1115:. I agree in particular with Prolog and Johntex - use 'main' templates where info is duplicated but keep it grouped together here, and add more info on epidemiology, stats of use and completion rates etc. It's possible a few suicidal people might come looking here for info, but actually what we've currently got wouldn't be that much use to them in a 'how to' sense anyway (in addition to
188:
1305:. While that article is indeed not a how to, there are strict guidelines in journalism which state that you do not show graphic images or talk about method when it comes to suicide. This is because it has been shown that suicide rates by one particular method increase in the public after it has been in the media.
653:
Those two examples are completely not related. The article is not trying to advocate suicide. Besides, you couldn’t provide reliable sources about the location of the Jews anyway. It would be unsourced and removed as such. I’m not a big fan of the article either (I don’t think it’s written well). If
703:
article from becoming too long, but it should focus on topics like the relative frequency of different methods, differences between culture and time period in suicide methods, etc. A brief list of significant suicide methods at the start of the article would be acceptable, but providing detail on a
965:
Who cares if it is "tasteless"? We are here to right a useful, informative encyclopedia. There are notable, reliable sources on this topic. We are not here to decide for people what is appropriate knowledge. It is perfectly "acceptable" for people to want to research this topic. Protecting people
643:
either. And sorry if I'm emotional, but when I have a friend who nearly is no longer here because of the information presented on this page, then yes, information is evil. Would you post information on where Jews during the
Holocaust, so anybody (including authorities) could look it up?
1129:
is needed for this article. It is presented as a How-To, and considering that the subject matter is already available on their own separate articles, there is no need for this article to remain. It's about as logical as having another article related to
1041:
This is informational and interesting. If you don't like it, don't look at it. Why is death/suicide so taboo? Get over it. Also I'm pretty mad that a lot of this page got deleted. A lot of valuable information was taken out. Thanks for that.
786:- I think the topic is encyclopedic- although it should be worded appropiately as to ensure if is not a user guide of suicide. Obviously suicide is an emmotive subject, but if appropiately written, it could be a useful article
460:. I knew this AfD would come the moment I saw the article was on the mailing list. This is an entirely reasonable subject to have an encyclopedia article about, it can be done in an informative and NPOV manner. Merging into
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Work to change the policy if you don't agree with it. There is nothing illegal about providing this information. To exclude this information for personal reasons is clearly a violation of all sorts of policies, including
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What I meant was particularly "tasteless" was the suggestion of transwikiing to
Wikihow, thus acknowledging that this article is indeed a "how-to" guide and should be openly acknowledged and promoted as such.
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This is potentially useful in a wide range of research uses, curiosity etc. The only possible reason for deletion is based on some people's individual moral decisions, which is a slippery slope indeed.
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as an encyclopedic article about an encyclopedic and notable topic. Merging is not good either, as the best way to present information on suicide methods is to collect it into one page, with
1336:. There is already a merge-discussion at both articles to re-merge the two, and the current consensus (of one) is that it is too long to merge. That said, I think it should be renamed to
1289:. Has encyclopedic value, and this is not a How-To. If you want to see a How-To, I advise you to view the ASH (alt.suicide.holiday) methods file plastered all over the net and available
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article: I'm talking about putting any useful non-duplicative content into the individual cause-of-death articles, and leaving references to them in the "suicide methods" subsection. --
695:
details of the "mechanics" of the means of death ("Burning to death can take several minutes to several hours...", etc.) into their respective articles, per nom, and (not per nom)
308:. All manner of other edits up to and including merging and redirecting are done without needing to go through AfD (not that I believe merging would be appropriate in this case).
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1058:- I agree that this article should "focus on topics like the relative frequency of different methods, differences between culture and time period in suicide methods, etc" --
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After various editors have now removed this extraneous content, what remains appears to be redundant, since every one of the topics covered seems to be a mode of death (
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unmerged—This topic is covered in many reliable sources and is of use to many people, including not only those who are suicidal, but also for writers, parents, etc.
132:
This article appears to serve no purpose other than to act as a magnet for people who want to add unencyclopedic "how-to" information, which is a clear example of
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keep it. people should be allowed to access fair information about how to kill themselves if they like. Don't censor. Leave wikipedia free and open.
155:, etc.) which already has its own detailed article elsewhere (or should have one), and a top-level summary of all known methods already exists at the
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430:
See comments above: this article as-is is a compendium of duplicated information that could better be developed in the more specific articles. --
1265:
The article could be improved, but even though some find the topic objectionable, overall the article adds to our presentation of knowledge. --
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wouldn't be a good idea, that article is already very large and too much would need to be cut from this article to make it fit. Renaming to
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And again you've missed the point. I just said that there are more important things in life sometimes than upholding an ideal. Not
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into the relevant cause-of-death-specific articles, each of which should then be briefly referenced in the short list given in the
540:. The content of this article constitutes a threat to human life, and its presence is likely to bring the project into disrepute.
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basis is (a) an unnecessary duplication of more specific articles, and (b) worryingly close to a "how to commit suicide" guide.
85:
1328:
article started out as a long section within the
Suicide article, constituting something like half of it in page-length, so
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810:- needs information on things like success rates for the various methods, differential selection based upon gender, etc.
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unmerged — Knowledge (XXG) is not censored, and deletion is not a substitute for "aggressive refactoring," a.k.a. cleanup
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but clean up. Could do with some more sourcing, particularly for the individual "methods". Also agree that renaming to
397:, and appropriately detailed treatments in cause-of-death subarticles, and then turning this article into a redirect. --
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I agree, anyone wishing to kill themself probably isn't going to consult an article online about how to go about it. --
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per above. This is a perfectly encyclopedic topic, though Bryan
Derksen's suggestion of a move does have some promise.
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36:
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1173:- the title sounds a little weird when it is describing different methods. Plural perhaps? Also far from complete. --
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Knowledge (XXG) isn't censored, true - but policy isn't a suicide pact either. An article on suicide is enough. -
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Keep it encyclopedic, yes, but putting it into the main article might make it a bit too big. That said, I'm not
1391:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
35:
Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a
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610:. Sorry, I have a friend that was close to suicide and told me she came to this site to look up information.
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it gets deleted, it should be because it is not a good article not because of moral objections. --
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below.
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as a how-to manual which has most methods referenced only to other
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722:. Encyclopedic topic. Could probably use a rename to "List of suicide methods". --
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per
Newyorkbrad. Sometimes there are things more important in life than keeping
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hostile to an aggressive merge and redirect. I'll keep tabs on this discussion.
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197:. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination:
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from themselves is a job for family and friends, not encyclopedia editors.
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I'm not advocating censorship: I'm recommending refactoring into a
1189:. A Keep/Delete decision should not be based on moral objections:
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or all that. The point is, AfD is not
Cleanup®. *sigh* I find it
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article can kill someone. Articles don't kill people, people do.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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Forget the licensing, that's the most tasteless suggestion yet.
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1324:, but that article is already overlong. It is clear that this
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is a ridiculous suggestion when that article is already 40KB -
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I propose that any remaining useful content in this article be
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265:. An AfD is not needed for an aggressive refactoring. --
1340:, seeing as there is more than one method discussed. --
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is preferable, it's more clear than the current title.
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996:. It is a bonafide subject with encyclopedic value. --
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I'm not suggesting putting its content into the main
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was split off to its own article with a note at the
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Howso? An AfD is about whether an article should be
413:. Make as encyclopedic as needed, but merging into
39:). No further edits should be made to this page.
1193:. Per above no merge because of size but possibly
772:templates where further information is available.
278:I think it is possibly called for, in this case.
1395:). No further edits should be made to this page.
626:. Information is not evil, folks—not any of it!
170:section, and that this article be turned into a
554:, and I would strongly contest the idea that
8:
845:some people cry for refactoring... =/ --
1371:epidemiology and methodology of suicide
1099:article. That article is overly long.
927:It's not. The licensing doesn't match.
18:Knowledge (XXG):Articles for deletion
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193:This project page was nominated for
1226:, not an excuse for censorship. -
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1012:after cleanup and summarization.
1185:Complements the main article on
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552:Knowledge (XXG) is not censored
1365:. Sufficiently encyclopedic,
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1220:Reparative therapy#Techniques
1216:Self-induced abortion#Methods
1277:. Obviously this is a keep.
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1317:. My first reaction was
528:Per above. Not censored.
1388:Please do not modify it.
1334:original section heading
32:Please do not modify it.
1119:). Rename method -: -->
502:List of suicide methods
466:List of suicide methods
168:Suicide#Suicide_methods
164:aggressively refactored
157:Suicide#Suicide_methods
1095:Do not merge into the
1295:Knowledge (XXG) brown
1246:comment was added by
1212:List of sex positions
1134:named Injury method.
746:Aggressively refactor
693:Aggressively refactor
798:very encyclopediac--
468:might be warranted.
393:short subsection of
267:Eugène van der Pijll
174:to that subsection.
1359:Keep, do not merge
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479:
457:
443:
419:David Gerard
410:
390:
373:
327:
323:
305:
262:
238:
221:
209:September 12
204:
171:
163:
161:
159:subsection.
141:asphyxiation
138:
131:
61:
54:
49:
45:
43:
31:
28:
1183:Strong Keep
978:Newyorkbrad
958:Newyorkbrad
788:Thunderwing
697:restructure
542:Newyorkbrad
515:•
239:Speedy keep
1224:neutrality
872:censored.
706:per-method
639:, but not
608:uncensored
378:➥the Epopt
247:discussion
243:2005-10-21
233:discussion
216:discussion
1319:merge to
1315:Weak Keep
1120:methods.
1014:≈ jossi ≈
902:Transwiki
800:Sefringle
748:per nom.
646:Part Deux
612:Part Deux
432:The Anome
399:The Anome
362:The Anome
176:The Anome
1350:contribs
1256:contribs
1244:unsigned
1229:cohesion
1136:Aquatics
831:Redirect
827:Refactor
724:Carnildo
344:contribs
328:entirely
292:contribs
195:deletion
172:redirect
126:View log
1367:WP:NPOV
1363:suicide
1321:Suicide
1187:suicide
1117:WP:NPOV
1097:suicide
1081:Deckill
1076:Suicide
1060:Richard
1010:Suicide
906:WikiHow
848:wwwwolf
813:Johntex
710:EALacey
701:suicide
641:ethical
637:illegal
624:WP:NPOV
530:Infodmz
486:Hut 8.5
462:suicide
415:Suicide
395:suicide
358:suicide
306:deleted
99:protect
94:history
1330:Method
1326:Method
1303:Delete
1195:rename
1171:rename
1132:Injury
1113:rename
1027:Delete
1018:(talk)
870:WP:NOT
857:growls
839:highly
774:Prolog
736:Edison
732:Delete
245:, see
231:, see
226:May 15
214:, see
134:WP:NOT
103:delete
1361:into
1342:T-dot
1175:MoRsE
1158:light
1074:into
1072:merge
1008:into
1006:Merge
931:: -->
876:: -->
853:barks
835:Merge
324:Keep.
120:views
112:watch
108:links
16:<
1346:Talk
1291:here
1287:Keep
1275:Keep
1267:Pete
1263:Keep
1252:talk
1238:Keep
1207:Keep
1167:Keep
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1144:Keep
1111:and
1109:Keep
1093:Keep
1070:but
1068:Keep
1054:per
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1039:Keep
998:Ezeu
994:Keep
947:<
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825:and
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796:keep
784:Keep
767:main
760:Keep
720:Keep
526:Keep
498:Keep
480:Keep
458:Keep
444:Keep
411:Keep
391:very
374:Keep
229:2006
222:Keep
212:2006
205:Keep
116:logs
90:talk
86:edit
51:Sr13
46:keep
1154:Twi
1122:Eve
1031:Doc
911:ffm
904:to
833:or
829:or
674:dir
587:dir
556:any
511:yan
508:Ark
340:g92
288:g92
263:???
124:– (
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1254:•
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1197:.
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855:/
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249:.
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63:C
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57:T
55:(
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