439:
Best 11," it's not pov. This template is not a pov issue, its a unsourced issue. Sourced material isn't considered pov if it only shows one side, as I've shown with my Pele analogy. If we remove the "Rangers Best XI" and MLS All Time Best XL because they're strictly the pov of the voters or what have you, then EVERY pov quote in the entire project needs to be removed, like the ones saying that Pele is the greatest player of all time, or that Steven
Gerrard is one of the best midfielders in the world...those are also strictly the pov of one person. If the sources for the Rangers Best XI can be found somewhere then the issue then becomes a discussion on whether or not a template should be used for that information and whether or not it is useful to editors and visitors to the site. POV isn't an issue at all here.
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258:
all the football player pages...like Steven
Gerrards say that he is "considered one of the best midfielders in the world." The source is Pele, is that not also POV and should that not also be deleted? Its the exact same thing. If Pele can say that Steven Gerrard is one of the best midfielders in the world and it stays, then why can't Rangers say who their best 11 players are?
381:
to be weighted towards the most recent players- for another thing, especially if the poll is an online poll, the things are hardly conducted in the best way, and generally feature some people voting hundreds of times. Any such list would firstly have to say exactly where it was derived and how- and secondly, I'm not really sure it
449:
deleted. Issues of page clutter, relevance, and usability (not to mention that this is not a current team) are all central parts of the WikiProject discussion for deletion of templates just like this. I am willing to create the category and/or add this information to every single players page if it is not currently available. --
429:
template such as this is meant as a navigational tool, but it becomes clutter when the information is no longer relevant and is mixed with several other templates (as is the case on many of the players on the team). Secondly, no source has been found yet. Even the
Rangers article does not have a source for this information. --
243:. The real question is, whose greatest team? Surely there many possible 'greatest teams'- one person declaring his a means for navigation around wikipedia certainly doesn't seem right. Even if it is an 'official' list from Rangers (and there's no indication of that), it still has POV written all over it.
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right that we simply accept such polls as a means for organising an encyclopedia (which is inherantly what templates set out to do, in that they prevent a means of navigating from one player to another). So it's one thing to say what the results were; it's quite another to present them as a template.
438:
But you see its NOT a pov issue. It's an issue about two things 1) sourcing material 2) relevance. POV isn't an issue. If Sports
Illustrated put out a listing of what they call their best 11 players in the history of soccer, and they were all women, and wikipedia posted it as "Sports Illustrated
380:
I've seen those kind of things lots of times, and while they're interesting lists, I really don't think they can simply be taken as creating a NPOV list of 'best ever players'- for one thing, people have short memories, and also limited access to television pictures and so results are always likely
257:
if this is the "Greatest Team Ever" put out by the football club. If not, then delete. POV doesn't apply when it is sourced material guys, if this was some obscure wikipedia editor saying that it was the greatest team ever, then THAT would be POV. If this counts as POV, then how about how nearly
448:
You are correct about the POV "issue", but this is not the only problem with the template. The two issues your list are still valid issues for this template's deletion. Just because I labeled this as a POV issue doesn't mean we should ignore the second part of my reason for wanting this to be
428:
I do not think the MLS All Time Best XI or even the MLS Best XI for a single year should be a template. If you want something beyond an article about the team then it should be a category. This is not only a POV, but also an issue of whether or not non-current team templates should be kept. A
288:
Then a source should be found. If the source turns out to be
Rangers F.C. then it is their right as the club to designate who their best squad ever is. In which case, my vote would remain a Keep. However, if the source is some guy at a newsmagazine, then my vote is delete. An online poll
418:
page about him being the best player of all time....isn't that POV as well. If this
Rangers stuff can be sourced, then POV isn't an argument anymore. Sourced statements CAN be POV on wikipedia, as long as the article is not inherently POV.
413:
If this is indeed the "Greatest Team Ever" as released by the club then "hopelessly POV" isn't a valid argument. Would you also then say that no mention should be made about the MLS All Time Best XI? Or that we should remove stuff on the
856:), and an extremely useful one at that - please, do let us keep this template - it will be discussed, formatted, and editted so all project members are happy with it before integration is attempted. --
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485:- Pointless. There is no need for it. As much a fan I am of football squad templates, I see 'Greatest Squad' templates as being very pointless. --
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British
Royalty articles - including those not about monarchs. Implementation into said articles has merely not been embarked upon as yet. --
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Then find, on the official
Rangers webpage, the results of the poll, and there you have the source. Then, its no longer a POV problem.
17:
835:. We can intergrate the functionality of British Royalty into Monarch if there is anything special, similar how the functionality of
471:- not because of POV, it seems it is not POV. But I just don't see any use of it. Just put the info into all players' articles. --
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The greatest ever team was voted for in an official poll by the club in 1999, with thousands of fans taking part.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a
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The use of this template would bring an aesthetically pleasing sense of uniformity across the WikiProject (
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below.
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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below.
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conducted by the team is also good enough for me, so in that case I would vote keep as well.
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But if there is no source, if we did it your way we would just assume we hadn't found it.
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if it fits into the article perfectly well put it in the article. Not as a template.
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has decided to remove any squad template for teams that are no longer current.
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And that's without even getting onto the templates as clutter arguments...
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is that only infoboxes for current football squads should be used in WP.
358:, otherwise it is completely unclear where such a list is coming from.
635:). It also ties in with the naming scheme for all college userboxes.
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in favour of new template. Anyway any fule kno that OU is Oxford.
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The template designed for
British Royalty is intended for use on
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate.
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A better template, with more features, has been created (
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882:Necessary and potentially very useful.
18:Knowledge (XXG):Templates for deletion
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205:consensus on WikiProject football
203:. Inherently POV templatecruft -
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757:Template:Infobox British Royalty
706:Template:Infobox British Royalty
267:Its not sourced though, is it.
729:The result of the debate was
564:The result of the debate was
112:Template:Rangers F.C. greatest
84:The result of the debate was
61:Template:Rangers F.C. greatest
1:
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837:Template:Infobox Arcade Game
354:It would need to be sourced
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684:(from Odense University).
909:Please do not modify it.
792:Template:Infobox Monarch
717:Please do not modify it.
691:Please do not modify it.
552:Please do not modify it.
526:Please do not modify it.
72:Please do not modify it.
671:(who went to Otago U.)
356:on the template itself
839:was assimilated into
746:(The people rejoice!)
581:(The people rejoice!)
101:(The people rejoice!)
841:Template:Infobox VG
630:User NCAA-Oklahoma
400:- hopelessly POV.
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566:deletion.
86:deletion.
55:August 10
43:August 11
658:Grutness
38:August 9
20: |
888:ÉIREANN
854:WP:BRoy
770:history
731:to keep
638:NMajdan
605:history
517:17/8/06
451:Rballou
431:Rballou
378:Comment
305:Comment
175:Comment
154:Rballou
125:history
833:delete
742:rbil10
675:Delete
654:Delete
577:rbil10
511:stalk
469:Delete
398:Delete
241:Delete
217:Delete
209:Qwghlm
201:Delete
150:WP:WPF
148:, and
97:rbil10
778:watch
774:links
734:ЯyanG
613:watch
609:links
569:ЯyanG
327:Philc
270:Philc
222:Philc
180:Philc
133:watch
129:links
89:ЯyanG
46:: -->
16:<
886:Fear
880:Keep
782:logs
766:talk
762:edit
664:wha?
644:talk
617:logs
601:talk
597:edit
500:yap
473:Monk
416:Pele
255:Keep
163:Keep
146:NPOV
137:logs
121:talk
117:edit
35:<
806:all
660:...
22:Log
843:.
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627:{{
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595:(
573:e
337:C
332:T
280:C
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185:T
139:)
115:(
93:e
Text is available under the Creative Commons Attribution-ShareAlike License. Additional terms may apply.