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404:). This is a bronze foundry in Pietrasanta, Italy. Other international sculptors such as Botero, Hanneke Beaumont, Yves Dana, Igor Mitoraj,... also work with this bronze foundry. ((for the moment there is not picture of one of my father's sculptures mentioned on that page, but I have just asked to put a picture of a sculpture from Kobe on that page). 572:, you need to stop editing your father's article and use talk page requests instead, as you have a serious conflict of interest, being his son and also running a foundation that supports him. You can contribute your thoughts here, but not in the article. You also need to declare your conflict on your user page. 436:
It is correct that my father has not been mentioned (as far as I know) in any English newspaper or magazine article. But there have been enough books and art catalogs published about Kobe, so in other words: I am convinced there is enough coverage about Kobe so that the wikipedia page does not need
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Hello, I am Albin Saelens, son of the deceased sculptor, artist Kobe (artistic alias of Jacques Saelens) and manage the website 'www.foundationkobe.com'. I would really love to keep this English wikipedia page about my father and would like to receive more information about what I should change in
876:, turned up by all the free research above, is decent. Along with the other items found, it's clear that he had some amount of professional recognition, with some coverage and one good collection. It's enough. The son needs to understand that this page is not part of his advertising apparatus. 503:. A quick search on my part (really nothing extensive) shows that a couple of his works are in major collections (although not the biggest national collections) and at least one of his exhibitions got dedicated coverage (though not many column inches) in a national newspaper. So I suspect he 481:
which books and publications (in any language) talk about his work in any detail but are not produced either by his own foundation or by dealers trying to sell his work. All significant information given in the article should be verifiable from these independent sources.
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I will do my best to improve this page (more independent sources, information about the collections that hold my father's work, and more information about books/articles). You will have to give me some time to improve the page. What time do I have? Kind regards, Albin
240:. Of the 15 references, 9 are to the artist's own web site, 3 are commercial galleries, 1 is commercial, and 1 is social media. Google search on his name, Jacques Saelens, shows that he exists and uses commercial media; we knew that. Google search does not find any 344:
The best coverage I could find for on this artist is on Knowledge (XXG). I trimmed the article in hopes of finding some decent sourcing underneath all those primary sources, but there isn't any to speak of. A search turned up very, very
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te be deleted. I do understand and I admit that I am speaking often in a "peacock language" (this is natural because I am his son). Please let me know what I have to change so that the page can stay online. (
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What you call "the rest" are actually more of the same. What we have here is an artist who has exhibited his work. He exists and has exhibited. We agree on this! But, on its own, this fact does not make him
746:. The emotional investment of the main curator of the article does not make this discussion easy but Knowledge (XXG) policy must prevail. The text possibly belongs in specialist publications; not here. 259:
because it "looks better", but contrary to the MOS. That isn't a reason to delete, but lack of notability is a reason to delete, and tweaking a disambiguator is the sort of editing where
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with moreref tags on the page. I don't read Dutch, but it seems the artist is represented in museums and catalogs. The page has also been improved since the initial AfD nomination.
300: 263:. The article says that the artist searched for beauty, simplicity, and purity, but the article's authors are not searching for simplicity or purity, which means something. 195: 320: 280: 154: 86: 852:
is co-authored by Kobe's son which detracts from its independence, but as far as I can tell, its publisher, Stichting Kunstboek, is established and reliable.
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Exhibitions are not enough. If academics, magazines, etc., have not covered the artist despite the exhibitions, then the exhibitions are really immaterial.
411:) written in Dutch, English and French. Some of my father's works are shown in museums, such as 'Beeldengalerij Het Depot' in Wageningen, The Netherlands ( 101: 161: 638:
A collection's website - they own the work and not just exhibit it. Then a magazine reference, and the rest, seems to add up to notability.
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I also work together with an English company named Vastari (they facilitate exhibition loans and tours worldwide) (
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There have been a number of versions of this article with different disambiguators. The author changed
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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unless something more substantial in the way of independent sources is forthcoming. --
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There have been already many books, catalogs, and one DVD published about him (see:
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The fact that the artist has exhibited his work in museums does not render him
408: 873: 412: 382: 511:. However, as set up now the page is a mess and I'm reluctantly inclining to 433:). We are working on getting some more work of Kobe in international museums. 615:
subject is an artist who has exhibited does not, on its own, provide the
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My father's sculptures are being cast at Fonderia Artistica Mariani (
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Seems to be notable due to the fact that the works are in museums.
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which major collections permanently hold your father's work, and
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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on him (although I can only see it in snippet view). The book
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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https://artist.christies.com/Jacques-Saelens-Kobe--56826.aspx
397:),... that my father was an international recognized artist. 420:
https://www.headquarters-katoennatie.com/en/the-bather-kobe
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Some of his sculptures are part of a private collection (
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no amount of editing compensates for a lack of notability
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https://www.mutualart.com/Artist/Kobe/11C6655FC263AD81
208: 724:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, 694:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, 222: 391:https://www.invaluable.com/artist/kobe-hz4pe1my5u/ 248:language; trimming that out would leave a stub. 244:by independent sources. The article is heavy on 43:). No further edits should be made to this page. 905:). No further edits should be made to this page. 319:Note: This discussion has been included in the 301:list of Visual arts-related deletion discussions 299:Note: This discussion has been included in the 279:Note: This discussion has been included in the 8: 409:https://www.foundationkobe.com/publications/ 321:list of Belgium-related deletion discussions 281:list of Artists-related deletion discussions 102:Help, my article got nominated for deletion! 473:, the way to convince us of this is to say 413:https://www.hetdepot.nl/en/Kunstenaars/Kobe 383:https://www.artprice.com/artist/303542/kobe 537: 446: 422:) of one of the biggest Belgian companies 318: 298: 278: 791:notable per Knowledge (XXG)'s criteria 659:notable per Knowledge (XXG)'s criteria 507:just about (albeit narrowly) meet the 387:http://www.artnet.com/artists/kobe-2/ 18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion 7: 836:. I think this just scrapes through 619:for inclusion in Knowledge (XXG). - 402:https://fonderiamariani.com/works/ 24: 752:listing of haphazard information 356:changing to weak ke*p, see below 87:Introduction to deletion process 872:, with previous d vote struck. 431:https://www.vastari.com/contact 238:artistic notability guidelines 232:This article does not satisfy 1: 377:You can check on Christie's ( 234:general notability guidelines 353:) 05:42, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 509:relevant bar for notability 77:(AfD)? Read these primers! 922: 850:Kobe: ingenious simplicity 707:07:49, 30 April 2020 (UTC) 603:12:09, 27 April 2020 (UTC) 582:21:26, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 556:15:10, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 525:11:42, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 492:11:40, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 465:06:50, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 333:04:05, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 313:04:05, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 293:04:05, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 273:04:05, 23 April 2020 (UTC) 895:Please do not modify it. 886:04:36, 17 May 2020 (UTC) 864:00:53, 16 May 2020 (UTC) 829:22:15, 15 May 2020 (UTC) 803:22:59, 15 May 2020 (UTC) 781:18:09, 15 May 2020 (UTC) 764:18:05, 15 May 2020 (UTC) 671:22:59, 15 May 2020 (UTC) 648:18:22, 15 May 2020 (UTC) 629:18:05, 15 May 2020 (UTC) 366:04:33, 17 May 2020 (UTC) 57:18:38, 17 May 2020 (UTC) 32:Please do not modify it. 729:21:59, 8 May 2020 (UTC) 372:order to keep the page. 75:Articles for deletion 242:significant coverage 846:substantial article 748:This encyclopaedia 517:Andreas Philopater 484:Andreas Philopater 731: 709: 705: 617:necessary support 558: 542:comment added by 467: 451:comment added by 368: 335: 315: 295: 92:Guide to deletion 82:How to contribute 54:Black Kite (talk) 913: 844:seems to have a 738:. Subject fails 723: 721: 719: 704: 702: 695: 693: 691: 689: 611:The fact that a 571: 355: 227: 226: 212: 164: 152: 134: 72: 34: 921: 920: 916: 915: 914: 912: 911: 910: 909: 903:deletion review 874:This collection 732: 714: 712: 710: 698: 696: 684: 682: 565: 393:), Mutual Art ( 389:), Invaluable ( 325:Robert McClenon 305:Robert McClenon 285:Robert McClenon 265:Robert McClenon 169: 160: 125: 109: 106: 69: 66: 48:The result was 41:deletion review 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 919: 917: 908: 907: 889: 888: 878:ThatMontrealIP 866: 831: 817:User:The Gnome 809: 808: 807: 806: 784: 783: 766: 722: 711: 692: 681: 680: 679: 678: 677: 676: 675: 674: 673: 651: 650: 633: 632: 606: 605: 587: 586: 585: 584: 574:ThatMontrealIP 560: 559: 528: 527: 497: 496: 495: 494: 434: 427: 416: 405: 398: 374: 373: 369: 358:ThatMontrealIP 347:ThatMontrealIP 337: 336: 316: 296: 230: 229: 166: 105: 104: 99: 89: 84: 67: 65: 60: 46: 45: 25: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 918: 906: 904: 900: 896: 891: 890: 887: 883: 879: 875: 871: 867: 865: 862: 861: 857: 856: 851: 847: 843: 839: 835: 832: 830: 826: 822: 818: 814: 811: 810: 804: 800: 796: 792: 788: 787: 786: 785: 782: 778: 774: 773:Expertwikiguy 770: 767: 765: 761: 757: 753: 749: 745: 741: 737: 734: 733: 730: 727: 720: 717: 708: 703: 701: 690: 687: 672: 668: 664: 660: 655: 654: 653: 652: 649: 645: 641: 637: 636: 635: 634: 630: 626: 622: 618: 614: 610: 609: 608: 607: 604: 600: 596: 592: 589: 588: 583: 579: 575: 569: 564: 563: 562: 561: 557: 553: 549: 545: 541: 535: 530: 529: 526: 522: 518: 514: 510: 506: 502: 499: 498: 493: 489: 485: 480: 476: 472: 469: 468: 466: 462: 458: 454: 450: 444: 440: 435: 432: 428: 425: 421: 417: 414: 410: 406: 403: 399: 396: 392: 388: 384: 381:), Artprice ( 380: 376: 375: 370: 367: 363: 359: 354: 352: 348: 343: 339: 338: 334: 330: 326: 322: 317: 314: 310: 306: 302: 297: 294: 290: 286: 282: 277: 276: 275: 274: 270: 266: 262: 258: 257:Kobe (Artist) 254: 253:Kobe (artist) 249: 247: 243: 239: 235: 225: 221: 218: 215: 211: 207: 203: 200: 197: 194: 191: 188: 185: 182: 179: 175: 172: 171:Find sources: 167: 163: 159: 156: 150: 146: 142: 138: 133: 129: 124: 120: 116: 112: 111:Kobe (artist) 108: 107: 103: 100: 97: 93: 90: 88: 85: 83: 80: 79: 78: 76: 71: 64: 63:Kobe (artist) 61: 59: 58: 55: 51: 44: 42: 38: 33: 27: 26: 19: 894: 892: 869: 868:Changing to 859: 854: 849: 841: 833: 821:Psiĥedelisto 819:is correct. 812: 768: 740:WP:NCREATIVE 735: 713: 699: 683: 613:biographical 590: 538:— Preceding 512: 504: 500: 478: 474: 447:— Preceding 424:Katoen Natie 341: 340: 250: 231: 219: 213: 205: 198: 192: 186: 180: 170: 157: 68: 50:no consensus 49: 47: 31: 28: 196:free images 700:Sandstein 640:Randy Kryn 595:Randy Kryn 385:), Artnet( 899:talk page 870:Weak keep 834:Weak keep 795:The Gnome 756:The Gnome 750:is not a 742:and even 663:The Gnome 621:The Gnome 37:talk page 901:or in a 855:Spinning 716:Relisted 686:Relisted 552:contribs 540:unsigned 513:deletion 461:contribs 449:unsigned 155:View log 96:glossary 39:or in a 842:Tableau 726:Spartaz 501:Comment 479:exactly 475:exactly 345:little. 246:peacock 202:WP refs 190:scholar 128:protect 123:history 73:New to 813:Delete 744:WP:GNG 736:Delete 568:AlbinS 544:AlbinS 471:AlbinS 453:AlbinS 342:Delete 174:Google 132:delete 860:Spark 505:might 217:JSTOR 178:books 162:Stats 149:views 141:watch 137:links 16:< 882:talk 838:WP:N 825:talk 799:talk 777:talk 769:Keep 760:talk 667:talk 644:talk 625:talk 599:talk 591:Keep 578:talk 548:talk 534:talk 521:talk 488:talk 457:talk 443:talk 439:talk 362:talk 351:talk 329:talk 309:talk 289:talk 269:talk 210:FENS 184:news 145:logs 119:talk 115:edit 840:. 754:. - 661:. - 536:) 445:) 441:) ( 255:to 236:or 224:TWL 153:– ( 884:) 827:) 801:) 779:) 762:) 669:) 646:) 627:) 601:) 580:) 554:) 550:• 523:) 490:) 482:-- 463:) 459:• 415:). 364:) 331:) 323:. 311:) 303:. 291:) 283:. 271:) 204:) 147:| 143:| 139:| 135:| 130:| 126:| 121:| 117:| 52:. 880:( 823:( 805:. 797:( 775:( 758:( 665:( 642:( 631:. 623:( 597:( 576:( 570:: 566:@ 546:( 532:( 519:( 486:( 455:( 360:( 349:( 327:( 307:( 287:( 267:( 228:) 220:· 214:· 206:· 199:· 193:· 187:· 181:· 176:( 168:( 165:) 158:· 151:) 113:( 98:) 94:(

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Kobe (artist)

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Kobe (artist)
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