1321:
which are founded on the spam I've observed on
Knowledge (XXG) biographies (as I've said over & over; I repeat that when I first heard of the EGS on Knowledge (XXG), I had the same attitude as "Lulu" who thought it strange that I consider the internal link to be "spam" - someone had deleted it for that reason -. A few weeks later I understood the user's annoyal and the reason for its removal, and I see that Internet research does not provide any external sources on the notability of this school. If we were to include all private schools no matter how notable they are and how limited the sources on them are, we would be effectively transforming Knowledge (XXG) into a "Trojan horse" for advertising. Furthermore, I am surely not the only one to find it profoundly dishonest to put such an awesome lists of "teachers" without providing proof that they were there & precisions on their presence (if they were there one hour once, two hours twice, all year long, etc.) Finally, the anonymity of the users who've edited this page & who've repeatedly profited from the fact that it was a low-traffic page (surely something they hope to get higher, basing themselves on internal spam — and maybe external advertising for Knowledge (XXG), so the Google hit rise? We are starting to get familiar with techniques to boost one's site's popularity, and Knowledge (XXG) certainly is a powerful platform for this) by deleting NPOV modifications made by astoundished users as me does not encline one to put anymore trust. It is also symptomatic that with this second deletion
1572:
such as "The
European Graduate School Knowledge (XXG) entry is recently subject to various sorts of abuse, which generally (and unfoundedly) question the authenticity and quality standards of the institution.", which, if you stop using your newspeak & really were "keen on Knowledge (XXG)", you would have simply called "vandalism". Although this nomination may failed to achieve its aim (stopping your spammming & establishing your unnotability), I am quite surprised to see your reaction, which have only confirmed my fears. You are definitely using Knowledge (XXG) for commercial purposes, you're probably not the first, nor the last one, but since you seem to be one of the main source on the Internet about your school, I would require from you to precise and prove that EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THESE GENIUSES HAVE ACTUALLY BEEN TO YOUR SCHOOL. PS: in the era of images, it is quite doubtful to present "photos" as "proof". We would expect more from a school which keeps inviting "critical theorists". CQFD.
1501:
openly engage the
Knowledge (XXG) community in questions about European Graduate School, including its participation in open access to knowledge initiatives, media programmes, and its educational pedagogy. We refer Wikipedians to general search engines and the official EGS website for answers to rudimentary questions (including accreditation, courses and degree plans); video lectures, webcasts, as well as independent newspaper articles and blog entries (particularly those of Bruce Sterling and DJ Spooky); and invite the public to contact year-long faculty members directly for answers to questions of a more specific nature. European Graduate School believes that free and open discussion about itself and its impact upon postmodern media landscapes will not only strengthen our reputation but develop new democratic standards of excellence in the field of communications at large.
674:
harmony with the central aims of
Knowledge (XXG). It is from such perspective that EGS is concerned with the abuse of openness that certain users of Knowledge (XXG) display in continuing to attack our institution and its Knowledge (XXG) entry. We are concerned not only for our ourselves, but the implications of such abuse upon the internet at large, and Knowledge (XXG) in particular. Specifically, such abuse within one of the leading internet sites, especially one promoting open and egalitarian philosophy, can easily (and unfortunately) indicate the necessary implementations of restraints on freedom of communication to ensure the continued availability of high quality reputable knowledge against the growing maelstrom of misinformation (thereby fundamentally and permanently altering the egalitarian nature of cyberspace).
962:- I'm not convinced that this school actually exists. I couldn't find anything verifiable about it, and one thing that struck me as odd was that when I was searching for stuff about it, I could find anyone who said that they hated this school, that it sucked, that they couldn't stand it, etc. Real schools usally evoke such feelings - both from the rivalry/competition of other schools and the stress and distress that they can put on their students and faculty. So if this school is real then it must be the most well-liked school (by its students and faculty and other schools) of any school in the whole history of the world! And if this were the case then it would have recieved a lot of media attention and it wouldn't be so hard for us to ample verifiable evidence of its existance.
2444:) and the photos listed at the individual resource pages are quite amusing ... but they are certainly fake :) They must be ... (The video clips are either really good animations or Giorgio Agamben, Claire Denis, Chris Fynsk, Peter Greenaway, Agnes Varda, Alain Badiou, Chantal Akerman, Jean Baudrillard, Yve Alain Bois, Victor Burgin, Shelley jackson, Claude Lanzmann, Victor Vitanza, Michael Schmidt, Sandy Stone, Martin Hielscher, and DJ Spooky really teach there.) Another professor or guest speaker has discussed EGS and its faculty on his personal blog (Caveh Zahedi
1900:
haven't been there). I've never posted any photo relating to EGS, even one taken by someone else; nor have I ever edited the EGS WP article. About the closest I come to any connection is that I have met a couple of the guest faculty EGS has had (but I never talked about EGS with them; can't see why that would have come up, and probably they were guest faculty later than when I met them). And yet apparently I'm part of this same global conspiracy to advertise for this school, or hoax, or plot, or whatever Santa Sangre's latest fantasy of its nature is.
1563:
from
Salvador Dali's paranoiac-critic method, which you are surely familiar with, and others innovative ways of reading that some persons have developed over the age, in particular when confronted to official censorship - you surely are familiar with Leo Strauss' founding works on "suspicious reading" also)... So, when we see that you state that "its is our institutional policy not to edit the Knowledge (XXG) entries of our institution and its faculty" and then put the responsibility on your alumni, when no one has ever accused you of self-editing
730:(Note: We thought it appropriate to include below a recent photograph of Jean Luc Nancy with his 2006 student cohort at the Saas-Fee campus of European Graduate School. As one can see in the photograph, ensuring the quality of Knowledge (XXG) articles is important to Jean-Luc as well as EGS, and stimulated some vigourous intellectual exchanges during this summer residency. EGS students are excited to continue these discussions within Knowledge (XXG) - in fact two students have already expressed their personal opinions in the previous discussions.)
1360:]". If you don't think it's a hoax, presumably you think it's a school. There's a stub right there, no? An AfD isn't a vote on the specific content that's in an article currently, but on whether the topic itself is notable. If some particular fact purported in the article seems unverifiable, remove that fact, not the topic itself. Still, even if some information is sourced to EGS official sources, that isn't necessarily unacceptable. I haven't looked, but I'm pretty sure a lot of the information on
1506:
1217:
850:. Basically a student faq by some random person. Deals with the "is EGS a hoax" question early on and then moves on to more practical stuff like don't forget to buy your drugs in the city before coming, you better know how to drink, and don't forget to bring mindless entertainment to keep you sane. Faq fails to do deal with the "babes" question though, which is clearly raised by the highly trenchant "Jean-Luc Nancy's Quality Control Mechanisms of Knowledge (XXG)" image above. Does
1386:
also can't write an article based on our own impressions, DJ Spooky's weblog or a Flickr page. My point is quite simply: If you followed WP policies on using only reliable sources (no school website, no blog entries, no future publications), what would you be able to put in the article? AfD's are there to allow editors to establish that WP guidelines are fulfilled. So far the only ones I've seen try to do this are Bwithh, ENpeeOHvee and me. And we pretty much came up empty. ~
734:
1521:
policies. While we admit that the EGS entry is far from perfect, its is our institutional policy not to edit the
Knowledge (XXG) entries of our institution and its faculty. Of course members of the European Graduate School community are free (as any Wikipedian) to independently edit any Knowledge (XXG) articles, and the reasonable person can easily understand the impossibility of strictly regulating the private behaviour of 600+ adult students from around the world.
2379:(Disclaimer: I am a philosophy student and I did talk to a few EGS students. I have also registered at Knowledge (XXG) to read and discuss this article. My final decision and disclaimer: I am planning to study there.) The school is very real - several editors have pointed that out already. (I could confirm that with a simple phone call to the accrediting organization - the Swiss canton Valais.) Another phone call to the tourism information in Saas-Fee (
213:, etc., etc.) are professors there. No proofs are provided apart of the School's own website. The link is repeatedly spammed on others Knowledge (XXG) pages (namely, anybody who allegedly had a connection once in their life with the school, and placed in the first line of biographies). This has already been nominated because of spam concerns, but it should really be deleted again. Else all biographies will remain spammed... --
69:
454:... as for the other professors: john perry barlow was here last week, manuel de landa just left the classroom, jean luc nancy is teaching (im sorry for the shameless self-promotion but there are more links and it took me just two min to find a few references ... in 10 min it should be possible to find the entire faculty history - i guess Santa Sangre didnt bother ...) thank you for your consideration.
2495:. Self-descriptions and blog entries are generally not considered reliable sources. But if you are aware of any newspaper articles, any scholarly or governmental sources that verify the claims on the EGS website or the various comments above and can add them here, your contribution is useful. I'm sure if you check with the EGS administration they can give you approriate leads to news coverage. ~
2480:). Now add the few newspaper articles and the AfD smells bad faith and has been started by one very "determined" editor with a certain agenda - the educational model of EGS and the faculty it offers can certainly pose a challenge for other minds and institutions. So far most comments are pro keep - Im looking forward to similar discussions in Switzerland next year. Thank you for this discussion.
2464:), DJ Spooky and Jean Luc Nancy. Either EGS can really mind control all these thinkers and artists and influence their blogs, websites and relationships - or ... The student blogs and statements are of the usual type, some are good others are less enlightening ... Im not worried about that - actually i would be more worried if such entries wouldnt be there :) (Please check: Elizabeth Albrycht
688:
status with
European Graduate School is mentioned in their Knowledge (XXG) biographies the primary teaching institutions of Jean-Luc Nancy, Claire Denis, Giorgio Agamben and others is clearly listed first. The Knowledge (XXG) European Graduate School entry simply provides a list of its notable faculty as do the entries of such larger institutions as New York University .. NYU Notable Persons:
1326:
Lulu's neutrality, although I certainly do believe on his good faith (which seems not to be his case if one is to believe his own user page ; I'm not sure if Lulu has understood that presupposition of good faith is like "presupposition of innocence": the matter is not what you believe about another user ("when it is evidently self-absent" - how do you judge that mate?) but the fact that,
899:'s page everywhere, with the nice logo "EGS". Soon not one Knowledge (XXG) or one person related far or close to contemporary philosophy will not have heard of this "fantastic school where when "Manuel de Landa just left the classroom", that's because "Nancy has just arrived..." And that's "critical" theory?? "Philosophers have only interpreted the world, the point now is to change it."
1748:
1194:
notable people are (loosely) affiliated with the school. None of those are hosted by EGS. I wince a bit at the jargony stuff about "openness", "collaboration", "the net" and all that. I wouldn't necessarily argue against the propositions that the school is "self-important" or "goofy", but it's pretty obviously not a hoax. The defunct journal
895:"The university is currently considering the release through Knowledge (XXG), under Creative Commons license, holdings from its extensive image and video archives - a catalogue including photographs, exclusive European Graduate School lectures and seminars by notable EGS faculty." Great, now they're going to post photos such as on
749:
its extensive image and video archives - a catalogue including photographs, exclusive
European Graduate School lectures and seminars by notable EGS faculty. If Knowledge (XXG) is interested in such material please contact European Graduate School either directly or through the talk page of this Knowledge (XXG) user account.
882:"while their faculty status with European Graduate School is mentioned in their Knowledge (XXG) biographies the primary teaching institutions of Jean-Luc Nancy, Claire Denis, Giorgio Agamben and others is clearly listed first.": the point is if it is relevant AT ALL to include the EGS on these people's page. IMO, this is
426:. as for your reference claim: there is a search engine called google and a simple search query would have opened your eyes. there are hundreds of references, links and disclaimers. please allow me to add just three references: dj spooky (6.2-6.5 Saas Fee, Switzerland: Annual teaching period at European Graduate School)
232:. This is the problem, not the question whether this school exists, whether it's good or not, whether it's a public or a private school, in Switzerland, in Italy or in Turkey. Some solution needs to be found for this spamming; if this page is not deleted, maybe by banning the users who keep on spamming. BTW,
2091:
The following are considered as institutions of higher education: the
Graduate Institute for International Studies (Institut universitaire de hautes Ă©tudes internationales IUHEI) in Geneva, the Graduate Institute for Advanced Public Administration (Institut de hautes Ă©tudes en administration publique
1899:
This is definitely getting into "paranoid conspiracy" territory by Santa Sangre. I think there's some cruft in this discussion, actually, but I've never taken a photo of EGS. I've never been to EGS or taken a course from them. In fact, I've never been in
Switzerland (seems like a nice place, but I
1562:
The creation of your own user page, while perfectly acceptable on a general way, is highly suspicious due to its timing. Your disclaimer are also highly suspicious, you do know that the problem of "newspeak" is that the few sceptics out there read "black" when we see "white" (a method surely acquired
1193:
I think some people affiliated with the school have been a little too devoted to self-aggrandizement, sure. But look at the links the EGS account gives for external faculty/personal pages of Ronell, Zizek, Greenaway and DJ Spooky. Those links by themselves are more than enough to verify that highly
770:
To promote such a dialogue with Knowledge (XXG), European Graduate School invites wishes, proposals, and critiques to the discussion page of the Knowledge (XXG) article. The students and faculty of European Graduate School sincerely thank Knowledge (XXG) for its consideration of these points, and EGS
687:
2. The accusation of abuse regarding the listing of European Graduate School faculty is unfounded. Santa Sangre is simply wrong that EGS appears in the first lines of our faculty biographies in Knowledge (XXG) - one need only look to Sangre’s own list to verify this for oneself .. while their faculty
551:
which show the EGS buildings, clearly labeled. Do buildings mean its a real school? Feel free to put that photo of the EGS main hall in the wikipedia entry. Or do students? Or professors? I'm happy to post more photos of dj spooky, bruce sterling, john barlow, gaspar noe and the other professors who
502:
reunion of the most famous "post-modern" philosophers! And I considers it despisable to use Knowledge (XXG) for such financial instrumentalization. If Manuel de Landa was willing to make a three-hour course there in order to win big bucks in five minutes, good for him$ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $
227:
on biographies creating external links to the EGS, some anons have created this EGS page in order to link it internally to all biographies: the end result is SPAMMING!!! If I asked for deletion although this has already been asked before, it is because it is getting tiring to see on the first line of
2439:
As long as they all teach there; as long as the pictures the school has added on its pages are real I am fine. Here in Germany I would never have a chance to meet and study with these people (not sure about the US) - but the Swiss school suits me fine. There are even videoclips listed at the faculty
2370:
I'm about to enter my third year with EGS and while they may have a tendency for self-promotion, it's a very new school that first has to gain credibility through its faculty until it has enough graduates out there to speak on its behalf. When we all showed up at this dreamy alpine village, we still
1571:
Last but not least, in the same sense that I've politedly requested from Lulu not to stop considering that I edit on good faiths (we are not in a Stalinian trial here, although I've speaken of "paranoiac" methods, do not read more than what I write), I would ask you not to make unfounded accusations
1524:
As an established yet still growing university, European Graduate School welcomes all thoughtful contributions towards the improved quality of its educational programmes and interfaces with the academe. We value the recent Knowledge (XXG) discussion about our educational model as an engaging example
1298:
What do you mean "write their own article"? Do you have some evidence that one of the contributors to the article is an official representative of EGS, or something? I do notice a couple IP addresses that seem to edit primarily this article; but then almost all the edits by the AfD nominator, Santa
748:
4. In keeping with its committed open philosophy, European Graduate School invites meaningful dialogue with Knowledge (XXG) to resolve issues with the EGS Knowledge (XXG) entry. The university is currently considering the release through Knowledge (XXG), under Creative Commons license, holdings from
1861:
I have removed Lulu's photos of his stay there (and you accuse of me of being partial, while you admit having studied there? are you kidding me?!!!) and EGS' news photos (with quite unadequate caption). Photos are not proofs (something which a school versed on "critical theory" would be expected to
1500:
The European Graduate School sincerely thanks those participating in this discussion. As previously expressed we are always open for meaningful/ constructive critique, and are committed to transparency of information regarding our institution and its Knowledge (XXG) entry. This forum is designed to
694:
3. The accusation that European Graduate School information is independently unverified is unfounded: a simple Google search can establish this fact. In addition to the external links provided by the previous entries (including mention in Wired magazine blog and DJ Spooky’s website), there are many
1320:
that "all my edits" are about EGS. You may have a quick look at my contributions to verify this. I apologize for what may have been perceived as "uncivilized manners" that don't respect Knowledge (XXG) rules, I am not familiar with all of them and I have very strong suspicions against this school,
1241:
If it's a hoax, it's a hoax that Ronell, Zizek and Greenaway are participating in; that would actually be more notable than is a small school of recent incorporation... but that would be a different type of article. In any case, it's not a hoax. Google shows 122k hits, for gosh sake. EGS itself
673:
We are posting this message to establish open dialogue with Knowledge (XXG) and render a permanent resolution regarding Wikipedian assaults upon European Graduate School and the legitimacy of its Knowledge (XXG) entry. As European Graduate School is essentially committed to openness, we find great
1520:
The European Graduate School Knowledge (XXG) entry is recently subject to various sorts of abuse, which generally (and unfoundedly) question the authenticity and quality standards of the institution. The EGS administration feels these issues were repeatedly resolved according to Knowledge (XXG)’s
1385:
It's a bit of a common fallacy around here to point at other questionable articles in order to lend credence to the one at hand. If the HCC article is swiped from the school website, the entry schould at least be tagged with a POV tag. Also, technically it doesn't matter who edits the article, we
1156:
Well, perhaps the fact that they are spamming Knowledge (XXG) & that it seems to be difficult to find any definitive source that would help us stop being suspicious from such an attitude? The mail above posted by the EGS is a symptom; which respectable institution would have taken the time to
1325:
has considered it necessary to create a EGS page. To end with what I began in this disclaimer, I firmly ask to Lulu to stop his ad-hominen attacks against me (falsely saying that main of my edits are related to the EGS) and his intimidation on my talk page. This does not encline me to believe in
594:
I looked at the pictures on Flicker there and to me they don't show very much. There's some people hanging out and walking around by some buildings. Some look like apartments and some look like a retreat center or ski-lodge or something. And then there's a sign on a wall that says "European
2201:
According to the Cooperative Agreement between EDUCAUSE and the U.S. Department of Commerce, all .edu names in existence as of October 29, 2001, are "grandfathered." This means that everyone who already had a .edu name by that date (October 29, 2001), regardless of current or past eligibility
1554:
if we have independent sources (doesn't seems so, but you seem to be keen on making photos as quick as you can, such as this photo of Dj Spooky where you ask him to engage in the Knowledge (XXG) debate - that's fair game...), which doesn't seems the case. I won't give you any advice on public
422:- its a shame that wikipedia provides the space for such flamewars. the person who started the second nomination is uninformed and failed to do some research and verification before he vandalized the wikipedia entry. right now the students are in class but the class schedule can be found at
241:
22:09, 11 June 2006 (UTC) Beside it is totally dishonest making this list of alleged teachers without giving precisions: these people might have been for two hours on the campus and they are listed as if they teach there. Note that attempts to correct this have been reverted by anons.
1334:
that this user is doing things with good faith; i.e. he is presumed innocent until judged guilty.) Therefore, I would be thankful for Lulu to not condemn me before having suited me, if such is his intent (see the threats on my talk page). Thank you, and my highest regards, peace
1039:
814:
I think this should be speedied because it's the 2nd nomination without any real new evidence against notability. The only real problem is that the editor(s) of this entry put so much effort into making it appear notable that it automatically raises suspicion. ~
1940:
I also wonder on Lulu's needs to counsel EGS on the best way to use Knowledge (XXG) (see EGS's talk page). If EGS is interested in "news technologies", surely it can get this on its own? Was that really useful (I'm not even asking if it was "necessary")?
1879:
think they're unnecessary but that's not reason enough in afd discussion. Santa Sangre's actions are making me start to wonder if he/she is in fact being malicious, or vindicative. Please don't take this kind of action to alter other people's arguments
1717:
Yes and no. You can click on the history tab on top of the entry and review the changes made, and if necessary revert to a prior version. As about maliciously deleting content, the edits I've looked at seem to be very much within the policies of WP. ~
1567:
when almost only anonymous users have contributed to the EGS page is quite suspicious, don't you think? If not, close your school & read again Freud (instead of Sun Tzu and other commercial hype readings), that might be useful for your futures
1734:
this is a WTF type of listing, obviously the place exists (meets WP:Verifiable), obviously we can proove DJ Spooky teaches there (WP:Verifiable) ... by my understanding that certainly makes it a notable school and should be an obvious duh! keep!
1215:
The Ronell, Zizek, and Greenaway pages are simply entries that link to the EGS website for whatever reason, but have no content on EGS itself. Spooky says he's "faculty" in quotes, what does that mean? October went out of business in 2000, and a
914:'s article (which badly needs cleanup) - Wolfgang is not just the dean of EGS but seems to be the founding/driving force behind EGS... his institution-creating efforts are admirable but these shouldnt extend to over-selling EGS on wikipedia...
236:
has created itself a page a few days ago, as a new spam attempt? Is Knowledge (XXG) going to be used as a platform for unscrupulous and cynical schools? (this is what this spamming gives as opinion on that school, whatever the reality is).
556:
We also webcast one of the lectures this year. I haven't posted the archive of that video online yet, but I can if that's necessary. Really folks, you're making a joke out of fact here and doing serious damage to wikipedia's credibility.
2094:
In addition to the institutes of higher education mentioned above, there are a number of private colleges which offer courses based on the Anglo-Saxon system. The studies and examinations offered by these colleges are not recognized in
800:
real notable school. (Slight overreaction from the EGS authorities though??). I've known about this institution for some time, though to be honest, for much of that time, I thought it was some kind of high-brow semi-scam perpetrated by
929:
but it probably isn't the most notable thing in the lives of many who have spent a summer there. And some of the external links are dead or of questionable significance -- the listing in gradschools.com? one student's blog entry? I'd
1412:. Whether or not there is spam for the European Graduate School in other pages has nothing to do with whether this article should be kept. This nomination is misconceived. If it fails, will the article be listed for a third time?
2506:
I'm going to close this in a minute but not before I make a comment deprecating the personal tone of the above debate. Just state what you think should happen and give rational considerations in support. Don't attack other users.
481:
Afd nomination and subsequent discussion on Knowledge (XXG) is not a "flame war". There's no need to be condescending about google searches etc.. I couldn't find any evidence of vandalism by Santa Sangre in the article history.
2305:
on its side. EGS so far: 1/4 Boston Phoenix article, LA Times article admittedly sourced from the EGS webpage, DJ Spooky's website. Maybe one of the stream of editors can actually establish verifiability than just allege it.
2092:
IDHEAP) in Lausanne, the Graduate Institute Kurt Bösch (Institut Universitaire Kurt Bösch, IUKB) in Sion and the Graduate Institute of Development Studies (Institut universitaire d’études du développement, IUED) in Geneva.
975:
1555:
relations, but if you muse on that you might need some, I'll be pleased to be your guest... Not that I'm a "fashion maker", but it seems that you do have some troubles which might benefit from amateur, external views :)
541:- This is totally ridiculous. Like I said last time, I'm enrolled in this school, I got a federal stafford loan to come here because it is recognized by the US govt as an institution. Here are my photos of my stay here:
1029:
the EGS (Perhaps this more traditional media outreach channel is something the EGS press office should focus its efforts on rather than the new-fangled wikipedia avenue?). The best English one I could find was a brief
1978:, more malicious deletion, even on this page! I'm sadly disappointed to see the malicious behavior of so called "objective" editors here on wikipedia. Someone deleted the links to my photos, so I put them back. --
1708:, I worked on the EGS page a fair amount, writing original content and adding images. Much of that has now been removed. Why? Is there a previous version to return to? Are people maliciously deleting content? --
434:('Last but not least, I'm also a "faculty member" of the European Graduate School, an experimental environment for discussion of issues involving contemporary culture outside of a normal academic environment').
2097:
Some of these colleges may even offer courses which are not serious. We therefore advise anyone interested in following such a course to make careful initial investigations into the problem of recognition.".
1558:
if what you're doing is not actually spam & auto-promotion, both on Knowledge (XXG) & through Knowledge (XXG) (spamming Knowledge (XXG) with EGS links boost your Google hit, you do know that, don't
2272:
Maybe Knowledge (XXG) should delete the Black Mountain College. How could John Cage, Merce Cunningham, Buckminster Fuller etc. possibly have been in one place, along with Einstein, Gropius, de Niro etc???
1548:(which quite clearly identifies yourself as a marketing or public communication type of person) and stop saying "white" when you hear "black", you would acknowledge the fact that we are discussing:
1458:
distinct hits on Google News. As for the EGS's eminent part-time faculty members, their association with the school does not appear to be intimate. DJ Spooky's teaching period, for example, is
283:. This school does exist and is therefore notable, and therefore the article should be kept. If the statements in the article are false, then they should be removed. Previous AfD discussion is
284:
684:
1. European Graduate School has already won the debate regarding the legitimacy of its Knowledge (XXG) article during the initial assertion towards deletion of the Knowledge (XXG) article.
511:
to make a self-advertising forum, and make a stupid page on a school nobody cares about but is so good everybody should know about & pay the big $ $ $ $ $ $ to go there in Switzerland.
1459:
76:
2076:...) and nobody in Switzerland considers such schools as universities (this why canton of Valais itself writes it has got no university, which is common knowledge in Switzerland).
2179:
Not an expert but I remember LBS sneaked in before they closed the registration to non-US schools. It seems they opened it again under some conditions (US accreditation).
1525:
of the practical issues involved with developing and preserving a philosophy of openness in cyberspace. Again, sincere thanks to all the participants in that conversation.
2487:
Thank you for your input. But you should read the WP criteria for inclusion before you offer an essentially redundant list of links. The issues is not existence, it is
1762:
even though I'm annoyed with the lazy editors who can't be arsed to establish verifiability rather than just alleging it, not to mention the blustery Officiousspeak of
1049:
s monthly "Improve Your Word Power" column. So you could either drop $ 4 to buy the full article or trust my own copyright-respecting excerpt from the Factiva database:
1220:
comes up empty. How can a school that claims to have such notable faculty so completely elude media interest? No New York Times, Neue ZĂĽrcher Zeitung, Der Spiegel? ~
972:
1025:
20-30 articles which mention the EGS in some way (usually as a brief reference in describing a person's background) there are veeeeeery few articles which actually
2089:
Here is an English page from the Rectors' Conference of Swiss Universities that talks a bit about Swiss graduate instiutions which backs up Marc Mongenet's point:"
1178:
the scope of the operation. I don't share the doubts that this place exists, but existence is not the inclusion criterion. It's coverage in reputable media. ~
2383:) has confirmed the "real" existence. Many other references specifically address EGS and its wonderful list of professors and guest speakers: Bruce Sterling (
1766:. I'm gonna keep this on my watchlist though and see if someone actually can provide reliable sources rather than just the school webpage and various bits of
652:
There are obviously socks, if not this one others. The message which immediately succeeds is totally intolerable: as if questionning the EGS brings tyranny!
1688:
Sorry I missed this. What is the gist of the article? No matter the language/access limitations, you should probably cite it and paraphrase key comments. ~
1368:(a school near me, with which I've never had any affilation beyond driving past) is pretty obviously taken almost entirely from the college's own website.
1137:
out of annoyance with some other editors who have overlinked to the EGS page. But there's not even the remotest plausible claim that EGS in non-notable.
1862:
know) and are quite unnecessary on an AfD page. Your claimed interest in "news technologies" would incline one to believe that you understand that this
1247:
1000:
So the only newspaper source we actually have so far is the Boston Phoenix entry? If so, Saas-Fee, we have a problem, since the inclusion criterion is
847:
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I don't find this dearth surprising, considering that the EGS is a small, recently established school, with only one full-time faculty member.
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looks forward to an increasingly close relationship with Knowledge (XXG) towards the achievement of our common aim of open access to knowledge.
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thought it was a hoax, but it wasn't. It's a truly challenging and nonconventional environment. It's not perfect, but it certainly does exist.
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European Graduate School believes those committed to the founding values of the internet should take this threat to such openness seriously.
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886:. It is getting very tiring to take out this spam for a private school in Switzerland, as good as it may be. This is going out of bounds.
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950:. I agree the carpet linking is a bit over the top but this is better addressed by engaging the editors than by outright hostility. ~
17:
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raise an RfC complaint for a bad faith nomination (it was pretty tempting in this instance, though they rarely do anything good).
1451:
1021:
newspaper and magazine database search (which covers English, German and French language publications) - while there are perhaps
947:
2237:
623:
2330:: "We meet there every year, are engaged for three weeks, I can bring my wife, do a 90 minute lecture and am free afterwards."
2358:
very well known, important, notable institution with an important group of teachers. Why the hell is this being nominated?
2341:
in process of accreditation (as of 2005) for preliminary exams, but not for Bachelors, Masters, PhD's, or as an institution.
101:
1901:
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all biographies of famous "hype" philosophers & artists "This guy teachs at the European Graduate School". Who cares?
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This does not mean that EGS is not notable, of course - and where does anyone claim the EGS is the University of Valais?
1269:
to base an article on. And DJ Spooky's blog, or Peter Greenaway's link site, simply don't qualify as reliable sources. ~
720:
2150:
Hmmm... I'm not sure what that edu domain list is based on. I mean it doesn't include the UK's top business school, the
1964:
by anon who linked several biographies to EGS. We can see an example of the good contributions made by this user there.
607:
EGS is authentic, as are its professors and degrees. Will Sims, Assistant Professor, VCU School of Mass Communications.
2526:
2034:
2019:
TRAINING AND RESEARCH - The department of Education, Culture and Sport organizes and oversees training and research in
1671:
I found a fairly substantial profile (about 700 words) of EGS in the Factiva database from the Swiss business magazine
36:
1770:, and I might put it up for AfD again if the entry isn't backed by reliable third party sources in the near future. ~
1763:
1526:
772:
508:
233:
1588:, this school is perfectly verifiable through reliable sources and unquestionably notable. What's next, nominating
1248:
http://www.google.com/Top/Reference/Education/Colleges_and_Universities/Europe/Switzerland/European_Graduate_School/
863:
Well thank God. An edgy po-mo summer-camp-slash-degree-mill without babes? We would have to file it under hoax. ~
74:
If you came here because someone asked you to, or you read a message on another website, please note that this is
1544:
to "engage the Knowledge (XXG) community in questions about EGS". If you would stop using your official business
1365:
1261:
criterion and we can't write an article on it. This is not a vote on whether we ok it if the EGSers writes their
2014:
1849:
EGS is chartered by the canton of Valais and is relatively well known amongst communication students in Europe.
1677:(which seems fairly reputable) from July 9, 1999. Unfortunately its in German and its not available on the web.
1512:. Digital Counter. Hijack. DJ Spooky expressing his thoughts concerning Knowledge (XXG) in a very humorous way.
328:
Only one professor in residence? It's a funny type of school. However it's apparently accredited, so a marginal
147:
2525:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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1513:
741:
466:
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35:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
1423:
Yes, because as you mentioned, the nomination is misconceived and fails to get to the heart of the problem. ~
1875:
I just restored the EGS photos, which were fine, in my opinion. What's the justification for removing these?
1646:
927:
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1170:
If you ignore the poor manners of the nominator you'll see that we actually have a hard time finding enough
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611:
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I don't give a... that "Manuel de Landa just left the classroom" and that "J-L Nancy is teaching" and that
458:
131:
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1432:
What is the heart of the problem? If it is WikiSelfPromotion by the EGS, this is nothing extraordinary.
1157:
actually do this? Oh, sure, it is only genuine interest for "new technologies" and "cooperative work"...
552:
were here this summer, but I don't think that's necessary. Here's my blog describing my experience here:
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If you know of any reliable sources we would be very very obliged if you could add them. Thank you. ~
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The media and communications program of the European Graduate School, a 9-year-old institution based
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profile which is, as the article itself admits, almost entirely blurby quotes (e.g. by faculty inc.
396:
since it seems to be a real school, but the long list smacks of advertising NOT of an encyclopedia.
364:
I still think this is fishy but no evidence of hoaxity has been offered, so Keep it is, but vote to
2327:
2060:. It may do so, but it has nothing to do with 'real' (and all public) universities of Switzerland (
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I don't believe it's a hoax (maybe those people who do would like to chime in), it just fails WP's
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shifts," its literature says, it brings students together with "visionaries and philosophers of the
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308:
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philosophers" (faculty members range from "black lady of deconstruction" Avital Ronell to New York
1106:
On the school's Web site (www.egs.edu), a quick scan of quotes from some of those "visionaries and
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is highly misleading. It is a small private school in a remote skiing resort that calls itself a
2003:
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had some of that quality, but also published some really good work (by some overlapping names).
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Edgy, although I was hoping for more pictures of the tattoo chick with the pink trucker hat. ~
2133:, despite having an .edu domain. (Also noteworthy that there are various EGS webpages, and the
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describes itself in expansive terms: "Aiming at creative breakthroughs and theoretical paradigm
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in Germany, Switzerland and New York, and offering advanced degrees in a number of specialties,
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One limitation being statements about third parties, which this site makes quite massively. ~
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503:$ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ But Knowledge (XXG) is not here so you can duplicate the
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29:
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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883:
723:
The previous submissions also failed to address the videolectures/videoclips presented here:
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229:
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The point is not in claiming the school doesn't exist, the problem is that in order to avoid
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2010:
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musician and conceptual artist Paul D. Miller, a.k.a. DJ Spooky That Subliminal Kid) gives a
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I just removed the line "Rogue philosopher, and enigmatic and inspirational professor" from
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comes up first, and WP is second; but not scrolling very far we get neutral mentions like:
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This article is unreferenced and claims that all sort of famous philosophers and artists (
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An absolute dearth of news coverage of an institution that seems eminently newsworthy. ~
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I can't really make sense of your claim, Trialsanderrors, that the article topic "fails
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Users first and only edit above, account created on 13:29, 11 June 2006. Likely sock.--
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comes from the uni's own materials. Or to pick something more modest, the article on
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http://www.bostonphoenix.com/boston/news_features/other_stories/documents/02824838.htm
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Not everybody who signs up to vote on an AfD is a sockpuppet. Any further evidence? ~
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I thought that's what the "Truth about EGS" link was about, but that link is dead. ~
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other examples of independent reference to European Graduate School. Victor Vitanza
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2033:, Valais is nevertheless an important place for research and training. Centers like
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Note that according to the LA Times article above, EGS has been around since around
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More information and a comparison with other/similar programs can be found here:
702:
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Graduate School." There's no good evidence that it's not just a big joke/hoax.
447:
251:
I'll be grateful not to have to deal with intimidations on my talk page. Thanks,
100:
However, you are invited to participate and your opinion is welcome. Remember to
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Found! EGS's valiant but apparently abandoned attempt at a snazzy flash website
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1979:
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740:. Jean Luc Nancy exploring the Quality Control Mechanisms of Knowledge (XXG).
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2183:, although I'm still in the dark about their NYC and Dresden operations. ~
2456:) - he personally met some other filmmakers including the Quay Brothers (
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971:
Well the guy Bwithh linked to above didn't sound all too happy. But I see
2264:
2024:
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to use the EGS's website as a source for the EGS article, within reason.
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http://schools.gradschools.com/graduate-schools/European-Grad-School.html
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My favourite moment is when the groovy flash intro inspiringly invokes "
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is entirely preoccupied with DJ Spooky's rewarding experiences with the
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kaleidoscopic taste of how minds are working in the avant-media realm:
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http://www.alexanderklemm.ch/?European_Graduate_School:Ph.D._Program
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2401:
http://www.nettime.org/Lists-Archives/nettime-see-0305/msg00016.html
2181:
Looks like EGS got around it because they have this New York address
755:
654:
Knowledge (XXG) does not want to "establish open dialogue" with EGS!
566:
You are making "serious damage to Knowledge (XXG)'s credibility" by
452:
http://lists.indymedia.org/pipermail/imc-audio/2006-May/0528-0n.html
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and clean up, and cease spamming other Knowledge (XXG) articles.
854:
have to be be shadowed/restrained by chaperones while he's there?
828:
Sounds like there could be a critical journal article in this!!!
2519:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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765:
349:
This is either a hoax on a massive scale or definitely notable.
1133:. This is a bad faith nomination by an editor who is making a
681:
To these ends we would like to establish the following points:
368:
all the spam entries left on the various "faculty's" entries.~
2449:
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have an important reputation out of the borders of the canton.
1589:
1252:
http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/European+Graduate+School
760:
63:
1038:) taken directly from the the EGS website. Unfortunately the
991:(though in the end he says its was all a good experience..
513:
Knowledge (XXG) is not a research engine for private schools!
2409:
http://www.com.washington.edu/cmc/resources_who.html#haraway
1866:
and that this page is not supposed to make you advertising.
498:
will soon begin to speak through the class-room thanks to a
94:(agreement) is gauged based on the merits of the arguments,
2405:
http://www.com.washington.edu/cmc/resources_who.html#stone
690:
http://en.wikipedia.org/List_of_New_York_University_People
442:
and here you can even find some of the lecture material: (
2425:
http://on1.zkm.de/zkm/stories/storyReader$ 5034#amelunxen
1551:
if your institution is notable enough to be included here
84:
among Knowledge (XXG) contributors. Knowledge (XXG) has
2155:
1950:
I don't see anything wrong with "Lulu"'s advice to EGS.
846:
There's a sloooow-loading google cache of the dead site
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http://blog.wired.com/sterling/index.blog?from=20060602
2117:
1961:
440:
http://blog.wired.com/sterling/index.blog?from=20060602
2016:(in French, here is my translation and wikification)Â :
1616:
709:
http://www.uvi.si/XLLMSlovenia/programme/slavoj-zizek/
2134:
1673:
408:
and remove the advertising, unless this is a hoax. --
438:, bruce sterlings class outline is posted at wired:
2333:The Center for Accreditation and Quality Assurance
1605:
Here are the current sources in the article itself:
39:). No further edits should be made to this page.
2433:http://www.victorvitanza.com/evitaw.html#education
2202:requirements, is allowed to keep those .edu names.
697:http://www.victorvitanza.com/evitaw.html#education
1917:I apologize Lulu, I apparently confused you with
507:EGS on all Knowledge (XXG) biographies, create a
2529:). No further edits should be made to this page.
549:http://flickr.com/photos/87338747@N00/153779319/
2170:, you'll get the registration info for egs.edu
1649:<-- A paid (?) entry in an online compendium
1062:Sunday Calendar; Calendar Desk; Sunday_calendar
2310:is not superseded even by editor consensus. ~
1065:VERBATIM So much percolating in the avant mind
926:. The school does seem to be somewhat notable
752:The following pages might serve as examples:
703:http://www.mediamatic.net/article-6244-en.html
448:http://blog.wired.com/sterling/hackerchart.jpg
444:http://blog.wired.com/sterling/powerchart.jpg
379:Withholding my vote, see discussion below. ~
114:Comments may be tagged as follows: suspected
8:
1631:<-- A (former) student's personal webpage
788:has been linked with it for some years now.
2417:http://www.cddc.vt.edu/feminism/Ronell.html
2137:page is not the university webpage. That's
715:http://www.petergreenaway.co.uk/pglinks.htm
2442:http://www.egs.edu/main/videolectures.html
2429:http://epl.scu.edu/~stsvalues/faculty.html
1265:, it's a vote on whether there are enough
725:http://www.egs.edu/main/videolectures.html
88:regarding the encyclopedia's content, and
756:http://en.wikipedia.org/John_Perry_Barlow
2466:http://ringblog.typepad.com/corporatepr/
2413:http://www.disinfo.com/site/Topic27.html
108:on this page by adding ~~~~ at the end.
2421:http://www.isnm.de/personinfo.php?id=30
1454:, a much larger institution, only gets
1783:Sure, you might renominate it. And I
1643:<-- A thread on a listserv, defunct
1475:. So not really recently established.
766:http://en.wikipedia.org/Jean-Luc_Nancy
546:http://flickr.com/photos/87338747@N00/
424:http://egs.edu/main/phdcurriculum.html
2381:http://www.saas-fee.ch/de/contact.cfm
523:Hey, hey, let's simmer down. Keep it
432:http://www.djspooky.com/articles.html
353:until someone establishes hoaxity. ~
18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
7:
2478:http://deletetheborder.org/node/591/
2458:http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093025/
2397:http://www.actlab.utexas.edu/~sandy/
2196:Domain record activated: 26-Sep-1997
761:http://en.wikipedia.org/Claire_Denis
2462:http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0219136/
2446:http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0004354/
2440:pages of European Graduate School (
2393:http://www.carleton.edu/events/daf/
266:. Does this school actually exist?
2389:http://www.djspooky.com/stage.html
1635:One student's blog entry about EGS
436:http://www.djspooky.com/stage.html
428:http://www.djspooky.com/stage.html
24:
2454:http://blogs.indiewire.com/caveh/
2035:Institut universitaire Kurt Bösch
1804:That's your prerogative, Lulu. ~
450:). there was even a live stream:
2470:http://www.paultulipana.net/egs/
1746:
1452:Alliant International University
1086:Copyright 2003 Los Angeles Times
948:User_talk:Europeangraduateschool
570:this school on all biographies.
554:http://deletetheborder.org/lotu5
67:
2493:reputable, third party sources
2116:is Valais in German) before I
230:Knowledge (XXG):No Advertising
1:
744:, Switzerland. June 11, 2006
104:on the part of others and to
44:The result of the debate was
2419:), Hubertus von Amelunxen (
2192:OK this seems to answer it:
2052:So, writing that the EGS is
1516:, Switzerland. June 12, 2006
946:I left a welcome message on
2450:http://www.cavehzahedi.com/
2322:Here are two more sources:
1764:User:Europeangraduateschool
1040:latimes.com archive excerpt
509:User:Europeangraduateschool
234:User:Europeangraduateschool
2546:
1299:Sangre, are about EGS too.
2512:14:33, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
2500:16:10, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
2363:12:53, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
2350:07:37, 16 June 2006 (UTC)
2315:08:30, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
2268:07:01, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
2254:21:30, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2245:19:11, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2213:21:45, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2188:21:30, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2175:19:07, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2162:18:59, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2146:16:21, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2125:15:03, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2104:12:19, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2081:10:58, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
2007:10:58, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1995:09:38, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1983:11:34, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1969:08:01, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1955:12:26, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1946:07:36, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1926:17:52, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
1913:17:18, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1885:11:56, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1871:07:32, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1854:20:30, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1836:23:49, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1827:22:53, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1818:. It is consistent with
1809:20:57, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1800:20:48, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1775:20:22, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1752:17:59, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1723:20:22, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1713:19:46, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1693:18:13, 17 June 2006 (UTC)
1682:18:46, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1665:17:53, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1637:<-- Another blog entry
1625:<-- Defunct blog entry
1597:17:35, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1577:07:26, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1530:12:25, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
1480:13:35, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
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1366:Holyoke Community College
1340:07:03, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
1274:01:55, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
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384:23:37, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
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247:22:12, 11 June 2006 (UTC)
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53:14:35, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
2522:Please do not modify it.
2238:The Miracle of the Andes
2129:Fwiw, EGS is not listed
2054:the University of Valais
1641:Nettime Thread about EGS
1617:European Graduate School
1514:European Graduate School
742:European Graduate School
59:European Graduate School
32:Please do not modify it.
2297:The BMC actually has a
2168:educause whois database
146:; accounts blocked for
116:single-purpose accounts
86:policies and guidelines
2152:London Business School
2062:University of Lausanne
1990:Bad faith nomination.
1647:EGS at gradschools.com
1527:Europeangraduateschool
1517:
1330:, you should maintain
773:Europeangraduateschool
745:
2326:Žižek on his time at
2166:If you search on the
2156:http://www.london.edu
2154:which has the domain
1619:<-- School webpage
1508:
1017:I ran a multi-decade
736:
2476:, and editor lotu 5
2431:), Victor Vitanza (
2110:University of Wallis
2066:University of Geneva
2013:writes about itself
1328:whatever you believe
912:Wolfgang Schirmacher
2415:), Avital Ronell (
2407:), Donna Haraway (
1962:An interesting edit
1623:The Truth about EGS
1332:as an a priori rule
1318:I formally disclaim
98:by counting votes.
77:not a majority vote
2472:, Alexander Klemm
2460:), Claire Denis (
2395:, ), Sandy Stone (
2340:
2182:
2031:without university
1518:
746:
386:
375:
360:
2427:), Carl Mitcham (
2338:
2294:
2280:comment added by
2180:
2139:egsuniversity.org
2009:Here is what the
1074:Los Angeles Times
1032:Los Angeles Times
897:John Perry Barlow
852:John Perry Barlow
628:
614:comment added by
475:
461:comment added by
378:
363:
348:
179:
178:
175:
102:assume good faith
2537:
2524:
2509:Metamagician3000
2468:, Paul Tulipana
2303:reliable sources
2293:
2274:
2263:per DarthVader.
2011:Canton of Valais
1910:
1904:
1797:
1791:
1750:
1741:
1378:
1372:
1267:reliable sources
1208:
1202:
1172:reliable sources
1147:
1141:
713:Peter Greenaway
637:
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191:Jean Baudrillard
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80:, but instead a
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50:Metamagician3000
34:
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2533:
2527:deletion review
2520:
2497:trialsanderrors
2347:trialsanderrors
2312:trialsanderrors
2275:
2251:trialsanderrors
2210:trialsanderrors
2185:trialsanderrors
2143:trialsanderrors
2108:It was written
1908:
1902:
1833:trialsanderrors
1806:trialsanderrors
1795:
1789:
1772:trialsanderrors
1758:I'm gonna vote
1737:
1720:trialsanderrors
1690:trialsanderrors
1662:trialsanderrors
1592:for deletion?
1443:trialsanderrors
1425:trialsanderrors
1388:trialsanderrors
1376:
1370:
1362:Yale University
1271:trialsanderrors
1222:trialsanderrors
1206:
1200:
1180:trialsanderrors
1145:
1139:
1045:Reader's Digest
1010:trialsanderrors
980:trialsanderrors
952:trialsanderrors
884:simple spamming
865:trialsanderrors
839:trialsanderrors
817:trialsanderrors
645:trialsanderrors
633:
609:
496:Albert Einstein
463:213.221.252.139
456:
381:trialsanderrors
370:trialsanderrors
355:trialsanderrors
292:
271:
183:Giorgio Agamben
163:
151:
135:
119:
106:sign your posts
62:
37:deletion review
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2543:
2541:
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2515:
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2437:
2436:
2387:), DJ Spooky (
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987:Also try this
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2122:Marc Mongenet
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2078:Marc Mongenet
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2004:Marc Mongenet
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1760:Cautious Keep
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1542:not a "forum"
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1259:Verifiability
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1101:media world."
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1071:20 April 2003
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2448:, Blog: -->
2438:
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2367:
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2321:
2276:— Preceding
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2195:
2113:
2109:
2095:Switzerland.
2093:
2057:
2053:
2030:
2018:
1999:
1987:
1975:
1966:Santa Sangre
1943:Santa Sangre
1923:Santa Sangre
1876:
1868:Santa Sangre
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1574:Santa Sangre
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1337:Santa Sangre
1331:
1327:
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1314:
1218:JSTOR search
1159:Santa Sangre
1130:
1120:
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1077:Home Edition
1043:
1026:
1022:
959:
943:
931:
923:
901:Santa Sangre
888:Santa Sangre
803:Slavoj Zizek
797:
784:For a start
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657:Santa Sangre
653:
610:— Preceding
606:
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572:Santa Sangre
563:
544:
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516:Santa Sangre
512:
500:spiritualist
491:
478:
457:— Preceding
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253:Santa Sangre
244:Santa Sangre
239:Santa Sangre
215:Santa Sangre
199:Sophie Calle
187:Alain Badiou
180:
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148:sockpuppetry
141:
130:; suspected
125:
111:
99:
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89:
81:
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45:
43:
31:
28:
2356:Strong keep
2058:universtity
1992:David Sneek
1988:Speedy Keep
1847:Speedy Keep
1824:Spacepotato
1732:Speedy Keep
1568:endeavours.
1464:Spacepotato
1434:Spacepotato
1414:Spacepotato
1263:own article
1131:Speedy keep
786:Tracey Emin
671:Strong Keep
539:Strong Keep
420:Strong Keep
398:Interlingua
2489:verifiable
2339:accredited
2118:changed it
1919:User:Lotu5
1768:cyberscree
1540:. This is
964:ENpeeOHvee
597:ENpeeOHvee
307:per Darth
225:spam-links
82:discussion
2482:Philophil
2299:long list
1629:Alex Site
1510:DJ Spooky
1460:four days
1068:376 words
1036:DJ Spooky
616:Will Sims
410:Coredesat
203:DJ Spooky
138:canvassed
132:canvassed
91:consensus
2290:contribs
2278:unsigned
1594:Silensor
1546:newspeak
1135:WP:POINT
1027:describe
1023:40-50ish
1004:and not
936:BuckRose
790:Tyrenius
624:contribs
612:unsigned
568:spamming
527:please.
492:Response
479:Response
471:contribs
459:unsigned
289:DarthVad
268:DarthVad
264:Question
170:username
164:{{subst:
158:username
152:{{subst:
142:username
136:{{subst:
126:username
120:{{subst:
2360:Deleuze
2135:egs.edu
2041:or the
2039:Bramois
2023:. Only
2000:Comment
1976:Comment
1859:Comment
1816:Comment
1739:ALKIVAR
1706:Comment
1538:Comment
1498:Comment
1323:someone
1315:Comment
1196:October
1083:English
1019:Factiva
944:Comment
924:Comment
564:Comment
134:users:
2242:Bwithh
2172:Bwithh
2159:Bwithh
2114:Wallis
2101:Bwithh
2028:canton
2025:Romand
2021:Valais
1952:Bwithh
1882:Bwithh
1851:Ulpian
1679:Bwithh
1477:Bwithh
1176:verify
1122:Bwithh
993:Bwithh
960:Delete
916:Bwithh
856:Bwithh
830:Bwithh
807:Bwithh
529:Bwithh
484:Bwithh
366:Delete
2435:) ...
2335:(OAQ)
1980:lotu5
1903:LotLE
1790:LotLE
1785:might
1710:lotu5
1559:you?)
1456:three
1371:LotLE
1201:LotLE
1140:LotLE
976:point
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