have tried there to survey all the considerations for and against keeping these types of articles in the encyclopedia; the simplistic comments above here ignore all the complexities of the matter, although I am doing my best to assume good faith rather than the presence of trolling. Please approach this DRV with a seriousness properly attendant to the nature of the issues presented.
302:. If you're going to remove an article about one person who is linked to a notable crime, then you're basically setting a major precident which lays the groundwork for removing all other articles of persons associated with or victims of crime. You could forseeably use this as a basis for removing articles on 9/11, Columbine, and the Virginia Tech shootings. This has to be the silliest XfD i've read this week, and yes even sillier than the nomination to get rid of
146:- If we can't have an article on Shawn Hornbeck, who was kidnapped for 5 times the length of time of this girl, then we shouldn't have one on this girl. After all, when she is in her 30's she might be traumatized to know a wikipedia article exist about her regarding a horrible experience she endure when she was just 14. Right Brad???
230:: This is silly, and I was quite shocked to see this tag at the top of the entry. Smart is a public figure, like it or not - and her story has been told repeatedly by every major news outlet in the country. Removing her article from Knowledge (XXG) (or even proposing to do so) is a stunt. Boisemedia 05:17, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
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are victimized by serious crimes, especially as minors. These are not easy issues, particularly when the victim has become far more famous for whatever reason than the typical victim or where the victim or his or her family has, after the crime was over, elected to take on a public role in addressing criminal justice issues.
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I missed the Shawn
Hornbeck discussions, and disagree strongly with Fighting for Justice's suggestion that it is hypocritical to comment here without also wading into that swamp - that ship has sailed (and, as many helpful editors have pointed out, there are many, many facts of the two cases that are
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User:Fighting for
Justice presents himself as a voice for the rights of crime victims on Knowledge (XXG), while User:John celona presents as an anti-censorship activist. Both raise, albeit with strident and unnecessary rhetoric, different aspects of the question of how we should deal with people who
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The arguments are the same ones used at the DRV for Shawn
Hornbeck. His story was also widely reported (over a hundred thousand google hits at the moment), the article was also well researched and cited. The BLP point is A) minor and B) raped. If that is not enough to remove the article, then you
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Mmmm, okay, now it has been nominated for deletion properly. I'm not saying I disagree with deletion (this is a very difficult and painful issue), but obviously a policy for these situations is needed, rather than an emotionally draining bitter fight over each and every one. I assume that such a
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Elizabeth Smart is no longer a minor. That nullifies the comparison to
Michael Devlin abductees that are minors. That said, Elizabeth Smart is not particularly notable outside of her abduction therefore he bio is not necessary and the relevant details of her life can be covered in the other
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I know that all of these articles have DRV cases opened on them as soon as the admin. closes the AfD. For me the ship sails at AfD closure, regardless of whether I like the outcome, and it should for more editors. DRV is a very destructive process, IMHO, and I refuse to participate.
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While I understand the nominator's argument, I don't necessarily agree with it. The article is well research, the information is in the public domain, and the family has gone to the point of publishing a book on the events surrounding the kidnapping. Meets
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As these cases have been widely reported I just don't see the point in pretending that it never happened here. Articles shouldn't be prurient but this isn't a place for censorship. Are we going to get rid of 'Mary Bell' next?
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Much of the
Knowledge (XXG) community as a whole is introspecting and agonizing over how best to deal with these issues. They are the subject of an ongoing arbitration case (see generally,
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nomination - and in any case, Smart is a public figure, having routinely given interviews over an extended period of term relating directly to her case, and advocacy surrounding it. --
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To the best of my knowledge, this AfD has not been transcluded onto the appropriate page. I do not know if it is a serious nomination or an attempt to make a
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196:: It hasn't been placed on the appropriate page (maybe because John celona got blocked before he could), but obviously was nominated in bad faith per
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to article with information on the crime itself, looks set to go, just need to rewrite first paragraph and a change of tense in others
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at my expense. If the page becomes a live AfD then I will rely upon other
Wikipedians to make their voices heard on the issues raised.
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article? His kidnapping is just as notable as the Smart one if not more. For example, his was gone much longer.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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different). However, two wrongs don't make a right. This article should be kept, as this person is notable.
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should go all to the DRV for Shawn and vote to keep that one as well since the situation is... identical.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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as "repeatedly raped". Same story, different sex. Exactly identical situation.
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in the extreme - and the editors responsible should be ashamed of abusing the
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articles. Remove the personal bio details (i.e. picture, birthdate, etc) --
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http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Deletion_review/Log/2007_May_28
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The DRV for Shawn is ongoing as we speak. It's not finished.
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