1177:: The purpose of an infobox image in a biographical article is to clearly illustrate what the person looked like. An image appropriately sized to achieve that purpose doesn't "glorify" the political beliefs of the subject, it just clearly illustrates what they looked like. As long as the image size doesn't distend the infobox (which probably starts happening about 250px), I fail to see what substantive issue you are trying to address here, especially when we are talking about 15px. I have written several FAs on Nazis which have infobox images larger than this one, and I have never had a reviewer at any level of review suggest that I was "glorifying Nazis" as a result. The logical extension of what you are suggesting is that we should have a really small thumbnail of Adolf Hitler in his article, but a really big photo of Nelson Mandela in his. I fail to see how that is encyclopaedic.
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is advocating for. While 180px may be fine for me (and it is—it's large enough for me to see clearly but doesn't "glorify" the individual in my opinion), others may need to different settings adjustments. Leaving it to auto-size provides that flexibility. Checking through the history of the page, the
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Not entirely - the
British and Russians were much more class-conscious than, say, the German or American armies of the pre-WW1 era. Germany was in fact a rather progressive country in matters of government, education, etc until the 1920s. It was difficult for a German enlisted man to achieve officer
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come to mind here. Infobox images should be made a reasonable size, and should be treated uniformly, with regard only to aesthetics, proportions, and functionality, not to subject matter. I believe image output can be adjusted in personal preferences, which is what I'd recommend. Otherwise, you're
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The lead image (sometimes the main infobox image) is often larger than default image sizes within an article - that isn't glorifying anything. For an infobox image it's really just a visual balance between a useful recognition size, and not expanding the width of the infobox. If not leaving it at
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Auto-sizing also seems sensible to me. I've seen a bit of editing going on in the last few months where one or two editors are seeking to artificially reduce the size of photos of Nazi war criminals, and it's really not a good idea. If the only photos which are available are clear-cut propaganda,
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BMK started discussions, in a short period of time, on the talk pages of over twenty Nazis and affiliates, that the size of the image was shouting. In about half the cases he shrank the image and then referred to it as "the current size". We need to have consistency in our image practices and
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The article says that he entered the army as a ""Fahnenjunker"", which is comparable to an ensign in
British usage. It's an entry point for someone who wishes to obtain a commission. So he didn't start as an enlisted man, he started as what amounts to an officer candidate. Best
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I don't really see that big a difference here between 167, 175 or 190px and certainly not significant enough to cause a dispute. Also, the editors that changed the size, other than BMK, haven't commented, but looking at the edit summaries I don't see any
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Where are we on this now? Where's the ANI thread, is it still open, or do we need another one? BMK is now off on a crusade across all the articles he dislikes on undeserving nazis, trying to reduce the image sizes. He's also claiming (see
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Eduard Dietl was a Nazi. He joined the German Worker's Party -- a short-lived predecessor to the Nazi Party -- in 1919, and was a member of the right-wing
Freikorps. He was not a "clean" Wehrmacht general with no Nazi connections.
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sits lower at 187px, however this is still noteworthily larger than the suggested size of just 167px. I feel that the much larger 220px is standard for ALL figures, Nazi or not, and thus does not represent glorification;
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at default setting for the infobox without any px sizing (which is deprecated anyway - upright should be used if re-sizing). This renders the image at the same width as other images in featured article biographies e.g.
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So far, for this discussion here, I see strong opposition to BMK either making per-article changes to individual biogs, to doing that with hard-coded pixel sizes, or to doing it because nazis only deserve small
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Auto-size seems reasonable here. Trying to purposefully reduce size of images simply because they depict nazis or other criminals and controversial people doesn't seem like a particularly productive endeavour.--
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That seems fair, but this is not the place. I would suggest a community wide discussion and an official policy on image size. If thre is an "official size" then it is one size fits all (even NARRRZISS!).
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Is there a problem with the default size seen across most articles of this nature? Why force a size at all? If anything upright=0.75 should be the max and the format used over "px" fixed size.--
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is currently 369 Ă— 586 pixels and shown at |upright=1.1|. Propose we reduce to 50 x 50, change to black and white, and display at upright=0.4. (In other words, yes, this is a stupid dispute.)
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When was Dietl promoted captain? The main text states "In March 1918, he was promoted to
Hauptmann", while the list of promotions below reads "Hauptmann: August 29, 1919”.
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What
Galobtter said. A really stupid dispute. Let the software decide image size and don't equate comfortably visible depiction of historic material with "glorification". --
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IMHO, I'm open to discussing better guidance on smaller images for biog infoboxes with portrait shaped images (MW has long been weak there), but this should stay based on
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Also, I'm slightly taken aback by my inference of the idea that it would be ok for "clean
Wehrmacht" generals to have large images, and "dirty" ones not. Hardly NPOV. (
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It is not the purpose of
Knowledge to either glorify or denigrate Nazis. We're supposed to document relevant facts and information on all manner of topics, that's it.
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I also condemn the behaviour of the nominator (and some others) here, for their "nazis don't deserve large images" nonsense, and their bully tactics on GF editors.
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190px does far more than simply identify the subject. As can be seen from the box above, 167 is sufficient to do that. Anything more than that is gratuitous.
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1684:) that it was ANI which instructed him to behave in that way. That is so not the way to do things, and it's ANI-worthy behaviour to be so disruptive.
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image spent most of its history (2012–2017) auto-sized (and almost all of the rest of it set to at least 200px, including 300px for about 12 months).
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review the helpful input provided here and then open an RfC on neutral ground such as an appropriate
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His image as presented in the article at the moment is too large. A single editor keeps bumping it up to 190px, when 175px is
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default, ideally use use "image_upright=" to respect user preferences. For this image, upright=1 (usually 220px) seems fine.
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I should click the revert button across 20 or 30 articles, and then copy paste the same thread across another 20 or 30 more
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Interesting - he seems from the list of ranks to have started as an enlisted man. Unusual in the German Army of that era.
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Agreed. Infoboxe images (and thumbnails) should not be size forced, let the template do what it's designed to do. -
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Leave it at the default size. I don't think the size of a photo is going to cause anyone to become a Nazi-lover.
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is pretty openly disruptive. Moreover, this issue goes back to at least July, when when they felt it necessary
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A neutral pointer to this discussion has been placed on the talk pages of the WikiProjects listed above.
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to make sure they're consistent with image size and BMK instantly started reverting the changes, so ANI
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This is a stupid dispute. It is definitely not glorifying Nazis to use the default image size. And per
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and four other passengers, was killed in an air crash in
Austria. The Ju 52 aircraft carrying Dietl,
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That seems fair. I do not mean, by the way, to denigrate Beyond My Ken, who is a very solid editor.--
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It is not
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To add onto what I said before, using Wiki formatting to cast moral judgments seems like a case of
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for ALL Nazis (and all other figures) because if we did otherwise it would display systemic bias.
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for using a high quality svg (as policy says we should) rather than a low quality, off center jpg.
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join
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The page's protection level has changed since this request was placed. You should now be able to
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Leave it at 190px or use alternative "image_upright" parameter to scale image to a similar size
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should not be using fixed image sizes here. (but maybe saying this means I must Heil Hitler?)
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2074:. If you still seem to be unable to, please reopen the request with further details. —
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Franz Rossi and three other passengers crashed in the vicinity of the small village of
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I believe the infobox image should be reduced to 175px or even 167px. Thoughts?
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Possibly better size (167px), still large enough to easily identify the subject
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This is an exceedingly stupid and pedantic dispute, even for infoboxes, but "
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imposing a view on articles where you can make it stick seems unwise.--
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to easily identify the subject -- in fact, 167px would be better.
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all have 220px portraits in their userboxes as well. I feel that
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we'd be better off not using them (which seems justifiable under
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attempting to impose your personal taste on everyone else.
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That was my only concern, as I left in my edit summary
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status, but not as hard as is commonly (now) believed.
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Infobox size I've been attempting to institute (175px)
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This article was edited to contain a total or partial
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This article has been checked against the following
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1584:Auto-sizing would seem the obvious solution..
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1982:On 23 June 1944, Dietl, along with generals
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1700:So the only ANI thread I can find is here:
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1942:Protected edit request on 15 December 2018
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1421:. BMK brought in the Nazi thing. -
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885:to see a list of its authors.
776:Military biography task force
525:This article is supported by
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383:and see a list of open tasks.
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278:and see a list of open tasks.
42:Put new text under old text.
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2046:. There were no survivors.
2010:. There were no survivors.
1972:to reactivate your request.
1960:has been answered. Set the
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1739:BMK is not an admin. FYI -
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50:New to Knowledge? Welcome!
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25:Eduard Dietl
19:This is the
1661:, as well.
1350:here we are
1274:MOS:UPRIGHT
1115:| upright =
871:translation
706:Structure:
573:World War I
199:Start-class
148:free images
31:not a forum
2094:Categories
1962:|answered=
1543:Staberinde
1472:FlightTime
1426:FlightTime
1357:FlightTime
1332:Bermicourt
1278:definitely
1223:sieg heil!
966:Image size
2068:Not done:
2049:Skjoldbro
2040:Rettenegg
2014:Proposal:
2004:Rettenegg
1980:Original:
1713:|upright=
1708:pictures.
1603:|upright=
1496:Auto-size
1286:pingĂł miĂł
1282:Galobtter
904:Engr105th
877:from the
561:Biography
498:Biography
438:Biography
88:if needed
71:Be polite
21:talk page
1663:Xcalibur
1641:Xcalibur
1397:contribs
934:contribs
922:unsigned
667:criteria
565:European
443:Military
56:get help
29:This is
27:article.
1928:Cogaidh
1866:Wehwalt
1860:And at
1786:Wehwalt
1758:Wehwalt
1632:WP:NPOV
1525:WP:NPOV
1387:Elmidae
948:regards
926:Helensq
640:C-class
581:C‑class
413:on the
386:Bavaria
377:Bavaria
333:Bavaria
308:on the
281:Germany
272:Germany
228:Germany
154:WPÂ refs
142:scholar
2044:Styria
2008:Styria
1844:warned
1659:WP:RGW
1555:I see
1529:Nick-D
1257:Thomas
569:German
205:scale.
126:Google
2018:Ju 52
1966:|ans=
1956:This
1561:Satan
1352:. -
1315:Leave
1303:Hohum
1276:, we
169:JSTOR
130:books
84:Seek
2053:talk
1932:talk
1916:and
1899:and
1870:talk
1852:talk
1790:talk
1776:talk
1762:talk
1742:wolf
1721:talk
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1634:and
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1393:talk
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1264:talk
1238:wolf
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1201:talk
1122:and
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1075:Moxy
1061:talk
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954:talk
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908:talk
487:and
162:FENS
136:news
73:and
1964:or
1864:.--
1607:not
1326:or
1124:OWN
873:of
405:Low
300:Low
176:TWL
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