Knowledge talk:Article wizard/Archive 5

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not to all. Have you considered bringing the first bullet point to the last position right before the three buttons, and also adding a sentence after that bullet point to give context about the buttons? For example, something like: "Although writing about subjects that you are close to is generally discouraged, there may be reasons that you may want to still write about those subjects. Please click on each of the following options to learn how you should handle each case." (This suggestion is by no means perfect. I'm just putting it here so you know my general line of thought. For example, it's too long, it also gives a feeling that I will be doing something wrong if I write about something close to me which in some cultures may result in people not publicly accepting it.)

520:. Your choice will be the first one of the two options. Enter the title of your article and keep following the instructions. Write or paste your page into the template, and keep following the instructions until you are ready to submit it for review. When you have submitted it for review, keep checking back for reviewers' comments - new articles are rarely ready for immediate publication. We are sorry if you don't have a lot of time, but this is an encyclopedia and it may well not be as easy to edit as a social media site - no new article is urgent. There is a button on the Wizard page that links you to our online help chat if you get stuck. 621:. Certain aspects such as the disclose COI mechanism now have preloaded links. I have rejiged the main start page with elements from the mainpage, made the buttons consistant etc. The article request has been directed to a feed (comments on this idea are appreciated). And several extra steps have been put in. The idea is that new users will receive less information, but it will be more targeted. (eg a student would be told about relevant policies for young people. A Professor would be told how our references are not quite the same as used in academia. You will note there is an option for experts, this will focus on 110:

step of the wizard. Second, a lot of the new text was about what kinds of articles not to create on Knowledge, which is covered in the subsequent steps of the wizard and thus redundant. Finally, while I appreciate the idea of adding some helpful video content, the two videos that were added were not relavent to article creation and thus I think would only be frustrating for someone hoping to learn how to create new articles on Knowledge (which is the purpose of the wizard). Let's discuss potential changes to the wizard here before enacting them.

1360:'s concerns that the current layout could be read as emphasizing that declared paid editing is less controversial than it currently is on en.Wiki. Whether or not it is within policy doesn't change the fact that there is a very strong and vocal contingent on this Knowledge that are opposed to it in all circumstances. Taking their concerns into account in one of the first pages people see is important, just as giving people correct information about the TOU and our local policies is. 129:, with buttons that size it's hardly surprizing. The button sections are a total mess anyway. What those pages should have is much smaller buttons with a much shorter legend and a text description next to them, or even radio buttons. The changes I made were as much as I dared without causing a furor or finding and changing the CSS. Preferably I would have liked to change the pages anyway to comply with age old rules of graphic design while combining today's best web practices. 3396: 3361: 31: 1165:. We already have admins, New Page Reviewers, Autopatrolled, and OTRS agents advertising their services. I resent spendig 1,000s of hours of my volunteer time giving them a platform to make fast big bucks. (or even slow ones). There are already RfCs on Meta discussing the introduction of more curbs. We should not rush into things, and while keeping the ideas flowing, allow time to see the impact that ACTRIAL is having. 3239: 3217: 1749:. You are being narrow focused here, paid editing includes various types of paid editor, these changes are not supposed to affect the experts that are paid per article. These changes are to inform the nice man in Mohammed Theriewshheias public relations team that they have to disclose, and that really they shouldn’t be making an article, could they kindly ask someone else? I have spent some time on IRC, and 551:(currently only the "A client" path is hooked up). I feel like this simplifies the onslaught of links the current wizard seems to have, and I also think it's gives a more frictionless path to disclosure. Also, it seems the current wizard "technically" has the user admit they have good references and all that, but it reads like a series of questions with very obvious answers. Paired on the back of 3817: 3668: 292: 210: 1913:

like the Drewmutt version better because it keeps it simple and doesn't rely on too much text, which is one of the biggest flaws of the current Wizard. When I go to ARTWIZ3 I'm likely to close the tab and not read because there is too much text. When I go to the refactor proposal, I know what button to press to do what, which is more intuitive for me even as an experienced user.

3877: 2799: 544:, I felt the article wizard could use some simplification. I propose this for a few reasons, most of which are the perennial gripes about the outcome of the wizard. As I feel many would agree, the AfC backlog is riddled with troublesome submissions. Paid editing without disclosure, COI without disclosure, poor referencing (if any), etc. I created 3726: 2573: 2217: 341: 2164: 2428: 1987: 1088:, The wording and layout should not appear as if we condone it (which we don't), or that we actively encourage it, which is how this wording and placement will be interpreted. While am heartily in favour of streamlining the Wizard, far reaching changes like this need to be very carefully studied and perhaps by people with 1754:

happy to follow the rules, but right now we are failing to explain the rules to them well enough. New editors create the vast majority of all articles (about 85% i think), and as much as we could perhaps only allow extended confirmed users to make articles or drafts, we need to at least try to make use of their input.

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I dumped your template at the end, it's not that I didn't like it, I just want to include "Live help" in some other way I have yet to think about, also I'm not a huge fan of "starting over" buttons (I hope no user would use that, actually). Paid bad? Start over! Anywho the content is bleh, go nuts on

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I have made alterations to the code which allow the wizard to function better on mobile devices. It also works on smaller screens in desktop mode much better. the previous design sometimes broke at tablet and phone screen sizes (mostly the button positioning broke). I have also streamlined the design

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I like that general layout. Re: your question above, the less text the better for new users. The goal is to give them a quick and dirty version of Knowledge that teaches the basic principles: discouraging articles that shouldn't be created, while making it user-friendly for those creating articles we

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looks a lot more current and less cluttered than ARTWIZ3, where I honestly can't tell any difference between it and the current wizard when first looking at it. I know it is different, but I wouldn't have known that unless you had told me it was a new version or if I had compared them side-by-side. I

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IRC is not Knowledge, and most of our editors who are the most active in dealing with COI/UPE do not use it. To my knowledge I'm the only person who is a semi-regular at COIN that goes on IRC. It's also likely that new users who go to -help display a selection bias: they're the most likely to want to

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Just as a point on numbers before the break: that statistic is false. New articles by new editors accounted for 47% of creations by non-autopatrolled editors, and 80% of those were deleted. The percentage of total articles created by new editors is likely significantly lower since these numbers don't

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have this concern, too) is that we don't communicate the WMF policy on paid editing very clearly or well. One thing I've noticed while helping in #wikipedia-en-help is that paid editors legitimately don't know they have to disclose, and it get a little tedious on our parts getting them to do so. This

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I much prefer Drewmutt's version. It is simpler: i.e. less clicks. We want people to know the basics of our policies while still making it as easy as possible to create an article in good faith. It is also cleaner and meshes better with the design of the landing page. If there is a way to incorporate

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Numbered list item 1) The linked "here" in the first bullet point takes me to a page with an alert at the top that says "If you want to draft an article, please create a userspace draft instead of creating it here." I'm going to ignore the alert, but would be nice if the instructions said something

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Could you make it somehow obvious that you are supposed to request creation for redirects elsewhere than this? The article wizard that you forced me through made no mention of it at all (it was more concerned in asking me whether I had a conflict of interest!), nor do I see anything on this page. Or

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When you create your draft, it won't be publicly viewable. However, when you finish, you'll be able to submit it to be reviewed by our volunteers. Reviews can take a long time, and are done in somewhat of a random fashion, so please be patient and rest assured that your draft will be reviewed in due

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has been policy for a very long time. IP users have not been able to create in mainspace for aons, and recently a restriction was introduced (on an experimental) basis to limit mainspace creation to confirmed users - those whose account is more than 4 days old and have made more than 10

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to get round any copyright for images. I haven't fought for six long years and spent 1000s of my $ $ to get ACTRIAL launched so that we can advertise paid editing in the Wizard where all the new users now have to go. If users are determined to encourage it, all they need to do is launch a watchlist

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going to be deterred by honesty and ethics, and they won't be affected by the Wizard either. They take their time to study our rules, notability, and MoS scrupulously, They will calmly wait 4 days, rack up 10 insignificant edits and then dump their insidious junk in one edit when they think we least

1555:. They are like the people on the sidewalk who take pennies out of a bind man's begging bowl. We do not allow spam, and most of the paid articles we identify are spam, spam, spam, and spam, and get deleted as spam. Moreover, there probably isn't a paid editor, declared or otherwise, who hasn't got a 1479:

to options of interest to a small percentage of the users - unless the COI and PAID editors are the majority, in which I case I don't know what I'm still doing here. Alternative proposal: remove the COI and PAID options and add a checkbox: "I certify that I have no external relation with the subject

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While I agree that we need to curb paid editing, allegations of its encouragement will not further our work on the simplification of the currently bulky article wizard ,I propose we keep the "A client" link aside for now and focus on the other bits until we have consensus on its exact wording.On the

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Looking at both of the mockups from the simplification and UI point of veiw I prefer Drewmutt's mockup. It does flow from the current landing page and contains a lot less wordy outlook. That said the help and go back buttons can be incorporated into Drewmutt's design to make it even better. A button

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In fact, I couldn't even figure out how to reach the edit screen. I manually edited the URL in my urlbar to the article title to bring up the 'wizard' which apparently is the only way to the editing screen. In the days of yore I just needed to 'search' for a non-existent article to get a 'red link'

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for the next 6 months on restricting direct creation of articles to autoconfirmed users. This is because data suggest that pages created by users with more experience are more likely to meet our inclusion standards. If you complete a draft before you are autoconfirmed, I would be happy to review it

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to comply but, for example, have issues finding their user page. The article wizard may, at times, be the only time paid editors are informed that they need to disclose the fact that they're paid. We may not be able to be subtle if we want to communicate clearly. Also, not advertising the fact that

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means to encourage paid editing, but rather realizes it's going to happen whether or not we acknowledge. As someone who's helped in #wikipedia-en-help, you can trust me when I say that the most we can do to paid editing is drive it underground; it will never be eliminated entirely. It's much better

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and I would support a change to something like this. It essentially is an interactive flowchart pathway, and in doing so it simplifies the process of getting new editors to where they need to be and giving them the information that is essential to them, without overloading them with excess text and

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Please don't make it look as if I didn't ask for discussion on those changes, I kept the community informed and constantly invited comment. To discuss such changes, you first need to find people who have the time, the energy, and the initiative to discuss them. When someone comes up with an idea,

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The page starts by listing 3 common mistakes as bullet points which is cool. Then, I'm offered three options to choose from. It is not clear "why" I'm asked to click on these options. This is a bit confusing for me as the options are logically related to perhaps one of the bullet points above, but

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I get that it's not technically accurate, but I (and I could be wrong) feel what generally people mean by "public" is that it's on Google and shows up in searches. I can't think of a non-kludgey way of saying "When you create your draft, it will be public, but will show up in Google nor will it be

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I reverted back to the earlier version for a few different reasons. First, the new version was too lengthy and was becoming a wall of text. On my laptop monitor, I was no longer able to see the buttons without scrolling down, which I think would be a deterant to people actually getting to the next

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Hey, sorry if this question is in the wrong pace. I'm longtime editor out of retirement so this wizard is new to me. Is it mandatory for all article creation now or only for user's who don't yet have autopatrol/confirmed status? I love the idea for new users but for someone who already knows what

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Thanks for doing that, although, to be honest, I feel that "back" buttons are bit out of fashion. To paraphrase what Toni said, we have a limited attention span with folks, and best to push the process forward than to give an option to undo something that got them on the path they're on. I get we

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I'd suggest as a compromise that promotes both compliance with the TOU but is also a bit more subtle. Perhaps changing the initial button from "a client" to "Someone I am connected to" or something similar. That way it would cover all COI, and not advertise the fact that some people edit here for

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of the people that need help are Indian actors, Indian PR teams, Indian CEO's etc. (not picking on Indians here, its just a billion people that speak English well enough to want an article, and not well enough to have read all the policy’s.) These people have no clue how Knowledge works, and are

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On the other hand, I agree with you that we need to cover all COI somehow. So maybe "someone I'm connected to" is, in fact, a good idea. In fact, we can tell all COI editors that, from an ethical standpoint, they need to declare their COI on their userpage, or at minimum, on the talk page of the

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offered by Guy into Books - it is a good, clear breakdown. The COI aspect seems to be missing a COI in regards to a person other than yourself, but works. Making sure people know of their obligations under policy is a good first step, especially with the additional statements about how this is

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I will remove the back buttons on some pages and deal with the 'summary' page, ideas on dealing with the 'summary' page could be useful. Also the "Advanced users portal" could use some extra options, it could easily be a one-stop toolbox for people who are still learning, but have reasonable

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is somehow encouraging paid editing, and that he didn't read what you said is quite unhelpful, and distracting, particularly when he is trying his hardest to accommodate your request that we discourage paid editing. We're here to comment on the design of the article wizard, not to get into a

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I understand that there has been a lot of discussions about this page. Please feel free to use this suggestion if you see fit or ignore it. Thanks for pointing me to this page, and I'm looking forward to learn more about the changes you will observe after the redesign you've gone about. :)

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I think a way to take into account the concerns above would be to remove anything COI related from the main splash, and have it at the very end as a question. "Are you connected to the subject or paid?" Then it could take them to a page strongly discouraging directly editing (per

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edits. This went into effect a few days ago and has already drastically reduced the vast amount of totally inappropriate new articles without apparently deterring those who have an honest and reasonable project for a new page and can wait four days and do 10 edits.

555:, I think this proposal also seems to "flow" more seamlessly. Anywho, I'm happy to talk more about my motivations, but feel it's best to get some initial feedback. Thanks in advance! (P.S. Obviously the content is mostly placeholder, I'm more trying to demonstrate the structure) 1546:

who understands my explanations and who also expresses the same concerns. Every single paid edit or article creation is spam. Spam in some form or another. Articles don't have to be written in adspeak or be full of links to commercial sites to be spam. Any person or entity that

868:. I believe (correct me if I'm wrong) that there is consensus among people who review drafts that it's much better to have people create drafts in draftspace rather than their sandbox. It would certainly be ever-so-slightly less work if people are going to submit drafts through 1876:) works slightly better, and is less cluttered. I do not like the 'tabs' in the existing layout, nor do I like the button style, or the insane group of buttons on the second page, it looks rather mid last decade (probably is). The new header template by Drewmutt/me (copy of at 2388:

Perhaps we could scrap the back button entirely, especially as it adds little actual functionality to the layout, regarding the template (Article wizard header 2), well It does not work brilliantly right now, it seems easier to add the code to the page directly at the moment.

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In my experience, people tend to instinctively assume that paid editing is forbidden on Knowledge and are astonished when they learn that it is not. It's a very bad idea to promote their awareness of the community's inability to put a stop to it. It is also a bad

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I see the second point has been fixed, but (regarding the first point) if you're not doing what the warning is warning you about, you can definitely ignore it. Also, a lot of editors have already created their user page, so the warning will not always show up.

3307:. IMO removing these pages was an improvement to the user friendliness of the process. At one point I did moot the idea of explaining the specific notability guidelines based on what article was being created, but that just created really complex tutorials. 1945:. I suppose the next question is how much do we want to say? We have the option of sending new users thorough a full tutorial, or simply linking to other tutorials and hoping they do those first?. NB. I will obviously make alterations to ARTWIZ3, here is a 2519:

Please don't change the targets of any buttons on these pages at the moment, as I still need to fix alot of the code to make it work on mobiles, but feel free to copy them to create alternate layouts. Spare pages (mostly redirects) are available at

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draft. This is being honest; the only COI editors that have to declare from a legal standpoint are the ones being paid, but ethically, we should all declare our conflict of interests, no matter if we're getting income from editing Knowledge or not.

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There is a spelling error in the second sentence under the subsection "Sources are (nearly) everything" of the Notability tab. I request a change of "Most articoles fail because they do..." to "Most articles fail because they do..." Thanks!

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some changes to CommonMistakes page and Drewmutt suggested that I add them here. So here I am. Please note that I'm neither a fluent enwiki editor (which may make me a perfect audience for this wizard;), nor a designer. With that in mind:

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Part of the changes made to the article wizard were to remove the facility for the creation of mainspace articles of any type, this includes redirects. It would be reasonable to assume that all newbies wanting redirects should be sent to

2783:--I think it would be better if we could centralised this into a single wizard in draft space by amalgamating the best of all the three versions and then we can call an Rfa to ask for community feedback and consensus on the new version.-- 2624:

Clickable button is basically a link with mw-ui-buttons css padding where as Clickable button 2 functions like a real button going light when you hover over it and dark when you click it. Also the link is hidden. It works on lua and is

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protection through g13, which last I heard, sandboxes lack. People are also more likely to collaborate outside of userspace than inside of it (I realize that there's little collaboration in draftspace, but I notice there's even less in

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comply. This is not discounting the work that people in -help do, but pointing out that appealing to that experience there is unlikely to move the conversation on-wiki forward because those who have concerns don't have that experience.

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That said, the Article Wizard is currently undergoing a complete overhaul and we would welcome your feedback here based on your experience. You can find links to the proposed changes in the various threads on this talk page.

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Well unless you are new editor you dont need to use this wizard, just make a link to the desired page in your sandbox, then clicking the redlink will create it. For reasons mainly related to ACTRIAL the option to create articles

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Two days to go, I hope you guys are still on the ball with the technical stuff. You still haven't published a time when the lever will be thrown. And if you don't tell us, there won't be any Wizard because it won't be linked to.

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as one of the first things seen could help promote that idea. Having a simpler joint COI page that also covers paid declaration and makes it easier, while making it clear that NOTSPAM is also applicable I think would be good.

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Now that the RFC is complete, I have moved the new/draft version of the Wizard and moved the old version to a /version1 subpage. If there's anything that I've messed up, feel free to either fix it yourself or let me know.

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It should relatively easy to include the main improvements i made (buttons and links) into Drewmutts work-flow, but I for one would like the see that return button feature that TheresNoTime came up with intergrated also.

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Hey gang, thanks to everyone who helped roll this over the mountain. I stayed out of it, but I saw some good discussion on the RfC, and so I summed up some of the issues that people had, but feel free to add more.

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of dirty socks. Look At COIN and SPI just to see what we we are up against. One or two declared paid editors is not going to reduce that massive work load (all done free of charge), so why should we encourage

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Then, before the three clickable boxes, add the sentence: "Thinking about the article you are about to write, please click on the description that best describes your relationship to the article subject."

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notable. I'm open to an argument about it, but I feel the alternative is back to what we had with walls of non-sense. Teaching a new user about notability, at the level we know it, seems a fruitless goal.

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I am going to be busy the next few days, so won't have much time to comment on this too much: as it stands, our TOU do allow declared paid editing. This is not a license to violate local policy, namely

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I like it. Just before ACTRIAL went live, I reedited all the Wizard pages as much as I dared without raising contentious comments. If other people think it could do with more slimming down, go ahead!

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I have fixed the buttons, also the links between pages were broken, so I updated those and you can navigate the wizard now. (some of the pages are unfinished, ie. have missing content and headers).

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That's not the point. Disclosing paid editing was a concession that was made. It was not supposed to be interpreted as a licence to practice or that paid editing should be so blatantly encouraged.

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This is followed by the 'search for an existing article' page. (which will of course use the new tour option by TNT). If the user finds an existing page they are directed to the community portal.

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I read the instructions and my article is ready to post. But, I keep getting forwarded back to the same page I was on. How do I just post the article and go? I have limited time to spend on this.

2078:.Please give feedback .I will be absent during the core puja days(next tuesday to October 2) so if any problem crops during that time I will allow anyone to ceate delete or modify any pages .-- 2747: 458:

Interwiki links are a whole different thing to interwiki redirects, which are blind. I would strongly oppose a redirect to another language Knowledge, even if it is a technical possibility.

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I see what you mean. ARTWIZ3 has all of the content on the existing article wizard page, but better organized, however it is mostly superfluous and does break at a larger screen width than

2809:, please don't move my userpages directly to draftspace! if you want to use what I have done, copy it. Note the headers are generally hardcoded as opposed to drewmutts original templates. 2436:

I have redone the layout of my design, and although the content, headers buttons etc are unfinished, it matches the diagram above quite closely. It is made up of the following subpages:

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The WMF don't care two hoots. They are paid already for their work and again it's the volunteers who provide the content and keep it clean that keeps them in business. They laugh at us.

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Perhaps we could condense the somewhat long and repetative list ("it will probably be deleted", "it will probably be deleted", "it will probably be deleted") into a single bullet point.

3557:. Draftspace is for making articles, not for making redirects, categories, templates, userpages or any of the other things that were previously available in the advanced users section. 3512: 3206: 3273:

I feel mixed about this. I think the current wizard approaches it from a bottom-up approach as opposed to top down. That is, if they follow all the steps correctly, the subject

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yet. This requires a wait of four days for some unclear reason. In a day or two, you should find that article creation works again in the way that you're familiar with.

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may not be a good user experience. Off the back of that, I have modified the inputbox extension to allow the addition of a tour parameter. I propose that we include the

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Numbered list item 2) The third/final bullet point says that I need to click the "Save Changes" button, but I see no such button. I'll try the "Publish page" button.

1512:. I personally don't think we should have too much information on one page, so linking to separate pages for each type of disclosure is still my preferred option. 2521: 516:

I've checked the Wizard and it's working perfectly. If you have followed the Wizard, read the pages carefully, and pressed the right buttons, you will arrive at

3387:. I know there was some concern about this being disparaging. I know there was some tweaks made after concerns were expressed. We still think it needs tweaking? 761:

Once the editor has disclosed, or if there was no disclosure, they are sent onto the notability tutorial and referencing tutorial before then creating a draft.

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dozens of people are ready to chime in and rip it apart, but when the time comes to actually carry out changes that get consensus, suddenly no one is around -

3285:- I edited the draft page on reference and added the smallest possible intro to notability in this . I believe any more than this would clutter up the wizard- 3601: 3558: 3403: 3368: 3367:

newbies seem to understand an article being 'live' as when it shows up on google, but this current wording does suggest it will be private - which it isn't.

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It tells people about referencing before notability - without knowing why they are referencing, what are new users going to gain?(Created a notability page)

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Its basically a tutorial to try and get people to make drafts rather than articles in main-space, if you know what you're doing, you don't need to use it.

3055:, the Wizard is not your only option as a non-autoconfirmed user. You have the option of creating using a sandbox as well or creating a draft directly at 882:

That being said, if the above wasn't an issue at all, I would prefer this over the current article wizard. It's better to have as few clicks as possible.

3483:, so that "Copy and pasting material" comes first, "Overly promotional language" comes second, and "Writing about something you're close to" comes third. 2048:

In veiw of the stalemate that has been reached I myself have taken the initiative to create a rough blueprint of the proposed article wizard shown above

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issues. and so on. Obviously this is more complicated from a design aspect, and may need twice as many subpages as before, so It is not finished yet.

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at all. I and many users are vehemently against users earning money on the back of our volunteer efforts. We should not be encouraging paid editors.

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All the buttons on the COI page are red, this is a red flag, since none of the other buttons are.(Purposefully done to make the editor be truthful)

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at the copy to make it a bit more pointed. At the end of the day, it is a legal thing, so maybe it's worth having WMF take a pass at it as well?

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By the way, it is very much not obvious that I need to click a button ('request review') to get the submission actually going anywhere either.

2488: 1092:. Web design is one thing, writing good instructions while keeping them succinct is another - something we at Knowledge are not very good at. 2750:

does seem to strike a good balance between being firm, and not being overtly off-putting. It is my preferred UI layout so far as well. ---

2837: 2498: 1447:, and get mad when their paid status is (legitimately) brought up as a deletion rational combined with lack of notability and tone. Having 3059:. Once you reach autoconfirmed status, you would be able to move that article to mainspace. The English Knowledge is currently undergoing 2513: 3511:

I haven't been following this all that much so I don't know how much of this is applicable, but someone left some feedback on the wizard

3711: 2972: 2860:, I think it's important we never use language that reinforces ownership concepts. Editors are, in fact, donating their words for free. 2757: 2678: 2650: 2604: 2538: 2508: 2493: 2473: 2400: 2283: 2250: 2006: 1960: 1891: 1765: 1523: 1009: 839: 772: 696: 636: 469: 412: 2503: 2160:

The buttons are encountering problems - this may be a template issue, but they don't look right unless they stack, or are in one line.(

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some people edit for pay won't take away the fact that some people edit for pay; it's going to happen whether or not we talk about it.

3578:. Maybe like simple.wikipedia's article wizard the first option should ask if the person wants to create an article or a redirect. 1703: 998:

The idea is that we can track their edits with greater ease. Which makes it harder for them to blend in and subvert the community.

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The buttons I did are built on a direct fork of Drewmutts design, you should be able to change the header template to build it in.

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I don't know how to create an article need an assist. ... to help in contributing my knowledge related to the subject topic.

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I am not convinced white buttons are a good idea - I think we need more colours, like gray buttons.(No other are available on MW)

2445: 3597: 2990: 2558:--I have looked over your Wizard .I feel you should replace the Clickable button templates with clickable button 2 templates -- 1855:

does. Finally, please let's remember point 1 and not let this bog us down from simplifying the wizard. It really needs a redo.

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whole I still prefer Drewmutt's design due to it's flow and simplicity and look forward to completion of it's other parts. --

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Link to page request system. (the page request system demoed here is a two page flow to add a page to a page request page).

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I am highly supportive of this, after seeing what Drewmutt has done (I saw it beforehand), I have expanded it slightly at

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So just because it's legal (barely), why do you want to actively promote paid editing? Did you read what I posted above?

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paid editors are going to edit, regardless of how much we tell them not to. I'd rather have them disclose it than not.—

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I am an autopatrolled user but it seems I can no longer use the wizard to get a new article direct to the main space?

3083: 3043: 2998: 2930: 1877: 1428: 1323: 1141: 1069: 987: 938: 899: 588: 380: 1827:'s point about UI is very good. The largest issue with the current version is that it makes paid status so prominent. 758:

Each path of disclosure gives instruction and auto-links to allow easy disclosure, and tells the user about policy.

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search results, although you can share the link to someone". Hmm... Maybe "it isn't private only to you" is better?

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Yeah it needs to be there somewhere, because it isn't there is why that person got confused. And categories too.

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That's actually a good idea, it would make the paid issue less obvious. I feel that what I did to the startpage (

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wall of text on my iPhone (desktop version of the site). Bullet points are easier to understand than paragraphs.

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Anywho, thanks in advance for your feedback, and try to keep the comments in thier respective sections, thanks!

726:(first page of this wizard, not 'THE landing page'). this gives basic initial information and has three links. 3593: 3402:

It would be easy enough to parse the time it will take from the AfC backlog notices and display this properly.

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My approach to communication is pragmatic: I first look at statements from the perspective of how they can be

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makes no mention of redirects at all, and this is probably an oversight given that it is a plausible option.

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want to provide a "oh nevermind" option, but I feel the people who really want to exercise this know how to.

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The next page is a simple 3 option conflict of interest test, which sends the user down one of three paths.

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Oh thanks. If I had realized that I would definitely used clickable button 2's, I will switch them over.

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Did you know? You can now earn mega bucks by writing articles to help companies sell their wares. Click

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I'm brand new and trying to navigate the How to Disclose wizard. I'm seeing two issues with this page:

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Forceradical actually seems to have omitted any mention of notability at all, I assume this is an error?

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I'm curious as to how you would word it, or at least how you think the wording encourages paid editing.

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result in running afoul of the community or with tone-related issues, but getting there is improbable.

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WP:ARTWIZ space also. I have tried to remix the best of both worlds .Frequenters of this page such as

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This page is for use of the developers of the Article Wizard only. DO NOT ADD ANY OTHER MESSAGES HERE.

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The person created a redirect in draft space, which is the second time I've seen that in a few days.

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The issue is that currently declared paid editors often treat the declaration as a license to ignore

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Do you have an example inputbox available? I quite get my head round how the tour parameter works.

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of the article" to reflect the fact that the COI editing, while allowed, is not (yet) encouraged.

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I'm fine with that version. Less prominent, but also makes people aware that they must disclose.

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tag in WP:Article wizard/Referencing is causing a lint error.(Notability guide linking portion)

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too. Some of them might use their other Reviewer account to patrol it, and their OTRS account

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in any way from a presence in Knowledge is a spammer. Paid editors are spam brokers. They are

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I appreciate the quick replies. When I attempt to create an article I get redirected to the

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Link to 'advanced user' wizard. (this has some options for making redirects, templates etc.)

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for experienced users may be added to the front page of the design(Like in the current one)

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This is all seriously frustrating for someone just trying to improve Knowledge a tiny bit.

2272:), its currently pointing into the existing wizard, but I will add more pages to it later. 3575: 3554: 3492: 3476:

I think this is a good idea, and here are my suggestions about how we might flesh it out:

3462: 3395: 3360: 3346: 1788: 1728: 1612: 1571: 1472: 2593::-- What exactly is the difference between them? they seem to work in much the same way. 2312:

at my flow taking Toni's input into consideration, so let me know how you feel about it.

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It skips the check for similar articles - Is this wise?(open to debate if needed or not)

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With anything up to $ 2,000 (or more) being offered for an article, paid 'editors' are

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I appreciate that, if I get something put together today I'll definitely let you know.

2710:. Ya feel they address your concerns? Just wanna make sure we keep the momentum going. 1650: 1552: 1420: 1365: 1315: 1133: 1061: 930: 891: 379:

It's been suggested that the dead-end presented by searching for alternative titles on

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to encourage people to admit they're being paid than to not acknowledge the practice.

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links that they are not going to bother reading. I'd suggest continuing work on it. —

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Yes, but I think the problem is that he was not able to find or was not directed to

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Ah, why do I care. I finally racked up enough edits to gain article creation rights.

2993:. The only option to create an article there is the Wizard. Am I missing something? 2925:

they're doing it's fairly burdensome. Can I no longer create articles from scratch?

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instead of the sandbox. I see that this hasn't been done; they all still point to

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I have significantly decluttered the layout (see picture), basically there is the

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I reworded your rewording to make it a little more truthful; COI editing doesn't

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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the

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Awesome, thank you for the explanation, that's exactly what I was wondering.

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The next page gives a sandbox/wizard choice, in case people arn't ready yet.

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is a "new user incompetency" issue, not an issue of good or bad faith. They

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https://en.wikipedia.org/User:Drewmutt/ArticleWizardRefactor-Proposal/Create

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I have been though it pressing all the buttons, everything seems in order.

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and have realized that for these purposes editors fall into three groups,

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I have tweaked the passages slightly could you take a look at them now --

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Change "souces" to "sources" (in "Article wizard/Not quite yet" page at

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Looking into it,I don't seem to encounter any problem on small screens)

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Otherwise the blending is not bad, I think this is getting somewhere.

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No, the wizard is designed to be helpful but it is not mandatory. --

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here]) if he were to get consensus. I'm totally okay with it, now. --

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features such as pre-loaded links into his design, that'd be a plus.

1356:'s attempt to get editors to comply with the TOU. I also appreciate 2427: 1986: 1368:

to weigh in on this as he often has good thoughts on paid editing.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Article_wizard/HowToDiscloseCOI

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it. Feel like we're getting there, let's keep the momentum going!

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Everyone here agrees that the current article wizard is non-ideal.

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I think this would be an issue for the landing page, part of the

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User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/Advanced users portal

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I agree this would be a welcome feature, and I created a rough

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User:A Den Jentyl Ettien Avel Dysklyver/Article Creation Wizard

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I think that version takes into account a lot of the concerns.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Article_wizard/Not_quite_yet

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User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/General notability

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has assured me he'll change the links I was concerned about (

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of how this could be implemented. Positive feedback only :P

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User:Drewmutt/ArticleWizardRefactor-Proposal/CommonMistakes

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is the assumption people want to make an article. However

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Adding a tour to "Search Knowledge for alternative titles"

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We just need a template editor or admin to implement it.-

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User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/Citing sources

1704:"Knowledge Strengthens Rules Against Undisclosed Editing" 1393:

One concern I have (and I know from a discussion on IRC

3449: 1946: 1673:"Toward a New Compendium of Knowledge (longer version)" 1163:'Wow! I can make money out of editing Knowledge? Cool' 1292:

stalemate over something so easily fixable as wording.

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tour. To see what this would look like, you can visit

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User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/Disclosure

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declare, and giving them the template to do so (like

443:? Shouldn't this allow redirects to other languages? 435:

I'm new and I'm a bit confused. What about the #RDIR

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I prefer Kudpung's version because it actually looks

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User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/New draft

1352:, which it is sometimes treated as being. I support 283:

Template-protected edit request on 17 September 2017

201:

Template-protected edit request on 11 September 2017

2438:(which have been deleted, but are in my userspace) 2086:) 06:50, 22 September 2017 (UTC)--(Ping correction) 1082:(corrected ping at 02:28, 20 September 2017 (UTC)) 3808:Template-protected edit request on 23 January 2018 3168:to mainspace via the wizard has been depreciated. 2509:User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/Summary 2494:User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/Confirm 2474:User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/Request 1423:by adding {{U|I dream of horses}} to your message 1318:by adding {{U|I dream of horses}} to your message 1136:by adding {{U|I dream of horses}} to your message 1064:by adding {{U|I dream of horses}} to your message 933:by adding {{U|I dream of horses}} to your message 894:by adding {{U|I dream of horses}} to your message 2504:User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/Inform 2343:I have made the go to start into a go back button 391:. Obviously the tour can be modified to suit -- 3299:I am unsure about this, we have deprecated both 2469:User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard/Check 1787:take into account autopatrolled creations. See 2522:Special:PrefixIndex/Wikipedia:Article wizard 2 1647:"Inside Knowledge – Attack of the PR Industry" 3517: 3016:The reason for this is that you're not quite 2305:thanks for the break, we needed that. I made 1995:I have outlined a new layout, see picture --: 518:Knowledge:Article wizard/Ready for submission 8: 3925:copy directly from another site, as you did 3856:like "(you can ignore the alert at the top)" 2347:I have addressed some of your concerns above 1943:User:Drewmutt/ArticleWizardRefactor-Proposal 1910:User:Drewmutt/ArticleWizardRefactor-Proposal 754:COI editor - conflict of interest disclosure 540:In light of the positive feedback regarding 510:, Please see the header on this talk page: 3253:is a template editor right now I believe). 3249:I drafted when this was being thought of. ( 860:about having the links eventually point to 2446:User:Aguyintobooks/Article Creation Wizard 3828:Knowledge:Article wizard/HowToDiscloseCOI 3301:the page to check for an existing article 1475:design to dedicate the upper half of the 1182:I share your frustration, I took another 3782:Just so long as we were both making the 3764:Hmm, looks like I hit "save" just after 3507:Someone left some feed back on redirects 2127:'s version is not free from issues IMHO. 1880:), is also something I am pleased with. 751:paid editor - disclosure of paid editing 713: 2836:I recommend a change in the wording on 1627: 1161:interpreted. I see this as being read: 3929:. Write everything in your own words. 3330: 3099:is not unclear and the definition of 2849: 2841: 2704:I made some more minor changes to my 1847:) while also informing them that they 1724: 1723:Italic or bold markup not allowed in: 1713: 303:Knowledge:Article wizard/Not quite yet 221:Knowledge:Article wizard/Not quite yet 44:Do not edit the contents of this page. 7: 2838:Knowledge:Article wizard/Referencing 748:No issue - carry on with the wizard 3444:Suggestion for CommonMistakes page 3064:and move it to mainspace for you. 24: 3245:this is a less obvious link than 2805:I concur, what I have done is at 1990:Article wizard improvements graph 736:Link to continue with the wizard. 3875: 3815: 3724: 3666: 3479:Reorder the three bullet points 3394: 3359: 3237: 3215: 2850:"The article you wish to create 2797: 2571: 2215: 2162: 1878:Template:Article wizard 2 header 1283:I'm going to have to agree with 718:possible layout of initial pages 381:Knowledge:Article wizard/Subject 339: 290: 208: 29: 3919:Well, the first thing to do is 3598:Knowledge:New user landing page 488:Problem with Posting an Article 3341:"won't be publically viewable" 3122:01:15, 24 September 2017 (UTC) 3088:21:46, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 3074:21:33, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 3048:14:41, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 3030:14:37, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 3003:14:26, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2985:14:21, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2957:14:19, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2935:14:15, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2770:09:32, 28 September 2017 (UTC) 2743:02:39, 28 September 2017 (UTC) 2729:02:34, 28 September 2017 (UTC) 2691:08:59, 25 September 2017 (UTC) 2663:08:21, 25 September 2017 (UTC) 2635:08:12, 25 September 2017 (UTC) 2617:08:04, 25 September 2017 (UTC) 2568:08:02, 25 September 2017 (UTC) 2551:12:59, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2413:07:50, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2384:07:43, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2357:07:10, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2336:04:55, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2296:00:02, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2263:19:10, 22 September 2017 (UTC) 2233:07:10, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2209:07:10, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2195:07:10, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2181:07:10, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2156:07:10, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2142:07:10, 23 September 2017 (UTC) 2110:14:39, 22 September 2017 (UTC) 2096:06:52, 22 September 2017 (UTC) 2034:16:16, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 2019:15:38, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1973:15:22, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1923:14:55, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1904:14:45, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1865:14:23, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1801:14:23, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1778:12:21, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1617:12:07, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1596:11:34, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1536:11:08, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1490:10:33, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1462:07:00, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1439:06:38, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1378:06:18, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1334:06:14, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1265:06:00, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1248:05:03, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1233:04:20, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1219:04:14, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1205:03:55, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1175:03:39, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1152:03:20, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1102:03:17, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1080:02:15, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1036:01:27, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 1022:21:11, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 994:20:43, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 971:19:20, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 949:03:12, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 910:02:28, 20 September 2017 (UTC) 852:18:44, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 821:17:52, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 801:16:37, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 785:14:34, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 709:11:28, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 673:09:50, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 649:07:35, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 609:02:24, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 595:01:35, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 574:01:03, 19 September 2017 (UTC) 530:13:11, 28 September 2017 (UTC) 502:12:39, 28 September 2017 (UTC) 482:16:00, 25 September 2017 (UTC) 453:14:50, 25 September 2017 (UTC) 425:12:05, 18 September 2017 (UTC) 369:20:22, 17 September 2017 (UTC) 334:19:10, 17 September 2017 (UTC) 277:18:02, 11 September 2017 (UTC) 255:17:38, 11 September 2017 (UTC) 98:Recent changes to Introduction 1: 1702:Elder, Jeff (June 16, 2014). 1510:Paid, affiliated, and neutral 396:10:02, 8 September 2017 (UTC) 191:17:32, 5 September 2017 (UTC) 177:20:55, 4 September 2017 (UTC) 159:20:24, 4 September 2017 (UTC) 120:18:57, 4 September 2017 (UTC) 18:Knowledge talk:Article wizard 3894:17:37, 23 January 2018 (UTC) 3869:17:25, 23 January 2018 (UTC) 3796:09:26, 5 December 2017 (UTC) 3778:09:20, 5 December 2017 (UTC) 3760:08:59, 5 December 2017 (UTC) 3743:08:56, 5 December 2017 (UTC) 3718:08:38, 5 December 2017 (UTC) 3645:17:45, 8 November 2017 (UTC) 3623:16:03, 6 November 2017 (UTC) 3609:16:00, 6 November 2017 (UTC) 3588:15:35, 6 November 2017 (UTC) 3566:15:30, 6 November 2017 (UTC) 3547:13:13, 6 November 2017 (UTC) 3501:21:08, 25 October 2017 (UTC) 3471:08:55, 25 October 2017 (UTC) 3439:00:31, 18 October 2017 (UTC) 3411:10:26, 18 October 2017 (UTC) 3376:10:26, 18 October 2017 (UTC) 3316:11:06, 18 October 2017 (UTC) 3295:06:37, 18 October 2017 (UTC) 3268:A page describing notability 3262:10:17, 18 October 2017 (UTC) 3233:06:25, 18 October 2017 (UTC) 3177:20:48, 17 October 2017 (UTC) 3159:19:37, 17 October 2017 (UTC) 2912:21:31, 14 October 2017 (UTC) 2896:21:09, 14 October 2017 (UTC) 2876:21:03, 14 October 2017 (UTC) 2527:understanding of Knowledge. 1504:have said here, I have made 3842:to reactivate your request. 3830:has been answered. Set the 3689:to reactivate your request. 3677:has been answered. Set the 3324:Draft creation page content 2818:19:44, 3 October 2017 (UTC) 2793:10:08, 3 October 2017 (UTC) 2268:of the initial two pages. ( 1570:expect it and probably get 1090:experience in communication 317:to reactivate your request. 305:has been answered. Set the 235:to reactivate your request. 223:has been answered. Set the 3955: 3939:12:22, 18 April 2018 (UTC) 3914:07:11, 18 April 2018 (UTC) 3305:page to explain notability 1553:unscrupulous and deceitful 1496:I agree with much of what 1419:If you reply here, please 1314:If you reply here, please 1132:If you reply here, please 1060:If you reply here, please 929:If you reply here, please 890:If you reply here, please 2440:updated to show userpages 2060:'s userspace and part of 2052:.The article wizard span 143:can sing a song about it. 3786:single "/" change? :-) 3594:Knowledge:Article wizard 3520:pretty much anywhere... 3095:, The reason stated by 1607:strongly discouraged. - 3635:be used for Templates. 1949:of what it is like now. 1708:The Wall Street Journal 536:Simplification Proposal 3631:, but the draft space 3535: 3385:"can take a long time" 2432: 2431:Diagram showing layout 1991: 1364:pay. I'm going to ask 988:InsertCleverPhraseHere 866:Special:MyPage/sandbox 719: 589:InsertCleverPhraseHere 3900:Masturbation Machines 3192:Adding a link to help 2991:new user landing page 2430: 1989: 717: 42:of past discussions. 3627:Just a minor point, 549:proposed alternative 3701:— comment added by 2465:(proposed shortcut) 2459:(proposed shortcut) 2453:(proposed shortcut) 1683:on October 11, 2006 3768:made the edit! -- 3715: 2433: 1992: 1791:for more details. 1635:User talk:Manc1234 720: 3846: 3845: 3716: 3702: 3693: 3692: 3659:Minor corrections 3093:LargelyRecyclable 3080:LargelyRecyclable 3053:LargelyRecyclable 3040:LargelyRecyclable 3012:LargelyRecyclable 2995:LargelyRecyclable 2943:LargelyRecyclable 2927:LargelyRecyclable 2707:proposed refactor 2076:I dream of horses 1751:a high percentage 1577: 1576:(diffs available) 1542:I am grateful to 1414:I dream of horses 1390:I'm of two minds. 1309:I dream of horses 1275: 1127:I dream of horses 1086:I dream of horses 1055:I dream of horses 990: 924:I dream of horses 885:I dream of horses 591: 367: 321: 320: 267:Well spotted! -- 239: 238: 95: 94: 54: 53: 48:current talk page 3946: 3879: 3878: 3837: 3833: 3819: 3818: 3812: 3750:, well spotted. 3732: 3728: 3727: 3700: 3698: 3684: 3680: 3670: 3669: 3663: 3606: 3563: 3436: 3432: 3429: 3426: 3408: 3398: 3373: 3363: 3350: 3313: 3259: 3241: 3240: 3219: 3218: 3203: 3183:Ch ch ch changes 3174: 3148: 3058: 3015: 2981: 2970: 2966:Α Guy into Books 2946: 2909: 2874: 2871: 2865: 2852:will be rejected 2844:will be rejected 2815: 2804: 2801: 2800: 2766: 2756: 2753:Α Guy Into Books 2726: 2722: 2719: 2716: 2687: 2676: 2672:Α Guy into Books 2659: 2648: 2644:Α Guy into Books 2613: 2602: 2598:Α Guy into Books 2592: 2579: 2575: 2574: 2547: 2536: 2532:Α Guy into Books 2409: 2398: 2394:Α Guy into Books 2381: 2377: 2374: 2371: 2333: 2329: 2326: 2323: 2292: 2281: 2277:Α Guy into Books 2259: 2248: 2244:Α Guy into Books 2223: 2219: 2218: 2170: 2166: 2165: 2067: 2059: 2015: 2004: 2000:Α Guy into Books 1969: 1958: 1954:Α Guy into Books 1900: 1889: 1885:Α Guy into Books 1854: 1841: 1774: 1763: 1759:Α Guy into Books 1748: 1733: 1732: 1726: 1721: 1719: 1711: 1699: 1693: 1692: 1690: 1688: 1679:. Archived from 1669: 1663: 1662: 1660: 1658: 1643: 1637: 1632: 1575: 1532: 1521: 1517:Α Guy into Books 1436: 1425: 1424: 1416: 1389: 1331: 1320: 1319: 1311: 1301: 1282: 1269: 1202: 1198: 1195: 1192: 1149: 1138: 1137: 1129: 1123: 1077: 1066: 1065: 1057: 1046: 1018: 1007: 1003:Α Guy into Books 986: 946: 935: 934: 926: 907: 896: 895: 887: 871: 870:{{subst:submit}} 848: 837: 833:Α Guy into Books 781: 770: 766:Α Guy into Books 705: 694: 690:Α Guy into Books 684: 645: 634: 630:Α Guy into Books 587: 571: 567: 564: 561: 478: 467: 463:Α Guy into Books 421: 410: 406:Α Guy into Books 355: 343: 342: 312: 308: 294: 293: 287: 266: 230: 226: 212: 211: 205: 108: 81: 56: 55: 33: 32: 26: 3954: 3953: 3949: 3948: 3947: 3945: 3944: 3943: 3902: 3876: 3835: 3831: 3816: 3810: 3770:John of Reading 3735:John of Reading 3725: 3723: 3696: 3682: 3678: 3667: 3661: 3602: 3559: 3509: 3446: 3434: 3430: 3427: 3424: 3404: 3369: 3344: 3326: 3309: 3270: 3255: 3238: 3216: 3197: 3194: 3185: 3170: 3142: 3114:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 3097:Andrew Davidson 3057:Draft:Page Name 3056: 3009: 2977: 2963: 2949:John of Reading 2940: 2922: 2905: 2883: 2869: 2863: 2861: 2834: 2811: 2802: 2798: 2762: 2751: 2724: 2720: 2717: 2714: 2683: 2669: 2655: 2641: 2609: 2595: 2586: 2572: 2570: 2543: 2529: 2425: 2405: 2391: 2379: 2375: 2372: 2369: 2331: 2327: 2324: 2321: 2288: 2274: 2255: 2241: 2216: 2214: 2163: 2161: 2061: 2053: 2011: 1997: 1965: 1951: 1896: 1882: 1852: 1831: 1811: 1770: 1756: 1742: 1738: 1737: 1736: 1722: 1712: 1701: 1700: 1696: 1686: 1684: 1671: 1670: 1666: 1656: 1654: 1653:. June 30, 2014 1645: 1644: 1640: 1633: 1629: 1588:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 1528: 1514: 1426: 1418: 1417: 1412: 1383: 1321: 1313: 1312: 1307: 1295: 1276: 1225:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 1211:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 1200: 1196: 1193: 1190: 1167:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 1139: 1131: 1130: 1125: 1117: 1094:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 1067: 1059: 1058: 1053: 1040: 1028:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 1014: 1000: 979:That being said 963:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 936: 928: 927: 922: 897: 889: 888: 883: 869: 856:I've talked to 844: 830: 813:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 777: 763: 701: 687: 678: 641: 627: 601:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 569: 565: 562: 559: 538: 522:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 490: 474: 460: 433: 417: 403: 377: 340: 310: 306: 291: 285: 269:John of Reading 260: 228: 224: 209: 203: 151:Kudpung กุดผึ้ง 102: 100: 77: 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 3952: 3950: 3942: 3941: 3901: 3898: 3897: 3896: 3872: 3871: 3857: 3844: 3843: 3820: 3809: 3806: 3805: 3804: 3803: 3802: 3801: 3800: 3799: 3798: 3691: 3690: 3671: 3660: 3657: 3656: 3655: 3654: 3653: 3652: 3651: 3650: 3649: 3648: 3647: 3569: 3568: 3524:to create it. 3508: 3505: 3504: 3503: 3489: 3488: 3487: 3484: 3445: 3442: 3418: 3417: 3416: 3415: 3414: 3413: 3389: 3388: 3381: 3380: 3379: 3378: 3354: 3353: 3335: 3334: 3325: 3322: 3321: 3320: 3319: 3318: 3279: 3278: 3269: 3266: 3265: 3264: 3235: 3212: 3211: 3193: 3190: 3184: 3181: 3180: 3179: 3161: 3140: 3139: 3138: 3137: 3136: 3135: 3134: 3133: 3132: 3131: 3130: 3129: 3128: 3127: 3126: 3125: 3124: 3109: 3033: 3032: 2921: 2918: 2917: 2916: 2915: 2914: 2882: 2879: 2864:Chris Troutman 2842:"Your article 2833: 2830: 2829: 2828: 2827: 2826: 2825: 2824: 2823: 2822: 2821: 2820: 2699: 2698: 2697: 2696: 2695: 2694: 2693: 2619: 2581: 2580: 2553: 2516: 2511: 2506: 2501: 2496: 2491: 2486: 2481: 2476: 2471: 2466: 2460: 2454: 2448: 2442: 2441: 2424: 2421: 2420: 2419: 2418: 2417: 2416: 2415: 2338: 2300: 2299: 2298: 2236: 2235: 2211: 2197: 2183: 2158: 2144: 2129: 2128: 2121: 2120: 2119: 2118: 2117: 2116: 2115: 2114: 2113: 2112: 2039: 2038: 2037: 2036: 1984: 1983: 1982: 1981: 1980: 1979: 1978: 1977: 1976: 1975: 1930: 1929: 1928: 1927: 1926: 1925: 1829: 1828: 1822: 1818: 1813:A few things: 1810: 1807: 1806: 1805: 1804: 1803: 1781: 1780: 1735: 1734: 1694: 1664: 1651:Deutsche Welle 1638: 1626: 1625: 1621: 1620: 1619: 1599: 1598: 1562: 1561: 1539: 1538: 1493: 1492: 1467: 1466: 1465: 1464: 1408: 1391: 1345: 1344: 1343: 1342: 1341: 1340: 1339: 1338: 1337: 1336: 1293: 1287:. Saying that 1250: 1221: 1115: 1114: 1113: 1112: 1111: 1110: 1109: 1108: 1107: 1106: 1105: 1104: 1047:I don't think 974: 973: 954: 953: 952: 951: 879: 878: 854: 824: 823: 807:I concur with 804: 803: 756: 755: 752: 749: 743: 741: 738: 737: 734: 731: 712: 711: 652: 651: 614: 613: 612: 611: 537: 534: 533: 532: 514: 489: 486: 485: 484: 432: 429: 428: 427: 376: 373: 372: 371: 319: 318: 295: 284: 281: 280: 279: 237: 236: 213: 202: 199: 198: 197: 196: 195: 194: 193: 145: 144: 131: 130: 99: 96: 93: 92: 87: 82: 75: 70: 65: 62: 52: 51: 34: 23: 15: 14: 13: 10: 9: 6: 4: 3: 2: 3951: 3940: 3936: 3932: 3928: 3924: 3923: 3918: 3917: 3916: 3915: 3911: 3907: 3899: 3895: 3891: 3887: 3882: 3874: 3873: 3870: 3866: 3862: 3858: 3854: 3853: 3852: 3851: 3841: 3838:parameter to 3829: 3825: 3821: 3814: 3813: 3807: 3797: 3793: 3789: 3785: 3781: 3780: 3779: 3775: 3771: 3767: 3763: 3762: 3761: 3757: 3753: 3749: 3748:Force Radical 3746: 3745: 3744: 3740: 3736: 3731: 3722: 3721: 3720: 3719: 3713: 3709: 3705: 3704:Force Radical 3688: 3685:parameter to 3676: 3672: 3665: 3664: 3658: 3646: 3642: 3638: 3634: 3630: 3626: 3625: 3624: 3620: 3616: 3612: 3611: 3610: 3607: 3605: 3599: 3595: 3591: 3590: 3589: 3585: 3581: 3577: 3573: 3572: 3571: 3570: 3567: 3564: 3562: 3556: 3551: 3550: 3549: 3548: 3544: 3540: 3534: 3531: 3528: 3525: 3521: 3516: 3514: 3506: 3502: 3498: 3494: 3490: 3485: 3482: 3478: 3477: 3475: 3474: 3473: 3472: 3468: 3464: 3458: 3454: 3451: 3443: 3441: 3440: 3437: 3423: 3412: 3409: 3407: 3401: 3397: 3393: 3392: 3391: 3390: 3386: 3383: 3382: 3377: 3374: 3372: 3366: 3362: 3358: 3357: 3356: 3355: 3348: 3342: 3339: 3338: 3337: 3336: 3333: 3328: 3327: 3323: 3317: 3314: 3312: 3306: 3302: 3298: 3297: 3296: 3292: 3288: 3284: 3281: 3280: 3276: 3272: 3271: 3267: 3263: 3260: 3258: 3252: 3248: 3244: 3236: 3234: 3230: 3226: 3222: 3214: 3213: 3209: 3208: 3201: 3196: 3195: 3191: 3189: 3182: 3178: 3175: 3173: 3167: 3162: 3160: 3156: 3152: 3146: 3141: 3123: 3119: 3115: 3110: 3106: 3105:autoconfirmed 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2556:Aguyintobooks 2554: 2552: 2548: 2546: 2540: 2537: 2534: 2533: 2525: 2523: 2517: 2515: 2512: 2510: 2507: 2505: 2502: 2500: 2497: 2495: 2492: 2490: 2487: 2485: 2482: 2480: 2477: 2475: 2472: 2470: 2467: 2464: 2461: 2458: 2455: 2452: 2449: 2447: 2444: 2443: 2439: 2435: 2434: 2429: 2422: 2414: 2410: 2408: 2402: 2399: 2396: 2395: 2387: 2386: 2385: 2382: 2368: 2363: 2360: 2359: 2358: 2354: 2350: 2346: 2345:Aguyintobooks 2342: 2339: 2337: 2334: 2320: 2315: 2311: 2310: 2304: 2301: 2297: 2293: 2291: 2285: 2282: 2279: 2278: 2271: 2266: 2265: 2264: 2260: 2258: 2252: 2249: 2246: 2245: 2238: 2237: 2234: 2230: 2226: 2222: 2212: 2210: 2206: 2202: 2198: 2196: 2192: 2188: 2184: 2182: 2178: 2174: 2169: 2159: 2157: 2153: 2149: 2145: 2143: 2139: 2135: 2131: 2130: 2126: 2123: 2122: 2111: 2107: 2103: 2099: 2098: 2097: 2093: 2089: 2085: 2081: 2077: 2074: 2071: 2065: 2064:Aguyintobooks 2057: 2051: 2047: 2046: 2045: 2044: 2043: 2042: 2041: 2040: 2035: 2031: 2027: 2022: 2021: 2020: 2016: 2014: 2008: 2005: 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1359: 1355: 1351: 1335: 1329: 1325: 1317: 1310: 1305: 1299: 1294: 1290: 1286: 1280: 1273: 1272:edit conflict 1268: 1267: 1266: 1262: 1258: 1254: 1251: 1249: 1245: 1241: 1236: 1235: 1234: 1230: 1226: 1222: 1220: 1216: 1212: 1208: 1207: 1206: 1203: 1189: 1185: 1181: 1178: 1177: 1176: 1172: 1168: 1164: 1160: 1156: 1155: 1154: 1153: 1147: 1143: 1135: 1128: 1121: 1103: 1099: 1095: 1091: 1087: 1084: 1083: 1081: 1075: 1071: 1063: 1056: 1050: 1044: 1039: 1038: 1037: 1033: 1029: 1025: 1024: 1023: 1019: 1017: 1011: 1008: 1005: 1004: 997: 996: 995: 992: 991: 989: 982: 978: 977: 976: 975: 972: 968: 964: 960: 957:I don't like 956: 955: 950: 944: 940: 932: 925: 920: 916: 913: 912: 911: 905: 901: 893: 886: 881: 880: 875: 874:WP:NOTWEBHOST 867: 863: 859: 855: 853: 849: 847: 841: 838: 835: 834: 826: 825: 822: 818: 814: 810: 806: 805: 802: 798: 794: 789: 788: 787: 786: 782: 780: 774: 771: 768: 767: 759: 753: 750: 747: 746: 745: 735: 732: 729: 728: 727: 725: 716: 710: 706: 704: 698: 695: 692: 691: 682: 677: 676: 675: 674: 670: 666: 661: 660:Aguyintobooks 657: 650: 646: 644: 638: 635: 632: 631: 624: 620: 616: 615: 610: 606: 602: 598: 597: 596: 593: 592: 590: 582: 578: 577: 576: 575: 572: 558: 554: 550: 548: 543: 535: 531: 527: 523: 519: 515: 513: 509: 506: 505: 504: 503: 499: 495: 487: 483: 479: 477: 471: 468: 465: 464: 457: 456: 455: 454: 450: 446: 442: 439:as described 438: 430: 426: 422: 420: 414: 411: 408: 407: 400: 399: 398: 397: 394: 393:There'sNoTime 390: 386: 382: 374: 370: 365: 362: 359: 354: 350: 349:Jo-Jo Eumerus 346: 338: 337: 336: 335: 331: 327: 316: 313:parameter to 304: 300: 296: 289: 288: 282: 278: 274: 270: 264: 259: 258: 257: 256: 252: 248: 244: 234: 231:parameter to 222: 218: 214: 207: 206: 200: 192: 188: 184: 180: 179: 178: 174: 170: 166: 162: 161: 160: 156: 152: 147: 146: 142: 138: 133: 132: 128: 124: 123: 122: 121: 117: 113: 106: 97: 91: 88: 86: 83: 80: 76: 74: 71: 69: 66: 63: 61: 58: 57: 49: 45: 41: 40: 35: 28: 27: 19: 3921: 3920: 3903: 3881:Partly done: 3880: 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Retrieved 1641: 1630: 1622: 1585:for details. 1580: 1566: 1548: 1529: 1516: 1515: 1509: 1498:TonyBallioni 1454:TonyBallioni 1448: 1403: 1386:TonyBallioni 1370:TonyBallioni 1362: 1346: 1303: 1298:Forceradical 1285:Forceradical 1257:Forceradical 1240:Forceradical 1162: 1158: 1116: 1015: 1002: 1001: 985: 984: 845: 832: 831: 809:TonyBallioni 793:TonyBallioni 778: 765: 764: 760: 757: 739: 724:landing page 721: 702: 689: 688: 681:Forceradical 665:Forceradical 653: 642: 629: 628: 586: 585: 545: 539: 511: 508:Ddaviswestny 494:Ddaviswestny 491: 475: 462: 461: 445:SafwatHalaby 437:lang:article 434: 418: 405: 404: 385:returnWizard 378: 360: 344: 326:TelosCricket 322: 314: 299:edit request 240: 232: 217:edit request 169:TonyBallioni 164: 141:TonyBallioni 101: 78: 43: 37: 3329:Currently: 3247:that button 3151:TheWarOfArt 1725:|publisher= 1687:October 10, 1677:Citizendium 1602:I like the 1557:drawer full 877:userspace). 36:This is an 3832:|answered= 3697:<i: --> 3679:|answered= 3493:Tryptofish 3463:LZia (WMF) 3448:Hi all. 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