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1251:. That has 44Â Ă— "Shooting of" and only 2Â Ă— "Killing of". All of those are about people killed by shooting. Note that there was a previous RM six months ago for this page where I started the discussion, but no actual statistics were offered in that prior discussion, and there was a lack of consensus declared (in a non-admin closure) despite there being only one expression of opposition to the move and two supporting expressions. Note that there is also a related active RM discussion at
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have been a good decision, because the people who have commented so far don't seem to be advocating something different for each of the three titles. But that does sometimes happen in
Knowledge multi-page move discussions. Multi-page move proposals are quite common on Knowledge when the motivation for changing the titles of several pages is the same, and consistency is desired. —
238:
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1598:– Per COMMONNAME. On Google, "Killing of Atatiana Jefferson" for example has 2X as many results. Knowledge is operating in a vacuum to force this title for consistency that was established for no reason. These people were killed. This is so racist. How can no one see that. (I know Duncan Lemp was white.)---
1883:
The reason these three articles should be considered together, in my opinion, is that I am proposing a consistent form for the title for all three of them (a title of the form "Shooting of") and because they are the only three articles in a large category that I noticed that clearly did not have that
2067:
policy with regard to existing "Shooting of..." and "Killing of..." articles titles, and 2) the greater specificity that "Shooting of..." affords over "Killing of...", as killing by gun violence is a specific aspect of victimhood and some editors believe it should be highlighted as it's own form of
1964:
Yes, I did think I could anticipate the type of comments that other editors would be making – I thought the comments would be similar for all three of these articles. It is possible that my anticipation could be proven wrong, of course – that sometimes happens in multi-page move discussions, and
1849:
Sounds like you should make a "support" or "oppose" comment in this thread, and then make your best case argument as to which specific articles should be named the same or named differently, thus providing your reasoned input for everyone to consider in this centrally located discussion. Regards,
1892:
in the category and that its title was also an outlier.) If I started three separate discussions, the people involved in the discussions would be jumping from Talk page to Talk page making the same type of comments in three different places, which would be annoying and time-consuming. It seems to
2062:
comment opposed. Rationale for the one oppose was WP:COMMONNAME for one of the three affected articles (Killing of
Atatiana Jefferson) and the sincerely held belief that moving the article's name would be racist. Consensus rationale for the supporting comments center around 1) Article Title
2077:
with header notices posted on all three articles. Editors who disagree with the outcome here may want to immediately launch another solo RM on a given article if they feel that article's situation is unique and warrants reconsideration, especially if there are additional facts that were not
1812:
Separate discussions are not preferable. With regard to your concern, editors should take into account whether specific articles should be treated differently (if deviations are required) when they consider the multiple articles in question. Having the discussion in one place is better for
2164:
As has been brought to light at trial, contrary to news reports, the officers were not performing a "Welfare check", but were responding to an "open structure" call. This is a a critical distinction as it has impact on what the police policy is for response to these calls.
1345:
There are many "Killing of" articles already, and it would be ideal if we were consistent. While that's a fine longer-term goal, I think the scope of this poll is limited to just these three. So, yes, I do support these three being renamed to "Killing of".
2072:
Additional editor commented to provide their opinion that separate RM procedures were preferable to a collective RM discussion for the three articles, but there was no support from other participants in the discussion and the RM was a properly formatted
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190:
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I added before that her sister Amber Carr who is her nephews mother died in
January 2023 then it was removed by user:WWGB who said it was irrelevant to the page but if it is not relevant than how are her parents deaths relevant?
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153:
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1944:, and deaths as a result of firearm use, as in the case of the three headers in question. Since all three were victims of gun violence, the same arguments are applicable in the formulation of their articles' main headers. —
1831:. Why would the titles of these 3 articles be lumped together? From where are you deriving that these 3 articles should be treated alike as regards their titles? Based on what? I would compare this discussion to playing
1783:
There are page move notifications at the top of all three articles, with links that direct back here to this one discussion, so we needn't worry that editors who watch those pages will overlook this. Regards,
1868:
You are entitled to that view. And it may be a defensible view under some circumstances. But concerning these 3 articles, why would it be advantageous to discuss the titles of these 3 articles all at once?
1444:" headers, a number of nominations featuring these forms have become akin to uncontroversial technical requests — passing with only a single vote — as in the case of the mentioned-in-the-nomination
880:
340:
2145:. The page had originally been at that title and was moved to "Shooting of" to be consistent with other similar pages, but this naming convention should change such pages to this language.
2286:
1908:"If I started three separate discussions, the people involved in the discussions would be jumping from Talk page to Talk page making the same type of comments in three different places"
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Obviously separate discussions are preferable. What is the argument for combining these 3 discussions? Possible title revisions should be specific to the article under consideration.
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Jefferson had a gun and was pointing it towards the window/cops, so why is this murder instead of self defense? Someone explain this to me otherwise it seems like anti cop bias.
44:
1965:
it is part of the purpose of having a discussion. But so far, I think my anticipation has not been proven wrong. We will see what happens as the discussion proceeds further. —
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be discussed at this article's Talk page? A "move" is pertinent to one article. These should be discussed on their respective pages. This discussion should only be about the
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all 3 per nom, especially Duncan Lemp killing, though I will note that my reason for voting how I did was based on the firearm use taking precedence over the death. -
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2001:" and the three articles in question center upon shootings of those three individuals, the intuitive form for the headers of the three articles is, naturally, "
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1676:. Also, I don't think that WP:COMMONNAME really applies in this situation as "Killing of" vs "Shooting of" vs "Death of" are just title descriptors.
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agree that death as a result of gun violence is a very specific aspect of victimhood and needs to be highlighted as a separate form of killing. —
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If all main title headers of
Knowledge articles focusing upon individual deaths, both violent and non-violent, were to use the single form "
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Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a
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1981:"Since all three were victims of gun violence, the same arguments are applicable in the formulation of their articles' main headers"
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This article has previously been nominated to be moved. Please review the prior discussions if you are considering re-nomination.
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The three main headers nominated in this RM are inconsistent with generally accepted header forms for this type of content and "
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Why should these 3 articles be considered together? I hope that's not too difficult a question for you to address. You say
1440:" is inconsistent even as far as the basic form of its header in concerned. Possibly as a reflection of the acceptance of "
576:
on
Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions.
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Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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have demonstrated that
Wikipedians prefer more specific headers which differentiate between historical events, such as
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The name should be
Shooting Of... for reasons mentioned above, especially, but not exclusively, as described by
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1983:? That could properly be considered your proposal rather than something Knowledge as a whole has agreed upon.
1294:
The fact that they were shot and not stabbed or clubbed is irrelevant. What matters is that they were killed.
2200:
They're not and I don't see them mentioned in the article. Can you point me to the part that mentions them?
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1932:", there would be no need for this discussion. However, as mentioned above, discussions such as the one at
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Bus stop, since among main title headers for
Knowledge articles are numerous ones that use the form "
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consistency and overall visibility of the relevant arguments that affect all the articles. Regards,
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It most certainly can imply intent to kill: "killing--an act in which someone is deliberately killed"
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after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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considered in this collective RM discussion. For the foregoing reasons, non-admin closing now as
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on
Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
732:
on
Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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1910:. That in and of itself is fascinating—it sounds like you feel that you already know the
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concerns in attributing bad intent to living persons, and "killing" implies bad intent.
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wasn't even in the category yet, but then I added the third one after noticing that it
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for all the reasons above which can be summarized as it is a more neutral title.
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May I assume you would suggest renaming all those "Shooting of X" articles? —
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572:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the
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Category:People shot dead by law enforcement officers in the United States
1409:, English Knowledge has numerous main title headers under six forms — "
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Talk:Shooting of Yoshihiro Hattori#Requested move 16 October 2018
1489:
Talk:Shooting of Yoshihiro Hattori#Requested move 16 October 2018
1269:
Talk:Shooting of Terence Crutcher#Requested move 23 November 2019
1273:
Talk:Shooting of Patrick Harmon#Requested move 24 November 2019)
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per nomination, per Love of Corey and, indeed, per consistency.
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Talk:Shooting of Randolph Evans#Requested move 14 October 2019
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Oh sorry I didn’t notice that they were removed before. Lol
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It doesn't even imply intent to kill, much less bad intent.
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Talk:Shooting of Ahmaud Arbery#Requested move 12 May 2020
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Knowledge:Requested moves#Requesting multiple page moves
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form. (I actually started only with the first two, and
1835:. It is much more difficult than the standard version.
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1701:- Support all moves in the interest of consistency. --
160:
1056:. Please replace this template with a more specific
927:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
728:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
390:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
301:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of
2143:Knowledge:Naming conventions (violence and deaths)
1247:– For consistency and reduced sensationalism. See
2287:C-Class United States articles of Low-importance
481:, a project which is currently considered to be
33:for general discussion of the article's subject.
1979:From where do you (Roman Spinner) derive that
1564:for consistency with other similar articles.
1143:This page has archives. Sections older than
174:
8:
2257:Low-importance Black Lives Matter articles
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1866:"Separate discussions are not preferable."
1467:In fact, a number of Wikipedians, such as
1167:The following is a closed discussion of a
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1071:may be able to locate suitable images on
2267:Low-importance African diaspora articles
315:Knowledge:WikiProject Black Lives Matter
2327:Low-importance Law enforcement articles
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493:Knowledge:WikiProject Dallas-Fort Worth
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318:Template:WikiProject Black Lives Matter
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1153:when more than 5 sections are present.
496:Template:WikiProject Dallas-Fort Worth
404:Knowledge:WikiProject African diaspora
2282:Low-importance United States articles
2272:WikiProject African diaspora articles
855:Knowledge:WikiProject Law Enforcement
407:Template:WikiProject African diaspora
7:
2332:WikiProject Law Enforcement articles
1940:, or non-shooting killings, such as
1186:The result of the move request was:
921:This article is within the scope of
858:Template:WikiProject Law Enforcement
722:This article is within the scope of
566:This article is within the scope of
477:This article is within the scope of
384:This article is within the scope of
295:This article is within the scope of
2342:All WikiProject Women-related pages
2252:C-Class Black Lives Matter articles
2160:"Welfare check" vs "open structure"
1190:. See closing comments at bottom.
613:Knowledge:WikiProject United States
254:It is of interest to the following
23:for discussing improvements to the
2337:C-Class WikiProject Women articles
2307:WikiProject United States articles
616:Template:WikiProject United States
14:
2262:C-Class African diaspora articles
2100:The discussion above is closed.
1147:may be automatically archived by
1069:Openverse Creative Commons Search
2322:C-Class Law enforcement articles
1581:in the interest of consistency.
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45:Click here to start a new topic.
2054:: The closing !VOTE count was
1914:other editors would be making.
875:This article has been rated as
762:This article has been rated as
633:This article has been rated as
424:This article has been rated as
335:This article has been rated as
2277:C-Class United States articles
1265:Shooting of Markeis McGlockton
1253:Talk:Shooting of Ahmaud Arbery
1219:Shooting of Atatiana Jefferson
1010:Shooting of Atatiana Jefferson
992:Shooting of Atatiana Jefferson
298:WikiProject Black Lives Matter
1:
2317:Low-importance Death articles
2297:Low-importance Texas articles
2155:14:25, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
2131:01:48, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
1745:Killing of Atatiana Jefferson
1214:Killing of Atatiana Jefferson
1046:Killing of Atatiana Jefferson
1006:Killing of Atatiana Jefferson
988:Killing of Atatiana Jefferson
935:and see a list of open tasks.
736:and see a list of open tasks.
671:This article is supported by
479:WikiProject Dallas-Fort Worth
398:and see a list of open tasks.
309:and see a list of open tasks.
42:Put new text under old text.
25:Killing of Atatiana Jefferson
2235:18:45, 17 October 2023 (UTC)
2221:18:29, 17 October 2023 (UTC)
2195:18:15, 17 October 2023 (UTC)
2175:15:06, 6 December 2022 (UTC)
387:WikiProject African diaspora
941:Knowledge:WikiProject Women
834:WikiProject Law Enforcement
827:This article is within the
742:Knowledge:WikiProject Death
321:Black Lives Matter articles
50:New to Knowledge? Welcome!
2368:
2352:Knowledge requested images
2347:WikiProject Women articles
2302:WikiProject Texas articles
2075:multiple page request move
1458:Shooting of Randolph Evans
1450:Shooting of Patrick Harmon
1257:Shooting of Trayvon Martin
1160:Requested move 14 May 2020
947:WikiProject Women articles
944:Template:WikiProject Women
768:project's importance scale
745:Template:WikiProject Death
639:project's importance scale
499:Dallas-Fort Worth articles
430:project's importance scale
2141:I've moved per policy at
1446:Killing of Patrick Harmon
1261:Shooting of Michael Brown
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569:WikiProject United States
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80:Be welcoming to newcomers
2102:Please do not modify it.
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1938:Death of Edgar Allan Poe
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1230:Shooting of Edmund Perry
1207:17:32, 21 May 2020 (UTC)
1174:Please do not modify it.
1036:It is requested that an
986:, 2 December 2019, from
861:Law enforcement articles
574:United States of America
1833:Three-dimensional chess
1454:Death of Randolph Evans
1241:Shooting of Duncan Lemp
1225:Killing of Edmund Perry
2312:C-Class Death articles
2292:C-Class Texas articles
1065:Free Image Search Tool
1058:media request template
1032:
651:
619:United States articles
244:This article is rated
75:avoid personal attacks
2058:comments in support,
1942:Killing of Tim McLean
1739:. Why would multiple
1031:
650:
199:Auto-archiving period
100:Neutral point of view
1075:and other web sites.
1004:, 21 May 2020, from
561:United States portal
105:No original research
1886:Duncan Lemp killing
1438:Duncan Lemp killing
1423:Assassination of...
1236:Duncan Lemp killing
1054:improve its quality
1052:in this article to
587:Articles Requested!
1912:"type of comments"
1405:As I mentioned at
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312:Black Lives Matter
303:Black Lives Matter
275:Black Lives Matter
250:content assessment
86:dispute resolution
47:
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2121:comment added by
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2117:— Preceding
2114:
2111:Self defense
2101:
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2084:AzureCitizen
2082:. Regards,
2079:
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1852:AzureCitizen
1815:AzureCitizen
1786:AzureCitizen
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1665:struck per
1431:Death of...
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1322:BarrelProof
1312:struck per
1277:BarrelProof
1255:. See also
1179:move review
1150:ClueBot III
148:free images
31:not a forum
2246:Categories
2068:killing.
1678:Rreagan007
1630:Rreagan007
1624:There are
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1014:discussion
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1383:per nom.
1117:Archive 1
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71:Be polite
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186:Archives
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191:Index
169:JSTOR
130:books
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