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states that Jamal is often "overlooked" by critics. This endorsement is made all the more unusual with the addition of the Miles Davis quote that has already been mentioned, since Davis chose Bill Evans to be in his band at the time of Kind Of Blue. Crouch has a heavy-duty agenda for some kind of jazz purity that is simply not universally accepted in Jazz, especially not by guys like Miles Davis... So Crouch's particular take coupled with Davis's comments appear as supporting a position about Ahmad Jamal that is not representative of the Jazz "world" as a whole. That's not to put down Ahmad Jamal in any way whatsoever. But if the article is going to make claims, they should represent some kind of worldview of equals, rather than that of certain individuals only, who may have been trying to just be polite at best or self-serving at worst. -
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intolerance had the intelligence to check out the edit history, he or she would have seen that I am the editor mainly responsible for keeping that reference to Jamal's original name, well-known within the music world, regardless of whether
Knowledge (XXG) considers evidence to that effect a primary source. I very much doubt that Jamal himself would stoop so low as to threaten anyone as musicians tend to be remarkably tolerant people, but they do tend to find themselves surrounded by "morons" of many types, precisely because of their excessive tolerance. --
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1056:, "any material challenged or likely to be challenged must be attributed to a reliable, published source using an inline citation." The article had an inline citation from a well-respected source stating that Jamal's name at birth was Jones. This has been "over-turned" by an OTRS decision - without any corresponding inline citation to a "reliable, published source". And no-one seems to mind...--
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Just a quick note in response to the threat of "suffering the consequences" aimed at the above editor. First of all, my support to Dr Aaij. Nobody, here at
Knowledge (XXG) or elsewhere, for that matter, should be subjected to threats, anonymous or otherwise. Second, if the person responsible for such
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That the place of nativity of
Frederick Russell Jones is the state of Pennsylvania and that the place of nativity of Virginia Wilkins Jones is the state of Illinois. That the age of F. R. J. is 21 years and that the age of V. W. J. is 25 years. That F. R. J. has resided in the state of Illinois for 2
1467:
Hi, I just made an addition to the discography but thought it well to log in and make myself known so as not to have made the change anonymously. I was looking at the page for AJ's album 'Digital Works', and noticed that it lists 'Goodbye Mr. Evans' as the preceding album in 1982 but there's no page
984:
Obviously the musician was not born Ahmad Jamal. The court papers for his name change were filed on
February 18, 1952; they state that his name at birth was Frederick Russell Jones. He was identified in a high school photo as Freddie Jones and in nightclub advertisements, OKeh Records ads, and in
900:
Is it just me or does "Ahmad Jamal is an exclusive
Steinway Artist" having its own paragraph sound like advertisement vandalism? I think if he only used Steinway pianos it's worth mentioning, but I most certainly don't think it belongs as the very last part of his biography, in its own paragraph.
1096:
I don't know if I'm the only one who's been receiving insulting email from someone claiming to be Ahmad Jamal about the birth name--this abusive person holds me responsible for putting the name in the article, and tells me I should remove the name from
Knowledge (XXG) or "suffer the consequences."
1133:
I don't believe it's really right to include Crouch's assessment of Ahmad Jamal as "second in importance in the development of jazz after 1945 only to
Charlie Parker" right in the second sentence of the Intro, without a counter assessment for balance there, especially as later in the article it
968:
Despite repeated requests on his/her talk page - which may possibly not have been seen by the editor in question - and hidden text on the article itself which has been deleted by the editor, an editor (who works for Mr Jamal) is constantly deleting the name and corresponding inline citation and
969:
stating that Mr Jamal was born Ahmad Jamal. As this concerns a living person - and one of my favourite jazz musicians - and the reverting editor seems to be acting in good faith, but is generating unnecessary work, is there any admin. out there who can take this matter up? Cheers! --
964:
However, there seems to be an issue regarding his name at birth, i.e. before his conversion to Islam in the 1950s. As per
Knowledge (XXG) guidelines, the article gives his full name - at birth - as Frederick Russell Jones, and gives a reputable inline citation. So far, so good.
764:]. I wanted to ask him if he recorded the o.v. of it but certainly not in 1958 (mystiping of coverinfo.de) seeing Mrs. Brewer was already #1 in the POP chart back in 1950. (DECCA/Coral 9-60140). I'd really like to know what is going on. Thanks in advance.
927:
Whats with the second paragraph which should be an introduction to this artist in his own right? No offense to miles davis, but couldn't this go lower down in thhe influenced" section. If mentioning davis is a must, perhaps a sentence would do?
820:
See below. Frederick
Russell Jones changed his name to Ahmad Jamal on February 18, 1952. His wife changed her name on the same occasion. The exact date of his conversion to Islam is not in the public record but presumably was not much
1097:
You know, that really kills my desire to play his music again--if it is really him. To whoever the idiot was who identified me as the "culprit": you're a moron, and you should look at the edit history more carefully.
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the current version says: "in 1962... at the age of 32, he took a three-year hiatus from his musical career" but he recorded the
Emerald City Nights series in 1963 and 1964. This needs to be reconciled somehow.
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The article clearly states that Mr Jamal is known as Ahmad Jamal and refers to him as such throughout. There is no question whatsoever on that point. Anybody who knows anything about jazz has that very clear.
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The document or documents on which this decision was based have not been made available. The claim was merely made that they were "vital records" (of what sort and from what jurisdiction was not specified).
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years and that V. W. J. has resided in the State of Illinois for 25 years last past... Their names may be changed to Ahmad Jamal and Maryam Mezzan Jamal... Witnessed by Eddie A. Calhoun, February 18, 1952.
1028:
Here is the text of a name change petition, filed in a Cook County (Illinois) court in 1952. It was located by Alexia Kinni, a graduate student of Lewis Porter at the Institute of Jazz Studies:
874:
i'm puzzled by the expression "his innovative use of multi-tonal melodic lines". i'm really curious to know what the author thought he or she was saying with "multi-tonal melodic lines"....
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for that album, nor did I see it listed in the discography table on the full Ahmad Jamal page. I went to ahmadjamal.com and got the info to add it, citing the website.
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At the very least, some response is called for, on the part of those who deny that Ahmad Jamal was ever named Frederick Russell Jones, Freddie Jones, or Fritz Jones.-
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I'm with you--would something like this work instead? "Jamal has achieved critical acclaim around the world for his (insert description of style of playing)."
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I think it would be great for the readers if we separate Jamal's influences and who he influenced. both of these subjects have a great deal of information.
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1950 makes more sense chronologically for his conversion to Islam and changing his name. "...Stan Getz and The Ahmad Jamal Trio. This was 1951 an..." from
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1st name: Jamal - family name: Ahmad...I spoke with somebody last evening about it and told him what was/is his 1st name and surname: JAMAL AHMAD...
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What on earth could constitute "sufficient evidence" that Ahmad Jamal (who changed his name in 1952) was known as Ahmad Jamal at birth?-
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or other tool because one or more other projects use this class. Please ensure the assessment is correct before removing the
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There needs to be further discussion of the OTRS decision (see above) to delete all references to Ahmad Jamal's birth name.
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I've linked the first mention of him and cut the second (it must have been the same person, as Ray Kennedy was a pianist).
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https://web.archive.org/web/20081123052922/http://www.jazz.com/jazz-blog/2008/1/16/ahmad-jamal-s-poinciana-turns-50-today
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I removed the length of it, but left the hiatus part. Without a source to say how long, if any, it should remain.
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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the
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the records of Musicians Union Local 208 before his name change as Fritz Jones. 'Nuff said... I hope.-
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https://web.archive.org/web/20081013162056/http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/musician.php?id=7955
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http://www.jazz.com/jazz-blog/2008/1/16/ahmad-jamal-s-poinciana-turns-50-today
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Could the violinist described be Joe Kennedy Jr. instead of Ray Kennedy?
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I just saw his homepage and dicovered his e-mail address is non valide
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RfC on Not Giving Ahmad Jamal's Birth Name as Frederick Russell Jones
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Agreed, but this is more of a support for a general legacy section.
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A news item involving Ahmad Jamal was featured on Knowledge (XXG)'s
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They have to mean Joe Kennedy Jr. He was also from Pittsburgh.
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3 weeks with no dissent, so I've moved it to the main text.
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCV8enW2mpLuygvyx7jiCAFg
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This article is the subject of a request emailed to the
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http://www.allaboutjazz.com/php/musician.php?id=7955
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Even if the document is publicly available, it is a
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814:User:Arhada
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536:Pittsburgh
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1545:Viriditas
1470:KVAartist
1436:this tool
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1078:Sole Soul
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843:Irishgeek
821:earlier.-
332:Biography
277:Musicians
272:Biography
197:Main Page
88:if needed
71:Be polite
21:talk page
1442:Cheers.—
1332:Cheers.—
1149:Agreed.
1076:source.
945:contribs
933:unsigned
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896:Steinway
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525:and its
56:get help
29:This is
27:article.
1530:Ayyydoc
1366:my edit
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1165:Tdimhcs
1136:Jelsova
1099:Dr Aaij
1074:primary
1052:As per
837:Samples
675:on the
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130:books
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