54:ā. I don't see a consensus here and I don't think things will become any clearer additional relistings. Numerically, there are more editors here arguing to Keep this article and their arguments rely on existing reliable sources (although if there are dozens, as is claimed, it wouldn't hurt to add them to the article). Those advocating Deletion claim that this event doesn't have sustained coverage but that is impossible to state definitively when the event is so recent. As an aside, and this just my opinion, this article was brought to AFD too soon, I think the closure might have been diferent if the nominator had waited a month or more after the event when SUSTAINED could be better assessed. I agree that some of these articles are created too soon after an event but they can also be tagged for deletion too quickly. The notability of an article subject often can be more clearly assessed after some time has passed since an incident occurred.
1452:. The original poster and other contributors put forth several points that deserve consideration and response. Accusations or assumptions about others' motives, such as suggesting they are engaging in propaganda, aren't conducive to the collaborative and respectful environment we strive for on Knowledge (XXG). It would be significantly more constructive to address the specific arguments made, providing evidence and citing guidelines as necessary, to ensure the discussion remains focused on improving the encyclopedia. This way, we can work together toward a consensus that reflects both Knowledge (XXG)ās standards and the verifiable information available on the topic.
1393:, I am surprised that the article was nominated for deletion! Knowing that the article was nominated on the basis that targeting the school was not intentional!! Please do not consider the statements of the Israeli army as neutral. Israeli statements cannot be considered neutral in this case. There are comments saying that the number of deaths is not large!! Is the killing of 6 civilians in the targeting of a school belonging to an international party normal? The article meets the criteria.--ā
978:- Editors should guard against recentism as current events may seem more important initially than they do in hindsight, often due to varying criteria between news outlets and Knowledge (XXG). When evaluating an event's notability for a Knowledge (XXG) article, it's essential to assess its enduring historical significance, coverage extent, and impact, considering factors like depth, duration, geographical scope, etc..
986:- We should avoid hastily writing articles on breaking news, as initial reports might lack depth and offer a skewed perspective, potentially leading to recentism. Instead, consider first adding information about the event to a related existing article. If the event proves to be notably significant over time, it can subsequently be given its own dedicated article.
766:). The analogy is apt because while we won't create a separate article on every kidnapped Israeli, collectively its an important topic. Likewise, collectively Israeli attacks on UNRWA during the war are important and have sustained coverage (and if past is any indication, they will be talked about for years to come, eg see
1485:
Opinion is roughly evenly divided, hopefully not on the basis of views on this war but based on policy and sourcing. Discounting that this might be viewed as a "minor event", this was one incident of conflict in a larger war. As we've recently discovered at AFD with incidents during the conflict in
1648:
Aside from the speculative nature of this type of reasoning, in the more than a week since the event, there has been little (if any) significant additional coverage beyond the initial, brief news stories quoting UNWRA. Given the unfortunately escalating nature of the conflict and the occurrence of
786:
I'd name it something different, as that proposed title has some NPOV issues (Israel's position is that it isn't targeting UNRWA but rather Hamas facilities that are build under, in, or around UNRWA locations). However, the concept of that article would be a suitable merge target, if we can find
1507:
Just in case it wasn't clear: I wrote "minor" only in the context of a war with thousands of casualties and hundreds of fully destroyed buildings, not because death in war is ever minor. Damage to one building and 6 deaths, with no other details, when we have only a couple dozen articles on any
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On 17 October, the IDF carried out an airstrike on a UNRWA school sheltering 4,000 refugees in the Al-Maghazi refugee camp, killing six and injuring dozens. Philippe
Lazzarini, the UNRWA Commissioner-General, called the attack "outrageous" and showing "a flagrant disregard for the lives of
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This appears to have been nominated within six hours of its creation with nary a hint of discussion on its talk page, and presumably before the subsequent coverage could be weighed. Seems pre-emptive and perfunctory. Yes, there's lots of news going up now, and not all of it develops
1430:- the propaganda war clearly reaches Knowledge (XXG) as well, with some POV editors intent on silencing "uncomfortable" truths as the unfounded nomination proves. But Knowledge (XXG) is not supposed to be a propaganda outlet, and there is no doubt that this is notable. Neither can
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relevance, but once something has been put up, better to wait and see how it develops. Here the topic is more generally notable as a strike on a school that is clear civilian and UN infrastructure, i.e. one of the more tangible war crimes out of many in the conflict.
509:, as the facts of the hospital airstrike come to light, this event could turn out to be related to the hospital airstrike. Keep for at least a week, as the event only took place today and articles related to war shouldn't be deleted this fast.
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Redirect is a possible outcome, you are the only one suggesting it however and you have actually !voted delete. Why is a compromise necessary anyway? Articles like this are created all the time and not usually deleted.
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Ukraine, not every incident, however terrible, warrants a standalone article so are there thoughts on where this content might be Merged to as an ATD? Just raising the question as opinion seems deadlocked right now.
970:- Knowledge (XXG) values enduring notability over mere newsworthiness, and while news can serve as source material, most newsworthy events donāt qualify for inclusion due to Knowledge (XXG)ās non-news style.
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A minor event in the ongoing war, damage to a school during an airstrike and not an intentional targeting; not a 'named event' in any sources, no substantive coverage beyond noting that it occurred.
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Sustained refers to "a sufficiently significant period of time" not a day or two. More useful when looking back in time to see whether an article that was initially kept still deserves to be.
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This story comes from just one report and had zero sustainable coverage. It could be added to a list of airstrikes during the war, as there's no need for separate articles for each one.
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That depends on whether the material is maintained on those other pages, and if the weight does not decrease with time, and also on whether this page is expanded, which it could be.
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1310:. Routine event in a war, and more importantly no sustained coverage. This short blurb is based on basically the same press release from the day of the event. ---Lilach5 (
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prove his claim that the attack was "unintentional" apart from official statements from
Israeli spokesmen, and even if it was it wouldn't be a reason for silencing it. --
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401:ā It hasn't even been a day since the event took place. We don't know what amount of RS coverage will develop, or if this will become more important due to later events.
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discussion much? No PROD occurred prior to AfD being started, no talk page discussion occurred prior to AfD being started, and event occurred a few hours ago.
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Another important distinction is that this was a standalone event, whereas this is a relatively minor event within a larger event, making this unnecessary
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Additionally, looking over at the case you provided, the arguments made there doesn't seem to hold here, and in fact highlight why this article here fails
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Knowledge (XXG) is not news. Little, not enough sustained coverage. Would recommend it be merged with other incidents, if not. Recommend deletion.
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I must have missed the point in history when bombing UN schools became routine ... Or maybe it occurred over the course of this conflict ...
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808:: After waiting for about a day to see if any further coverage is made to this article, one thing is clear: no sustained coverage was made.
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How about we redirect this article, and if additional coverage is produced that would enable it to be expanded we restore it at that time?
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737:. The topic received a little coverage immediately after the event, but lacks the sustained coverage needed to comply with those policies.
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Thank you for the reference; however, I'm not just going based on what exists in this article, but rather what exists period .
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to tell which events in this fast-moving situation will have ongoing resonance, and it isn't the job of en.wiki to decide.
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1640:"Keep for at least a week, as the event only took place today and articles related to war shouldn't be deleted this fast"
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I was making a suggestion that I hoped would be a reasonable compromise we could agree on within this AfD.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
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keep or convert into a list for all the airstrikes on refugee camps dring the conflict. --
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Seems significant, particularly in view of hospital explosion only a short time earlier.
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This story has received neither in depth/detailed coverage, and certainly not
1070:"I've reviewed the two papers listed in further reading and they both provide
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258:- Not notable, no continuing coverage, wasn't intentional, not many deaths.
1205:. It also partially duplicates content in several other articles, such as
559:. Receiving a lot of significant and reliable coverage, enough to satisfy
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607:- not sustained coverage nor notable enough for a separate article. --
279:, the article quality does not have to be good (seen/confirmed in in
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No sustained coverage, and what coverage there was is superficial
1728:ā Notable event with dozens of international sources. This is a
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it is a notable topic and there are no good reasons for removal
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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Allegations of war crimes against Israel#UNRWA school airstrike
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War crimes in the 2023 IsraelāHamas war#Indiscriminate attacks
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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would a reasonable compromise be to merge this article into
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also on whether this page is expanded, which it could be
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were based on assumptions that have not been borne out
1196:: This article entirely duplicates content already in
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articles about the event include, but not limited to:
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has sig coverage and will have more as time passes.--
1489:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
962:- Notability guidelines require sustained coverage.
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1571:2023 IsraelāHamas war#Second week (14ā20 October)
760:Attacks on UNRWA during the 2023 IsraelāHamas war
45:). No further edits should be made to this page.
1761:). No further edits should be made to this page.
1065:. The opinion over there stated (emphasis mine):
470:Note: This discussion has been included in the
1566:It already is merged into at least 5 articles:
456:so there will be more coverage in the future.
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768:2014 Israeli shelling of UNRWA Gaza shelters
764:Kidnappings during the 2023 IsraelāHamas war
111:Help, my article got nominated for deletion!
1711:none should hide a widely admissible event.
1634:"there will be more coverage in the future"
1527:Israeli strikes on UNRWA schools in general
1525:It is indicative of something else, namely
629:, coverage will intensify as time goes on.
1547:the scope of the article to address this.
1254:How about we await the result of the AfD?
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505:. Significant event especially after the
454:"the casualty count is likely to climb"
1586:2023 in the State of Palestine#October
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1604:that potentially address issues like
18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
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120:October 2023 UNRWA school airstrike
72:October 2023 UNRWA school airstrike
358:I find it ironic when people cite
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474:lists for the following topics:
96:Introduction to deletion process
435:per The Weather Event Writer.--
1207:2023 in the State of Palestine
1072:in depth SIGCOV of the subject
532:could be notable in the future
281:1999 AĆÆn TĆ©mouchent earthquake
1:
946:) for the following reasons:
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86:(AfD)? Read these primers!
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526:. Notability guidelines
34:Please do not modify it.
849:per above reasonings -
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1133:- suspect it is just
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1757:or in a
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309:UN News
293:Reuters
207:WPĀ refs
195:scholar
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524:Delete
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476:Events
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