1411:"Does it really matter whether a citation was made originally from an online source versus an offline source in a publication?" Yes. You need to indicate where you got the sourced material from. This is essential in regards to sourcing on Knowledge (XXG). I understand if you haven't picked this up before, as it is most commonly stressed and explained in Featured Article Candidates pages. The way you can tell if an online or a print version was cited is simple: there will be a URL with an access date or not. "Making online cites for a publication such as Entertainment Weekly or Rolling Stone is somewhat misleading" is not misleading if you are indicating that you are citing the website, which is common practice in the better-written articles already. You say "So I think it should be reasonable and acceptable practice to add more information about the sources such as adding page numbers or links to (legal) copies of the source online whether originally accessed online or offline.", but this is not about accessibility, it's about verifiability, which assume far greater importance. There are instances in this article where the original magazine version was cited, and instances where a reprint legally published online was cited. It was essential for the
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This article is a featured article, and has already been vetted for quality, so most of your changes are profoundly unneeded and unrequired. It's strongly frowned upon to change the citation style in articles, especially
Featured ones, and there are some instances where you changed to web cites when I had in fact cited the original publication from hard copies I possess. Once again, read
1326:
I'm not saying formatting cites the way you did is not a valid way to format cites on
Knowledge (XXG); what I have been trying to explain to you is that it's inconsistent and unnecessary to do it for this particular page per the guideline, and ignores the work of past editors who have worked on the page before you, regardless of what your editing preferences for cites are.
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I reverted because the established citation style of the article does not follow the format you changed it to (which I explained from the get-go), the tracklist template is unnecssary and not mandatory, and some links were added by another user that weren't valid sources (one was even a broken link).
916:
Actually, re-reading the discussions, it appears that there is consensus for adding links to streamable copies of the albums or songs even on social networking sites except for the issue as to whether the threshold for availability of the links is sufficient to include them. That is a discussion for
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Yes, these pages are hosted by MySpace, which many assume to be evil by definition. But nothing is fixed on the
Internet. Having lost the battle to Facebook, MySpace is now hosting licensed streamed copies of music from artists to attract more eyeballs and users. Pages whose editorial oversight is
1435:
I restored the date "November 1, 2001" to the
Allmusic review citation. When I cited Allmusic reviews in the past, I checked with the Amazon.com's previews of All Music Guide books, from where most of Allmusic.com's reviews are adapted. In this case, the review of Filles de Kilimangaro was published
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explains why tweaking citation formatting in an article where everything is already settled is a bad idea, and why it states "Editors should not attempt to change an article's established citation style merely on the grounds of personal preference, or without first seeking consensus for the change".
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to a legal online copy even if the original citation was made with the publication as source. And adding page numbers seems useful for other editors when they want to review the citations. As to the formatting of the page numbers, please point me at the source where I can learn for myself. Thanks.
1247:
It's not just the use or non-use of templates--it's how the citations are laid out that also needs to be preserved. Among the issues you have introduced are adding page numbers for articles cited from online sources, adding online links to articles cited from hard copies, and adding page numbers for
1320:
Page numbers aren't required; for magazine articles, article title is sufficient. I know, having been dealt with several
Featured Article Candidates, Good Article Nominees, Peer Reviews, and Featured Article Reviews. You say "adding page numbers seems useful for other editors", but that ignores the
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It's only the last of these that I think you can really have a complaint with, and to which I will accept responsibility. It seems entirely reasonable to add publication information even if the original citation was made from an online copy, and similarly, it seems entirely reasonable to add a link
1184:
I reverted your changes because you reverted valid edits. If you want to remove the issue numbers, fine, but some of my changes are valid such as replacing a dead link with its archive, adding links to a posted copy of a review, etc. Also, page numbers are relevant as well. And, some of the author
1043:
If there's enough prose from their criticism, I usually exclude most mentions of the grade the critics gave, especially if the grade is already in the ratings template. I suppose an A+ grade is an A+ grade by any critic and doesn't need extra clarification, so the
Christgau quote isn't necessary if
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There's a enough other reviews directly related to the album to expand the prose using quotes without resorting to quoting
Christgau's general rating guidelines. I have seen other editors make note of the A+ Christgau rating, e.g., "as one of the few A+ rated albums" (not a real quote, but you get
867:
Ok. I'll stop until there is consensus, but it's unclear to me when I can tell that. On the Albums discussion, there were some objections raised, but I thought they had all been addressed besides the redirect to the EL discussion. And there, the reference was to ELNO#7, which doesn't say that it
744:
about adding the links, and another somewhere else (suggestions?) about linking to those MySpace music pages (there seems to be a blanket exclusion of MySpace). But of course, I cannot do any of that until I'm unblocked, which everyone seems to agree is the right thing to do. Could you remind
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Per discussion on your talk page User talk:Fastily, please unblock me. I did not post spam. I will discuss with the Bot administrator about making it more discriminating, and will not post any more links until that is resolved. Thank you.J. Wong (talk) 22:49, 19 July 2011 (UTC)
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Those are the discussions I saw. On the albums page, there appears to be no consensus and on the EL page the one response clearly says it should be avoided. Which begs the question as to why you are taking it upon yourself to add the links to a bunch of articles.
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Yes, that's all I want "careful cutting and pasting". Simply reverting all my changes is not acceptable. I spent time putting them in, and now I have to spend time doing it all over again because of laziness or I don't know what on the part of some editors. --
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I did follow the format. When you pointed out that the article wasn't using citation templates, I reapplied my changes textually, which included valid changes that were independent of format. Simply reverting all of that is not called for. --
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Ok, I'm registering as a user to add links to album pages (and song pages) to the original source material (streamed). These are legitimate external links since each links to the source material (media in this case) for each relevant article.
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article to become a
Featured Article to indicate this. The citations have already been heavily vetted; though very well-intentioned, your edits throw an unnecessary wrench into the article's structure and past efforts of other editors.
1131:, there is an already-established citation format for the article. Remember to watch out for previously established citation styles in articles in the future, as it can unknowingly cause problems for other editors if you change them.
1353:
Okay, cool down everyone - I see that J.wong has added some bluelinks that are worthwhile (remember though they only need linking on the first instance), we don't want see-sawing, but careful cutting and pasting of best bits :)
1165:
The
Wikilinks in the refs are debatable, but issue numbers aren't required--date is how most publications are identified, and not including them is a perfectly valid means of citation, which has been long-used in the article.
1557:. It has the authority to enact binding solutions for disputes between editors, primarily related to serious behavioural issues that the community has been unable to resolve. This includes the ability to impose
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I can't unblock you (I'm not an administrator), but it may help them make the decision to unblock you if you'll go ahead and commit to, if you're unblocked, discussing the myspace links at
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I am not 100% happy about the links you have added, but I don't see them as spam, and I don't think they justify an indefinite block. Also, the blocking admin has agreed to an unblock.
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978:); I added it because Christgau's grading are at a higher standard (like his "B" grade would be a bad record), so it seems constructive to add the quote from his grading key.
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fact that the established citation form for the article didn't use page numbers for magazine articles, and you have only added page numbers for a few cites. Once again,
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917:, which I'll add. I won't add any more links, but I also won't revert my changes unless the consensus is negative (since its still a managable handful). --
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Fairly poor block in my view, (the length is rather excessive) I'm inclined to unblock, as long as J.wong.wiki agrees to engage in discussion, perhaps at
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magazines when they aren't required and adding them in an inconsistent manner from how page numbers are cited in the article's refs.
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Ok, but maybe this should be turned into a book cite then so it is clear since the review on the web-site doesn't have a date. --
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users to be linked, but obviously if a site was not available to a majority of users, then it probably should be avoided. --
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controlled by the artist in question (or their deputized representative). So should we take advantage of that? Yup, I say.
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I just thought I'd add it since the section pretty short on prose and there aren't a lot of albums rated A+ by
Christgau.
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describes the Committee's roles and responsibilities in greater detail. If you wish to participate, you are welcome to
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page? I've been advised before that soliciting comments speeds things up a bit with the backlogged nominations there.
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if shown; this will automatically produce your username and the date. Also, please do your best to always fill in the
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P.S. I've restored the additional info' I had added such as issue and page numbers that your reversion removed. --
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Ok, thanks. I thought the full citation form was preferred since it allows better instrumentation of the articles.
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I looked around a bit and don't see where there was consensus to add these links. Am I missing something? --
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wikilinks are not otherwise mentioned in the article so keeping them seems relevant. Thank you for
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field with your edits. Below are some useful links to facilitate your involvement. Happy editing!
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Laziness wasn't my motivation, it was retaining the establish citation style per
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Thank you. You should also remove the ones you added until there is consensus. --
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Hi. Since you are a member of WP:ALBUMS, would you like to comment at my
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is the panel of editors responsible for conducting the Knowledge (XXG)
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section, which I have now reverted. Please be more careful in future.
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Note that your last edit to this article duplicated the whole of the
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Thank you. I noticed that myself, but you got to it before me. --
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on your talk page and ask your question there. Please remember to
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Is there something I need to do to complete my unblock request?
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Hello, I would like to discuss some of your recent edits to the
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tags in the appropriate place in the article? Thanks!
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article back in September. Could you please discuss on
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in All Music Guide to Popular Music (November 1, 2001).
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to this 💕. If you decide that you need help, check out
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740:. I am planning on starting two discussions. One, in
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what specifically you think needs to be cited, or add
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Hi there, I reverted your edits for the citations on
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This user's unblock request has been reviewed by an
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8:
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1189:removing these changes. --
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