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963:, another excellent article. Review follows: article 5x expanded from 24 January; article is extremely well written and cited inline throughout to excellent sources; I don't have access to the offline sources but more than happy to AGF on any copyright violation; hook is very interesting, mentioned in the article and cited; perhaps we should put "reportedly" in there (but happy either way)? a QPQ has been carried out. All good here -
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one might argue that
Kinghorn was the first conflict of the Second War of Scottish Independence, assuming you're a historian who recognises such an entity - most don't - but at the time it was just argy bargy among the Scottish nobility. I could possibly cherry pick sources - especially the more
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Not really. Just that he was an experienced old soldier who dropped dead in June. One source (just one) mentions rumours that the
English poisoned him, but there were rumours of poisoning around most royal and near-royal deaths from 3,000 BC to about
1513:
So that's two reasons why I duck it. I agree that it leaves a minor hole - but only because
Knowledge as an encyclopedia likes to pigeon hole things in neat categories, inventing them - or at least overstressing their importance - if necessary.
1394:
Because there is a modern secondary RS which gives a figure for the
Scottish numbers, but none that do so for their casualties - they all repeat what the contemporary sources say, so I have used them. (The repetition in the Rss, not the
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I guess just one more thing, the first war of independence is mentioned in the body, but the second war of independence is only in the infobox. Is there any context that can be added to place this battle into the second war?
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in
Knowledge is "reportedly", and can be taken as inferred. A more experienced editor than me once told me off for using it, saying that its only function was to subtly cast doubt on what was "reported" and that is PoVing.
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Ah, you would ask that. The RSs don't really go for the First/Second war thing. ORing a bit, Balliol's invasion was just a dynastic squabble. England didn't get involved until the next year, when Edward invaded
Scotland.
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If you mean why did I not refer to it as the "Treaty of
Edinburgh–Northampton" it is because none of my sources do so. Sumption, Ormrod, Rogers and DeFries all call it the "Treaty of Northampton".
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Source: DeVries, Kelly (1998) . Infantry
Warfare in the Early Fourteenth Century: Discipline, Tactics, and Technology. Woodbridge, Suffolk; Rochester, NY: Boydell & Brewer.
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popular ones - to come up with a coherent sentence or so, but the consensus of RS scholars is the ignore the whole First/Second Wars of
Independence altogether.
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1387:"variously as 4,000, 10,000, 14,000 and 24,000" these alts are not given in the infobox yet the casualty alt figures are. Any reason for that?
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1430:"Scotland at Scone – the traditional place" if you made this a comma-separated clause, you'd avoid that tragic reference space en-dash clash.
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Yeah, I'm happy with that. The detail on who reported it is in the article anyway for those who want to click through to find out more -
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Oof. There's a complex question. Added "or regent" and linked it, which is about the closest short equivalent.
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1466:, many thanks for picking this up and for your usual high-quality review. Your comments all addressed above.
150:. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a
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Is there a useful link for "king of
Scotland" which could be deployed on its first mention in the lead?
1315:, saved my work while I checked this and forgot that that would ping you. My edit clash response is:
741:
for that content in the latter page, and it must not be deleted as long as the latter page exists.
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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Apologies. My poor proof reading. (I think. Or a "helpful" drive-by edit I missed.) Fixed.
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1195:"town of Berwick" for the benefit of our many non-UK readers, I would link this location.
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in 1332 the Earl of Fife was "full of shame" at being defeated by such a small force?
787:
in 1332, the Earl of Fife was "full of shame" at being defeated by such a small force?
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1237:"Treaty of Northampton" any reason you're not using Knowledge's common name for this?
822:
The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as
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Articles created or improved during WikiProject Europe's 10,000 Challenge
985:, high praise. I am indifferent re "reportedly", but it seems to me that
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There is a list. I don't find it that useful, but I have added it.
1153:"would come over to him" bit euphemistic, can you be more direct?
1279:"but he died ten days before they sailed" any detail on that?
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They don't, they don't. Although I like that one. Changed.
1345:"as the new guardian" what is "guardian" in this context?
1359:"would come over to him" again, say what this really is.
1265:"turned a blind eye" not sure encyclopedia's use idioms?
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794:. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at
685:", which started on 20 August 2016 and is still open.
1135:"A Scottish army, possibly 4,000... this sentence is
796:
Template:Did you know nominations/Battle of Kinghorn
609:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
504:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
399:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
294:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
182:
928:: Suggestions for alternative blurbs are welcome.
681:This article was created or improved during the "
45:. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can
1373:"by Duncan, Earl of Fife and" comma after Fife.
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1402:"Dunfermline, where" consider linking.
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154:. To use this banner, please see the
790:A record of the entry may be seen at
167:Template:WikiProject Military history
7:
1603:Medieval warfare task force articles
1139:bloated with factoids, can we split?
683:The 20,000 Challenge: UK and Ireland
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1540:07:05, 6 September 2021 (UTC)
1524:21:23, 5 September 2021 (UTC)
1493:21:06, 5 September 2021 (UTC)
1476:20:50, 5 September 2021 (UTC)
1455:19:58, 5 September 2021 (UTC)
1333:21:02, 5 September 2021 (UTC)
1297:20:58, 5 September 2021 (UTC)
1223:Suggest linking "regent" too.
1124:12:56, 4 September 2021 (UTC)
630:Template:WikiProject Scotland
621:and see a list of open tasks.
512:and see a list of open tasks.
413:Knowledge:WikiProject England
407:and see a list of open tasks.
302:and see a list of open tasks.
291:WikiProject Medieval Scotland
1416:"Rogers' estimate" Rogers's.
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1000:14:41, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
973:14:22, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
945:13:10, 25 January 2021 (UTC)
863:03:28, 31 January 2021 (UTC)
416:Template:WikiProject England
147:Military history WikiProject
1099:Talk:Battle of Kinghorn/GA1
838:Knowledge talk:Did you know
830:this nomination's talk page
771:column on 5 February 2021 (
241:Medieval warfare task force
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781:... that after losing the
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1535:Keep wearing the mask...
1528:Understood, no problem.
1488:Keep wearing the mask...
1450:Keep wearing the mask...
1292:Keep wearing the mask...
761:appeared on Knowledge's
419:England-related articles
1563:Knowledge good articles
834:the article's talk page
815:Did you know nomination
722:Siege of Berwick (1333)
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717:this version
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94:WikiProjects
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43:please do so
31:
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1095:transcluded
773:check views
515:Middle Ages
462:Middle Ages
1557:Categories
1048:Authorship
1034:GA toolbox
987:everything
37:under the
1107:Reviewer:
1071:Templates
1062:Reviewing
1027:GA Review
908:, p. 117.
806:Knowledge
763:Main Page
731:this edit
1462:Evening
1423:Changed.
1366:Changed.
1160:Changed.
1130:Comments
1120:contribs
1076:Criteria
917:Reviewed
851:promoted
624:Scotland
611:Scotland
567:Scotland
126:Medieval
122:European
84:GA-class
47:reassess
1006:Dumelow
983:Dumelow
981:Thanks
965:Dumelow
926:Comment
875:Comment
765:in the
735:history
651:on the
542:on the
437:on the
410:England
401:England
357:England
332:on the
118:British
1311:Sorry
90:scale.
54:Review
1437:Done.
1409:Done.
1380:Done.
1319:1700.
1258:Done.
1230:Done.
1202:Done.
1146:Done.
1097:from
729:with
1520:talk
1472:talk
1329:talk
1137:very
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969:talk
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613:and
1464:TRM
1313:TRM
959:Hi
877:or
853:by
836:or
719:of
643:Low
534:Low
429:Low
324:Low
49:it.
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