Talk:Freya (walrus) - Knowledge (XXG)

2309:(generally) don't object to the use of the word "abortion", they instead object to abortions. In fact, those who push for "abortion" to be called "killing" generally want to push a POV, and I feel the same could apply here. Thus, "kill" can just as easily be used as a non-neutral term, especially in some contexts. "Euthanise" in this case can be more reflective of what actually happened, the intent was to euthanise her, as I discussed. Personally, I think the best course of action for us here on Knowledge (XXG) is to wait a few weeks or months, see if any sources discuss this dispute of wording, and come back to this discussion to establish some firm consensus based on some retrospective analysis by reliable sources. :) 1955:

people disagreed with this assessment, and this is discussed in the article. And of course, most of the sources used in the article (ignoring the oft-sensationalised headlines) use "euthanised" or some other euphemism (eg. "put down"). I don't believe that euthanasia is a euphemism for killing in this particular context. It's made clear in the article that Freya was suffering and that the only option that the Norwegian authorities thought they had to alleviate or end that suffering was to euthanise her. Therefore, I don't think it would be appropriate or helpful for the reader to substitute "euthanised" with "killed". Regardless, have a great day!

2554:). This is the term used for euthanasia of sick pets but also for "put down" in a wider sense, e.g. it's what's done to animals that are healthy but causing a danger to humans. But I think Norwegian vets might be primed to translate "avliving" into English as "euthanasia", and that might be influencing the translation of the official statement and the reporting about Freya. (I have no particular strong feelings about what should go in the infobox but perhaps "shot by the Norwegian Directorate of Fisheries" is a factual and neutral description.) 1932:(not a walrus). I strongly believe that "euthanize" is an equally inappropriate word, as euthanasia is what is done to an animal if it is suffering, without hope of recovery, from an illness or injury. What was Freya's illness or injury? The words "euthanize" and "euthanasia" are BS with regard to Freya. I believe that every occurrence of those words in this article should be replaced with the words "kill" and "killing". After all, we don't use euphemisms here on WP. I'd like to know what others think before I make such an edit. 218: 2222:

political opponent who shoots a country's leader dead over political differences is not said to "execute" him, and a firing squad does not "assassinate" a convicted criminal. And so on. And I still see that the justification for using "euthanize" here hasn't truly been established. It continues to be a highly debatable point as to whether killing Freya was warranted, not only among animal lovers, but even among experts. Incidentally,

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as being euthanised. Walruses can really fucking move on land if they want to, and no way is anyone getting close enough to an animal that big, with a hide that thick and teeth that large for an injection to be reasonable – you can imagine the chance of it going wrong, and causing further distress to both animal and human, making it an unsuitable choice for putting a Very Large Fighty Animal down.

1665: 1133: 1059: 190: 294: 532: 1031: 1023: 994: 974: 963: 934: 923: 235: 1293: 371: 350: 1099:, would you mind quickly checking my latest update to the article? The Guardian source suggested above led me to realize that she was first spotted on top of a "Walrus–class submarine", while also being the first of her species to enter Dutch waters in 23 years. I smell a hooky hook here! If you suggest an ALT one, I could approve it :D -- 2122:, I think the word should be "kill", as there is no question that they killed the animal, and quite a bit of debate about whether it was warranted. Saying "euthanize" is editorializing, taking the Norwegian authorities' POV (although, having said that, a Norwegian official on the news last night said "kill" rather than "euthanize"). 381: 2908:'s earlier suggestion of waiting for the dust to settle. I'll move to other places for a while, and let this rest. Feel free to react of course, but I'd suggest that we all come back here much later – it is much easier to discuss the assassination of Julius Caesar, after all, since it's not a fresh shock to us all. 2818:

No. Yes? Maybe. Wait, what do you mean by this? The people who did this might reasonably not think it was a good death. They might think it was bad, or they might think that Freya was a stupid old animal that was be fun to slaughter. We don't know. What we know is: This was reported as an euthanasia.

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English speaker living in Norway here. Just a quick note on a translation issue that might be adding to the confusion: in Norway the word nearly universally used in the media (and in the Directorate of Fisheries' official statement) for what happened to Freya is "avlive", literally "to de-life" (also

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That's the thing, we don't know. I remember reading "humane", and I certainly believe they weren't trying to be cruel. Likely how usual euthanasia is done; there was no apparent time pressure here like with Harambe (and this was, after all, not Texas. Carrying guns around in Norway is only a thing in

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Regarding a source for this debate for "euthanise" vs. "killed", this I think reflects what the real debate is. People are not objecting to the use of the word "euthanised" in reference to Freya, instead they object to the the descision to euthanise her. Paralleling the Abortion debate again, people

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of the term euthanasia in several sources in some way. Maybe have a small note with an explanation on why some sources say euthanised, but we don't follow. And I'd really like at least one source that actively questions the usage of "euthanasia" (it may be that some of the critics have said that, but

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I would just like to point out that the suggestion for using the word "kill" is not "editorializing". "Kill" is, in fact, the most basic, neutral term for ending a living thing's life, whereas "euthanize" is –let's face it – nothing but a euphemism for "kill" here, as the grounds for using that word

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Yes, the explanatory note is lacking an explanation. Feel free to amend that if you have time Andrew. Ideally, we should give both the official Norwegian source and the English media thingy. It might likely not have been euthanasia, but we need something to explain why so many reliable sources used

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in a clinical veterinary setting brings to mind a sedative followed by a lethal injection, but in a non-clinical veterinary setting, especially for wildlife control, I wouldn't assume that a), a lethal injection would be used, or that b), just because a rifle was the given method, it wouldn't count

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Could there potentially be a compromise here? "Killed", "Shot" and "Euthanised" are all arguably accurate terms in this context. Perhaps something along the lines of "Freya was killed via euthanasia by gunshot". A little wordy, but I feel that way of saying things ensures no-one misunderstands what

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I've added in a "wild" to hopefully make it clearer that she was not a zoo animal. However, I feel that we should keep the information on Stena minimal in this article, as it is about Feya explicitly and not the "wandering walruses" (not an official, just my term) in general. If you want, you could

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I think we should stick with the euthanasia wording, for a couple reasons. I'll start with one that hasn't seemingly been explored yet, namely that as far as I can tell, the Norwegian authorities intent was to euthanise Freya, as in they wished to stop suffering that she would (as far as they were

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This is a valid question, but it is not our job to determine whether the examination by a veterinarian was done appropriately. None of the organizations criticizing the death, either, knew anything about the health situation of Freya (with the sole exception of Rune Aae maybe, who actually seem to

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This actually results in x5 killed vs x4 euthanised (although we could discuss whether "Life in Norway" counts as a very reliable source). I was personally leaning on "euthanised" being the appropriate term (since they did consult vets and stuff), but just from the sources we might well have both.

2723:), and we have at least half a dozen reliable sources that use it in the context of Freya's death. We are all entitled to our own opinions (and as I have hinted at above, I do NOT think the killing was justified), but we must not get too confident in what words are appropriate, lest we stray into 1397:

It's still a bit of a weird tagline because there's no causation between the cute riding of a ship named after her species, and her accidentally sinking several ships due to being disruptive. Perhaps write a tagline that highlights just one of these events. Alternatively, I wonder if you could do

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of people on Twitter thought this affair an outrage. I thought it an outrage. Several animal rights or conservation organizations thought it an outrage, not just the ones from Norway, but also e.g. from the Netherlands, too. But did they criticise the decision, or did they provide proof that the

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suffering, with vets concluding that she was likely stressed and not getting enough rest, and most other options (like moving her) would of likely led to Freya suffering more. In other words, she was not likely to improve in her condition, or at least the Norwegian authorities believed so. Other

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Is "murder" really an accurate word? Seems less-than-charitable to the Norwegian Gov't. Ignoring the "human being" aspect of that definition, do not they define what is lawful and what isn't in their country? Especially given she was euthanized for her own safety. "She was murdered, her cause of

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made some good remarks regarding language above, but frankly while I believe that reply was good, it doesn't numb my remaining issue: This was reported as an "euthanasia" – and yes, that implies something. But likewise, using the simplest possible term is not always the solution. Sometimes we

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A good compromise, I agree it can stay this way. "Shot" is actually more precise than killed, but still neutral. And since shooting is a possible way of delivering euthanasia, we are now leaving it to the reader to decide on whether or not they want to see this as an act of euthanasia, or an

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Thankyou Andrew for these sources, it certainly clarifies a lot of questions I and others had. I would now not object to the lede stating "shot" or "killed", although I still think it is important to mention in the article that the procedure was "euthanasia", at least as far as the Norwegian

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if it is an animal suffering from illness or injury with no hope of recovery. Each one of those words is being misused if the context doesn't fit the word's specific meaning. You don't "abort" a pig to make bacon, ham and pork chops out of him, nor does an abortionist "slaughter" a foetus. A

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The word "killed" tells us what happened. The word "shot" tells us how it was done. The word "euthanized" puts a value on it by telling us that it was a "good death". But that's the POV of the people who did the killing. Lots of other people think that this was quite bad and so

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Ok, I don't agree with your opninion. Stena did not survive the rescue effort, thats the matter. And critics will have to consider the harms of failed rescue attempts. Thats what I wanted to point out. Also I sure did appreciate your interfering and speedy deletion... Good evening,

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death was euthanasia." seems logically incoherent to me. We generally wouldn't say a senior citizen who undergoes medically assisted suicide has been murdered, by analogy I think this fits this scenario as well. If anyone murdered her, it wasn't the government, but the plebian.

1790:), which also happened to be in the news recently. I don't see how the incident fits into this article, specifically into the Criticism section. And altough I agree that these incidents beg the question of "why did they travel so far south?", we need to be careful lest we add 2871:. In its simplest form, yes, they died, and they were killed. But we don't write "killed", because sources reported an assassination. Assassination isn't value-laden when discussing an assassination, it's the best word to use. And we have good reason to believe that these 2390:

the sources confirm that she was not healthy, yet she didn't die by euthanasia, but likely from stress/malnutrition/bad health. For Freya, we don't really have the veterinarian's assessment (yet?), which certainly would help to determine whether the euthanasia claim about

2845:? You probably mean those people/organizations whose opinion was reported in reliable sources (Martinsen, Aae, Seal Rehabilitation and Research Centre, Norwegian Green Party etc). Were these "lots"? Well, I was trying to determine that above, but the discussion moved on. 2147:

neutral term – but I think it is not perfect in all circumstances. Just consider any controversial topic (which I don't want to drag this discussion into, it's merely used as a example) like e.g. abortion: Do you say "kill an unborn" or "abort"? This is controversial

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Thanks, these sources were exactly what we were looking for I think! Previously, we only had the official statement claiming a "euthanasia" vs the criticism; but we didn't know anything about the procedure (I also stand corrected on not assuming a firing squad).

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of sensational /emotional language; frankly I'm surprised such a paper would use these words. In any case, this is not in the least any point in favour of changing out wording. Moreover, I fail to see how euthanasia would exclusively imply an injection (see

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My view is that we should only use "euthanised" for the attributed statements of parties like the minister and PM. They naturally want to use a bland euphemism in their PR but the fact that they are officials does not mean that we have to copy them – see

2960:, which describes the reason for death – her own health and safety, none of which could be assured in this situation – accurately as well. I hope this makes sense. I have to admit I did pop on this article and think "killed? That seems a bit much".-- 1831:

Hmm, I understand now what you meant to say. We might be able to add that in some fashion, as a sort of background info why a transport might not have been considered. I will try to come up with something, and then you can see if you like it, okay?

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Thank you. I studied languages in university, including things like semantics. I, too, have been hoping for a few more opinions. I am not averse to it being pointed out that some sources call the killing "euthanasia". Yes, let's hear some further

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provides a detailed account of the stages in the operation and uses a variety of phrases to describe it including "mob-like hit", "executed", "slaughter", "death squad", " controlled operation to put the animal down", "killing", "execution",

3132:" – even if you believed this bordering-on-conspiracy-theory, then it spectacularly failed); but the non-reflective use of "euthanasia" by the media (especially if it doesn't correspond 100% to the Norwegian wording) should be mentioned. – 2526:

Update: In the current state, "euthanasia/euthanised" is now only used thrice: In the infobox, the explanatory note and the director-general's statement. I'd let these instances remain, as they're all related to the official statement(s).

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I'm honestly impressed, this is a really fine reasoning. I'm tempted to be convinced; however, I would like a few other opinions (mini-consensus) before making the change. And even then, I'd still like to preserve the information on the

1447:. I'm aware that this is ever so slightly "misleading", but the point is that nothing about hook ALT2a/b is factually incorrect (they only state that the sinking happened later than the riding); it's hooky because the reader might 2435:

for typical walrus hunting details). I have added details and sources for this. As the walrus was shot, and then cut up we should state these plain facts rather than use inappropriate and imprecise terms like "euthanise". See

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This particular Walrus has been spotted in various other places around the North sea in the year leading up to her untimely demise. All of this is well documented in the media. Maybe include some other sightings in the article?

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that word. I think that's my remaining issue: Dropping "euthanasia" completely from the article text without explanation would create a disparity between sources and Knowledge (XXG) article, which might confuse readers. The

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I see, but I maintain that "kill" is the nearest thing that English has to a neutral word for the act. Other words meaning "kill" are used to specify what kind of killing is being referred to. To take your example, it is

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Addendum: This was only a brief check based on the sources currently in the article. There are many more out there which – for a thorough anaylsis – we should consider as well. For example, many German sources

2736:); I believe we didn't bring this article up to shape for both ITN and DYK to engage in an endless discussion about terminology, but because we wanted to bring attention to the incident and Freya herself. -- 633:

I'd love to, could you help perhaps by pointing out any sources (most of the media attention is focused on her death at the moment, making it hard to find any other sources!)? Thanks for the suggestion!

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being maintained and that this wasn't "euthanasia"? I believe the former, and not the latter. And even then, criticism does not mean by definition that the critics are right, just that we must consider

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we currently barely have any mentions of euthanasia left. I recognize you're a prolific editor, but at present I can't agree with your stance. The New York Times article you linked above reads like the

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that we must stick to what the sources call it. So the question is not: Was she murdered (certainly not per definition, although it may feel like it), killed or euthanised? But: What do the sources say?

2812:), and I can't stand in the way of consensus. However, I still believe that you are not right, and can't accept that change in good conscience. I've problems with your reasoning, I'll try to explain: 1077:

I would of done that hook, but someone had already nominated the article for ITN/Recent Deaths, so I thought I'd focus on something else about her! Thanks for the speedy review, and have a great day!

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Ok, last one I can find quickly. This is a guardian article on Freya snoozing on the submarine. Don't know how wikipedia rates its sources but this might be considered more reliable than Ducth News.

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I am very sympathetic to the animal (heck, why else did I contribute so much to the article?), and am personally as angry as anyone about not knowing whether this was appropriate or not (I actually

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sources who report it also as that, as claimed, an "euthanasia". Did they not question it? Why were those sources so stupid, to repeat a word that is not accurate, because it wasn't an euthanasia?

1739:" I'm not sure how to interpret this, but it could mean that we might be able to have it in the article. Would likely involve some work determining what license this could be interpreted as. -- 1914: 2712: 3154:

for providing a neutral compromise! I would just say it might be useful to ensure the entire article is consistent with this wording, but I'll see if there's any consensus to change. :)

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As you can see, I'm still somewhat invested. Yet I believe I am not mistaken in my judgement, at least to the best of my ability, even after sleeping on it. And thus, I would get back to

2582:" We should refer back to the original Norwegian for clarity when citing contentious quotes so I sought out that source to establish exactly what the minister said about the ammunition. 648:

I'm coming across quite a few in Dutch but this one is in english. She made the news then when she was using a submarine of the Dutch navy to sunbathe in Den Helder, the Netherlands.

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I see an obvious alternate hook, how she had to be put down because people wouldn't leave her alone. Feel free to suggest one, but current one isn't bad either so I'm approving. --

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if it would be okay with you, we could shelve this discussion, and return to it later. For now, I'd definitely add a small note that mentions the use of "kill" vs "euthanize". --

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Interestingly, for the latter two options there is actually some reason for debate. I'll list those sources currently in the article by what their headlines call the incident:

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Haha, it's fun to play around with. I've got my April Fools Day cap on. I'm happy with ALT2c. Approved. (Unless you want to go with my playful one which I'm fine with too).--

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Some critics have suggested that the action was taken to protect the fishing and whaling industries of Norway from the public developing too much sympathy for marine mammals

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ALT2fake is not factually correct, because if you read carefully the sources actually say that she only rested on the submarine while it was in port. So, no actual sailing

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Just wanted to pop in here – are there other example articles of wildlife that got put down on Knowledge (XXG) that we could draw from, in terms of wording? I agree that

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I have added back in the news about Stena, in a different way. I have also added a section about the "why did she travel" question. Are you okay with how it looks now? --

2230:; in the folkspeech, though, it has come to have a bit of a visceral effect and is not neutral and thus not appropriate, however literary WP seeks to be; so it won't do. 800: 586: 147: 3053:

That's better. It's not quite clear which official statement is being referred to though and I'm not sure we have a link or citation yet. Presumably it's this one:

1290:'s assessment above with the review, wouldn't change a thing. Regarding the hook, it's a bit ambiguous whether Freya herself "sunk several boats". Perhaps a rephrase? 2015: 834: 1601:

My personal preference is ALT2c, although I really like the April Fool idea, but I think the hook has more potential as a non-AF hook rather than vice-versa. :)

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I'm formally opposing any more changes to the article's use of "euthanasia" at present, per reasoning given above. Let's keep cool and distance ourselves (

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authorities were concerned (and as described by multiple reliable sources like the BBC). Again, thankyou for finding these sources, and have a great day!

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that the two incidents are related causally. There's imo a bit of leeway with what's considered hooky and what not; your call. Anyway, maybe you'd like

3071:. I found the latter follow-up after noticing that there was a spike in readership recently and Google News put this at the top of their news search. 1183: 865: 701: 582: 1480:

better? It has more separation between the two events, but maintain both aspects for which Freya was known. (actually I found that the sources say

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has "kill, put to death, put down". The word "euthanasia" seems to have appeared in English-language media but their choice of language has been

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But maybe lots of people thought that Caesar deserved to die? Maybe he was terminally ill, and Brutus really did him a favour. Do we really know?

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The lacking info now is, that Stena too came all the way South and then headed for the eastern Baltic. She was no zoo animal... But up to you.--

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Thankyou! Although I don't think the reliability of Dutchnews is a problem, although it's always worth to be sure! Have an amazing day!

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have studied Freya)! I am not a veterinarian, so I would likely have had no idea whether she was healthy if I had stood before her

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I had a quick look around, no English source that I can find as of yet but there is one from the Norwegian state broadcaster NRK.

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Opinions on this? An alternative might be to explain the issue in the article, though I'm not sure how that would best be done. --

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https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/12/freya-the-walrus-norway-officials-warn-of-euthanasia-risk-if-crowds-dont-stay-away

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The walrus was shot with a rifle. The minister was coy about the ammunition but presumably it was a high-powered rifle (see

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are pretty flimsy (what kind of examination did they do to determine that Freya was "likely stressed"?). In the interests of

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synonym. Most such sources seem to say "euthanise" or "put down", rather than "kill" or "murder", and so should we.

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that they had to put Freya to death, to euthanise her, because she was a) sick and b) a threat to society (latter one

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https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/nov/03/walrus-leaves-arctic-comfort-zone-for-snooze-on-dutch-submarine

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https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/nov/03/walrus-leaves-arctic-comfort-zone-for-snooze-on-dutch-submarine

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https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/nov/03/walrus-leaves-arctic-comfort-zone-for-snooze-on-dutch-submarine

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that it was not). But I'd personally like to keep this just to the sources, so as to stay as NPOV as possible. --

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is not listed there as an example directly; and actually, in the animal euthansia lede we are given euphemisms

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Thanks for trying to find a compromise, but it does seem a bit wordy and clunky. Not really the best solution.

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into the article, so we first need sources that discuss this question. We can discuss here how to proceed.

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So, I'm thinking we should expand the note to clarify and explain more, while we still have fresh links.

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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join

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I made a good search for sources about the killing and the two which I used in the recent update were:

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The story, it would appear, is not quite done. Apparently she is getting a statue. (source in Dutch)

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makes it clear that a rifle was used with the ammunition normally used to kill that sort of creature.

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happened and best facilitates the reader to from their own opinion. What does everyone else think?

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You can not, or you have not been able to yet, convince me that the reason for using "killing" is

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simply declares her "dead". My French is much worse, but again I see a lot of "euthanasia", e.g.

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I changed the infobox cause of death from "euthanasia" to "shooting", with the word linking to

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As you have previousely participated in this discussion, what do you think @{u|Ghmyrtle}} and

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https://www.dutchnews.nl/news/2021/10/travelling-walrus-hitches-a-lift-with-dutch-submarine/

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euthanasia, such as "put down". But although I don't believe the term animal euthanasia is

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I also disagree with your other point, that the reasons for using euthanaize are "flimsy".

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to add "conspiracy theorist" to it), but I don't see how that applies here: Euthanasia is

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Approving ALT1 also; my personal preference is that one, but promoter may chose either. --

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Fiskeridirektoratet har vært sparsommelige med detaljer om forløpet da Freya ble avlivet.

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is maybe going a bit far with their general criticism and speculation of motivation ("

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As much as I sympathise with the feeling that her death was unjustified, I agree with

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an explanatory note sounds ideal, and should hopefully avoid problems in the future.—

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I can't find it atm), i.e. not merely calling it a killing, but calling it a killing

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requires us to use value-free language except where we are attributing the opinion.

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below.

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health was justified. Who knows, in time sources might become available on that. --

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what kind of examination did they do to determine that Freya was "likely stressed"?

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seem to use "euthanasia", even the notoriously sensational (and mostly unreliable)

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Marthe Øvergård; Andreas Bakke Foss; Arnhild Aass Kristiansen (16 August 2022),

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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as

481: 456: 1292: 376: 289: 2952:, as this is the most accurate description of cause of death, and instead of 2801:

I just realized I'm a little invested, too. Gotta remind myself that I don't

3180:

https://nos.nl/artikel/2473247-standbeeld-in-oslo-voor-dwalende-walrus-freya

1715: 1472: 1374: 1336: 1176: 823: 776: 575: 542: 283: 265: 196: 2707:" – that's reading a bit too involved, imo. I've also been in contact with 1928:

No, it isn't, since murder is legally defined as the unlawful killing of a

1314:

Hm true, she did cause the sinking, but ofc accidentally. How about instead

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if it is a killing of a political figure committed for political reasons;

2162:(which I wouldn't have because it was forbidden, but that's not the point) 3004:

and the footnote saying that "euthanised" was in the official statement.

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On a related matter, how exactly did they kill Freya? Firing squad, like

1786:, I have removed a paragraph you added about another walrus named Stena ( 685:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-59636151

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A news item involving Freya (walrus) was featured on Knowledge (XXG)'s

2837:– including me, yes. Wait, which people do you mean exactly? You, me, 2305:

concerned) not recover from, which fits the definition of euthanasia.

1583:

I'd say your call on whether you want this for April Fools or not. --

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Hmm, I still prefer mine, but I admit that this is also a nice one. @

1231:

Love it! Let's go with your one (Alt2), Thankyou for drafting it up!

827: 762:), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. 400: 312: 1345:

That sounds less intentional, but still retains the hooky aspect. --

2719:

a contentious or value-laden word (unless referring ofc to human,

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a photo showing her in front of a (censored) crowd is captioned "

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if it is an animal being prepared for butchering; and of course

1484:, so I guess we can use the active rather than the passive) -- 1254:

Splendid. We only need another reviewer to approve ALT2 now. --

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Template:Did you know nominations/Eurovision Song Contest 1956

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Also a valid aproach. Reminds me of the whole capitol affair

1625:(this time for real, you can move it to approved now @admins) 2656:. "Euthanised" is not a good general term as it suggests a 950:

Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems

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unjustified killing. I hope that this also works for you @

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and this is not what was done. "Shot" seems more precise.

3198:

https://www.nrk.no/norge/freya-statuen-avduket-1.16392565

2409:

Only been a few days, but the BBC has done this article:

1979:. We should use the term used in reliable sources, or a 2705:

they naturally want to use a bland euphemism in their PR

2877:(Let's stick with Caesar as an example, more distance.) 2808:"I believe we didn't bring this article up to shape to" 2610:"A Famous Walrus Is Killed, and Norwegians Are Divided" 2474:

nor I were unaware of this. I'd like to point out that

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But that's the POV of the people who did the killing.

2624:"Skjøt Freya med rifle og fraktet henne vekk med båt" 1003: 943: 903: 2205:

if what is being killed is a foetus. Further, it is

398:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 311:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 1335:before causing the sinking of several boats in the 1010:Hook has been verified by provided inline citation 174: 2835:Lots of other people think that this was quite bad 2470:was discussed throroughly above, I think; neither 1971:What editors think is of no relevance - we do not 2209:if the one being killed is a condemned prisoner; 2956:, which can sound a little emotive, I'd propose 2411:Freya the walrus: Did she have to be euthanised? 587:Template:Did you know nominations/Freya (walrus) 491:, a project which is currently considered to be 33:for general discussion of the article's subject. 665:Brilliant, Thankyou so much! Have a great day! 2887:). I think not. I think we must, until we are 1188:https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62539485 1113:I like your thinking! I'll draft one up ASAP! 838:https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62539485 2896:killing was unjustified, that animal welfare 2703:). I don't want to dismiss your points, but " 2366:? The sources seem curiously coy about this. 8: 764:No further edits should be made to this page 583:Knowledge (XXG):Recent additions/2022/August 3150:Just like to chime in and say Thankyou to @ 3063:which may be translated in various ways – 2325:(ugh I really don't want to start on that) 1778:I removed a paragraph about Walrus "Stena" 612: 451: 344: 260: 2875:assassinations, and not e.g. executions. 2713:heplped defend it from some bogus attempt 2010:(or related euphemisms like "put down"): 555:). The text of the entry was as follows: 2863:to use words that reliable sources use. 2259:because euthanasia is not the right word 1445:(if you can even sail a submarine... ^^) 593: 503:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Marine life 453: 346: 262: 232: 3129: 2834: 2815: 2807: 2704: 2483: 2156: 1736: 1714:, and later sank several boats in the 1481: 1471:, and later sunk several boats in the 1209:Would that one be acceptable for you @ 910:Article is new enough and long enough 826:was nicknamed after the Norse goddess 574:, and later sunk several boats in the 3254:Knowledge (XXG) Did you know articles 2810:– yeah that reads a bit protective... 2261:. Then we'd have a watertight reason. 1915:2001:56A:FC0D:DA00:C70:B532:1D25:CB4C 1373:before she sunk several boats in the 581:A record of the entry may be seen at 7: 3224:Knowledge (XXG) In the news articles 1908:Is "murder" really an accurate word? 1175:before sinking several boats in the 487:This article is within the scope of 392:This article is within the scope of 305:This article is within the scope of 3056:Hvalrossen i Oslofjorden er avlivet 683:The BBC picked her up in Scotland. 414:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Mammals 23:for discussing improvements to the 2854:to make the article more neutral. 2827:more important). And then we have 1882:try and create her own article at 325:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Norway 14: 2608:Jason Horowitz (19 August 2022), 2413:. Thought it might be useful! :) 760:Knowledge (XXG) talk:Did you know 50:New to Knowledge (XXG)? Welcome! 1946:I'd have to disagree with you, @ 1663: 1627:. I've struck the other ones. -- 1291: 1249: 1131: 1057: 1029: 1021: 992: 972: 961: 932: 921: 530: 506:Template:WikiProject Marine life 480: 455: 379: 369: 348: 292: 282: 264: 233: 188: 45:Click here to start a new topic. 2865:Shinzo Abe wasn't just "killed" 1737:Free use of photos with credit. 1282:Happy to jump in. I agree with 747:Please do not modify this page. 434:This article has been rated as 3244:Low-importance mammal articles 2170:(if you've had pets, you know) 1886:, that would be better imo. -- 1723:Potential photograph available 1195:It's even more hooky maybe. -- 541:appeared on Knowledge (XXG)'s 251:It is of interest to multiple 1: 2974:15:18, 4 September 2022 (UTC) 2091:goes with "killing", and then 408:and see a list of open tasks. 319:and see a list of open tasks. 42:Put new text under old text. 3249:WikiProject Mammals articles 3162:15:10, 12 October 2022 (UTC) 3146:10:16, 12 October 2022 (UTC) 3119:10:13, 12 October 2022 (UTC) 3086:09:56, 12 October 2022 (UTC) 3049:09:18, 12 October 2022 (UTC) 3014:21:36, 10 October 2022 (UTC) 2693:, and although that section 1528:was spotted publicly riding 1398:something cute like this. -- 417:Template:WikiProject Mammals 3234:WikiProject Norway articles 2988:07:01, 6 October 2022 (UTC) 2922:22:58, 25 August 2022 (UTC) 2829:several independet reliable 2780:09:46, 25 August 2022 (UTC) 2761:13:53, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2746:09:47, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2672:09:01, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2592:09:09, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2564:08:22, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2537:08:17, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2514:08:12, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2499:08:01, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2484:inappropriate and imprecise 2450:01:16, 24 August 2022 (UTC) 2423:07:27, 20 August 2022 (UTC) 2405:15:44, 19 August 2022 (UTC) 2376:02:48, 19 August 2022 (UTC) 2341:09:35, 18 August 2022 (UTC) 2319:19:43, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 2300:19:42, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 2278:18:45, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 2240:16:36, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 2226:is a neutral term too, but 2189:16:00, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 2143:I agree that "killed" is a 2132:15:37, 16 August 2022 (UTC) 2113:13:12, 16 August 2022 (UTC) 2074:10:36, 16 August 2022 (UTC) 2045:NU.nl ("gedood" = "killed") 1993:07:57, 16 August 2022 (UTC) 1965:07:49, 16 August 2022 (UTC) 1942:04:48, 16 August 2022 (UTC) 1923:01:59, 16 August 2022 (UTC) 1896:05:33, 15 August 2022 (UTC) 1877:21:29, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1863:21:21, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1842:20:39, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1819:20:22, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1804:20:16, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1772:18:11, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1749:17:29, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1678:21:04, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1637:20:55, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1611:20:43, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1593:20:38, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1568:19:28, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1494:19:19, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1408:17:04, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1393:15:35, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1355:15:03, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1306:05:13, 17 August 2022 (UTC) 1264:07:34, 15 August 2022 (UTC) 1241:06:53, 15 August 2022 (UTC) 1223:21:37, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1205:21:35, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1146:21:30, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1123:20:39, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1109:20:37, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1087:17:26, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1072:16:51, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 1040: 894:15:25, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 785:23:42, 18 August 2022 (UTC) 752:this nomination's talk page 727:18:13, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 713:17:28, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 696:16:57, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 675:16:57, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 661:16:55, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 644:16:42, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 627:16:36, 14 August 2022 (UTC) 328:Template:WikiProject Norway 3270: 3209:13:39, 29 April 2023 (UTC) 3191:13:30, 29 April 2023 (UTC) 3002:Animal euthanasia#Shooting 2691:animal euthanasia#Shooting 2572:Good point. For example, 2168:, euthanazia is warranted 1428:sailed to the Netherlands? 822:who sunk several boats in 551:column on 24 August 2022 ( 440:project's importance scale 2885:"Severus . . . please..." 1623:it is, as approved above 1532:off the coast of Holland? 1482:occasionally sinking them 475: 433: 364: 277: 259: 80:Be welcoming to newcomers 1154:No wait, how about this: 3239:C-Class mammal articles 3229:C-Class Norway articles 756:the article's talk page 737:Did you know nomination 489:WikiProject Marine life 3059:. This uses the word 2721:involuntary euthanasia 2699:is not sourced, there 1762:?). Have a great day! 1754:Thanks for the photo @ 1469:Walrus-class submarine 1371:Walrus-class submarine 1333:Walrus-class submarine 1173:Walrus-class submarine 859:Walrus-class submarine 598: 241:This article is rated 222: 75:avoid personal attacks 3126:Sentient Media source 1707:was spotted riding a 1520:: ... that in 2021 a 1467:was spotted riding a 1369:was spotted riding a 1331:was spotted riding a 1171:was spotted riding a 892:). Self-nominated at 857:was spotted riding a 596: 567:was spotted riding a 245:on Knowledge (XXG)'s 220: 100:Neutral point of view 1704:a walrus named Freya 1464:a walrus named Freya 1383:How about this one? 1366:a walrus named Freya 1328:a walrus named Freya 1168:a walrus named Freya 981:copyright violations 854:a walrus named Freya 564:a walrus named Freya 509:Marine life articles 105:No original research 3107:Ineffablebookkeeper 3097:sounds good to me. 3026:Ineffablebookkeeper 2962:Ineffablebookkeeper 2552:no:Freya (hvalross) 2364:Harambe the gorilla 2164:. I only know that 1418:: ... that in 2021 395:WikiProject Mammals 2615:The New York Times 2228:only in literature 1977:right great wrongs 1693:per discussion at 989:close paraphrasing 599: 308:WikiProject Norway 247:content assessment 223: 86:dispute resolution 47: 2878: 2811: 2735: 2698: 2476:animal euthanasia 2326: 2171: 2163: 2055:(e.g. murder): – 1697:. 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