Talk:Richard Mellon Scaife - Knowledge (XXG)

1976:"wrote that he responded by calling her a "fucking Communist cunt" and telling her to "get out of here."" Am I alone in wondering what the import of this is? An obscure, untaped event without witnesses is said to have happened 25 years ago -- an event much disputed by the subject of the story -- is included here, it seems, only because it seems so salacious. It adds nothing to our understanding of the man, just as the original CJR article suffers from a non-POV bias. It's ironic that someone mustered the gumption to suggest that there should be an entry for Karen Rothmeyer, about as minor a figure one can find in American journalism. In the corpus of her work, one finds few stories that do NOT harp on Dick Scaife, her bete noire. Did she put this chestnut into the encyclopedic entry in order to revive a career that's best considered moribund? 887: 1960:"Scaife's interest in politics was influenced by four factors." But this is mere conjecture. Do we have an interview wherein he says as much? Or the work of a political analyst who will say what drove Scaife to become interested in conservative thought? Some of this seems absurd -- He was fond of newspapers as a child? His father's alleged service in the OSS? Come on. He might invest in newspapers as an adult because of a childhood fondness for the written word; he might donate to anti-communist causes because of some nostalgia for his father's deeds in WWII. But it seems implausible to suggest that he embarked on a jihad against the Left because he liked Dear Abby and his father, supposedly, was a spy. 1039:, have repeatedly added information about Clinton perhaps as if to offset Scaife's funding of the "Arkansas Project". Is the addition intended to show that Scaife was justified in doing so? Right now it comes off as almost a non-sequitor, ad hominem attack on Clinton. That may be why it has been removed again and again. (By comparison, we also wouldn't add a paragraph to an article on Khrushchev about Kennedy's womanizing in order to justify some KGB subterfuge.) Can you explain here why you think it is important to a biography on Scaife? Maybe we can find a way of incorporating it more logically. Finally, while anonymous edits are allowed, every editor is expected to sign his or her contributions to the 1948:"Charitable foundations are required to disburse at least 5% of their assets annually, forcing Scaife to become a philanthropist." But above we learned that Scaife's mother encouraged him to become active in philanthropy. Wherefore this compulsion to give away money? From the shift in the tax laws? Or because he already had been doing it, or came from a family that did it? The Scaife charities managed to spend enough charitable money finding a cure for polio, so perhaps the 501(c) regulations might have had little to do with the push to give. Or, most likely, it's a combination of the two. Regardless, this is so poorly sourced and badly written, one can't make a decision about the issue. 1997:"President Clinton later admitted to sexual indiscretions, but the other allegations that came out of the Arkansas Project were never proven." Wasn't the allegation that he lied under oath also "proven," or did I miss something? I thought the drive for the stories wasn't that Clinton engaged in sexual misconduct, but that he displayed a pattern of covering up the allegations, to the point of perjuring himself? Just as one would be fair to Bill Clinton, one should try to be fair to Dick Scaife, who seems to have had little influence on all of this aside from giving money to organizations that did have a bone to pick with the president. 1954:"While his mother preferred to give to the arts, libraries and population control projects, her son gave heavily to anti-communist organizations." But some of the source material from journals of some reputation listed here indicate that he continued to give "heavily" to non-political causes. In fact, that might comprise the vast bulk of his giving, not political donations. Have PBS, Planned Parenthood and Goodwill Industries become tools of the vast right-wing conspiracy? It seems the entry can't even decide which is which. Perhaps it would be better to simply drop the non-POV language. 1982:"Reporter Marisol Bello depicted his boss" Sigh. I've already pointed out that "Marisol" is a woman's name. I corrected the obvious error, and it was reverted by one of the savants who run Knowledge (XXG). Amateurs! If you don't realize that one of the most popular names in the Latin languages might be female, then don't start non-POV screeds by slurring her work. She's a reporter for the Detroit Free-Press, one of the nation's most respected daily newspapers. Give her the respect she's due by not suggesting that she wrote a portrayal of her "boss" because of some cash compulsion. 980:

never tested in court. The Namebase link contained third-hand hearsay and innuendo based on the already dubious Quinde affidavit. Link deleted. The link to LaRouche's EIR should be sufficient, although I personally think all links on Knowledge (XXG) to LaRouche articles should note their frequent lack of reliabilty as a source of information. As a leftist who has written a print encyclopedia entry on Scaife, I have to say this is otherwise an excellent job. Sorting the facts from rumors and smears about Scaife must have been quite a task. I think the facts speak for themselves.--

331: 310: 430: 403: 750: 1742:: Richard Mellon Scaife's philanthropy has come from family trusts set up by his mother, four foundations and his own checkbook. The trusts expired in the 1980s. The tax law required Scaife to become a philanthropist. The foundations he inherited had to give away 5 percent of their assets every year. He can deduct the amount of each gift he makes from his taxable income, which – given the billion dollars or so in his personal fortune – is presumably substantial." 740: 719: 440: 619: 545: 533: 2006:"Pittsburgh World Affairs Council" Is that really a "conservative" or "libertarian" clique? I checked out the reporting on it and it seems to be mostly a luncheon group, mainly for school children, in Pittsburgh. It's also 75 years old. Certainly it's existence pre-dates much of the debate over Bill Clinton, post-war Communism and Ken Starr. It's this sort of fact-challenged writing that damns this entry. 240: 222: 609: 581: 685: 595: 1951:"The inherited Mellon fortune allowed Scaife to pursue his political activism." But in other parts of the encyclopedic entry, it's suggested that he was involved in politics BEFORE his father and mother passed away. He obviously was pursuing "political activism" before they died and left him a vast fortune. This seems like non-POV conjecture, and it's poorly phrased anyway. 191: 852: 1985:"Scaife, however, was closely involved in his empire's coverage" Non-POV use of "empire." What "empire?" Has this been properly sourced? How closely involved? None of the sources listed in the article, expect some conjecture from a Harvard Speakout diatribe, makes the case. In fact, the Washington Post and others mentioned here speak to the opposite. 919: 1813:

hand, I don't know that we need to repeat the exact expletive that Scaife used. I don't object to censoring it for the children and instead saying that he used a "crude epithet", or similar description. By all means it should be handled in an NPOV manner. I also agree that the use of "Dick" mid article is odd. I'll go take care of that. Cheers, -

250: 1304:

someone's imagination. Even when you tack on the disclaimer, the raising of the issue smears the man accused of it. It's sort of like saying, "Joe Smith was said to have beaten his wife, but it was never proven." Who said it? Why was it never proven? Why mention it unless you want to demean Smith or his wife?

1010:

Scaife at the home of John Train to talk about LaRouche. I used "facilitated" to try to attain a NPOV that the LaRouche supporters would accept. If they object to that, funding is just plain not proven, so I have stated the facts as documented. Now it just looks silly. I think it should just be deleted. --

2093:

I also added a little bit of lead information re: the paper, just to show a bit of the timeline of how it grew. I grew up in Greensburg, and my parents had the original Tribune-Review delivered to the door every day. It was a sleepy little paper, the kind where "editing" an article just meant you cut

1839:

Perhaps the previous editor lacks the proper objectivity to edit this encylopedic effort? He or she obviously doesn't appear particularly clever -- at least neither bright enough to realize that "Marisol" is a female title for many thousands of Latinas nor so intelligent as to realize that the links

1812:

Anecdotes are legitimate material in biographies. We should not limit ourselves to only dry summaries. Life is a drama. This particular case is well-known. It illustrates Scaife's personality. The fact that a website is no longer operating does not mean that the event no longer happened. On the other

1659:

check to see that it's comprehensive? We shouldn't suddenly introduce our readers to a wife in this manner, peeking in the windows. Let's nail down the weddings, divorces, children, and other hard facts, and present them clearly. As with many of our older subjects, this biography could become an obit

1503:

While there is evidence that Sciafe has conservative, right wing, and libertarian views, they are not clearly defined (according to the conventional uses of the terms) nor are they fixed. For those reasons it might be better to avoid labelling him with one or another political epithet as his primary

1478:

Let me get this straight. The competition published a piece written by an employee let go by the Tribune-Review years ago. The work, using anonymous quotes from "one employee" or "one mid-level editor," insists there will be "layoffs" at "everyone of the daily publications." The newspaper's editors,

1342:

I tweaked some wording from the Washington Post 1999 story on the Arkansas Project and also deleted the reference to Scaife-funded investigations of Bill Clinton when he was the governor of Arkansas. There is no evidence the man had any interest in Clinton when he was a relatively unknown leader of a

1149:

He was not removed from office during the impeachment vote, but was censored for his perjured testimony by the Congress. Both the U.S. Supreme Court and the Arkansas Supreme Court determined that his perjured testimony affected his ability to practice law. He did not challenge these civil hearings.

1130:

Right now, it sounds like you are saying "If Scaife funded it, and if the purpose was to find sexual dirt on Clinton, then the sexual dirt is relevent." You are saying the payments are alleged. The revelations certainly wouldn't be relevent if Scaife didn't make the payments. Do you believe that he

1024:

In its present form, this article is fair enough. I am concerned, however, about some rumors which continue to be raised (i.e.-- Scaife was somehow involved in CIA espionage) that have long been denied both by him and the agency. There seems little independent confirmation of the intelligence work,

2022:

It is very sad to note that in this case the points raised in the Biographies guidelines have not been followed. Rather than lay blame for these excesses, it is best to move on and try to be as fair to the subject as possible, even if one does not personally like his politics. That's what "neutral

1972:

Last time I checked, 200,000+ seems like a large number of subscribers. Was it small then? What was its circulation? And judging from related entries in the encyclopedia, it's not even clear that the Greensburg Tribune-Review was the primary chronicle of anti-Clinton stories. The Washington Post

1829:

This is inane because the Wiki article actually links to three other news sources (Washington Post and two NY papers) that are not owned by Scaife. We know from the links on this very page that he talked to them AND George AND one of his own reporters. So, obviously, this non-POV statement was not

1552:

Are there no "editors" in Knowledge (XXG) to police these sorts of things? Why isn't a crude, poorly written opinion piece by someone named "Chris Potter" (does he really exist?) at a tiny partisan press not discounted, when different versions of the same events from important news outlets carry the

1489:

Boy, you certainly do know a lot about the Pittsburgh newspaper market. It's a good thing we have you along. When did Trib-Review editors say that there would be no layoffs? Would editors, rather than business managers, be in a position to say? No, we don't know if they hired twenty more, but if you

1443:"They told us point-blank that there would be layoffs," said one employee at the Greensburg Tribune-Review who, like others, asked not to be identified. Workers at all of the affected papers said they were told the layoffs would hit every one of the company's daily publications, including Pittsburgh. 1333:

It's a good anecdote. Feel free to add it again, but it's best not to use the word "booted" unless you're quoting, in which case it needs quotation marks. At the end of the sentence, either link to the Post story again, or write the name of the book author and year of publication e.g. (Smith, 1979),

1328:

Hi. I found it in two sources. One, previously cited, in the 1999 Washington Post story. It referenced a book on the Mellon family by Burton Hersh (aptly called "The Mellon Family"). I looked up the reference in the 1978 book and it was accurate. It's not really essential, but it's such a colorful

1184:

The source was listed. It was a very large article by Marisol Bello, now of the Detroit Free Press. That's hardly a pro-Scaife outlet. A similar article in George also portrayed Scaife as hardly the scary monster of the far right this section seems to find him. I don't believe George is available

1145:

One of the targets of these investigations, however, did bear fruit. It was alleged that Clinton had engaged in a series of sexual affairs. That kicked off the Troopergate allegations that churned up a name, Paula Jones. Jones' civil suit required testimony from Bill Clinton, words that later were

1141:

First, I would like to see some record that showed Scaife's funding directly led to the Arkansas Project. It seems to me that he founded conservative groups that, in turn, investigated Clinton's activities while governor of Arkansas. I'm not sure that it's a clear match of dollars to probes because

2301:

Much of what is listed under 'philanthropy', namely monetary support for POLITICAL organizations, is not philanthropy - it is political activism. I think these two should be split into separate sections. The way the article is formatted now implies that rightist political organizations are by their

1925:

A good example might be the inclusion of the factoid that he owns 7.2% of NewsMax. First, it's unsourced. Second, it's meaningless. The Knowledge (XXG) contributors determined that it was more important that a man owns a bare minority of a company (if that's true; it's unsourced) as the fact that

1790:

The he-said/she-said pissing match between Scaife and the reporter is meaningless without access to the four or five-part series in the Columbia Journalism Review, which put the encounter in perspective and which is no longer online-- and that was stated in the deletion, contrary to your claim that

1409:

Dear "Anon": I'm sure you would know first if there are any layoffs. Maybe the President of the Trib-Review company lied. But he said there would be layoffs or, as he called them in the Trib-Review article, "staff reductions". Do you have any verifiable evidence that Harrell is wrong or a liar? If

1273:

Too bad Time, Newsweek, the NY Times, Washington Post, Los Angeles Times, et al, don't believe in leaving "it as is." It seems as if Clinton's misconduct has been proven beyond any doubt, seeing as it led to impeachment, censor, the loss of his right to practice law in Arkansas and before the U.S.

1794:

More specifically, what does the paragraph about that chance encounter tell us about the subject of the article that his life story, which I added awhile back, not tell us? His relationships with his family members are much more revealing about his character than a chance encounter with a reporter

1747:

I removed it did not belong in the intro, because we should summarize the info rather than simply quoting it, and because it is not clear about who is making the gifts- only Scaife's gifts to charities are deductible, not the gifts by the charities. The information on his fortune and trusts should

1383:

added the latest circulation numbers, and I added the recent consolidation. But Anon deleted the consolidation info. It seems just as relevent as the circulation numbers. The overall relevence, which might be pinned down further, is that I am not aware of any other business that Scaife is involved

1179:

Inconvenient facts, known to nearly all Pittsburghers but somehow mysterious to the editors of this "biography" -- Scaife is very active in numerous board meetings and charity events in California, Pennsylvania and Florida. But don't let a good, spooky image of the "extremely private and taciturn"

2164:

The Pittsburgh Post Gazette has uncovered some accidentially unsealed documents from Scaife's divorce, and has posted them online. Are these appropriate materials to cite? Even though they are supposed to be secret, they have been published by a respected news organization. Is this similar to the

1885:

One also wonders about the reasons listed for Scaife's interest in politics (liked to read newspapers? come on). It appears as if this is uninformed conjecture. There is no source material to justify its inclusion. Has some political analyst of some reputation said as much? Has Scaife admitted

1878:

Gamaliel continues to make edits that are unsupported by either fact or source material. Some of the edits, as mentioned above, are clearly contradicted by evidence from credible sources in other parts of the encyclopedic entry, most especially the notion that Scaife rarely talks to reporters he

1360:

This article had become disorganized, with "giving" spread into two separated sections and biographical details mixed. I hope I've straightened it out by placing all the giving in one section at the end (though I'm not sure about the section title. I'm sure some of it came from his own pocket). I

1254:

Of course, the so-called "editors" of this piece wish to exclude the noisome fact that the president later testified under oath that he had, indeed, engaged in "sexual indiscretions" during his years in Washington. The editors don't wish to mention that a certain woman, most likely unknown to the

979:

Claims from LaRouche sources such as EIR always need to be double-checked. Scaife did not fund Dennis King. This is unsubstantiated. King has denied it. Deleted. The so-called "Quinde" affidavit is largely unverified claims by a LaRouchite, and anything from it needs to be double-checked. It was

2127:

I just stumbled upon this article and was surprised by its partisan tone. I'm tagging it because I believe that it is not written in a properly neutral fashion under WP:NPOV. I removed a passage that I believe clearly violates WP:UNDUE. More attention needs to be paid to achieving a neutral and

1600:

Wow. It's always ironic for those of us who actually are experts on important subjects to come into Knowledge (XXG) and see pure crap. I'll make a few points: His name is not "Mellon Scaife." It's just "Scaife." He doesn't use "Mellon" as a working title for obvious reasons mentioned in this

1425:

The key phrase, to me, is "yet to be determined." So far, there is no public record that there have, in fact, been reductions. Certainly you are erroneous to point to "staff reductions" in all the operations you listed because the Tribune-Review officer did not say where the reductions, if any,

1303:

It seems to me bad cricket to raise an allegation that's completely speculative and unproven, such as "Scaife buys up books published by conservatives to boost their sales." This has never been proven, shows up on no tax forms or any other publicly available records and seems to be a figment of

974:

For some reason, people continue to scribble "facts" about Scaife that are little more than Internet rumors, with what seems to me little basis in fact. A "fact" is raised, only to be somewhat disregarded. Much of it seems libelous, and the sources cited by the authors are less than mainstream

1069:

It's unfair to attack a man's (allegedly) paid investigations and then not mention that the fruits of his (alleged) probes were proven to be true. It's not an ad hominem attack on Clinton to say that he later admitted, under oath, that he conducted several affairs with women, including one that

1009:

Weed Harper has posted another LaRouchite claim that is not verified. Facts matter. Supposition, rumor, and suspicion are not fact. There is no evidence that Scaife ever funded King. The charge originates with the LaRouchites. What is arguably fair is to say that King attended one meeting with

2321:

Although the newspaper he previously founded endorsed Hillary Clinton in 2008, Scaife never did personally. More importantly, the endorsement was for the Democratic primary. At that time, many conservative organizations wanted to draw out the Barack Obama v. Hillary Clinton primary to increase

1458:

Lou Ottey, who was fired as circulation manager for the Greensburg paper last week, said a general downturn in newspaper circulation compounded problems because daily newspapers in Connellsville, Monessen and Kittanning included delivery of the Sunday Tribune-Review, and when those papers lost

1490:

find a verifiable source saying that they did then we can include that info. Do we have any proof that the writer was a former employee? How carefully should we scrutinize the contributions and opinions of past and present employees of the Trib-Review? Are they automatically suspect? Thanks, -

1230:

I don't see how Scaife "directed" anything against Clinton when he was a relatively unknown governor from Arkansas, vying with others for the Iowa primary. Only after he emerged as president did any sort of investigation into his past commence, unless there's sourcing to show otherwise (there

1672:

I am the person who added the marriage info, and I agree. I would like to research this more and additional info. Also, two small things: as noted in the article, Mr. Scaife placed the call personally. The previous editor's wording made it appear as though someone else did. And, I added more

2056:

Some errors are so blatant as to be laughable. For example, several "editors" have taken a verbal slap at Marisol Bello, a reporter for the Detroit Free-Press. The postings are so devoid of fact that they refer to Bello as a man ("Marisol" is a common, female name) and claim her "boss" is

1117:

But the allegations of sexual misconduct were most certainly "proved," by Clinton himself. Clinton admitted under oath to a series of extramarital affairs while governor of Arkansas and president of the United States. The scandal of one affair in Arkansas led to Clinton's initial perjured

1892:

Also mystifying is the slur that the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review is a low-circulation paper that is "attempting" to circulate in Pittsburgh. ABC circulation reports, as cited in the linked article about the newspaper, show that it has nearly 250,000 subscribers, which is narrowly below the

1608:

True, it's a source that can be verified, but that doesn't make the source accurate or trustworthy. The Nation is a wonderful publication, but it's a self-described partisan press. I also would be careful of using, say, the Weekly Standard to dig up dirt on someone like Ted Kennedy.

1921:

1. It's badly written. The piecemeal approach to creating this encyclopedic entry has created a largely unreadable, herky-jerky summation of the life of a man. This sort of pitiful writing about a man who owns newspapers would be considered tragic if it weren't so hilarious.

991:

Hi Chip, following the ArbCom ruling against Herschelkrustofsky, LaRouche material (claims, links, or references to LaRouche) is not allowed to be inserted into any article that is not "closely related" to Lyndon LaRouche, and any editor finding such material may delete it.

1798:

Explain exactly what using the nickname --Dick-- in the middle of the article accomplishes? Exactly why did you put that back in? Please point to other articles where the subjects of articles are not referred to strictly by their last name. Why the sudden informality?

1319:

Hi 147.72.93.199, I just reverted your claim about him being booted out of Yale for breaking someone's leg. It's a good story, but we need a reference if you have one. Also, it would be good if you could get a user name: not obligatory of course, just nicer somehow. :-)

1932:

2. It's riddled with non-POV assertions and bad guesswork, unsubstantiated with meaningful sourcing. Let's just say that the Washington Post and some of the other periodicals listed are considered good sources for factual material. A Harvard Speakout project is not.

1583:

I also took out the questionable business about Scaife somehow attempting to murder his brother-in-law, claims that do not appear in the LA Times, Washington Post, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette or any other mainstream publication I could find, either online or offline.

1429:

It appears as if they have not. Perhaps the company changed its mind. Or perhaps it transferred them to other operations or other Scaife-directed corporate activities. Unfortunately, the footnotes you provide do not show if there are any reductions of any kind.

1562:

This appears to be a relatively old comment about something no longer in the article, but I wanted to make a comment and say, yes, there really is a Chris Potter, and yes, he really does work for a legitimate newspaper called the Pittsburgh City Paper. Thanks.

1131:

made those payments or not? Further, was the purpose of the Arkansas Project to find evidence of Clinton's sexual habits? If you can prove both of those, then the Clinton sexual dirt might be appropriate here. Looking forward to seeing your evidence. Cheers, -

1973:

doesn't even contend that Scaife was the man behind the Arkansas Project, but the entries here seem to suggest that he was. At best, these insinuations are feckless misrepresenations. At worst, they're intentional lies. Either way, they're unworthy of Wiki.

1166:

made, which ought to have been posted to this talk page instead. While glibly worded and improperly posted, some potentially legitimate issues are raised by the editor. I am posting them here on that editor's behalf in case anyone would care to discuss them.

1056:

Anybody want to beef up the article with Scaife's sources of income? Where does his supposed billions come from? Is most of it inherited? It seems unlikely just the ownership of the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review would allow him to be such a big philanthropist.

1548:

Although a supporter of the open source effort to produce an encyclopedia, methinks Wiki would be taken more seriously if contributors didn't so badly botch pieces about the various media (see CBS 60 Minutes) or the biographies of well known publishers.

2089:

Tried to balance negatives and positives. I'm not a conservative, and I'm not a big fan of this guy, but for any bio we need NPOV, verifiable info, etc. And I think the best bios balance any criticism of a subject with a list of their accomplishments.

1334:

then at the end of the article, under ==References== (create a references section if there isn't one), write out the name of the book, author, and publisher etc if you have that information. Just add what you've got and someone else can tidy up later.

1988:"and in which Paula Jones' accusations of sexual harassment against Clinton were first widely publicized." Drudge might disagree, as would CNN, the Washington Post, et al. They ran stories following the infamous Drudge report while it was online. 1399:

It becomes irrelevent when there have been no reported layoffs, only speculation that there will be, and your footnote no longer exists as a source. Of the remaining references, the only one is a story by the Tribune-Review, which doesn't announce

1957:"while Cordelia supported her own charities, including Planned Parenthood" But the entry says he continued to support Planned Parenthood? Indeed, some of the national journals listed here repeat this fact. Poorly written, and unsourced as is. 1685:

Why is that? It's riddled with mistakes, innuendo and falsehoods. It's footnoted haphazardly, using sources of dubious repute. It's been humorous watching this section develop, almost as a test-case for how not to write an encyclopedic entry.

1604:

Second, doesn't anyone know who Rothmeyer is? Last time I checked, she was an associate editor at The Nation. Shouldn't the compilers of this page at least take that into consideration when producing this bio? Or does source material matter?

1347:

147, if you type 4 tildes ~~~~ after your posts it will automatically give you your IP address and a timestamp. Or if you get a user name (they're free and anonymous), it will use that instead of your IP address, which gives you more privacy.

1541:

Well, wouldn't that be what he "allegedly" called the woman? There doesn't seem to be any tape of the event and no outside corroboration it actually happened, except from the words of a freelance reporter who never really became a reporter.

2322:

inter-party tension and give the Republicans an edge in the general election. It seems someone added this in to make Hillary Clinton seem like she had a conservative backer when, in reality, he almost ended her husband's political career.

1939:"He was expelled from Yale University in the aftermath of a drunken party" Prove it with a source. I know some of them, but they're not online. A lazy researcher resorts only to non-POV google searches, which is what we have here. 1029:

There are only two mentions of the CIA, both rather restrained. How are they a problem? The article is not yet comprehensive on his political funding. A few foundations and causes are mentioned, but there's a lot of work to do in that

1612:

An uncorroborated version of an account that has been publicly challenged should not be given carte blanche authenticity. Who is this Gamaliel and why should we assume he knows anything about Scaife, publishing or American politics?

2232:

anyone have Richard's email address? i would like to email him without going through people who will never pass the letter on. i doubt i will get a reply or any hlep but, no harm in me trying =) thanks in advance, Alan Scaife

1906:. Please stop filling up this page with pompous twaddle. Try to raise issues using plain English in a way that allows us to find a constructive solution. Your lectures are merely annoying as waste hard drive storage space.-- 782: 1791:

that part of the edit was not explained. The information about the reporter is flat out wrong, as she occasionally wrote more than 25 years ago for The Nation, and moved on to other publications. Why is that still there?

153: 903: 594: 1994:"Shaheen subpoenaed Scaife, who testified before a federal grand jury in the matter." What did he say under oath? Did he confirm or deny the non-POV version of what transpired printed above? Where's the sourcing? 2896: 1153:

Seems to me he (1) engaged in extramarital affairs, as alleged, and (2) lied to cover up those affairs. This is beyond dispute. If those were two of the various targets of the Arkansas Project, they were proven.

1410:

so, please post it. Otherwise, the preponderance of evidence is that the company has announced that there will be layoffs. (PS, please sign your talk page articles by typing four tildes "~" at the end. Thanks). -

1689:

Oddly enough, "Willmcw" already has read the aforementioned paragraph several times, but has yet to realize that "peaking" is the wrong verb. I can't imagine any real journal using this flotsam as an "obit."

1795:

whose four or five-part series we can no longer read. But maybe then Knowledge (XXG) is trying to out-Enquirer the National Enquirer in the area of titilating readers by throwing the word "cunt" around. Great!

2003:"Scaife became a major, early supporter of the Heritage Foundation" How much is major? Where is the sourcing? That would be interesting to know, in a concrete, factual way. It's phrased too clumsily now. 2000:"The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review continues to challenge the Post-Gazette in the Pittsburgh media market." Shouldn't this be moved to the breakoff entry on the Tribune-Review? It seems out of place here. 2063:

The article itself in nearly complete devoid of fact throughout, relying mostly on Google searches of partisan websites and very lightly on respected publications such as the Washington Post or Newsweek.

1262:

Complicated by the fact that much of the material in the Scaife-funded articles--even about sexual misconduct--was never shown to be true, and one author retracted parts of his work. Best to leave it as

966:

I worked desperately to maintain NPOV throughout this article, and stated only facts provided in reputable publications; however, I suspect it will become a popular target for vandalism, mostly from the

1556:

Shouldn't there be a ranking of sources used to construct an article? I would imagine a free, largely unread effort by some hack in Pittsburgh wouldn't have the substance of WAPO. But what do I know?

1464:

Last night, in Greensburg, one mid-level editor complained bitterly about the planned reductions in staff. "For years we financed their shenanigans in Pittsburgh and now they've turned on us," he said.

2191:

The references section is all mucked up. None of the articles listed are used for in-text citations. This does not comply with wikipedia standards. When in doubt, use the to cite things. --

2302:

nature philanthropic, which is a slanted and un-encyclopedic way of dealing with this. A simple move of his support for these political groups to a separate category would fix the problem.

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If you want to pretend that political machinations during the late 1990s never transpired, except because of some weird conspiracy by Richard Scaife, then you're not much of a journalist.

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or the Pittsburgh City Paper were removed. Others can discuss this decision, but the poster from the previous comment made IMHO acceptable claims of NPOV that should be investigated.

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Anyway, it's equally odd to find "Online Journal" and the Pittsburgh City Paper used to debunk narratives portrayed by respected mainstream publications, such as the Washington Post.

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I have to agree. It'd be like devoting space to Oswald in the bio of JFK, only in this case the two never even saw each other. The Kangas article can cover the incident in detail. -

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I suggest the data point from 2005 be dropped from the lead, along with the cry-me-a-river "dropped" comparative that including this earlier data point seems to necessitate. —

147: 1966:"In 1969 , he purchased " If we can't even name the year he bought a newspaper that would grow to become one of the nation's 50 largest dailies, maybe we should just bag it? 1655:

The recent addition of a news item about Ritchie Scaife is sourced and verifiable, but it highlights the fact that the subject's marriages are not clearly described. Could we

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The information that he was expelled from Yale is sourced to an article which doesn't appear to be in a reliable publication. The author being "reliable" is not enough, per

1979:"In 1990 Scaife quit drinking alcohol." No source. If you're going to accuse someone of being an alcoholic, albeit a recovering one, you need a source of some reputation. 1846:

I also might suggest that Scaife's degree from the University of Pittsburgh includes an incorrect major. I would give you a hint, but the information likely can be googled.

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Sorry, Cberlet, I didn't realize that criticism of a poor effort -- including prose that's virtually illiterate in the main article -- was tantamount to "pompous twaddle."

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would come. One would imagine in such a competitive media market at Pittsburgh there would be some mention (any?) of "layoffs" or "staff reductions" if they had happened.

2846: 830: 2138:"Partisan tone" is clearly in the eye of the beholder. There are bits that are suspect (and the one you removed was overt), but overall it's a fairly balanced article. 1580:

In response to the above-mentioned problems with this article, I ventured in here to try to make some alterations. Some of the writing was clumsy, so I shored that up.

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So, Scaife's (alleged) payments brought one salient fact about Clinton to the general public and nearly destroyed Clinton's presidency. Seems somewhat relevant to me.

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it off where you ran out of space. 1992 was the year of the big Pittsburgh paper strikes...but ironically, it was also the year, of course, that Clinton was elected.

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The "Politics and philanthtropy" section is what concerned me. I could not find an NPOV section just to cover that section. Let me look again in the templates area.--

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This weekend, I plan to rewrite this entire biography. My lodestar shall be the guidelines available at en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons

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A lot of the poor non-POV edits could have been avoided by simply questioning either the objectivity or the competence of a "Harvard Speak-Out" on the subject.

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vast majority of Americans but named Monica Lewinsky, had something of a fling with the man and led to his impeachment. No. Let's pretend this never happened.

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This Scaife guy is one of the most dispicable human beings on the face of the earth. I wish I could smack him in the mouth after what he called that woman.

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determined to be perjured by the Office of the Special Prosecutor, the grand jury convened to weigh Clinton's guilt or innocence, and the U.S. Congress.

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specifics on where Scaife's home is, only to indicate that he owns multiple homes in the Pittsburgh metro area. I reverted these two things for clarity.

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I think the guy's kinda fascinating, actually. And I know people who have worked for him that have had some very fascinating things to say about him.

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I believe this article suffers from a relentless non-POV attitude throughout, and that this biased format only weakens Knowledge (XXG)'s stature.

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Also, a quick Internet search revealed that Marisol Bello is a, ahem, woman. So the "his boss" reference -- also snide -- was equally untrue.

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however, say this will not happen and, more than a month later, there are no reports, even from the competition, that such a thing transpired.

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testimony, which triggered the impeachment vote and, later, censor by Congress. He also lost the ability to practice law in his home state.

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Supreme Court and a very lengthy grand jury report that finds him, indeed, admitting to affairs with, among others, a White House intern.

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Scaife get in the way of a good strawman! Instead, let's pull up a 1981 CJR story written by a columnist for The Nation to define the man.

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NVOA would imply that one should use "stories" framing an economic competitor with great care, especially work from a former employee.

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Wiki's "bosses" should get this right. There's probably enough here that's libelous or simply false to trigger an immediate rewrite.

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Revert attempts to embelish this incident. The guy was troubled. End of story. It has nothing to do with the subject of this article.

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Earlier this week, advertising director Andrea Mroz was let go, as was Kraig Cawley, the general manager of the Valley News Dispatch.

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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

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Clearly, he has spoken to at least four major newspapers listed in the article and only once to one of his own (former) reporters.

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https://web.archive.org/web/20090722030033/http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/specialreports/10year/s_104854.html

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I just removed half of a paragraph that wildly accused Scaife, and pretty much the rest of his family, of being alcoholics. The "

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None of these theories are sourced, so who cares how right they are? Mere speculation, of course, should rule in these instances.

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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions.

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Most material for a complete article needs to be added, and it certainly exists, in fair, objective prose, in the public domain.

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or other tool because one or more other projects use this class. Please ensure the assessment is correct before removing the

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https://web.archive.org/web/20051028015726/http://www.pittsburghcitypaper.ws/prev/archives/newsarch/potter/2c01/2c72501.html

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This entry on Richard Mellon Scaife easily should prove one of the worst examples of "biography" found in Knowledge (XXG):

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Most of the allegations about Clinton funded by Scaife were not proven to be true. Not Whitewater. Not Mena. Not Foster. --

2515: 2112: 1945:"Still, he inherited a good part of the Mellon fortune when his mother died." How much is a "good part?" Find a source. 2264:" mentioned none of this. Someone needs to go through this article for other BLP problems, as I suspect there are more.-- 1918:

From a professional standpoint, here are some glaring problems with the wiki effort to comprise the sum of a man's life:

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Do you still insist layoffs are not planned? Two managers have already been "reduced". (PS. please sign your comments) -

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https://web.archive.org/web/20050310051111/http://www.newsmeat.com/media_political_donations/Richard_Mellon_Scaife.php

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Cheap and lazy and, ultimately, meaningless conjecture. Find some sourcing that would support it or get rid of it.

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The footnote says nothing of this alleged quid pro quo about hiring practices at the (erstwhile) George magazine.

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I agree. If there's no decent source it should be removed. Anyone wanting to re-add it should provide a reference.

1969:"With Scaife as publisher, the small circulation newspaper was the chief packager of editorials and news columns" 693: 125: 109: 2502:

https://web.archive.org/web/20060219051641/http://pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/trib/regional/s_297308.html

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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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https://web.archive.org/web/20050404123743/http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/business/s_295006.html

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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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nearly collapsed his presidency. To say otherwise is to be guilty of a myopia that has no place in journalism.

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I thought this article has a lot of information on Scaife if anyone wants to add some of it to the article.

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I made some revisions to this article - I tried not to REMOVE much comment unless it looked decidedly POV.

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So why is this fact mentioned if never proved? Well, alleging it to be so, for these editors, makes it thus.

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Let's pretend, for once, that the Clinton scandals were covered by some publications outside of Salon.com?

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I didn't realize Knowledge (XXG) required usernames. Is this simply decorum, or a writ from the editors?

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Looks like someone forgot to sign his screed. What are the chances this is a registered user going anon?

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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with

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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with

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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with

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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join

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on Knowledge (XXG). If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join

24: 2672:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit 2482:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit 2352:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit 1621: 70: 2238: 1482:

How do we know the newspaper "reduced" two managers, but hired, say, twenty new employees? We don't.

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pages require a signature at a minimum. You are welcome to contribute, but please follow Wiki norms.

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https://web.archive.org/web/20090520072112/http://mediatransparency.org/funderprofile.php?funderID=3

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https://web.archive.org/web/20090520072112/http://mediatransparency.org/funderprofile.php?funderID=3

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The changes most likely will involve a yet-to-be determined number of staff reductions, said Harrell

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https://web.archive.org/web/20041028043822/http://www.harvardsquarelibrary.org/speakout/scaife.html

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https://web.archive.org/web/20041002070446/http://www.pfaw.org/pfaw/general/default.aspx?oid=2065

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https://web.archive.org/web/20100304025805/http://www.heritage.org/About/Departments/trustees.cfm

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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template

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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template

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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template

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Which means that in typical Knowledge (XXG) fashion it was allowed to remain for many months.

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https://web.archive.org/web/20070608130352/http://www.mediatransparency.org/scaifeaggregate.php

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Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. |

51: 697: 1814: 1773: 1749: 931: 772:, an open collaborative effort to coordinate work for and sustain comprehensive coverage of 255: 2739: 2629: 2535: 2439: 1864: 2323: 2265: 2192: 2173: 2148: 2129: 1703: 1674: 1349: 1335: 1321: 1312: 993: 2565: 2365: 2682:

https://web.archive.org/web/20050425101414/http://www.harvardsquarelibrary.org/speakout/

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https://web.archive.org/web/20040404051254/http://www.salon.com/news/1998/04/07news.html

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I made some brief edits to make this "biography" a tad bit fair to the subject of it.

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http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/specialreports/10year/s_104854.html

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small southern state. The project began AFTER he was elected president. "147.72.93.199"

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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with

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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with

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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with

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My edits made sense. Yours did not. Perhaps you will explain in detail what you did.

1787:

Please defend the revert of the sublime edits of the Richard Mellon Scaife article.

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overnight. With a person this prominent we should be able to get the basics right. -

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Some of this appears in newspaper and magazine articles, I can try to dig them up.--

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Removed "Hillary Clinton" endorsement because he did not endorse Hillary Clinton...

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This article isn't even good enough for a cleanup tag: it still needs to be built.

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http://www.pittsburghcitypaper.ws/prev/archives/newsarch/potter/2c01/2c72501.html

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That sort of editorial decision is hilarious. Dilettantes at work, it seems.

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In 2005, Scaife was number 238 on the Forbes 400, with a personal fortune of

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If you don't think it's good enough, then pitch in and give a hand. Cheers, -

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http://www.newsmeat.com/media_political_donations/Richard_Mellon_Scaife.php

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description. Later in the article we discuss his politics in some detail. -

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online, but the article is available on Lexis-Nexis and other fee sources.

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http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/trib/regional/s_297308.html

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But if you say there are layoffs, I'm sure there are, unless there aren't.

1991:"gave root to hyperbolic conspiracist notions" "Hyperbolic" is non-POV. 2165:

Pentagon papers--that once they're out in the public they're fair game?

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Hillary Clinton wrote a book that touched on some of these notions too.

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PS - Is it irrelevent to note that the company is laying off workers? -

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This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.

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http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/tribune-review/business/s_295006.html

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Scaife's stepson, Turner Westray Battle, was hired as an intern at

1826:"Although Scaife rarely talks to reporters who don't work for him" 1226:

Re: "Scaife ...directed his attention against governor ... Clinton"

275:. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the 1090:

Knowledge (XXG) does not require usernames. However discussion on

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New Washington Post article on Scaife and his divorce proceedings

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Shakeup at the Tribune-Review; layoffs expected at all newspapers

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haven't deleted anything, and only copy-edited slightly. Cheers -

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I agree. This seems to be a better and more accurate approach.--

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Knowledge (XXG) requested images of people of the United States

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It suffers from non-POV descriptions and "facts" throughout.

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circulation, the Tribune-Review's Sunday figures were also hit.

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Re:Hillary Clinton's reference to "vast right wing conspiracy"

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http://www.mediatransparency.org/funderprofile.php?funderID=3

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http://www.mediatransparency.org/funderprofile.php?funderID=3

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for additional information. I made the following changes:

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for additional information. I made the following changes:

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for additional information. I made the following changes:

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It's unfair to demand a debate and not post your username.

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to number 371 on the listing, with a personal fortune of

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these organizations did other things with his cash, too.

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http://www.harvardsquarelibrary.org/speakout/scaife.html

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Knowledge (XXG) wants to charge ad space for this crap?

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Other sources without those papers' reputation, such as

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Heir to the Mellon family industrial/banking fortune. --

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http://www.pfaw.org/pfaw/general/default.aspx?oid=2065

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http://www.heritage.org/About/Departments/trustees.cfm

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The entire effort needs a complete, non-POV rewrite.

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It's unproven beyond internet rumors. I deleted it.

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http://www.mediatransparency.org/scaifeaggregate.php

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although a bit of innuendo taints the "revelation."

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WikiProject Massachusetts - Cape Cod and the Islands

342:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 2708:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors 2598:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors 2408:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors 174: 1926:he reportedly controls $ 1.2 billion in assets. 1657:consolidate his personal life into one section and 2852:Mid-importance Cape Cod and the Islands articles 2842:B-Class United States articles of Mid-importance 1373:How relevent are the business operatoins of the 1052:Scaife funds lots of things.. what funds Scaife? 33:for general discussion of the article's subject. 2694:This message was posted before February 2018. 2584:This message was posted before February 2018. 2394:This message was posted before February 2018. 2060:In fact, her "boss" is the Detroit Free-Press. 2857:WikiProject Cape Cod and the Islands articles 2386:http://www.salon.com/news/1998/04/07news.html 1936:Some of the more glaring problems include -- 1203:Re: theories of Scaife's interest in politics 1191:Find a source and this is worth mentioning.-- 1096:Knowledge (XXG):Sign your posts on talk pages 8: 2877:Automatically assessed Conservatism articles 2686:http://www.harvardsquarelibrary.org/speakout 776:and related subjects in the Knowledge (XXG). 1158:Comments from Main Article by 147.72.93.172 2664:I have just modified one external link on 805:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Libertarianism 713: 575: 397: 304: 216: 2847:B-Class Cape Cod and the Islands articles 2474:I have just modified 9 external links on 2344:I have just modified 3 external links on 894:may be able to locate suitable images on 498:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject United States 1889:It appears not. It only shows up here. 650:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Conservatism 2210: 1637:The same reason we assume you do. See 943:] The anchor (#Conspiracism) has been 715: 577: 399: 306: 218: 188: 2892:Low-importance Libertarianism articles 701: 360:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Pittsburgh 2837:Mid-importance United States articles 1840:dispute the bias in the other slur. 285:Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Biography 7: 2872:Mid-importance Conservatism articles 2128:encyclopedic tone in writing this.-- 2042:Substantial/major editing is needed. 1306:unsigned comments from 147.72.93.199 1043:pages. Usernames are free. Cheers, - 630:This article is within the scope of 451:This article is within the scope of 336:This article is within the scope of 261:This article is within the scope of 808:Template:WikiProject Libertarianism 207:It is of interest to the following 23:for discussing improvements to the 2862:WikiProject United States articles 2822:Mid-importance Pittsburgh articles 501:Template:WikiProject United States 14: 2882:WikiProject Conservatism articles 2668:. Please take a moment to review 2478:. Please take a moment to review 2348:. Please take a moment to review 2297:Improper (slanted) categorization 1639:Knowledge (XXG):Assume good faith 892:Openverse Creative Commons Search 653:Template:WikiProject Conservatism 50:New to Knowledge (XXG)? Welcome! 1329:anecdote I thought it would fit. 1279:Re: buying up conservative books 917: 748: 738: 717: 617: 607: 593: 579: 543: 438: 428: 401: 329: 308: 248: 238: 220: 189: 45:Click here to start a new topic. 2887:B-Class Libertarianism articles 2827:WikiProject Pittsburgh articles 1417:The exact line from the story: 1369:Trib Review business operations 1238:Text probably need rewording.-- 825:This article has been rated as 670:This article has been rated as 518:This article has been rated as 380:This article has been rated as 363:Template:WikiProject Pittsburgh 2832:B-Class United States articles 2812:WikiProject Biography articles 1748:all be handled in one place. - 1736:Where Scaife's Money Came From 288:Template:WikiProject Biography 1: 2867:B-Class Conservatism articles 2762:13:18, 14 December 2017 (UTC) 2652:00:11, 5 September 2017 (UTC) 2102:16:13, 21 February 2007 (UTC) 2076:23:06, 5 September 2006 (UTC) 1720:08:47, 31 December 2005 (UTC) 1707:20:40, 31 December 2005 (UTC) 1665:09:32, 28 December 2005 (UTC) 1646:18:32, 23 December 2005 (UTC) 1568:14:58, 21 February 2007 (UTC) 1508:21:24, August 25, 2005 (UTC) 644:and see a list of open tasks. 556:This article is supported by 354:and see a list of open tasks. 42:Put new text under old text. 2249:15:07, 10 October 2008 (UTC) 2201:06:01, 15 January 2008 (UTC) 2152:14:40, 24 October 2007 (UTC) 2143:00:01, 24 October 2007 (UTC) 2133:20:46, 23 October 2007 (UTC) 2118:13:53, 22 October 2007 (UTC) 1863:shortly after the interview. 1856:This also is unsupportable: 1162:Here are some comments that 273:contribute to the discussion 2817:B-Class Pittsburgh articles 2182:02:09, 9 January 2008 (UTC) 1730:I removed this blockquote: 1532:20:52, 27 August 2005 (UTC) 1517:12:33, 27 August 2005 (UTC) 1338:00:32, Jan 27, 2005 (UTC) 2913: 2807:B-Class biography articles 2793:19:40, 15 April 2018 (UTC) 2725:(last update: 5 June 2024) 2661:Hello fellow Wikipedians, 2615:(last update: 5 June 2024) 2471:Hello fellow Wikipedians, 2425:(last update: 5 June 2024) 2341:Hello fellow Wikipedians, 2160:Divorce Proceedings Opened 2028:17:36, 2 August 2006 (UTC) 1753:23:07, 17 March 2006 (UTC) 1352:10:37, Jan 28, 2005 (UTC) 1324:00:15, Jan 27, 2005 (UTC) 971:23:10, 28 Sep 2004 (UTC)) 831:project's importance scale 769:WikiProject Libertarianism 676:project's importance scale 524:project's importance scale 386:project's importance scale 2767:Unintentionally hilarious 2291:11:07, 5 March 2011 (UTC) 2274:04:50, 8 April 2009 (UTC) 2014:21:35, 31 July 2006 (UTC) 1911:02:09, 31 July 2006 (UTC) 1873:14:33, 27 July 2006 (UTC) 1851:20:01, 26 July 2006 (UTC) 1777:08:07, 6 April 2006 (UTC) 1767:04:53, 6 April 2006 (UTC) 1376:Pittsburgh Tribune-Review 1315:00:08, Jan 26, 2005 (UTC) 1175:11:29, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC) 996:23:44, Jan 12, 2005 (UTC) 824: 733: 691: 669: 602: 539: 517: 454:WikiProject United States 423: 379: 324: 233: 215: 80:Be welcoming to newcomers 2462:16:40, 24 May 2017 (UTC) 2332:06:57, 6 July 2014 (UTC) 2312:10:28, 5 July 2014 (UTC) 1830:only snide, but untrue. 1494:21:55, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC) 1414:20:46, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) 1395:22:12, 7 Feb 2005 (UTC) 1388:20:19, 7 Feb 2005 (UTC) 1365:07:50, 2 Feb 2005 (UTC) 1294:14:02, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1267:14:02, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1242:14:02, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1218:14:02, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1195:14:02, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1135:00:51, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1113:19:15, 20 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1102:00:51, 24 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1065:13:43, 20 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1047:05:26, 19 Jan 2005 (UTC) 1014:16:33, 13 Jan 2005 (UTC) 984:22:52, 12 Jan 2005 (UTC) 859:It is requested that an 633:WikiProject Conservatism 459:United States of America 414:Cape Cod and the Islands 2657:External links modified 2467:External links modified 2337:External links modified 1893:competition's figures. 1818:07:46, 8 May 2006 (UTC) 1807:06:57, 8 May 2006 (UTC) 1474:22:20, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC) 1290:Agnostic on this one.-- 811:Libertarianism articles 766:is within the scope of 2786: 2776:. 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