835:
deletion, and it hasn't been made. I see that in 2012 an editor said that the portal looks like a mess, and was reasonably told to explain what they meant, and the subject was dropped. I last looked at this portal in August when the case was being made for deletion of provincial portals, most of which have been deleted. I saw that this portal has 64 daily pageviews, which is better than most portals, as opposed to 18598 for the head article, but the head article is about a great country. The portal has 69 article subpages (or did when I looked). I haven't done an analysis of how often they are updated. I assume that they are not updated, because portal subpages seldom are, but that is a case that should be made by the nominator. I see a mention that the average age of the edits is 2010. (I assume that means 2010 CE and not 2010 days ago, but that would be 2013 CE, which is similar.) If that is computed using a tool, I would appreciate a link to the tool, either here or on my user talk page. I see that one subpage has content rot. I had considered a
2177:, clearly a suitable topic, no longer abandoned. BHG's objections about "decay" and "maintenance plans" above are irrelevant: we do not have maintenance plans for BLPs either, we simply allow them to become out of date (it happens constantly) and hope somebody comes and fixes them (which always happens eventually). The idea of asking for designated maintainers is antithetical to the wiki principle, where when you notice something needs updating, you go and update it, or at least ask someone else to update it. —
912:
1051:
no clue what our circumstances will be tomorrow or next year. If you see a problem with it down the line nominated for deletion or better yet make a correction yourself or bring it to someone's attention who knows what to do. This philosophy you have of blocking progress because of unknown future neglect and your approach of deletion over fixing is very problematic to the many editors here as its the opposite of
2053:: I'm not sure if portals in general are that great an idea in practice. Anyway, on this portal: Not sure how much editing activity is onecessary to satisfy nay-sayers. If anyone wants to pass on or point me to a list of tasks or regular upkeep schedule, I'd be willing to contribute. I work on a fair number of Canada-based articles.
1707:
maintenance. Other nation portals have been deleted, so that in itself does not mean the topic is "broad" in the sense that it is a viable portal. If deleted, subpages should not be saved; and I support replacement of links rather than redirection, as proposed by BrownHairedGirl, to avoid surprising our readers.
1787:
Now it's six months since the spam was deleted. In that time, the portals project hasn't even a drafted proposal for what direction portals should take. But we're asked to believe here that some "retooling" is in the pipeline. Retooling with what goals? Where has this been discussed? Where is the
1050:
Pls apply common sense.....I did not nominate this portal for deletion like the others....instead I and another took on the job of updating the format and have clearly shown interest in it. I nor anyone else have any obligation to give you any assurance on what we plan to do in the future as we have
1578:
It's clear to anyone here that the editors who claim to care about the portal haven't cared enough to stop it rotting for years, or to do any significant work until it was finally brought to MFD. It is also clear to anyone here that those same editors are giving nobody any reason to believe that the
1278:
What's the fastest way to delete subpage? PS all we care about is the end users result...un-used pages can be cleanup at any rate and definitely not a reason to deleted but to help out just a bit. This name calling is getting old and leads to zero credibility on the part of the authors. What more do
1025:
As you know, Moxy, you created several dozen portals which were unmaintained, and just rotted for years. As a result, most of them were deleted, some of them after you were wise enough to nominate your own creations at MFD, which was a helpful and constructive thing to do. Now you want to keep this
1175:
Even a lot of the editors wanting to mass delete portals don't support getting rid of high-level ones, namely those for countries. No opinion on the different states of Canada, but such a big country should have its own portal - very useful for navigation if nothing else. And as it's geographic, it
834:
I am probably one of the more outspoken critics of portals, but I haven't seen the case against this portal, except that its design relies on content-forked subpages, which is an unsound design. However, the case for deletion should be made by the nominator, or at least by another proponent of the
1887:
deprecation for the 3rd time in 3 years (move content portals to main namespace) Do not support deletion at the deletion board by a few editor's (have been vocal about this fact but to no avail). Also would be best if the portal project - if any left after this talk - is not dominated by those in
1094:
Your response that I should look for errors and fix them myself or bring them to someone's attention completely misses the point. I have no intention whatsoever of turning myself into a single-handed monitor of portal errors; it's far too much work for one person to do. Portals are viable only if
1706:
per BrownHairedGirl. The page views are 64 per day, which is not particularly high, and are a mere 0.34% that of the article Canada, which serves our readers much better. It has been shown repeatedly that last-minute improvements to stave off deletion usually don't turn into long-term interest in
1529:
The result is that v few editors maintain portals. So most of them rot, as this one has. That's why TTH began his automation spree: he could see that manually-maintained portals usually don't work, because there are not enough manual-maintainers. However, his automation method produced portals
1259:
saying "Fixed" and "Portal Redone", but also saying "sub page cleanup now in progress slowly". The portal isn't fixed until the subpages are cleaned up. The one subpage that was reported to have a rot error may have been fixed, but the way that the portal advocates and would-be maintainers are
1450:
No aspersions, Moxy, just recurrent real problems which are very relevant to others deciding whether to keep the portal. I have asked you and others many times to distinguish between a driveby lick of paint and long-term maintenance, and your reply confirms that my concerns are well-founded.
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anything which doesn't conform to Moxy's discursive habit of hostile one-lines, and now c) demanding that those who disagree with Moxy and his dwindling set of portal fans should get lost so that discussions can continue to be dominated by Moxy and the same crew of portal fans whose chronic
1776:
Portals have been around for over 14 years. For the last ten years of that, most of them rotted, often abysmally. The "Featured portals" was essentially a fake, because its reviews consisted almost entirely of cheering; no checklist was applied, and no assessment was made of the choice of
943:
it. I was not referring to one-off fixes to issues identified by an MFD nominator. Maintenance is an ongoing, pro-active process; what Moxy has done is to make an emergency repair, which is a whole different ballgame to maintenance, and which does nothing to solve the long-term problem.
2113:-style flurry of activity to to try prevent deletion, but there is no maintenance plan, and no set of editors committed to maintaining it. If the MFD is closed as "keep", the portal will simply revert to the process of decay which led to this MFD happening in the first place. --
1930:
failed portals happened only because most editors who saw the folly just walked away rather stay to argue with the fan club, just as the same portal fans' cheering of TTH's spamfest drove out those who saw the folly of the spam. That isn't going to happen again; the
1922:
is a core policy of
Knowledge. Consensus is not achieved by Moxy's desire to throw personal insults at, and demand the silencing of, editors who disagree with your dogged determination to learn nothing from the last decade of failure when portals were managed your
1086:
Portals are nor articles, and they are not content. If a portal is deleted, precisely zero content is lost. Portals are a navigational tool plus showcase, and an abandoned portal doesn't fill those functions; on the contrary, as we have seen here, it actively
2070:, personally not a fan of Portals in general, however Canada does at least seem like an appropriate topic for a Portal. There are a good amount of Featured or Good articles (albeit added after this MfD) to keep the Portal populated with decent content.
1255:. I don't see anything said by NA1k that I could consider to be a "finding". It was the lack of findings that made me originally say Weak Keep. Metrics, counts, and observations are findings; I see no observations by NA1k, only statements. Now I see
1013:
that others point out the complete lack of even a hint of a maintenance plan, that's their own choice. They can either produce a maintenance plan, or leave the community to decide whether the portal is viable without one. If that chice causes them
1090:
I entirely agree that we don't have or need Wiki-police. What we do have is community discussions to make decisions, and right here the community id discussing whether this portal is likely to be maintained to a level where it adds value for
2002:
Here are three portals that were kept at MfD in the past partially on the grounds that maintenance had suddenly appeared, and it was claimed it would continue, and yet they were neglected again and found themselves nominated a second time:
1780:
When the community decided not to delete all portals en masse, the portals project responded by unleashing a tsunami of portalspam. When the community called a halt to that, the portals project howled in rage at the deletion of the
1475:
Comment again does not help in anyway.....what do you want from us editors? Want me to tell you I will look at the page every
Wednesday and email you an update? Most of us work and will do what we can when we
839:
until I saw that. I don't see a "great portal". I think that the argument for tagging the portal is nonsense, because experience has shown that the tagging of portals renders them nearly invisible due to a
1279:
you want from the volunteers here ???.... good faith edits being dismissed again.... simply deplorable. Looks lIke sub page cleanup well on its way... thank you to the volunteers with deletion powers!--
1784:
When editors who weren't part of the portals project began analysing and MFDing the older portals, the portals project howled in rage again, furious that junk they hadn't even assessed was being removed.
235:
template and providing the reasons in the nomination for how the portal can be improved on the portal's talk page is superior to a TNT deletion, which equates to throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
1493:
Any portal needs to be maintained on a continual basis. This one has not been maintained on a continual basis, and I see no reason to believe that in future it will be maintained on a continual basis.
1408:-style activity to try to stave off deletion until another day. This is all completely unpersuasive; there is zero reason to believe that this is start of any long-term commitment to maintenance. --
2159:
1502:
However, the community does need to assess whether the maintenance effort is enough to sustain the portal. And in this case, the evidence of the last decade is that it is nowhere near enough.
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and their respective subpages have since been deleted (by an uninvolved admin), with a deletion rationale of "Portal now using one page method". As such, the subpages require no updating.
1505:
The problem is that you and NA1K choose to hear a different question. When I ask "is this portal being well-maintained", you hear "Am I doing all I can?" ... which isn't the issue.
1006:
If any editors want to start spelling out what sort of ongoing commitment they are willing to make, then we can assess that commitment, and see whether it's plausible and sufficient.
1055:. Try to be productive in your discussions ( suggestions on improvements)....don't block progress for what you think might happen in the future. We don't have or need Wiki-police.--
141:
etc., rather than to attempt fixing hundreds of subpages. Alternatively, interested editors could do it now and the subpages could be transformed in redirects to their parent page.
281:- The advocates of portals have repeatedly argued for tagging of portals in need of repairs, in spite of repeated evidence that tagging of portals has no effect and does not work.
1540:
their fault that instead of accepting the consequences of that reality, they yet again ask the community to keep a portal which lacks the human resources to sustain it. --
1508:
You may be doing superhuman work, and making huge sacrifices to achieve it ... but that's not what the community needs to assess. It needs to assess results, not inputs.
1348:– More FA-class articles that were not present on the (now deleted) portal's Selected biography subpage have since been added to the portal's Selected biography section (
1533:
If we had say a dozen enthusiastic editors working collaboratively on the portal, then obviously it would be maintained, and it wouldn't rot. But we don't have that.
1095:
maintained by multiple editors who pro-actively look check for problems. That takes a lot of work, and if the work isn't being done, then the portal isn't viable. --
1083:
give some such credible assurances or can point to a pattern of active maintenance, then the only reasonable assumption is that this portal will continue to rot.
1841:
In any case, here we have Moxy complaining about lack of progress on portal guidelines, in a discussion where Moxy is passionately opposed to deleting opposed
2036:: Pageviews are well above average, but are still low in comparison to the parent article, among other problems already pointed out by the "delete" !voters.
1072:
This portal has been severely neglected for years. Common sense is that unless something changes radically, it will remain severely neglected in the future.
2008:
222:
page, to update the portal using transclusions of article titles from the subpages to present up-to-date information, directly on the portal's main page.
138:
1524:
few editors are sufficiently interested in portals to want to put the time into a) learning their structure, and b) using that skill to maintain them
207:
Contrary to the nomination, the page has not been "basically abandoned since". For example, a new
Selected cuisine section was added on 9 June 2019 (
1003:. That's the core of the problem: the portal has rotted for years, and even now that it is at MFD, nobody has committed to its ongoing maintenance.
1582:
Best for those editors to stop defending a portal which nobody wants to maintain, and to move onto something productive rather than parading their
2004:
1888:
favor of deletion as this has proven detrimental to any moment forward on anything related to portal improvements, guideline improvements. etc.
1144:
remove the backlinks? I have an AWB setup which allows me to easily replace them with links to the next most specific portal(s) (in this case
238:
I disagree with the notion that the portal "looks like a mess", and no qualification at all was provided in the 2012 comment that stated this.
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Its very clear to all why portal guidelines have not moved forward....walls of text like above that help in no way with the topic at hand .--
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And your pov on others and there intent is relevant to whom. Just more aspirations flying around that we have asked you many times to stop.-
98:
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scurrying around talking big while admitting that the job isn't finished gives me no confidence that they will ever finish the job.
2163:
1564:
It's clear to anyone here that there is people that care about it....thus way it was revamped. Best move on do something productive.--
1855:
Moxy's contributions to this MFD might have some trace of value if Moxy could make up their mind what on earth they actually want. --
94:
17:
137:: it's easier to recreate it in the future with some single-page or semi-automated method fetching from the extensive selection of
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Portal created in 2005, average age of its edits is 2010. Basically abandoned since. 2124 edits by 202 users, but already in 2012
1208:
is the only needed sub page now for content. (sub page cleanup now in progress slowly waiting on deletors)...just need to change
970:
You have no clue what my or anyones intent is and it causes great distress too many editors that this is your approach. Pls give
882:. Theoretically this is a broad, topic, but in practice nobody as been bothered to maintain the forest of abandoned subpages. --
1759:
100 and 10% right.....no data either way as the retooling has just started when the community runaround started months ago.--
86:
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one, but so far you haven't given anyone any reason to believe that it won't just continue to rot like all the others. --
2188:
1307:
123:
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mismanagement of portalspace for a decade has led it to the mess which the community has spent 8 months cleaning up.
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1075:
Sure, neither you anyone else have any obligation to give any assurances on what you plan to do in the future; see
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and all
Canadian provincial portals, showing that nearly all of the provincial portals have already been deleted.
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1200:- As per above the portal has been redone to basically one page tracluding pages of FA and GA articles from
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There is zero data that newly revamp portals are not being maintained (bad faith guess work at its worst).--
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Originated 2005. Originator inactive since 2013. Four articles and three biographies, no updates since 2014.
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Great portal with some minor errors...would be an easy fix for anyone with a keyboard ( Nielsen entry fixed).
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which added no value, so the community rejected it, and we are back to the high-maintenance manual portals.
1247:- The portal advocates are starting very slowly to make the deletion case that the nominator hasn't made.
1069:
Moxy, I have been pleading with portal fans for months to apply some common sense, but with little success.
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29:
The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the miscellaneous page below.
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Moxy, you clearly still don't understand my point, so let me try to spell it out in more detail.
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It's not Moxy's fault or NA1K's fault that this portal lacks that dozen maintainers. But it
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Moxy's idea of "how to help" consists of a) pure personal abuse, calling reasoned response
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that comment contains absolutely nothing other than a personal attack. Please strike it. --
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Originator inactive since 2009. Little maintenance since 2007. No maintenance since 2017.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's
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2010:
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I see that the usual crew of fire-hose carriers are engaging in their customary flurry of
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the page's
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you think can be done over chastising editors in their attempts at resolving problems.--
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The fact is that en.wp portals are constructed in a very complex may which resembles a
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per BHG, with thanks that she's gone out of her way to clear out unmaintained stuff. —
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This is more of the next-time-we'll-do-it-right argument, but it has no basis in fact.
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The following table shows the pageview counts for Jun19-Jul19 and article counts for
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81:
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1672:– The portal has been further expanded with the addition of more FA-class articles (
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never-mind-the-quality-feel-the-width crew of portal need to drop their decade-old
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Yup walls of text that do zero to help. Should have quoted what I said in the RFC
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Again and again and again and again.....just pointless unhelpful crap talk.--
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52:. There is a clear consensus that this portal should be kept at this time.
1499:, so nobody is obliged to do anything to the portal, or to any other page.
1327:
and it's subpages. Anyother concerns.... should we transclude FA images?--
1176:
doesn't need to be super maintained/kept current to function, either.
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Has multi-level sub-portal structure that has not been fully assessed.
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Extensive content, which however has decayed beyond possible repair.
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There is zero data that newly vamped portals are being maintained.
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Originator inactive since 2011. Very little maintenance since 2010.
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few editors understand the structures well enough to maintain them
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Rather than deleting in entirety, it is better and congruent with
918:....much harder to start from scratch in a situation like this.--
2200:
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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has died in 2010 but the corresponding entry was not updated.
1788:
RFC on the direction being taken by these proposed new tools?
2097:
a decent quantity of available high-quality is content is a
1136:. I don't want in any way to prejudge the outcome ... but
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Only 6 articles, some tweaked since 2010, some not tweaked.
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Originator inactive since 2007. No maintenance since 2010.
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conditions: active maintenance. It has had from the usual
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condition for the existence of a portal. But it is not a
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on what more needs to be done. What we are looking for is
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The overal topic of Canada is clearly a broad subject area
1838:, my 210 words above is not in any sense a "wall of text"
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This is all just deflection from the fact of neglect. --
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Originator inactive since 2009. Last maintenance 2012.
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Yet only two weeks ago, we had Moxy insisting that "
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you close this discussion as delete, please can you
2105:condition, and this portal fails one of the other
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Daily average of 124 page views in the last 30 days
796:Last maintenance 2010. 3 articles, 3 biographies.
1965:Thank you for the example......very productive.--
1228:all over for mobile viewers to increase views. --
126:were content-forked in 2007 and abandoned since:
43:). No further edits should be made to this page.
2212:). No further edits should be made to this page.
694:Only seven articles. Last maintenance was 2018.
186:as per the points below, relative to the failed
844:field. But the nominator hasn't made a case.
8:
1579:rot win't resume as soon as the MFD closes.
307:
2158:Keep as per revamp by multiple editors.--
1850:Pls note I am for deletion of all portals
1148:), without creating duplicate entries. --
1009:But if some editors choose to experience
197:The page receives adequate views, with a
139:Category:FA-Class Canada-related articles
1926:The creation of a vast walled garden of
1518:a lot of work is needed to maintain them
1204:in selected bios and selected articles.
1001:have no clue what or anyone's intent is
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1251:said to Keep based on the findings of
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832:unless I see a good case for deletion.
117:it was noted that "looks like a mess"
7:
941:nobody as been bothered to maintain
48:The result of the discussion was:
24:
1018:, then they should examine their
163:21:21, 4 October 2019 (UTC) ....
18:Knowledge:Miscellany for deletion
1308:Portal:Canada/Selected biography
910:
861:per North America's findings. -
456:Originator inactive since 2016.
119:and it has not since improved.
1676:) and more GA-class articles (
1304:Portal:Canada/Selected article
659:Originator edits sporadically.
423:Originator edits sporadically.
1:
1325:Portal:Canada/Selected symbol
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225:Tagging the portal with the
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133:This seems a good case for
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1206:Portal:Canada/Did You Know
999:it's entirely true that I
625:No maintenance since 2010.
1379:great to see some help.--
976:any positive contribution
583:Newfoundland and Labrador
256:as per comments above by
2202:Please do not modify it.
1935:about portals and learn
218:, part of the Knowledge
32:Please do not modify it.
842:Someone Else's Problem
2034:Extremely weak delete
1928:Rube Goldberg machine
1904:Wow, Moxy. Just wow.
1513:Rube Goldberg machine
1253:User:Northamerica1000
1202:Portal:Canada/Indices
1134:Note to closing admin
1146:Portal:North America
939:I specifically said
787:Prince Edward Island
167:see section below.--
124:Selected biographies
1911:, b) denouncing as
1515:. That means that
1249:User:Knowledgekid87
753:Northwest Territory
190:non-guideline page:
317:Article Page Views
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2013:-Crossroads-
2012:
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1920:WP:CONSENSUS
1913:wall of text
1884:
1711:-Crossroads-
1710:
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1584:WP:OWNership
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1081:some editors
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1020:WP:OWNership
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650:Saskatchewan
278:
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2144:Joeyconnick
799:Jun19-Jul19
765:Jun19-Jul19
731:Jun19-Jul19
697:Jun19-Jul19
662:Jun19-Jul19
628:Jun19-Jul19
594:Jun19-Jul19
561:Jun19-Jul19
527:Jun19-Jul19
515:Nova Scotia
493:Jun19-Jul19
459:Jun19-Jul19
426:Jun19-Jul19
392:Jun19-Jul19
357:Jun19-Jul19
2119:HairedGirl
2103:sufficient
1945:HairedGirl
1933:groupthink
1883:namespace
1861:HairedGirl
1797:HairedGirl
1643:HairedGirl
1592:HairedGirl
1586:issues. --
1546:HairedGirl
1457:HairedGirl
1414:HairedGirl
1371:Thank you
1323:Same with
1154:HairedGirl
1101:HairedGirl
1032:HairedGirl
950:HairedGirl
888:HairedGirl
2206:talk page
2107:necessary
2099:necessary
2051:Week keep
1909:crap talk
1257:User:Moxy
1087:misleads.
1053:WP:HANDLE
830:Weak Keep
165:ALL FIXED
37:talk page
2208:or in a
2128:contribs
2055:Alaney2k
1954:contribs
1870:contribs
1806:contribs
1652:contribs
1601:contribs
1555:contribs
1466:contribs
1423:contribs
1163:contribs
1110:contribs
1091:readers.
1041:contribs
959:contribs
897:contribs
549:Manitoba
341:Deleted
329:Articles
323:Baseline
320:Comments
39:or in a
1777:topics.
1670:Comment
1402:Comment
1346:Comment
1245:Neutral
1178:Kingsif
1022:issues.
616:Nunavut
414:Alberta
380:Ontario
372:Country
326:Percent
279:Comment
95:history
2140:Delete
2124:(talk)
2111:WP:ARS
2093:Blaixx
2038:ToThAc
1950:(talk)
1866:(talk)
1802:(talk)
1704:Delete
1648:(talk)
1597:(talk)
1551:(talk)
1476:can.--
1462:(talk)
1419:(talk)
1406:WP:ARS
1213:portal
1159:(talk)
1106:(talk)
1037:(talk)
955:(talk)
893:(talk)
880:WP:TNT
876:Delete
823:Canada
810:Canada
776:Canada
742:Canada
708:Canada
674:Canada
639:Canada
605:Canada
572:Canada
538:Canada
504:Canada
470:Canada
447:Quebec
436:Canada
409:FALSE
403:Canada
375:FALSE
346:Canada
266:Sm8900
230:Update
216:WP:ATD
188:WP:POG
135:WP:TNT
57:bd2412
2180:Kusma
2117:Brown
1943:Brown
1859:Brown
1795:Brown
1781:spam.
1641:Brown
1590:Brown
1544:Brown
1455:Brown
1412:Brown
1152:Brown
1099:Brown
1030:Brown
948:Brown
916:Fixed
886:Brown
816:TRUE
813:State
802:0.51%
782:TRUE
779:State
768:0.78%
748:TRUE
745:State
734:0.68%
719:Yukon
714:TRUE
711:State
700:0.59%
680:TRUE
677:State
665:0.57%
645:TRUE
642:State
631:0.56%
611:TRUE
608:State
597:0.58%
578:TRUE
575:State
564:0.61%
544:TRUE
541:State
530:0.53%
510:TRUE
507:State
496:0.47%
476:TRUE
473:State
462:0.48%
442:TRUE
439:State
429:0.73%
406:State
395:0.53%
360:0.34%
352:18958
332:Notes
311:Title
254:Keep.
103:watch
99:links
16:<
2175:Keep
2164:talk
2148:talk
2068:Keep
2059:talk
2042:talk
2019:talk
1998:Moxy
1968:Moxy
1939:. --
1923:way.
1893:Moxy
1834:Moxy
1820:Moxy
1762:Moxy
1749:talk
1732:Moxy
1717:talk
1690:diff
1686:diff
1682:diff
1678:diff
1674:diff
1633:Moxy
1619:Moxy
1567:Moxy
1479:Moxy
1439:Moxy
1382:Moxy
1350:diff
1330:Moxy
1300:Note
1282:Moxy
1266:talk
1231:Moxy
1198:Keep
1182:talk
1173:Keep
1058:Moxy
995:Moxy
981:Moxy
935:Moxy
921:Moxy
878:per
867:talk
859:Keep
850:talk
837:Keep
793:1768
759:1157
725:1467
691:1704
656:1946
622:1952
589:1893
555:1792
521:2630
487:3222
453:3561
420:2344
386:3569
338:Type
294:talk
270:talk
209:diff
184:Keep
170:Moxy
157:Moxy
143:Nemo
107:logs
91:talk
87:edit
50:keep
2126:• (
2082:IXX
1952:• (
1890:.--
1868:• (
1804:• (
1692:).
1650:• (
1599:• (
1553:• (
1464:• (
1421:• (
1352:).
1218:to
1161:• (
1142:not
1108:• (
1039:• (
957:• (
895:• (
2191:)
2166:)
2150:)
2061:)
2044:)
2021:)
1972:🍁
1897:🍁
1824:🍁
1766:🍁
1751:)
1736:🍁
1719:)
1688:,
1684:,
1680:,
1623:🍁
1571:🍁
1538:is
1483:🍁
1451:--
1443:🍁
1386:🍁
1334:🍁
1306:,
1302:–
1286:🍁
1268:)
1235:🍁
1226:}}
1220:{{
1216:}}
1210:{{
1184:)
1138:if
1062:🍁
985:🍁
944:--
925:🍁
869:)
852:)
771:10
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