476:, an important section in NCORP. So the interpretation in the table of "independent" is wrong - it seems to only look at whether there are corporate links between the publisher and the organization and does not consider that the content must also be independent. We don't want "echo chamber" references based on information provided by company sources to be used to establish notability. Also, GNG is not the appropriate guideline. A references may pass GNG and fail NCORP - an article may pass GNG and fail NCORP requirements and be deleted.
52:. There appears to be a consensus that the subject clears the notability hurdle, though I note there is some disagreement about the extent to which the reliable sources cited clear the NCORP threshold. Admittedly, more nuanced policy-based arguments tend towards deletion, but I plainly do not see a consensus for deletion and, after two relists, this is a pretty clear keep/no consensus.
954:
911:
904:
868:
782:
739:
696:
653:
610:
602:
566:
1100:
947:
940:
897:
853:
825:
818:
811:
775:
768:
732:
725:
689:
682:
646:
639:
595:
559:
552:
387:, that says “at least one regional, statewide, provincial, national, or international source is necessary”, and there are several here of those kinds. If we were dealing with a print encyclopaedia, it would be useful to have people weeding out the articles with no national or international importance, but that isn’t the case.
1495:
An operator working in a rural area rather than a big city doesn't attract so much fan interest and hence fewer citations. If it is not part of a big group it doesn't attract a lot of press attention, hence fewer citations. South West
Coaches has been operating longer and with a fleet and operating
423:
are simply the GNG, as interpreted there. To me, the sources comply with the GNG. If you say not, you may like to create a source assessment table (as mentioned on that page) and post it here. But there has to be a purposive approach to all policy, and I guess if a WP page is useful, as this one
1519:: This seems part of an attempt to destroy all independent bus operators leaving only the big 4/5, losing the history without engaging at WikiProject level, and that in the middle of a lockdown. This is a swamping attack which cannot be defended, and a lot of stuff has already gone.
1499:
I would suggest that a 'ref improve' may be more appropriate. There is clearly an imbalance in the article in as much as only one of the predecessor operators is mentioned in detail. I'm sure that Wakes
Services, its direct predecessor, can offer some good quality, relevant sources.
1623:
I do not agree with HighKing’s comments. Local press articles written by local journalists clearly have independent content, as do some of the other sources. Not clear what more could be expected in a case like this. Academic articles? Doctoral theses?
1486:. We need to be careful that we don't just delete every independent bus operator as that would leave Knowledge with a distorted coverage that suggests all UK buses are operated by the big groups. As the notability guidelines say,
1013:
803:
1537:
Except I would have done a mass nom of every independent if they all weren’t notable. All I am doing is identifying articles that don’t meet the clearly established notability guidelines. It is not my fault if they don’t.
209:
1053:
804:
https://www.dorsetecho.co.uk/news/15102789.thanks-to-south-west-coaches-and-cllr-kate-wheller-the-route-between-wyke-regis-and-weymouth-via-lanehouse-rocks-road-and-fiveways-will-run-again/
1016:
announcement from the table above. None of the references in the article meet the criteria and having searched I am unable to locate any references that meet the criteria. Topic fails
401:
Which of the SIGCOV sources is provincial/national? GNG is irrelevant in this case as the article is about a company, which means the standard is NCORP, a stricter version of GNG.
332:
and is supported by a well-populated category at
Commons. I have added some more reliable sources, but they could still be better, I would suggest adding a {{refimprove}} header.
285:
1000:
and applies a stricter interpretation of requirements than for other topics. In short, WP:NCORP requires multiple sources (at least two) of deep or significant coverage with
521:
203:
420:
1046:
265:
170:
305:
674:
1039:
117:
102:
1010:
original and independent opinion, analysis, investigation, and fact checking that are clearly attributable to a source unaffiliated to the subject
975:
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using
424:
clearly is, that influences people in what they say (if anything) in an AfD like this. On that front, please see also the template copied below.
361:, a component of NCORP. Being within the scope of a WikiProject and having related images on Commons do not address deficiencies in notability.
1422:. Whether or not you personally find it horrendous, that is where it comes from. If you think it is inadequate, then take it up with WP:NCORP.
143:
138:
383:, which isn’t about importance. Its main purpose is that the contents of an article can be verified from reliable sources, which this has. On
147:
957:
Similar AfDs have established that news articles about buses on fire or with windows smashed etc do not constitute significant coverage
130:
66:
932:
996:
First off, the table above is horrendous and unnecessary. The criteria for establishing notability for companies/organizations is
1406:
224:
329:
191:
97:
90:
17:
760:
1012:. That means, nothing that relies on company information or announcements or interviews, etc. For example, that rules out
845:
675:
http://www.chardandilminsternews.co.uk/news/15627650.Four_letter_rant_from_managing_director_as_bus_company_stops_running/
1331:
1266:
979:
111:
107:
1278:
1182:
185:
1457:
1389:
1678:
40:
1651:
1633:
1618:
1604:
1590:
1572:
1547:
1528:
1509:
1475:
1448:
1431:
1408:
1026:
482:
472:
Just my 2c, the table is useless. It doesn't for example have a part for "Independent
Content" which is part of
467:
450:
433:
410:
396:
370:
341:
317:
297:
277:
257:
72:
1369:
181:
631:
1524:
1505:
1444:
1288:
526:
134:
59:
1427:
1346:
231:
1674:
1326:
1298:
1283:
1215:
1159:
1126:
1079:
36:
1404:
1116:
531:
1629:
1600:
1568:
1001:
463:
429:
392:
337:
217:
1520:
1501:
1440:
1336:
1293:
1225:
1192:
1063:
933:
https://www.chardandilminsternews.co.uk/news/16083658.chard-bus-window-smashed-disgusting-attack/
126:
78:
54:
197:
1423:
1316:
1261:
1177:
1149:
86:
29:
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
1673:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
35:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's
1647:
1614:
1586:
1543:
1471:
1364:
1251:
1154:
1121:
1005:
473:
446:
406:
366:
313:
293:
273:
253:
761:
https://www.dorsetecho.co.uk/news/15506294.first-wessex-announce-changes-to-their-services/
1419:
1399:
1341:
1220:
1207:
1197:
1089:
1084:
1017:
997:
717:
245:
1008:. "Independent content", in order to count towards establishing notability, must include
1625:
1596:
1564:
1273:
1256:
1246:
846:
https://www.somersetlive.co.uk/news/somerset-news/what-know-nearly-one-month-829806.amp
459:
438:
425:
388:
352:
333:
1031:
863:
Sister website of Daily Mirror; both owned by Reach plc - no consensus on reliability
1639:
1021:
537:
477:
384:
380:
358:
241:
164:
1643:
1610:
1609:
No they don't? Every source failed the NCORP standards. See HighKing's comment.
1582:
1560:
1539:
1467:
455:
442:
416:
402:
376:
362:
309:
289:
269:
249:
1099:
569:
appears to be a listing in a book about hundreds if not thousands of companies
441:, GNG does not have the extra criteria which is part of NCORP - such as AUD.
1321:
1308:
1131:
889:
632:
http://www.dorsetecho.co.uk/news/4668135.End_of_the_Sureline_for_Portland/
587:
1238:
1108:
379:, I agree with your last sentence, but this page has enough sources for
1374:
1356:
1187:
1071:
1169:
1496:
area similar to many big group brands which have their own articles.
546:
Who Owns Whom: United
Kingdom & Ireland, Volume 2 (2009), p. 754
1141:
240:
No evidence of significant coverage in multiple reliable sources (
1669:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
1035:
1460:
to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
1392:
to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
421:
Notability (organizations and companies)#Primary criteria
1488:
smaller organizations and their products can be notable
718:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-41801760
160:
156:
152:
1563:, and also a useful article, part of a useful family.
357:
None of the sources added are both sigcov and satisfy
216:
1466:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
1398:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
1355:
1307:
1237:
1206:
1168:
1140:
1107:
1070:
286:
43:). No further edits should be made to this page.
1681:). No further edits should be made to this page.
304:Note: This discussion has been included in the
284:Note: This discussion has been included in the
264:Note: This discussion has been included in the
1418:: The table above is explicitly recommended in
266:list of Companies-related deletion discussions
1047:
328:This is a useful article within the scope of
230:
8:
306:list of England-related deletion discussions
118:Help, my article got nominated for deletion!
1054:
1040:
1032:
505:
303:
283:
263:
242:that are not local or of limited interest
1004:and (this bit is important!) containing
890:http://www.countrybus.co.uk/sureline.htm
588:http://www.countrybus.co.uk/safeway.htm
1581:Standard is NCORP, higher bar than N.
1002:in-depth information *on the company*
7:
1595:The sources also comply with that.
24:
1559:Enough reliable sources here for
1098:
952:
945:
938:
909:
902:
895:
866:
851:
823:
816:
809:
780:
773:
766:
737:
730:
723:
694:
687:
680:
651:
644:
637:
608:
600:
593:
564:
557:
550:
103:Introduction to deletion process
18:Knowledge:Articles for deletion
419:, and it seems to me that the
1:
1449:19:41, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
1432:17:43, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
1409:16:28, 22 February 2021 (UTC)
1027:22:00, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
483:22:04, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
468:14:54, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
451:14:44, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
434:14:35, 21 February 2021 (UTC)
411:19:54, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
397:19:50, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
371:14:05, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
342:12:59, 19 February 2021 (UTC)
318:15:41, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
298:15:41, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
278:15:41, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
258:15:41, 14 February 2021 (UTC)
1279:First Hampshire & Dorset
1267:Somerset Passenger Solutions
1183:First Hampshire & Dorset
458:, on AUD, please see above.
946:
939:
896:
852:
824:
817:
810:
774:
767:
731:
724:
688:
681:
645:
638:
594:
558:
551:
93:(AfD)? Read these primers!
1698:
953:
910:
903:
867:
781:
738:
695:
652:
609:
601:
565:
73:16:48, 13 March 2021 (UTC)
1652:22:34, 9 March 2021 (UTC)
1634:22:28, 9 March 2021 (UTC)
1619:14:00, 7 March 2021 (UTC)
1605:13:54, 7 March 2021 (UTC)
1591:06:07, 7 March 2021 (UTC)
1573:00:47, 7 March 2021 (UTC)
1548:21:53, 4 March 2021 (UTC)
1529:21:38, 4 March 2021 (UTC)
1510:17:46, 4 March 2021 (UTC)
1476:14:25, 4 March 2021 (UTC)
1096:
973:
871:Another Nippybus article
511:Source assessment table:
508:
1671:Please do not modify it.
32:Please do not modify it.
1289:Quantock Motor Services
415:I have looked at that,
1229:(via Pulham's Coaches)
914:Mainly about Sureline
699:Mainly about Nippybus
656:Mainly about Sureline
1347:Swindon's Bus Company
1327:First West of England
1299:Stagecoach South West
1284:First West of England
1216:First West of England
1160:Stagecoach South West
1127:Stagecoach South West
1080:First West of England
1006:"Independent Content"
613:mainly about Safeway
605:Enthusiast blog/site
532:Significant coverage?
330:WikiProject Wiltshire
91:Articles for deletion
536:Count source toward
1014:the Dorchester Echo
980:source assess table
785:Mainly about First
1337:South West Coaches
1294:South West Coaches
1226:Oxford Bus Company
1193:South West Coaches
1064:South West England
127:South West Coaches
79:South West Coaches
1478:
1411:
1383:
1382:
1317:Connect2Wiltshire
1262:Buses of Somerset
1178:Buses of Somerset
1150:Buses of Somerset
1062:Bus operators in
990:
989:
986:
935:
892:
848:
806:
763:
720:
677:
634:
590:
547:
320:
300:
280:
108:Guide to deletion
98:How to contribute
1689:
1465:
1463:
1461:
1397:
1395:
1393:
1370:National Express
1252:Bath Bus Company
1230:
1155:Plymouth Citybus
1122:Plymouth Citybus
1102:
1056:
1049:
1042:
1033:
984:
978:
974:
966:
965:
956:
955:
949:
948:
942:
941:
931:
923:
922:
913:
912:
906:
905:
899:
898:
888:
880:
879:
870:
869:
862:
855:
854:
844:
836:
835:
827:
826:
820:
819:
813:
812:
802:
794:
793:
784:
783:
777:
776:
770:
769:
759:
751:
750:
741:
740:
734:
733:
727:
726:
716:
708:
707:
698:
697:
691:
690:
684:
683:
673:
665:
664:
655:
654:
648:
647:
641:
640:
630:
622:
621:
612:
611:
604:
603:
597:
596:
586:
578:
577:
568:
567:
561:
560:
554:
553:
545:
506:
356:
235:
234:
220:
168:
150:
88:
69:
64:
57:
34:
1697:
1696:
1692:
1691:
1690:
1688:
1687:
1686:
1685:
1679:deletion review
1479:
1456:
1454:
1439:Fails WP:NCORP.
1412:
1388:
1386:
1384:
1379:
1351:
1342:Stagecoach West
1303:
1233:
1228:
1221:Stagecoach West
1208:Gloucestershire
1202:
1198:Transpora Group
1164:
1136:
1103:
1094:
1090:Transpora Group
1085:Stagecoach West
1066:
1060:
982:
976:
961:
960:
918:
917:
875:
874:
858:
831:
830:
789:
788:
746:
745:
703:
702:
660:
659:
617:
616:
573:
572:
513:
350:
177:
141:
125:
122:
85:
82:
67:
60:
55:
48:The result was
41:deletion review
30:
22:
21:
20:
12:
11:
5:
1695:
1693:
1684:
1683:
1665:
1664:
1663:
1662:
1661:
1660:
1659:
1658:
1657:
1656:
1655:
1654:
1576:
1575:
1553:
1552:
1551:
1550:
1532:
1531:
1513:
1512:
1497:
1492:
1491:
1464:
1453:
1452:
1451:
1434:
1396:
1385:
1381:
1380:
1378:
1377:
1372:
1367:
1361:
1359:
1353:
1352:
1350:
1349:
1344:
1339:
1334:
1332:Salisbury Reds
1329:
1324:
1319:
1313:
1311:
1305:
1304:
1302:
1301:
1296:
1291:
1286:
1281:
1276:
1274:Damory Coaches
1271:
1270:
1269:
1259:
1257:Berrys Coaches
1254:
1249:
1247:Bakers Dolphin
1243:
1241:
1235:
1234:
1232:
1231:
1223:
1218:
1212:
1210:
1204:
1203:
1201:
1200:
1195:
1190:
1185:
1180:
1174:
1172:
1166:
1165:
1163:
1162:
1157:
1152:
1146:
1144:
1138:
1137:
1135:
1134:
1129:
1124:
1119:
1113:
1111:
1105:
1104:
1097:
1095:
1093:
1092:
1087:
1082:
1076:
1074:
1068:
1067:
1061:
1059:
1058:
1051:
1044:
1036:
1030:
1029:
988:
987:
971:
970:
958:
950:
943:
936:
928:
927:
915:
907:
900:
893:
885:
884:
872:
864:
856:
849:
841:
840:
828:
821:
814:
807:
799:
798:
786:
778:
771:
764:
756:
755:
743:
742:Same as above
735:
728:
721:
713:
712:
700:
692:
685:
678:
670:
669:
657:
649:
642:
635:
627:
626:
614:
606:
598:
591:
583:
582:
570:
562:
555:
548:
542:
541:
534:
529:
524:
519:
515:
514:
509:
504:
503:
500:
499:
498:
497:
496:
495:
494:
493:
492:
491:
490:
489:
488:
487:
486:
485:
345:
344:
322:
321:
301:
281:
238:
237:
174:
121:
120:
115:
105:
100:
83:
81:
76:
46:
45:
25:
23:
15:
14:
13:
10:
9:
6:
4:
3:
2:
1694:
1682:
1680:
1676:
1672:
1667:
1666:
1653:
1649:
1645:
1641:
1637:
1636:
1635:
1631:
1627:
1622:
1621:
1620:
1616:
1612:
1608:
1607:
1606:
1602:
1598:
1594:
1593:
1592:
1588:
1584:
1580:
1579:
1578:
1577:
1574:
1570:
1566:
1562:
1558:
1555:
1554:
1549:
1545:
1541:
1536:
1535:
1534:
1533:
1530:
1526:
1522:
1521:Djm-leighpark
1518:
1515:
1514:
1511:
1507:
1503:
1502:Geof Sheppard
1498:
1494:
1493:
1489:
1485:
1481:
1480:
1477:
1473:
1469:
1462:
1459:
1450:
1446:
1442:
1438:
1435:
1433:
1429:
1425:
1421:
1417:
1414:
1413:
1410:
1407:
1405:
1403:
1402:
1394:
1391:
1376:
1373:
1371:
1368:
1366:
1363:
1362:
1360:
1358:
1354:
1348:
1345:
1343:
1340:
1338:
1335:
1333:
1330:
1328:
1325:
1323:
1320:
1318:
1315:
1314:
1312:
1310:
1306:
1300:
1297:
1295:
1292:
1290:
1287:
1285:
1282:
1280:
1277:
1275:
1272:
1268:
1265:
1264:
1263:
1260:
1258:
1255:
1253:
1250:
1248:
1245:
1244:
1242:
1240:
1236:
1227:
1224:
1222:
1219:
1217:
1214:
1213:
1211:
1209:
1205:
1199:
1196:
1194:
1191:
1189:
1186:
1184:
1181:
1179:
1176:
1175:
1173:
1171:
1167:
1161:
1158:
1156:
1153:
1151:
1148:
1147:
1145:
1143:
1139:
1133:
1130:
1128:
1125:
1123:
1120:
1118:
1115:
1114:
1112:
1110:
1106:
1101:
1091:
1088:
1086:
1083:
1081:
1078:
1077:
1075:
1073:
1069:
1065:
1057:
1052:
1050:
1045:
1043:
1038:
1037:
1034:
1028:
1025:
1024:
1019:
1015:
1011:
1007:
1003:
999:
995:
992:
991:
981:
972:
969:
964:
959:
951:
944:
937:
934:
930:
929:
926:
921:
916:
908:
901:
894:
891:
887:
886:
883:
878:
873:
865:
861:
857:
850:
847:
843:
842:
839:
834:
829:
822:
815:
808:
805:
801:
800:
797:
792:
787:
779:
772:
765:
762:
758:
757:
754:
749:
744:
736:
729:
722:
719:
715:
714:
711:
706:
701:
693:
686:
679:
676:
672:
671:
668:
663:
658:
650:
643:
636:
633:
629:
628:
625:
620:
615:
607:
599:
592:
589:
585:
584:
581:
576:
571:
563:
556:
549:
544:
543:
539:
535:
533:
530:
528:
525:
523:
520:
517:
516:
512:
507:
502:
501:
484:
481:
480:
475:
471:
470:
469:
465:
461:
457:
454:
453:
452:
448:
444:
440:
437:
436:
435:
431:
427:
422:
418:
414:
413:
412:
408:
404:
400:
399:
398:
394:
390:
386:
382:
378:
374:
373:
372:
368:
364:
360:
354:
349:
348:
347:
346:
343:
339:
335:
331:
327:
324:
323:
319:
315:
311:
307:
302:
299:
295:
291:
287:
282:
279:
275:
271:
267:
262:
261:
260:
259:
255:
251:
247:
243:
233:
229:
226:
223:
219:
215:
211:
208:
205:
202:
199:
196:
193:
190:
187:
183:
180:
179:Find sources:
175:
172:
166:
162:
158:
154:
149:
145:
140:
136:
132:
128:
124:
123:
119:
116:
113:
109:
106:
104:
101:
99:
96:
95:
94:
92:
87:
80:
77:
75:
74:
71:
70:
65:
63:
58:
51:
44:
42:
38:
33:
27:
26:
19:
1670:
1668:
1556:
1516:
1487:
1483:
1455:
1436:
1424:Gnomingstuff
1415:
1400:
1387:
1022:
1009:
993:
967:
962:
924:
919:
881:
876:
859:
837:
832:
795:
790:
752:
747:
709:
704:
666:
661:
623:
618:
579:
574:
522:Independent?
510:
478:
325:
239:
227:
221:
213:
206:
200:
194:
188:
178:
84:
61:
53:
49:
47:
31:
28:
204:free images
1401:Ritchie333
244:) - fails
1675:talk page
1626:Moonraker
1597:Moonraker
1565:Moonraker
1322:Faresaver
1309:Wiltshire
1132:Truronian
527:Reliable?
474:WP:ORGIND
460:Moonraker
439:Moonraker
426:Moonraker
389:Moonraker
353:Moonraker
334:Moonraker
62:Phightins
37:talk page
1677:or in a
1458:Relisted
1420:WP:NCORP
1390:Relisted
1357:National
1239:Somerset
1109:Cornwall
1023:HighKing
1018:WP:NCORP
998:WP:NCORP
479:HighKing
246:WP:NCORP
171:View log
112:glossary
39:or in a
1441:Charles
1416:Comment
1375:FlixBus
1365:Megabus
1188:Morebus
1072:Bristol
518:Source
210:WP refs
198:scholar
144:protect
139:history
89:New to
1644:SK2242
1640:WP:AUD
1611:SK2242
1583:SK2242
1540:SK2242
1468:Daniel
1437:Delete
1170:Dorset
1117:Kernow
994:Delete
456:SK2242
443:SK2242
417:SK2242
403:SK2242
385:WP:AUD
381:WP:GNG
377:SK2242
375:Sigh.
363:SK2242
359:WP:AUD
310:SK2242
290:SK2242
270:SK2242
250:SK2242
182:Google
148:delete
1482:Weak
1142:Devon
225:JSTOR
186:books
165:views
157:watch
153:links
16:<
1648:talk
1638:See
1630:talk
1615:talk
1601:talk
1587:talk
1569:talk
1561:WP:N
1557:Keep
1544:talk
1525:talk
1517:Keep
1506:talk
1484:keep
1472:talk
1445:talk
1428:talk
464:talk
447:talk
430:talk
407:talk
393:talk
367:talk
338:talk
326:Keep
314:talk
294:talk
274:talk
254:talk
218:FENS
192:news
161:logs
135:talk
131:edit
50:keep
838:Yes
538:GNG
232:TWL
169:– (
1650:)
1642:.
1632:)
1617:)
1603:)
1589:)
1571:)
1546:)
1527:)
1508:)
1474:)
1447:)
1430:)
1020:.
983:}}
977:{{
968:No
925:No
882:No
796:No
753:No
710:No
667:No
624:No
580:No
540:?
466:)
449:)
432:)
409:)
395:)
369:)
340:)
316:)
308:.
296:)
288:.
276:)
268:.
256:)
248:.
212:)
163:|
159:|
155:|
151:|
146:|
142:|
137:|
133:|
56:Go
1646:(
1628:(
1613:(
1599:(
1585:(
1567:(
1542:(
1523:(
1504:(
1490:.
1470:(
1443:(
1426:(
1055:e
1048:t
1041:v
985:.
963:✘
920:✘
877:✘
860:~
833:✔
791:✘
748:✘
705:✘
662:✘
619:✘
575:✘
462:(
445:(
428:(
405:(
391:(
365:(
355::
351:@
336:(
312:(
292:(
272:(
252:(
236:)
228:·
222:·
214:·
207:·
201:·
195:·
189:·
184:(
176:(
173:)
167:)
129:(
114:)
110:(
68:!
Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.