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Talk:Fiber (mathematics)

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powerset of the domain, to actually prove that this is a function would require some possibly tricky uses of the ZFC axioms), however I would much rather change 'naive set theory' to just 'set theory' because by this article's reasoning we should say 'naive set theory' whenever we aren't rigorously applying ZFC axioms, for example with images, preimages, indexed families, set operations, etc. etc.
22: 352:. The preimage is a separate thing, a generalization of the fiber to whole subsets of the codomain, instead of single elements at a time. We use the same notation for it, but definitions are the place where clarity is most valued. We don't need a notational allusion to a related concept. We need a simple function 888:
Is there really any need to say that fibers are a notion of naive set theory and not just set theory? I understand that we are not formally proving that the fiber of an element is a set using the ZFC axioms (and similarly if we want to consider the 'fiber function' mapping from the codomain to the
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as the definition for the fiber. I think this conflates the concept of "fiber" with "preimage". We are trying to express, in symbols, "the fiber of a function over a value in its codomain is the set of all inputs in the domain that map to that output", and that translates to
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The lead implies that there are two topics here. I tried to split the article but that wasn't appreciated :-( Sorry, but anyway, can the lead be re-written or expanded in a way that explains this as a single topic?
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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I put it back along with a ":=" to make it clear that this statement is defining
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since I had taken it to mean that it was saying that that it's being defined as
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generalizes the concept of a fiber to whole subsets of the codomain
15: 750:{\displaystyle f^{-1}:{\mathcal {P}}(Y)\to {\mathcal {P}}(X)} 916:. Theres no point in having a dedicated Knowledge article. 733: 714: 665: 407:, and then we can add a note beneath it, along the lines of 383: 543:
is still used to refer to the fiber, as the fiber over
822: 780: 695: 640: 595: 569: 549: 510: 484: 458: 419: 358: 280: 195: 101:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 266:{\displaystyle f^{-1}(\{y\})=\{x\in X\mid f(x)=y\}} 856: 808: 749: 681: 626: 581: 555: 535: 496: 470: 444: 399: 344: 265: 908:For the first definition, it could redirect to 345:{\displaystyle f^{-1}(y)=\{x\in X\mid f(x)=y\}} 864:which happens to equal the right-hand side. – 682:{\displaystyle f^{-1}:Y\to {\mathcal {P}}(X)} 400:{\displaystyle f^{-1}:Y\to {\mathcal {P}}(X)} 8: 845: 839: 689:, and the inverse image generalizes this to 618: 612: 576: 570: 339: 306: 260: 227: 218: 212: 189:I don't agree with your reason for writing 19: 563:is the inverse image of the singleton set 47: 827: 821: 785: 779: 732: 731: 713: 712: 700: 694: 664: 663: 645: 639: 600: 594: 568: 548: 515: 509: 483: 457: 424: 418: 382: 381: 363: 357: 285: 279: 200: 194: 634:. That is, the fiber creates a function 49: 7: 95:This article is within the scope of 38:It is of interest to the following 478:at a time, instead of one element 14: 956:Mid-priority mathematics articles 115:Knowledge:WikiProject Mathematics 951:Start-Class mathematics articles 118:Template:WikiProject Mathematics 82: 72: 51: 20: 883: 135:This article has been rated as 904:This article should be deleted 878:20:12, 14 September 2018 (UTC) 857:{\displaystyle f^{-1}(\{y\}),} 848: 836: 800: 794: 769:19:31, 14 September 2018 (UTC) 744: 738: 728: 725: 719: 676: 670: 660: 621: 609: 530: 524: 439: 433: 394: 388: 378: 330: 324: 300: 294: 251: 245: 221: 209: 1: 627:{\displaystyle f^{-1}(\{y\})} 109:and see a list of open tasks. 471:{\displaystyle A\subseteq Y} 912:and for the second one, to 173:17:20, 26 August 2017 (UTC) 972: 809:{\displaystyle f^{-1}(y),} 936:17:05, 4 March 2021 (UTC) 899:15:15, 4 April 2019 (UTC) 536:{\displaystyle f^{-1}(y)} 445:{\displaystyle f^{-1}(A)} 134: 67: 46: 914:Fiber product of schemes 141:project's priority scale 98:WikiProject Mathematics 858: 810: 751: 683: 628: 583: 557: 537: 498: 497:{\displaystyle y\in Y} 472: 446: 401: 346: 267: 28:This article is rated 859: 811: 752: 684: 629: 584: 582:{\displaystyle \{y\}} 558: 538: 499: 473: 447: 402: 347: 268: 820: 778: 693: 638: 593: 567: 547: 508: 482: 456: 417: 356: 278: 193: 121:mathematics articles 884:'Naive Set Theory' 854: 806: 747: 679: 624: 579: 553: 533: 494: 468: 442: 397: 342: 263: 158:One or two topics? 90:Mathematics portal 34:content assessment 922:comment added by 556:{\displaystyle y} 155: 154: 151: 150: 147: 146: 963: 938: 863: 861: 860: 855: 835: 834: 815: 813: 812: 807: 793: 792: 756: 754: 753: 748: 737: 736: 718: 717: 708: 707: 688: 686: 685: 680: 669: 668: 653: 652: 633: 631: 630: 625: 608: 607: 588: 586: 585: 580: 562: 560: 559: 554: 542: 540: 539: 534: 523: 522: 503: 501: 500: 495: 477: 475: 474: 469: 451: 449: 448: 443: 432: 431: 406: 404: 403: 398: 387: 386: 371: 370: 351: 349: 348: 343: 293: 292: 272: 270: 269: 264: 208: 207: 188: 123: 122: 119: 116: 113: 92: 87: 86: 76: 69: 68: 63: 55: 48: 31: 25: 24: 16: 971: 970: 966: 965: 964: 962: 961: 960: 941: 940: 917: 906: 886: 823: 818: 817: 781: 776: 775: 758: 696: 691: 690: 641: 636: 635: 596: 591: 590: 565: 564: 545: 544: 511: 506: 505: 504:. 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Mathematics
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Mathematics portal
WikiProject Mathematics
mathematics
the discussion
Mid
project's priority scale
Volunteer1234
talk
17:20, 26 August 2017 (UTC)
Deacon Vorbis
inverse image
Howtonotwin
talk
19:31, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
Deacon Vorbis
carbon
videos
20:12, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
Joel Brennan
talk
15:15, 4 April 2019 (UTC)
Inverse image
Fiber product of schemes

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