1311:. It is defined as "a movement of Muslims who think back to earlier times and seek to return to the fundamentals of the religion and live similarly to how the prophet Muhammad and his companions lived". This term can't even be applied to Shiite groups since such an idea makes no sense in Shia Islam at all and Hezbollah is even not mentioned in that article. Those Oxford sources are unfortunately written by some illiterate authors (this always happens when you use sources that are not written by experts). Hezbollah is now a legal political party in Lebanon, it is part of Lebanon's government, its representatives are democratically elected, and it does not seek to implement Sharia laws in Lebanon as stated by its leaders (so listing Hezbollah in this article is in contradiction with the led of the article). If you insist on including Hezbollah in such lists, probably you could include it in
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arguments for its notability or authority. It quite clear from the source material, that definitions vary greatly and range from vague to quite precise. However, a 10 point rationale by a single
British judge in a case concerning a libel case involving a single person should not be considered adequate source material. I even doubt if such writings would qualify as a source at all for the matter at hand. So, with that in mind and the various and numerous tags, some of which have been part of this article for years have led me to remove much of the superfluous information. Information which, as I stated before, is already present in other articles such as
1554:(which is the opening of the verdict, "In my opinion") differ on the definition of Islamic extremism. This is what the revised article does; it makes clear that definitions vary and links to several (better written, more precise) articles that specify the use of this proven umbrella term. I see no justification whatsoever, why this legal rationale by a British judge concerning a person of minute importance should be given so much undue weight. I also oppose it on the grounds that it makes this article self contradictory as it clearly and well sourced states that the definition varies, but then goes on to make a quite precise 10 point definition.
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1146:"Dahr Jamail" is just a journalist, he doesn't have a say on this. The other source is written by an unnamed man from "Israel Ministry of Foreign Affairs", Israel is the archenemy of Hezbollah. The claim that Hezbollah is "extremist" clearly needs a better source and you can't just publish it based on some unreliable sources.
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The question we need to decide per WP policy isn't whether
Hezbollah is or isn't extremist, but rather whether the term reflects the usage found in RSs and WP consensus, if one exists. Furthermore, "extremist", "radical" and "fundamentalist" aren't technical terms with commonly accepted definitions.
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1) "A radical
Islamic fundamentalist party and guerrilla organization." A Dictionary of Contemporary World History (4 ed.) Oxford University Press; 2) "Political and social movement founded in the early 1980s seeking to transform Lebanon into an Islamic state." The Oxford Dictionary of Islam; 3) "an
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I've removed a lot of text from this article; I'll try to explain why. First, this article has been a mess for quite some time, evidenced by the neutrality dispute, the non-world POV and the lack of clearness in the lead section. Secondly, this term is clearly an umbrella term which can and is used
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Again, I'm no expert, don't know who the experts are, don't know what qualifies one person as an expert and another as a layman, and don't want to have that long discussion. But since you keep pinging me, because I reverted and said you should discuss it here in the face of several other reverts, I
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article, they're used for something else, not for proving they're "extremist". The authors may be credible in something else (and they can be cited in those subjects), but they don't have a say in
Islamic Studies and you can't cite them to prove Hezbollah is an "Islamic extremist" organization, you
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Information not applicable to the article or already present elsewhere was removed. If believe that this information should be present in this article, you should provide arguments as to why you think this. You claim for instance that there is a "definition by a notable legal body", but provide no
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This list quite notably lacks the
Taliban in Afghanistan. And this is only made further outstanding by the inclusion of the Pakistani Taliban, which bizarrely outright distinguishes itself from its unmentioned sibling in Afghanistan. I feel that the original Afghan chapter deserves greater note.
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Most of the definitions of islamic extremism are based on UK law. I think the article should have more information from sources outside of the UK (USA, UN, etc.). However, i don't believe the UK sources should be removed outright, as that would make the article even more stripped down than it is
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Looks good to me. I find court judgments can be really long-winded, so I prefer the approach of summarizing the factors mentioned in the case law, as you've now done. Let's see what others think, but there might be an opportunity to expand the article by looking at court rulings in other
1277:, as pointed out before, is quality rated; hence the sources there wont be too bad. I found an entry in the "Encyclopedia of Modern Worldwide Extremists and Extremist Groups" by Stephen E. Atkins from 2004. It qualifies it as the "leading shi'ite terrorist organization" in the country.--
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Kindly revert your edit, I have explain it here in the talk page and in my previous edit summaries. The sources are not reliable because they are not written by specialists in
Islamic Studies. This is controversial and needs a reliable source written by experts, not any source. See
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for a variety of different movements and beliefs, writing a single article about it would be impossible. I have therefore removed the large amount of
British court POV (which, while interesting, adds little to the article) and the terrorist groups which were already covered under
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You basically gutted the article. If there is a definition by a notable legal body, it should be mentioned. Reducing the article to a stub/disamb is not the way to go. If you object to parts of it, tag the article appropriately, or be bold and remove that section.
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I have removed a rather extensive treatment of a recent UK case from the article. I don't have any objection to the case's definition of extremism being briefly summarized in the article, but the whole-cloth quoting from the text seemed like too much.
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And interestingly, even the source by "Dahr Jamail" is a fake one and his article is misrepresented. What he said about
Hezbollah is this: " has successfully transformed itself from a radical extremist group into an effective political force".
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which are much better sourced and have a much clearer subject. I urge you to provide sources and rationals for your reinstation of the removed information. It is not my task to say why it should go, it is yours to prove why it should stay.
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policy does not apply directly to the subject of this article, it may contain material that relates to living persons, such as friends and family of persons no longer living, or living persons involved in the subject matter. Unsourced or
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This article was listed as a set index/disambiguation page, but it really isn't; I've re-listed it as a stub. It could do with being expanded by someone who knows more about the subject (and has access to the sources given), maybe as a
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It looks like the IP user has a point. One cited source is misused and our articles on extremism can't list anyone called extremist by their political opponents. We need some sources that can be reasonably called reliable and neutral.
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It's been a stub for 7 years. Perhaps we should admit that it is really a disambiguation page. After all, "extreme" means "to a great degree" and begs the question "degree of what?" The 1st choice suggests an extreme literalness, i.e.
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All of these groups advocate the subjugation and intentional violence against the unbelievers. I completely agree with the important need to appropriately document such claims. Be patient, it is a giant work in process.
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extremist Shiite Muslim group." Oxford
Dictionary of English (3 ed.); 4) "a radical group in the Lebanon." The Concise Oxford Dictionary of World Religions; 5) "Islamic fundamentalist group" World Encyclopedia, Philip's
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1341:, which is misused here as I said before. And "Stephen E. Atkins" is a librarian, Google his name, he isn't a qualified person. I still see no reliable source here, but a fake and misrepresented source.
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article itself. It appears that sources there are more thorough. But again, this is not an area I claim any expertise in. I merely reverted to head off an edit war, which would do no one any good.
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that are actively involved in armed activities including terrorism. I realise that this is very hard to draw the line at but as an example definitely on the non-include side are groups like
1050:== "Islamist" refers to an extremist political movement supporting an Islamist state. "Islamic extremism" implies the guilt of all Muslims. It is an unencyclopedic loaded term.See
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Indeed, it should be referred to as "Islamist extremism" or "Muslim extremism", instead of
Islamic, since the tenets and practices of Islam have nothing in common with terrorism.
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made no sense to me at all. The article now is simply a buffed up disambiguation page, which, I believe, is the best way to go for an ambiguous term like 'Islamic extremism'.
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So I have pulled from the UK high courts findings website, the two cases that address directly islamic extremism: and have mentioned them both abd provided source URLs.
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On that basis I put back in the 10-point definition that the Judge in the Shakeel Begg used: as it provides a digestible (not too much legalese!) definition.
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because of some alleged assassinations conducted by the organization (and apparently it is already listed there), but Hezbollah does not belong to this article.
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https://web.archive.org/web/20150216091255/http://www.visionofhumanity.org/sites/default/files/Global%20Terrorism%20Index%20Report%202014.pdf
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Hi Wiae, thanks for helping to get this page into shape. You're right, as written that single UK court did not seem so signficicant.
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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is a quality article, then look at its first line, which introduces the organization as "a Shi'a Islamist militant group", based on
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When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
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1389:. I personally don't have a definite opinion one way or another; just trying to help anchor this discussion in RSs and policies.
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article is enough, while the word "extremist" is not even mentioned in that article? Joobo, don't misrepresent that article, if
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http://www.quilliamfoundation.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/publications/free/the-balance-of-islam-in-challenging-extremism.pdf
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https://www.webcitation.org/659kGUopL?url=http://terrorism.about.com/od/groupsleader1/p/Jemaah_Islamiya.htm
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If you think this need further framework to explain the sigificance of the 10-pint framework - do shout.
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If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with
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I would say "probably", depending on whether "radical" is considered interchangeable with "extremist".
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when compiling this list. Which lists of Islamic extremist groups should be cited in this article?
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http://www.visionofhumanity.org/sites/default/files/Global%20Terrorism%20Index%20Report%202014.pdf
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This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between
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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template
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will respond that in my world of common sense, it all depends on what you consider "extreme" -
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Very useful list potentially but as of right now it is missing a lot, I literally just added
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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with
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All I have to go on, without launching a massive search and study review, is the
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shows notability and If that did not suffice, the presence of two
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http://terrorism.about.com/od/groupsleader1/p/Jemaah_Islamiya.htm
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Or if you think the case is significant to get it's own page?
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Its notability is either with the person who lost that trial,
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sources like Oxford reference works are a good way of gauging
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to verify the list of groups that you added to this article?
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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for additional information. I made the following changes:
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need a peer-reviewed source by an Islam scholar. --
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http://www.conflict-news.com/boko-haram-worse-isis/
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33:for general discussion of the article's subject.
845:I have added more context to show the relevance
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1669:source check
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869:CanterburyUK
863:— Preceding
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239:WikiProjects
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19:This is the
1383:WP:TERTIARY
1339:this source
1075:Izan Mehdi.
633:Moonraker12
148:free images
31:not a forum
1739:Categories
1706:Report bug
1037:Report bug
604:6 May 2022
542:discussion
190:While the
1689:this tool
1682:this tool
1381:Academic
1335:Hezbollah
1331:Hezbollah
1275:Hezbollah
1250:Hezbollah
1190:Dawn Bard
1123:Dawn Bard
1102:Hezbollah
1089:Hezbollah
1020:this tool
1013:this tool
812:MarkiPoli
622:Templates
547:Terrorism
538:terrorism
510:Terrorism
88:if needed
71:Be polite
21:talk page
1695:Cheers.—
1552:opinions
1488:Islamism
1484:Jihadism
1461:Khawarij
1420:Khawarij
1391:Eperoton
1321:Jusdafax
1300:Eperoton
1228:Eperoton
1201:Eperoton
1194:Jusdafax
1056:HuffPost
1026:Cheers.—
877:contribs
865:unsigned
762:Islamism
653:Jihadism
458:Religion
436:Religion
389:Religion
56:get help
29:This is
27:article.
1619:my edit
1584:Kleuske
1580:opinion
1575:sources
1569:Sources
1556:AKAKIOS
1534:Kleuske
1508:AKAKIOS
1493:AKAKIOS
1465:Kleuske
1447:Kleuske
1440:AKAKIOS
1424:AKAKIOS
1409:Rewrite
1387:WP:NPOV
1192:, and
924:my edit
574:on the
485:on the
344:on the
229:C-class
154:WP refs
142:scholar
1530:WP:BRD
1526:WP:3RR
1522:WP:OWN
1463:-bit.
1060:Edison
756:Jarble
740:Jarble
707:Jarble
692:Jarble
235:scale.
126:Google
1325:Joobo
1279:Joobo
1186:Joobo
1130:WP:RS
1096:Joobo
897:/wiae
832:/wiae
317:Islam
308:Islam
258:Islam
169:JSTOR
130:books
84:Seek
1727:talk
1588:talk
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1497:talk
1486:and
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1079:talk
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901:/tlk
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816:talk
804:here
800:ISIL
785:talk
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637:talk
602:and
447:and
445:good
162:FENS
136:news
73:and
1663:RfC
1633:to
1372:fax
1362:Jus
1307:is
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994:RfC
964:to
954:to
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566:Low
477:Low
449:1.0
336:Low
176:TWL
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