Knowledge (XXG)

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The result was Keep. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:57, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Ashtown, Dublin (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Many roads here lack pavements. I'm sure they do but that does not make it notable. A railway passes through the area. Does every square metre in the world that has a railway pass by occasionally get an article? Near a road that goes to Navan indeed you might say of all places. Says it all. There isn't even anything else worth mentioning in the article. The roads are bad, a railway goes through it (probably very quickly) and it goes to Navan. More likely it is notable as being an escape route from Navan. Balloholic (talk) 23:59, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Keep Notable for its moss and much else besides. Colonel Warden (talk) 00:24, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep - it's a notable place. It's had its own railway station for more than 100 years. - Richard Cavell (talk) 02:31, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
    • As railway has been in existence for more than 100 years that is hardly a valid point. Lots of nooks and crannies have had railways for the same period and not much else. If each is notable it would seem to lower the overall notability of railways by suggesting that every single one is worthy of mention never mind the avenue where it is located. --Balloholic (talk) 14:13, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • question it is not clear to me what the jurisdictional status of this & the other two locations might be: In terms of the Local Government Act 2001, is it a "Town: The remaining town authorities, formerly known as urban districts or towns with town commissioners, were all redesignated as towns" that elects a Town council? If it has a Council of it's own, it is a separate jurisdictional unit, and intrinsically notable. Or is it a Local Election Area, which just elects a representative to a council? In that case it probably would not be notable, unless there wa something special. It seems to be more than a mere neighborhood, whose notability varies. Is it a region known historically by the name, or a contemporary artificial construct? It does not necessarily matter how good the roads are, or the other environmental factors; if it is, or is about to be, a separate jurisdiction, it is as notable as if it were a village geographically isolated separate from Dublin. If not, it depends. Not every p
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ireland-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 09:23, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
    • It's not a separate village. The name Ashtown is relatively new as can be told by its components. Old Irish names don't tend to be composed of two English words, they tend to be translations of words like baile or rath. It is clear it is a newly expanded part of the city which thinks it has a bigger place in the world. --Balloholic (talk) 14:13, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep as per everyone but the nominator. Edward321 (talk) 15:54, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Weak Delete Everything I've read about this suggests that it is a non-notable district of a larger, more notable region. I see nothing that warrants it's own article. Trusilver 09:39, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was keep. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 14:14, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Adamstown, Dublin (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

A plan. States that it is a town yet immediately contradicts itself by saying it yet has to be granted "town status" and may never be. "Development plan" section starts off with "It is intended" which typifies the article really. Littered with phrases such as "plans to expand", "being put in place" "will be" and "no date has been set". Everything is going to be happening here in the future, nothing is definite and certainly nothing is happening right now. This is even worse than the non-notable Dublin alleyway tourist attractions that exist already - it's for the tourists who are planning to come to Dublin at a later date! It's more like religion or a philosophical dream than an encyclopedic entry. On top of this it has the cheek to not even offer a reference to the person who came up with this fantasyland. Balloholic (talk) 23:48, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Keep Here is an adequate source which should have been found before nomination per WP:BEFORE. Colonel Warden (talk) 00:33, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep - there are houses built in the area, and it has its own football club and local council. It exists. I believe that it is notable, and that all such suburbs/districts are notable. - Richard Cavell (talk) 02:32, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Comment any area can have houses. I live in a house. My area is not on wikipedia and I don't think it would be notable for what we are trying to achieve on this project. Having some houses does not make it meet the notability criteria I'm afraid. --Balloholic (talk) 16:56, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Comment Any area can have its own football club. I believe these are very popular in the UK and that there are also many in Dublin. There is even one down the road from me. However I would not suggest that my area in notable for having some football clubs. The club in question is amateur - there are barely a dozen semi-pro clubs in Ireland as it is. There is nothing to suggest that it is little more than a schoolboy club either. --Balloholic (talk) 16:56, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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  • Keep as per Colonel Warden, Richard Cavell. Edward321 (talk) 15:56, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep as per editors reasoning above. travb (talk) 17:02, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep per Colonel Warden. Even proposed towns or topics can be notable provided there are adequate sources about them. Just because something is proposed doesn't in itself violate WP:CRYSTAL. --Oakshade (talk) 22:16, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep, the foundation stone has been laid http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/?c=ireland&jp=kfididkfeysn Scaldi (talk) 22:48, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment: I don't think one stone will make a blind bit of difference. Lots of stones will be lain and never built upon. Especially the way the building trade is going with the recession we have to be careful what sort of buildings and towns we're licensing. There is no proof these ever exist. Someone could just as easily dig out one saying the Adamstown has had to be cancelled because of the bankers and a lack of funding for developers. On top of all this there are a lot of ifs and buts and should haves about that article. Very like a CRYSTALBALL. --Balloholic (talk) 23:09, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Strong Keep - Adamstown is not just notable because it as another large housing development in Dublin. It is notable because it was the first scheme to be built as a Special Development Zone (SDZ). This means that (for once in Ireland), the planning is joined up. The schools, shops, and other facilities are being built in tandem with the phases of the housing. A new transport link was also built (direct to Heuston Station), complete with train turntable. There is no crystal balling involved, the first phases of the the houses/apartments are finished and occupied, as are the first primary schools, and the rail link. The development is ongoing. I'm surprised this was even nominated. Snappy (talk) 08:19, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment - Does anyone else find it uncivil that the nominator makes sarcastic and patronising comments to anyone who votes against the nomination? Every editor has a right to vote whatever way they like, and this vote should be respected. The comments and tone of User:Balloholic certainly leave a lot to be desired, e.g. "Their mythical arguments have been debunked". Because someone disagrees with you, there is no need to be uncivil. Snappy (talk) 08:19, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was keep. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 14:15, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Phibsboro (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Article gives an indication that it is near one or two notable places. But being near isn't much use. Being there would be better and serve to be proper notable. It is "served by several forms of public transport including several routes of Dublin Bus and by the Dublin Suburban railway system" - what in Dublin or Ireland or the world isn't? Being two kilometres from Croke Park or a river doesn't help much. How about if they were actually there? One or two "traditional pubs" - I'm sure there's many's a village is Ireland that has at least three or four such pubs. There are plans to build a hospital. It is near another hospital. The government has more plans. All plans. It's a bit Crystalballish I'd think especially considering the government are cutting back and there is a recession. A sports team are located here but are soon moving away. Sums it all up really. An area that has nothing going for it. Its neighbours get everything. Balloholic (talk) 23:35, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was keep. John254 00:18, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Pickled dragon (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

An article over a prank in order to promote a novel. Delete as a hoax. Tavix (talk) 22:17, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was G1 speedy by TerriersFan. Master of Puppets Call me MoP! :D 21:44, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Ooba Shiggly (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Knowledge (XXG) is not a dictonary. The Rolling Camel (talk) 21:12, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Speedy delete Patent nonsense. Peridon (talk) 21:15, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Extremely Speedy delete Nonsense, should be CSD not AFD. FlyingToaster 21:16, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 23:55, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Helen Waite (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Neologism. Delete Mr. Vernon (talk) 20:54, 24 December 2008 (UTC)


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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 17:31, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Time is grainy (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable fringe theory, WP:SOAP might be relevant here. Headbomb {κοντριβς – WP Physics} 20:38, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Merge into Space-time#Quantized_spacetime. The single source given in the article might be useful there, even if none of the text is salvageable. I'd hang on to the resulting redirect as it seems like a plausible search term. Reyk YO! 23:59, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Science-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 00:24, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete or redirect to 'Space-time#Quantized spacetime'. I don't think this theory is new, or in any way distinct from that old argument. - Richard Cavell (talk) 02:35, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete. The article as it stands lacks suitable references, and the final sentence practically screams WP:HOAX. Although quantized spacetime is a legitimate theory, "Time is grainy" is not. siℓℓy rabbit (talk) 04:30, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete. There isn't even any real information in the article. It only briefly mentions the history of theory with no explanation of it. Not what I would call quality Knowledge (XXG) stuff. Swiftek (talk) 20:26, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete and do not merge. It is not clear that the astrophysicist mentioned, Richard Lieu, actually proposes spacetime graininess in the publication mentioned ("The effect of Planck-scale spacetime fluctuations on Lorentz invariance at extreme speeds". Richard Lieu, The Astrophysical Journal Letters. Volume 568, issue 2, pages L67–L70, April 2002). What he does is point out an effect that must be manifest if quantum spacetime is real. There is no evidence of the claim in the article that that the concept of quantized spacetime "gained a wider appreciation" by this publication: the title of the publication has 7 Google hits only, and no citations are found using Google scholar so it has not been widely cited. In a later article the same author argues against the existence of such Planck-scale spacetime fluctuations, at least to first order ("The phase coherence of light from extragalactic sources: direct evidence against first-order Planck-scale fluctuations in time and space". Richard Lieu and Lloyd W. Hillman, The Astrophysical Journal Letters. Volume 585, issue 2, pages L77–L80, March 2003). The article title is imho not a plausible search term. 88.234.1.171 (talk) 14:40, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was speedy delete, G3 (obvious hoax). Author warned with {{uw-hoax}}. Blueboy96 20:40, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Stefan Keusch (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

The sole reference cited, IMDB, does not link to this film, if it exists, because a Google search finds, er, nothing. My guess is that it's a hoax. Rodhullandemu 19:42, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

In fact this article looks strangely like a cut & paste copy of that one, with the name changed. WP:SNOW anyone? --Rodhullandemu 20:31, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 17:33, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Stronger (Amy Winehouse album) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Fails WP:CRYSTAL. ukexpat (talk) 19:28, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

We already said a million of times, Knowledge (XXG) isn't a crystal ball. ROGERCHOCODILES 19:13, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was speedy delete. Unverifiable article by known hoaxer. See discussion. Mgm| 22:48, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Cartoon Network and Nicktoons Clash with the humans (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Article does not establish notability or even if the game exists given such a long leadtime. Reads like a hoax to me given the title alone. treelo radda 17:35, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was speedy delete, G11 (blatant advertising), without prejudice to recreation by someone unrelated to the subject. The article's author was HouseofL (talk · contribs), whose username is an exact match to the organization promoting this pageant. Blueboy96 20:56, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Miss Black Virginia USA (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Speedy tag removed by a third party with a grand total of three edits. Competition with no assertion of notability. Delete.  Blanchardb -- timed 17:24, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Keep. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 01:01, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

The Lickets (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable band. Article appears largely promotional. References provided are not enough to prove notability. No major label, no significant airplay or charted songs. Speedy declined merely because the band released two albums. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 17:08, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

The band has charted on independent and college radio in the top 20 for last two albums. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chalfantsandilands (talk • contribs) 18:41, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Proof, please. References. It's required. We have to be able to verify what you write. Moreover, the "charts" you have mentioned are merely for individual stations, and not well-known national or regional charts. That is not sufficient. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 19:05, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

According to wikipedia: "All Class C and B FM stations in the United States can be included. Class A and D FM stations should generally not have articles, but exceptions may be made if they have a large audience, such as stations for medium to large universities, or are notable for some other reason." All of the stations listed fulfill this criteria, and according to wikipedia's rules are notable. The link to this wikipedia article is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/Wikipedia:Notability_(TV_and_radio_stations)Chalfantsandilands (talk) 02:59, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Uh, this has to do with whether or not the stations themselves are notable enough for articles about them. It has absolutely, positively nothing to do with the notability of their airplay rotation or charts. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 04:55, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

All chart positions mentioned with the exception of KVRX, which has no archive, have been referenced with links to the radio stations sites.Chalfantsandilands (talk) 03:01, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Will try to assemble as much "proof" as possible but independent radio charts are largely compiled through CMJ. A paid service. And these stations are all extremely well known. You really seem to be trying hard on this one. Chalfantsandilands (talk) 19:37, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Is it possible there is a fundamentalist agenda in Realkyhick's nomination of this group for deletion? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chalfantsandilands (talk • contribs) 19:54, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Comment: Personal attacks of the nature shown above are specifically prohibited. Moreover, I have no idea how any fundamentalist agenda, mine or anyone else's would have any bearing whatsoever on this matter. The musical group simply does not meet notability requirements, period. It is not signed to a recognized label, it has not had any songs to appear on any noteworthy chart (single-station charts do not qualify), and it has not achieved notability through any other means outside of their performance. I've nominated for deletion many, many bands and musicians of all genres for these very same reasons. Not every musician merits a Knowledge (XXG) article, because of policies that have been put in place here for quite some time. I strongly suggest that the original author (who never bothers to sign his/her comments) read the relevant policies before continuing, and to refrain from remarks of a personal nature that may result in him or her being blocked from editing. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 02:13, 25 December 2008 (UTC)


It is immediately apparent from looking at the entry that the band meets criteria 1 from the notability guidelines. Link: notability requirements. It has been the subject of multiple non-trivial published works whose source is independent from the musician/ensemble itself and reliable.And according to the guidelines the entry only needs to fulfill this single criterion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chalfantsandilands (talk • contribs) 03:13, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Again, the charts for individual stations are useless as only more notable charts are recognized for Knowledge (XXG). Only the Lost in E Minor and Garden of Earthly Delights links actually have verifiable mentions of the band, and the longer of the two is nothing more than a paragraph. Two of the references link to other Knowledge (XXG) article - Knowledge (XXG) is not self-referencing. On the whole, the list of references is very insufficient. At the risk of repeating myself, the band is not notable. - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 04:10, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

The Wire, The Fly, Skyscraper, and the Sound Projector are all significant publications distributed internationally. The band is notable. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.130.184.112 (talk) 05:09, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

That would really depend on the scope of the coverage. Does anyone here have access to any of these issues? --Kraftlos (Talk | Contrib) 05:38, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

I added to the article links both to the fly article, as well as the text of the review in the wire by Matthew Ingram/ Woebot. This article continues to meet criteria for inclusion in wikipedia. Mentioned on Simon Reynolds blog here: http://blissout.blogspot.com/2005/06/blog-post.html. He made the term post-rock. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.130.184.112 (talk) 05:20, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

I'd be wary of using a blog as a source. --Kraftlos (Talk | Contrib) 05:38, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
I know just saying...Also just added links to the pdf of h magazine, as well as verifiable contents of the sound projector links. This entry continues to meet criteria 1.
No, it doesn't. The mentions max out at three paragraphs for the longest one, which doesn't qualify as non-trivial. Blogs are not considered reliable sources. (And would you please sign in and sign your posts, Chalfantsandilands?) - Realkyhick (Talk to me) 05:48, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Thank you! Also: Scans of Reviews in The Wire, The Sound Projector, and Skyscraper here:

http://img78.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thewireoutsidehq3.jpg
http://img224.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thewireinsideql8.jpg
http://img387.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thesoundprojectoroutsidko0.jpg
http://img234.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thesoundprojectorinsidemv2.jpg
http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=skyscraperinsideid5.jpg
—Preceding unsigned comment added by Chalfantsandilands (talk • contribs) 06:53, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Weak keep. I would like to see more coverage, but The Wire and The Fly are good sources, and they've been played on national UK radio, and they've obviously got beyond the 'garage band' stage, so let's keep it.--Michig (talk) 21:03, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 17:34, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

NCAA bdc (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

I'm guessing this is some sort of TV program, but there are no links or references, and no pages link to it. Delete Unless someone can tell me what it is. Dengero (talk) 16:54, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • All I can come up with so far is this news release by the NCAA here, explaining that one "BDC Partners, Inc." registered over 23,000 school-related domain names for marketing purposes. MuZemike (talk) 20:21, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete. It lacks context (without any actual prose that is speediable), and it looks like it will be a bunch of statistics that should be incorporated in another article when said episodes have actually run. - Mgm| 22:43, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Speedy delete (A1) — no context. Looking at the creator's userpage, there seems to be more on the way. MuZemike (talk) 03:53, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 02:00, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Codeprofiler (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

No reliable third party sources. Product has only been around since Sept 2008 so difficult to believe it's notable. Omarcheeseboro (talk) 16:29, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was speedily deleted per discussion with author on talk page. Jclemens (talk) 04:06, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Sophiophilia (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

WP:Knowledge (XXG) is not a dictionary, WP:Knowledge (XXG) is not for things made up one day. Not found in OED or Merriam-Webster Unabridged. Even if the construction existed, it would likely be "sophophilia" (as "sopho-" is the combining form), but that doesn't exist either.WP:SYN for the personal reflection on philosophy.

After I proposed deletion for the article, the author posted a link to a website that includes the term along with several others. That page itself notes that all the terms are neologisms coined by one person. —Largo Plazo (talk) 16:27, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 01:06, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

IChase (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Delete Sounds suspiciously like nonsense. Can't find anything on this subject that doesn't lead back to the Knowledge (XXG) article. And even if it does actually exist, I'm not sure it would be notable enough to be worth having an article on... AlistairMcMillan (talk) 15:30, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was keep. John254 00:16, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Introduction to entropy (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Not for Knowledge (XXG), for Wikiversity instead Ipatrol (talk) 01:19, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

If we're trading links, you should read Knowledge (XXG):Many things to many people. Tim Vickers (talk) 18:09, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Having the introductory article at Thermodynamic entropy and the detailed article at Entropy would seem to me to be a recipe for confusion. Why not just keep the introduction at the most descriptive title? Tim Vickers (talk) 20:18, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Changed to Merge with Entropy and use this to create an "Introduction" section at the top.  LinguistAtLarge  00:09, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Merge with entropy. I agree with rogerd that it is the entropy article's job to explain what entropy is. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jason Quinn (talk • contribs) 21:30, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep We have other "introduction ..." articles, and they have been successfully defended against challenges. In practice they are very good ways of dealing with subjects like this. WP is used by a very wide range of people; I would suspect that about 100 times as many readers could understand this as compared to our other articles. I wish more could, but the intent is for our content to be accessible to the usual level of high school students as well as educated adults. Their presence is an exception to the general rule about forking. Paper encyclopedias can more easily deal with long multi-level articles than can we. DGG (talk) 22:04, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep Agree with DGG. Aymatth2 (talk) 22:12, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Merge to Entropy. Each article should provide a satisfactory introduction to its topic directly. Colonel Warden (talk) 22:39, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep. If an introduction to viruses can become a featured article, then the fact it's an introduction is not sufficient reason to delete it. We should use a certain level of of writing in regular articles if we are to be taken seriously as an encyclopedia. Introductions are a good way to simplify even further without making WP completely useless to experts. - Mgm| 22:41, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Your suggestion is directly contrary to policy which states "A Knowledge (XXG) article should not be presented on the assumption that the reader is well versed in the topic's field. Introductory language in the lead and initial sections of the article should be written in plain terms and concepts that can be understood by any literate reader of Knowledge (XXG) without any knowledge in the given field before advancing to more detailed explanations of the topic.". Colonel Warden (talk) 23:59, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • It is in no way contradictory to have, in addition to a well-written and accessible lead, a broader and more general introduction that both sets a specialised article in its broader context and provides a greatly-simplified view of the topic. In these introductions you omit unavoidably-technical aspects that still need to be covered in the main article for the main article to be comprehensive. For example, the level of detail used in Introduction to genetics would not be acceptable in gene, DNA or genetics (all articles that this Intro usefully augments) since too much is omitted. I see these articles as sub-articles that expand on a well-written introduction, just as other sub-articles expand on the other sections of the main article. Tim Vickers (talk) 18:45, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Since all the AfDs have closed as Keep, I think a reasonable consensus does exist. No need for what some might see as forum shopping. Tim Vickers (talk) 01:44, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was speedy keep per withdrawal by nominator. Bongomatic 23:52, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Redemptorists of Australia and New Zealand (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Google search (not perfect, I know) generated fifteen unique (non-redundant) hits. Of these, there was not a single one that was independent other than the Knowledge (XXG) entry and clones. And even the Knowledge (XXG) ones cannot be said to be independent as the article was penned by User:RedemptoristAus. Bongomatic 15:07, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

What is the notability criterion you are using here? The main problem with this article is the total lack of any independent coverage, not the COI/POV. Bongomatic 19:45, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Response. Common sense basically - in the same way that all royalty are notable, so, imo, is a Redemptorist province - assuming it does actually exist of course. Therefore, imo, the least it deserves is a stubby article. I have flagged it for rescue. It being Christmas day I am not going now to look for sources, but I suggest that lack of google-hits is not the end of the matter here :) Springnuts (talk) 23:49, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
The laundry list of activities is nonencylopedic and the fact that there are no third party sources referring to the group (province or not) indicate that it is non-notable. Not all chapters, subdivisions, subgroups, etc. of something notable are automatically notable. Notability is not inherited. Bongomatic 04:07, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
Response It took five minutes to find and source the first Rector of the North Perth monastery. Try some more google searches: "St Gerard’s" Monastery "New Zealand"; Redemptorists "New Zealand" etc ... I guarantee there is more to find. Springnuts (talk) 18:35, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep. There seems to be a 200 page book published on the subject: Boland, S. J. CSSR (1982). Faith of Our Fathers: The Redemptorists in Australia 1882 - 1982. Australia: H. H. Stephenson. ISBN 0949847070. There are also several online sources - I've added a couple. -- Avenue (talk) 07:35, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
And a similar book about the NZ side, cited here: Kearney, P. B. (1997). Plentiful redemption: The Redemptorists in New Zealand, 1883 - 1983. New Zealand.{{cite book}}: CS1 maint: location missing publisher (link) -- Avenue (talk) 07:43, 27 December 2008 (UTC)


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The result was keep. John254 00:17, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Philly Improv Theater (PHIT) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable theater group. References are not substantial, information provided is not encyclopedic. Bongomatic 15:02, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was keep per WP:SNOW. (WP:NAC) flaminglawyer 04:17, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

TNA Weekly PPV (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Being nominated for deletion as indiscriminate information. Weekly wrestling program results would seem to fall under the category of news reports, not encyclopedic content. Dsreyn (talk) 14:56, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Keep This was TNA Wrestling's main source of income. It is a valuable and important part of the company's history. They have released DVDs talking about these events. This is how TNA became a major wrestling company thanks to these events. This was not a weekly tv show. These ran live and were bought for 10 dollars each week.--WillC 21:03, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment. You say it wasn't a weekly show, but then in the next sentence you say it ran every week. So in other words, it wasn't a special once-per-year event like Wrestlemania, etc. - just a weekly event like Raw or Nitro, except you had to pay to watch it. And of course it was a major source of income. So should Knowledge (XXG) document every $10 sale at Wal-mart? After all, that's how Wal-mart makes their money. 71.233.6.118 (talk) 00:35, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Will, your comment at WT:PW can be seen as canvassing. Please don't leave any more messages for anybody else, thanks! ayematthew ✡ 03:55, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
I was informing people of the delete discussion. I was not incenuating which way the vote should go. It was related to the wrestling project. All I said was it can be improved, which it can by the multiple sources at PWTorch and at Pro Wrestling History.com--WillC 07:05, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Comment. From WP:Canvassing, in the section about halfway down the page titled Votestacking: Votestacking is an attempt to sway consensus by selectively notifying editors who have or are thought to have a predetermined point of view or opinion (which may be determined, among other ways, from a userpage notice, such as a userbox, or from user categorization), and thus encouraging them to participate in the discussion. You alerted people to the AfD discussion on the pro wrestling project page; what effect on the discussion do you reasonably expect that to have? People who read the project page are obviously going to be hardcore pro wrestling enthusiasts, are they not? Are these individuals more likely to vote "keep" or "delete" when it comes to a wrestling-related page? And I don't think it's an accident that most of the people who have weighed in on the discussion since your alert was posted seem to contribute mostly to pro wrestling articles. 71.233.6.118 (talk) 05:22, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
Most or if not all delete dicussions that have to do with the Professional wrestling project are mentioned on that page. I in no way was going "hey we need to keep this page so everyone go vote keep". All I said was in can be improved. Which is not trying to turn the vote. A wrestling article being deleted should be known by the wrestling project which it belongs too.--WillC 10:51, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
That makes no sense since technically it was Impact before iMPACT was established.--SRX 00:08, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
No it wasn't. These shows had a basic formatting like Impact but was not free. These shows made TNA money. They had no house shows or DVDs until late 2004 and early 2005; house shows did not begin until 2006. They sold shirts on TNA Wrestling.com was the only other money coming in. These shows where the entire beginning of TNA. They cost 10 dollars a week and had the most memorable moments in TNA. With the beginning of titles and title changes. Based on if they are notable, it is damn sure. They fall under the same format that Television episodes of prime time tv shows do. They can't even be bought anymore or downloaded. Plus there is enough sources for all of them. Even if individual articles aren't notable, an article about the series of them sure is. This was TNA's only means of television. They had no other shows besides these. TNA continues to talk about them today and release dvds about the first ones. These are very important to history of TNA.--WillC 00:32, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
So they are notable because people paid money for it? These were basically like ROH events, except they were taped. These PPV's led to the creation of Impact after they began airing on local cable television markets, a small prose in the Impact article or in the TNA article will do good because this list is just WP:LISTCRUFT and it is not notable like WWE Saturday Night's Main Event results.--SRX 03:49, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
I agree about about that results article. This was two years of history in TNA. What makes them less important than any other PPV article? They are carded just like these are. I don't see notablity in lets say Cyber Sunday. An interactive ppv which is not really choosen by the fans. That is trival as well. The only notbility in those articles are buyrates and title changes. TNA held Bound for Glory and Slammiversary before the monthly events were created. They named the aniversary weekly ppvs that aired Slammiversary and one in October by those titles, seeing from weekly PPV reviews from PWTorch.--WillC 07:05, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Keep But change to describe how they ran, where they were held &c rather than just a list of cards. We don't keep Impact, Raw or Nitro results and these don't qualify as supercards. Tony2Times (talk) 00:23, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment. So if they weren't supercards, why are they notable? Just because the audience needed to pay for it? Maybe the reason they ran as PPV events was simply because they didn't get enough customers paying to see it live and needed to raise extra revenue. I don't see anything suggesting that these events were any more notable than weekly episodes of Monday Night Raw. 71.233.6.118 (talk) 00:35, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Most of these events were supercards. Each week were highlighted by major title defences. These events were a contracted obligation between TNA and In Demand to run a certain amount of events. Spanning over two years before Fox Sports.net let them create Impact. The only reason they were stopped was to run monthly ppvs instead. Being a major part in the company's history is notable enough.--WillC 01:26, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep - per Tony2Times. Almost all other wrestling programs (most notably Monday Night Raw, SmackDown, Impact, etc., but right down to WWF Jakked/Metal and WWE Confidential) have articles. Although this is not, in itself, a reason to keep the article, it certainly provides a template for reformatting this article. Simply put, the article should be kept because it was a major program run for an extended length of time by a major wrestling company. It has received coverage in both reliable web and print sources. I do think it should be moved to TNA Weekly Pay Per View (or perhaps with hyphens, as in Pay-Per-View), and I definitely think it needs to describe the show, the creation of the idea and reason for weekly shows, notable occurrences, and the reason for ending the weekly events (see http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Wrestling/2004/08/19/589855.html). A list of results for 111 weekly show results doesn't belong, but a revamped version of this article definitely does. GaryColemanFan (talk) 07:05, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Now that I agree with, but if no work is put into the article, it will end up here again.--SRX 16:27, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Comment. But right now, the article is just a list of results - no introduction or explanation, or any assertion of notability (sorry, I just don't see how being a PPV automatically makes it notable; people pay to see house shows too, but weekly house show results don't seem notable either). A revamped article may indeed belong, but that's no reason to keep the current article; deleting the current one would not prevent someone from starting a completely new article. Note also that articles on other weekly shows like Raw and Nitro do not contain match results at all - except maybe mentioning specific, highly notable matches. Following the example set by articles on Raw and Nitro, a revised article should clearly consist almost entirely of text, without match by match results - so GaryColemanFan's argument seems like more of a reason to delete the current article and start fresh, rather than keep it. 71.233.6.118 (talk) 01:42, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep It just seems worthwhile to include. I don't have a great argument for it. How to reformat it or trim it, or rewrite it is another issue. But I think it's useful information that people are interested in. ChildofMidnight (talk) 07:10, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 04:34, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

The Tale of the 100-Acre Wood (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

The creator contested the prod that I put on it. The reason that I gave was fails WP:CRYSTAL. The article says, "The Tale of the 100-Acre Wood is an upcoming Winnie the Pooh animation (hand-drawn) with an unknown time of release. No casting members are yet present for this production, although these characters featuring in the film:". I can't find any sources for this and it also fails WP:NFF. Schuym1 (talk) 14:31, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was : Already speedily deleted (by me). - Mike Rosoft (talk) 12:12, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Travelland (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Not notable. This is a non-English article about a company that returns no GHIT's. Most of the hits were for an RV manufacturer in Canada. OrangeMarlin 11:58, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 01:08, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Venezuelan British (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Nothing in the article establishes that this is a notable intersection as required by WP:DIRECTORY. I quote: "Cross-categories like these are not considered sufficient basis to create an article, unless the intersection of those categories is in some way a culturally significant phenomenon". Cordless Larry (talk) 11:14, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Keep as for any other group of any significance--this is about 4,000 people. The above comment would appear to me to be an expression of inappropriate political feelings. It doesn't even apply--the article includes those immigrants who are not yet UK nationals. The example in NOT is ""People from ethnic/cultural/religious group X employed by organization Y" which is usually a very much more over-detailed cross-classification than this one. DGG (talk) 22:42, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
sorry--apparent edit conflict, the comment by Archivey just above yours. DGG (talk) 05:22, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
That makes more sense. Reyk YO! 08:12, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
It would be helpful if Archivey would explain what they meant by their comment more fully, I think. I'm not sure it was meant in the way that it might have been interpreted. Cordless Larry (talk) 21:14, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
Significance is not determined by numbers. 4,000 people is not particularly big for a migrant group --- in my experience writing and saving these articles, that number is right around/below the usual threshold at which groups tend to get enough published about them by journalists, scholars, etc. to meet the general notability guideline. Certainly, groups smaller than this have been proven notable, but that's by virtue of people actually finding the sources about them and putting them in the article. cab (talk) 09:01, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete there are clearly people who have links to both Venezuala and Britain but I don't see there being any evidence of "Venezuelan British" being a noted or accepted term for such a group - or any coverage detailing the group (its history, culture, etc.). Barring any evidence of reliable sources covering the group (that amount to more than a numerical statistic in a survey) I do not see how an article is possible. Knowledge (XXG) is not a publisher of original work, if no one else has written about the group we cannot cobble together a piece that identifies them as one. Guest9999 (talk) 08:57, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete Regardless of what name you want to call this group of people by, the usual barrage of searches—"venezuelans * in (london|britain|the united kingdom|the uk)" or in Spanish, "venezolan(a/o/os) * en (londres/inglaterra/reino unido)"—does not reveal any reliable sources about them, just blogs, yahoo groups, trivial mentions, a bunch of junk about the embassy, and one community association . cab (talk) 09:01, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete, small group with no shown impact. Punkmorten (talk) 12:26, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete. 'Keep' would make sense for a group of any significance--except that none whatsoever has been shown or even suggested. Cobbling together an adjective and a noun version of a nationality doesn't automatically signify anything particular. --CalendarWatcher (talk) 01:36, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was speedy delete (G12) by MacGyverMagic. Non-admin closure. MuZemike (talk) 15:30, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Nathalie_Archangel (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

non-notable, text is cut and paste from sole reference Markb (talk) 10:07, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was keep. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 14:17, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Shaktyavesha Avatar (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Should incarnations be included into wikipedia? I am not very sure about this article. Dengero (talk) 09:26, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Keep Lord Krishna is an important deity in Hinduism AFAIK, and this information should be included here. Such incarnations usually have a lot of information about them, enough to make a good article by itself. The article needs some cleaning up and improvement, but I think it should stay. Chamal 12:47, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Yes, they should be mentioned in that article of course. But I think there are many such incarnations that have a lot of individual qualities/characteristics. Discussing all of these in the main article would not be practical since it would take a lot of space, and all that could be included there is a kind of overview and not the full details. If I'm wrong please correct me; I'm not an expert in the subject matter, I'm just commenting on what I seem to remember about these incarnations. If I'm wrong on this matter, then I think adding the necessary info to the main article will suffice. Chamal 15:17, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was keep. John254 00:14, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

BCN Week (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

WP:N, only reliable external source listed is a deleted WordPress blog. StonerDude420 (talk) 08:53, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 01:11, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Mobiscope (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Unremarkable Gadget? Seems pretty promo to me. Dengero (talk) 08:40, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was keep. John254 00:17, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Mats Söderlund (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Somehow I mistakenly thought this was an internet phenomenon of some kind... I was wrong. I cannot find anything in the way of non-trivial third party publications about this musician, sorry. Delete. JBsupreme (talk) 08:36, 24 December 2008 (UTC).

  • Considering the nature of his performances, it is hard to imagine him in "non-trivial third party publications". Should we erase anyone who didn't make it to The New Yorker? The guy does have over 8 million views in YouTube alone! Do not delete. Vasilken 12:00, 24 December 2008 (UTC).
  • Keep Everything currently on the article page is reliable and verifiable. The album has been available in the US for a long time now. He has not reached mainstream popularity in the US, but is popular amoung college students. There were many college newspapers used as sources on the page before they were removed. Furthermore, anyone who's ever competed at Melodifestivalen (the biggest music competition in Sweden), should be well known enough amoung the European community. Furthmore, there are many articles in swedish and finnish available through their repsctive wikipedias. (Justinsane15 (talk) 21:42, 24 December 2008 (UTC))
  • Keep--Peak number 1 in the Swedish charts in 2004 and popular among the U.S college crowd. is not a proper argument to delete an article. --Jmundo (talk) 05:46, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 21:29, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Natalie Rotman (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Little known entertainment reporter. I found this interview with Leonardo DiCaprio and a few video interviews with celebrities, but I'm not sure if it's enough to meet WP:ENTERTAINER. Nudve (talk) 08:28, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 01:12, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

(Lil) Eco Racer (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable Facebook app. Unsourced. Doesn't meet WP:WEB. Graymornings(talk) 08:15, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Just like (Lil) Green Patch and thousands of other applications, (Lil) Eco Racer is notable. (Lil) Eco Racer is created by the same person as (Lil) Green Patch. (Lil) Eco Racer is still a super new application but it will expand just like (Lil) Green Patch. No website other than the application's lander page talk about the application and so this new Knowledge (XXG) page does not have any outside reference yet. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Minhnhatx (talk • contribs) 08:40, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Articles are never "approved". We try to tag new articles for deletion if they don't satisfy the criteria for inclusion. If an article stays un-noticed for a long time, it does not mean it has got a permanent place at Knowledge (XXG) or that it has been approved. Notability of an article can be challenged at any time.--Unpopular Opinion (talk) 11:40, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Sorry. Didn't know that was voting. I'm learning. =D. One of the links is from a user. --Minhnhatx (talk) 15:23, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Alright. Delete. I just wanted a guide for the 350,000 active monthly users. I was planning to advertise the page for the users to update the page themselves but I didn't know Knowledge (XXG). I will go elsewhere where it's more appropriate. Sorry and thank you everyone for your time. --Minhnhatx (talk) 15:35, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was delete. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 04:34, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

Molecular Gravity (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Incoherent, unscientific. Strong delete. StonerDude420 (talk) 08:15, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

It's gonna be a whiiiiiiite Christmas... Graymornings(talk) 00:06, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was keep. John254 00:19, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Refused discography (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Delete unecessary fork from main article on band Mayalld (talk) 07:48, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:55, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Moves Me E.P (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Delete non notable musical composition that has had no physical release. Mayalld (talk) 07:31, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:53, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

List of Nina Concerts and Gigs (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Listcruft and fancruft. What is "notable"? Very vague and pointless list. User:Woohookitty 06:44, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Keep. Eluchil404 (talk) 00:08, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Magic item (Dungeons & Dragons) (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Crufty, should be merged to Dungeons & Dragons or deleted outright. Knowledge (XXG) is not a game guide. Prodego 06:14, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Game-related deletion discussions. —Gavin Collins (talk) 09:35, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment Clearly this is an unimportant fictional artifact as it could be interechanged with just about any prop. --Gavin Collins (talk) 09:35, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Comment This isn't about an artifact; it is about an entire category of items in the game. -Drilnoth (talk) 13:35, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
      • Comment Indeed, this is more of a concept that goes back to the very roots of the game. I've seen Gary Gygax mentioning in interviews of how in the days before the game even saw print, players were looking to recover magical treasure from fallen enemies. This concept is neither a singular artifact nor a prop: "Magic item" is to Excalibur as "Basketball player" is to Michael Jordan. BOZ (talk) 15:33, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
        • Comment This article is not about a prop, under any definition of that term. To assert such, let alone to think it refers to a single object, shows a profound failure to understand the subject of the article. Edward321 (talk) 23:04, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
          • Comment If it is not a prop per se, then are you saying that is not used in the game? Are you saying it is a category applicable to only the Dungeons and Dragons game, a type of fictional category that is not actually used by a player of Dungeons and Dragons, but used to describe the fictional artifacts that are? What chances are there of ever establishing notability for fictional category that has no real-world application? --Gavin Collins (talk) 20:15, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete - there's a real lack of reliable secondary sources in order to demonstrate how much of the content is notable. I first considered a redirect, but haven't found a suitable redirect target myself. Ideally, I'd suggest a redirect to something like a Gameplay/Mechanics D&D article, or a wider Items RPG/gaming article. Gazimoff 09:51, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep: This is the result of a many-article merge of less-notable articles. The article certainly needs work, although it will never be improved if it is deleted. Were sources searched for before the nomination? WP:N states that "If appropriate sources cannot be found..." before explaining merging/deletion. Also, my interpretation of WP:GAMEGUIDE is that things such as attack bonuses and hit points should not be included, and righftully so. Now, some of the content in the article is gameguidy. However, enough of it isn't that we'd still have a decent article even if it was removed. -Drilnoth (talk) 13:34, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep: As per Drilnoth. The article needs improvement, but deletion doesn't seem to be an appropriate step at this point at all.Shemeska (talk) 13:54, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep I created this article in part, as a place to merge less notable articles into as Drilnoth states, but primarily to increase coverage on this important aspect of the D&D game. One of the main goals for players of the game is to have their characters accumulate treasure by defeating their enemies, and magical treasure is often paramount. Undoubtedly, this concept is likely to be featured in any secondary sources which discuss the game in depth. The D&D project has been a mess for a long time regarding sourcing, but I think we are finally coming around, and have just started to gather up information on reliable secondary sources that we may all make use of. I am confident that a search through those sources, or other ones not yet listed, will yield positive results for the concept of magic items in the Dungeons & Dragons game. If merge winds up being the preferred result, much of this content was moved from Magic of Dungeons & Dragons (which now focuses largely on magic spells rather than items) in the first place, so we could always move it back there. BOZ (talk) 15:33, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Comment Also, "crufty" is not a reason to delete, it is a reason for cleanup. And I would like to mention that the nominator did not alert me to this deletion discussion on my talk page. BOZ (talk) 15:36, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep - The article needs to be cleaned up, but there is nothing here that can't be saved with some edits. There are refs and I can find more. "Crufty" is not a reason to delete. This is not a game guide either. So with both reasons failing there is no reason to delete this article. Web Warlock (talk) 16:00, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Merge to Dungeons & Dragons game mechanics — I disagree with the above. Nearly the entire article is game guide material; however, it is still salvageable, so outright deletion may not be the best route here. Trim all that down and merge it into the game mechanics article. IMO it complements well with the material there. MuZemike (talk) 18:26, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Comment: I think that if the article was merged, Game Mechanics wouldn't be the right place. Additionally, WP:GAMEGUIDE says that "a Knowledge (XXG) article should not read like a how-to style manual of instructions, advice (legal, medical or otherwise) or suggestions, or contain how-tos." Although the article does contain some things which should probably be removed because they fail this, I think that the vast majority of the article just needs a bit of a rewrite. -Drilnoth (talk) 19:07, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
      • Comment - Magic items in D&D are both a setting element and a game mechanics element. I feel that it would be unprofessional to neglect the game mechanics aspects, and both unprofessional and silly to actively avoid using examples in the coverage of the game mechanics aspects when using examples would be clearer and more concise than the alternatives. If it does get merged, I feel that it would be more appropriate to divide the content between Magic of Dungeons & Dragons and Dungeons & Dragons game mechanics rather than merging everything into one of the two articles. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 19:34, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep or light merge per above. Hooper (talk) 19:09, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep - For the reasons outlined above by myself and others. -- Gordon Ecker (talk) 19:34, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep/merge The topic seems fairly generic and could be expanded to included RPGs in general or magic items of all sorts. Deletion is not appropriate as the article is already in better shape than the main article on Magic items. Colonel Warden (talk) 22:51, 24 December 2008
  • Keep and expand. This article suffers from a bad case of recentism--You'd think, from reading it, that 3, 3.5, and 4 were the influential editions of D&D. Jclemens (talk) 06:51, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete: no sources independent of the subject (only sources are published by the game's current/former publishers), so no evidence of notability. HrafnStalk 17:28, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Comment: Although the article does not currently have independent sources, I don't think that that means the topic is not notable... a topic is not notable once people have tried and failed to find independent sources. I think that the use of primary sources or unreliable sources is separate from notability, but correct me if I'm wrong. -Drilnoth (talk) 14:52, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Other than evidence of "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject", and similar objective criteria (which can only rely on coverage to hand, not speculation of what coverage might be out there), there's little but personal opinions (excluded as WP:ATA#Personal point of view) & subjective views (WP:LOCALFAME) -- neither of which is a good basis for collective decision making. HrafnStalk 15:12, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • WP:N states that quote "If appropriate sources cannot be found, consider merging the article's content into a broader article providing context. Otherwise, if deleting:..." My take on that is that an article's current sources should not be used on their own in discussions about notability, but other sources not yet added to the article should be considered before deleting/merging. I agree completely that the article needs better sources, but I believe that that is a question of WP:V and WP:RS, not WP:N.
  • Additionally, Knowledge (XXG)'s deletion policy says that reasons for deletion include: "Articles which cannot possibly be attributed to reliable sources," "Articles for which all attempts to find reliable sources to verify them have failed" and "Articles whose subject fails to meet the relevant notability guideline (WP:N, WP:BIO, WP:MUSIC, WP:CORP and so forth)" At this point, I do not believe that all attempts have been made to find reliable sources or that sources cannot possibly be found, nor do I believe that the subject is not notable... a subject fails to meet a notability guideline if sources to meet the guidelines have not been found after they are searched for, regardless of what is actually in the article at the time. -Drilnoth (talk) 19:04, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Airy assertions that 'there are sources out there somewhere ' are easy to make and impossible to disprove -- so are simply so much hot air. WP:NOTE requires that sources are reliable, independent and provide significant coverage -- issues that can only be evaluated for specific sources. Therefore specific sources are needed -- not airy assertions and WP:GOOGLEHITS. "To hand" does not necessarily mean 'already in the article', but it does mean that it can be specifically identified, so that it can be evaluated (and put into the article if it merits it). HrafnStalk 03:39, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was keep. John254 00:16, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Hjalmar Peterson (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Notability, I can't find anything on this guy (and the page title doesn't match the subject), but I am not sure, particularly due to the interwiki. More of a inquisitive AfD then anything else, wasn't sure enough to speedy. Prodego 05:51, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was no consensus. StarM 01:49, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Kate Morgan (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Goes against WP:1E in that the article subject is only associated with an alleged haunting and not notable for anything else under notability guidelines. KuyaBriBri 05:19, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Speedy Delete per A3 by It Is Me Here. (non-admin closure) MrKIA11 (talk) 15:40, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

The Moon Can Blow Me (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Potential hoax. I'm no expert on show tunes, but I'm highly skeptical. Also, no luck on initial 8 pages of g-hits on The Moon Can Blow Me by Astaire or Shatner. No hits at all on That Was No Lady, by either Gershwin. OliverTwisted (Stuff) 05:13, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

not to mention the shudder factor of William Shatner singing those lyrics... --OliverTwisted (Stuff) 08:00, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 17:37, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Mythkiwi (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

unsourced, non-notable website. dramatic (talk) 05:10, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Transwiki to Wikiquote. MBisanz 03:00, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Witness accounts of the Roswell UFO incident (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Primary source accounts and quotations of witnesses. Essentially, UFO-cruft. Certainly not encyclopedic. Consider trans-wiki to wikiquotes or wikisource but it certainly doesn't belong as an encyclopedia article. I mean, really. ScienceApologist (talk) 03:54, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Transwiki to Wikisource, if possible. Seems like too much detail to belong here. Ben Standeven (talk) 05:26, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of New Mexico-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 05:31, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Paranormal-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 05:31, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep-- The witness accounts of the Roswell incident are an intricate part of the whole UFO phenomenon. A search in Google Scholar and Google Books verifies the notability of the witness accounts. Maybe "UFO-cruft" but part of the American culture. Change to delete. --Jmundo (talk) 20:59, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep. No justification for the deletion stemming from any WP policy. Ungtss (talk) 08:12, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete or redirect This isn't an encyclopedia article. It's a repository of people making unanswered claims. An encyclopedia article would be "Roswell UFO incident" with a section on claims, or perhaps a citation saying "there are X many claims". Not this. This is just an assault of primary sources (in typical conspiracy theory fashion). Also, where are the lists of people who didn't see anything? I could be compelled to say keep if someone made a convincing argument that this article could and would be turned into a NPOV, concise and verifiable summary of the reports and discussion of their importance to the mythology as a whole. We don't need another page pretending the LGM are real. Protonk (talk) 09:11, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • transwiki although the Roswell status as the most well-known case in ufology makes these statements notable, this page doesn't really work as an encyclopedia article. WikiQuote would be more appropriate really. Oh my god I just agreed with Science Apologist... Totnesmartin (talk) 09:45, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Transwiki to Wikiquote. The Roswell UFO incident is arguably what set the whole UFO craze and associated conspiracy theories in motion. The witness accounts are an intricate part of that, but since they're entire first-hand not really suitable for Knowledge (XXG). Wikiquote (or second choice wikisource) are a better place (don't forget to link in the main article) - Mgm| 13:26, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete I was one of the main contributors to the page, and felt it was needed. But as time went on, I realized that this is no longer a useful page. That's because most if not all claims on this page are open to dispute. Even by pro-Roswell researchers. And while the numbers of witnesses found here may seem impressive, the number of first-hand witnesses is quite small. On the main Roswell page (which needs to be cut down, I agree), most of the broad themes mentioned here are spelled out. I'm not sure we really need to know a raft of intricate details about all these witnesses. And we certainly don't need a page which has something like 70 accounts. Many of which (such as the alien ones) are contradictory and can't be referring to the same incident. Canada Jack (talk) 18:04, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Transwiki & delete, this unencyclopedic quotefarm per WP:NOT. HrafnStalk 09:15, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Transwiki & delete KillerChihuahua 06:33, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Transwiki relevant content to WikiQuote. Per WP:NOT:
Knowledge (XXG) articles are not:
  1. Lists or repositories of loosely associated topics such as (but not limited to) quotations, aphorisms, or persons (real or fictional). If you want to enter lists of quotations, put them into our sister project Wikiquote. Of course, there is nothing wrong with having lists if their entries are famous because they are associated with or significantly contributed to the list topic, for example Nixon's Enemies List. Knowledge (XXG) also includes reference tables and tabular information for quick reference. Merged groups of small articles based on a core topic are certainly permitted. (See Lists (stand alone lists) - appropriate topics for clarification.)

--siℓℓy rabbit (talk) 15:22, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:51, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Melbourne's longest cake (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable fundraising event. A worthy cause no doubt, but Knowledge (XXG) is an encyclopedia not a promotional tool for charities Mattinbgn\ 03:34, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

It seems to be an annual event, therefore it seems obvious to me at least that publicising last years event is promoting next years, no? -- Mattinbgn\ 21:49, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was keep. — Aitias // discussion 21:32, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Pioneers of Prosperity (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

The article does not meet any of the Knowledge (XXG):Notability guidelines. Most of the references provided are from "Pioneers of Prosperity" or its affiliates. Was proposed for deletion by another user on early November for the same reasons, the template was removed without any subsequent improvement. I also suspect a WP:COI because the main (only) contributors for the page Special:Contributions/MNITMi, Special:Contributions/Mbrennan10 and Special:Contributions/Elizabeth.alton have all contributed exclusively to this article. Piccolo Modificatore Laborioso (talk) 06:59, 16 December 2008 (UTC)

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Foxy Loxy 23:44, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NuclearWarfare My work 03:14, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 04:38, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

Pokemon Quartz (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Contested prod. Hack with no assertion of notability. Delete.  Blanchardb -- timed 02:59, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:50, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Guacimal (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

I created this article, and even I believe that it should be deleted. It provides little to no context, and has barely been edited at all. Dylan620 Contribs 23:58, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

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Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, MBisanz 02:25, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment. There is still the small matter that this article is about Guacimal, and the sources are about Guasimal. Do we have any evidence that any of the information in this article applies to Guasimal? This looks more to me as if we should delete this and start an article on Guasimal from scratch. Phil Bridger (talk) 13:28, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
I agree fully. Delete Gua'''c'''imal and start new article on the Guasimal, in the Sancti Spíritus Province where Che Guevara setup camp, using Jmundo's source from the reliable source Escambray. I have modified my entry for delete to reflect this. Thanks! --Cerejota (talk) 13:33, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete and start new article on Guasimal, Sancti Spíritus Jmundo's source seems to be for a different place: Guasimal, in the Sancti Spíritus Province. The place identified as being affected by a hurricane in the article in question (and hence the article name) is a Guacimal in the Pinar del Río Province. The difference was already noted by others in this AfD, including the possibility of one Guasimal/Guacimal in the Camagüey Province. While it is not unusual for reliable sources to misspell name places, nor it is unusual for the same name for a place to happen in different areas of the same country (even with slightly different spellings), until we have more reliable sources for verification of which of the many Guasimal/Guacimal this article refers to am afraid we have to delete. We must not add to the confussion in the googletubes. However, if new sources emerge that clearly disambiguate the situation, and establish that a Guacimal in the Pinar del Río exists and was affected by a hurricane, then I am all for keep, as per WP:NGL. All I am saying is that we should pay more attention to spellings and other geo-identification before taking whatever the googletubes say at face value. Thanks! --Cerejota (talk) 13:30, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Comment I created Guasimal, Sancti Spíritus with Jmundo's source. Regardless of the result of this AfD, that's a new article. I used the province name in the title as there are obvious disambiguation issues with this town name as per MoS. Thanks! --Cerejota (talk) 13:37, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
COMMENTIt's really too bad no one's getting paid for all the research going into this!--Sallicio 21:03, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
LOL, we all wish! Seriously, this is what AfDs should be about... figuring it out! Thanks!--Cerejota (talk) 01:30, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 17:40, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

P2pr (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Knowledge (XXG):Avoid neologisms - The use of neologisms should be avoided in Knowledge (XXG) --smurdah (talk) 02:22, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Delete per WP:NEO. I couldn't find any reliable sources. Tavix (talk) 05:36, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • weak delete. The article describes an emerging approach related to viral marketing that may well become big and does not seem to be covered elsewhere. Not sure that this is the most common name for it. A quick search showed a couple of other uses for P2pr. If the authors improved the description and came up with a few unbiased references, and maybe changed to a more meaningful name (Social Web Marketing?) I would be inclined to change to keep. Aymatth2 (talk) 21:29, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Mr.Z-man 01:25, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

SLYT (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Neologism. Narutolovehinata5 06:51, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

Delete per nom. --Mr. Vernon (talk) 07:15, 19 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 17:43, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Spells in Power Rangers: Mystic Force (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

A list of fictional spells that consists entirely of plot details. Knowledge (XXG) is not an indiscriminate collection of information —Mythdon (talk • contribs) 01:06, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Yep, garbage. Delete. StonerDude420 (talk) 07:05, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Delete. Whatever the source for this is can be used as external link in the main article. If there is no source, it's original research. - Mgm| 13:16, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was Delete all. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:36, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

April Fools Day 2006 (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Article is an unencyclopedic list of assorted jokes made by the media on April Fools' Day in 2006. Knowledge (XXG) is WP:NOT an indiscriminate list of what Homestar runner and various news networks did for April 1. Reywas92 00:58, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

I am also nominating the following related pages:

April Fools Day 2007 (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
April Fools Day 2008 (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)
April Fools Day 2008 in the web (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) Reywas92 02:19, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment A unified approach to April Fools' lists / group nomination might be in order:

MickMacNee (talk) 01:55, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Just to clarify, the reason for my deletion vote, as stated, is that I believe the article is not notable. The precedent that it sets, of creating indiscriminate lists of information that will most likely never be searched for, was an afterthought... but probably should not have been posted. I'm sorry if I gave you the impression that this was an attack. I certainly didn't intend it that way. --OliverTwisted (Stuff) 23:58, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was speedy delete. copyvio Fabrictramp | talk to me 01:34, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Jaywant Guitar (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Original research, and possible spam. The only editor is Jaywantguitar (talk · contribs). Delete.  Blanchardb -- timed 00:35, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was keep. — Aitias // discussion 21:33, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Norm Hitzges (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Delete nn local radio sports personality; so nn, we don't even know when or where he was born or what he's done other than his current gig. Carlossuarez46 (talk) 20:07, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was delete. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 02:10, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

List of opera accompanists (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Was CSD'd three times. I was hesitant to delete it again as the community hasn't weighed in on this yet. So go forth, community, and weigh in. Master of Puppets Call me MoP! :D 00:16, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was delete. Closing per obvious consensus. — Aitias // discussion 02:14, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Thankstaking (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Only one reference, probably not notable. --smurdah (talk) 00:11, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:34, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Charles B. "Chuck" Greene (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Delete. This article was deleted in 2006 under the name 'Chuck Greene' due to lack of notability. Nothing seems to have changed on this issue. The username of the creator indicates possible vanity entry. I PRODded it, but this was removed by the creator without giving a reason. Boleyn2 (talk) 06:50, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Comment. Please note this is a different AFD discussion and not part of the discussion regarding Bill Scott (author). As of my timestamp some formatting appears to be missing which is causing this AFD to appear as part of the Scott AFD. (If it's been fixed, please disregard this). 23skidoo (talk) 14:51, 19 December 2008 (UTC) Fixed. --Metropolitan90 (talk) 15:00, 19 December 2008 (UTC)
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Actually, I meant to type "better sourced". Something a little more substantial than just a results listing. --Fabrictramp | talk to me 01:45, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Comment If anyone can improve this article so it meets the requirements, please go ahead. It failed WP:BIO last time, but I don't know how well-written it was last time. I am concerned about the possible conflict of interests from the creator but my main objection is the lack of proof of notability. If anyone has heard of this person and thinks they are truly noteable, then please improve this article. Boleyn2 (talk) 09:12, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was Keep. Withdrawn by nominator. Malinaccier (talk) 03:23, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Nana Upstairs & Nana Downstairs (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Consists of a plot summary only, contains no information on the notability of the book. --smurdah (talk) 00:08, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was no consensus. and I don't think re-listing again will bring closer to one. StarM 01:50, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Interoperable PDK Libraries (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable. i think this can be speedied, but there could be problems, so AFD. It seems to be promoting some sort of technology. Narutolovehinata5 06:37, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 04:23, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

Moksha Yoga (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

No indication of notability at this day and time. Magog the Ogre (talk) 11:12, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was no consensus. –Juliancolton 02:22, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Game Design Brief (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This is completely original research. The "literature" section does not suppport the article as third-party sources, other than perhaps as citations for an essay. Again, this would fall under original research. I can't imagine this could be rewritten to comply with Knowledge (XXG) guidelines, as whatever could be saved is already covered in Game design freshacconci talktalk 12:10, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

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  • WP:OR Delete StonerDude420 (talk) 07:13, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
    • How is it original research? Knowledge (XXG) doesn't require footnote or in text citations for all articles (And only recently required them for FAs). there are a half dozen sources cited that verify the claims made in the article. It isn't original research. Protonk (talk) 09:13, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Comment Well, WP:OR is pretty clear on this, especially in the first paragraph on what original research is. And as for sources, WP:V is again pretty clear on sources. Both of these are WIkipedia policy. The sources provided only provide support as an original essay, not verification for a teriary source of information, such as Knowledge (XXG). freshacconci talktalk 12:13, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
      • I'm sorry, I don't understand what you are saying. I am telling you that the sources listed in that article verify the material in the article. This is explicitly allowed. This article isn't OR just because it is poorly written or poorly formatted. Protonk (talk) 19:30, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
        • Those references listed specifically refer to the concept of "Game Design Brief"? If not, then this article is an essay, and therefore original research. If the references listed do specifically mention this concept, and no online versions are available, then the article would need to be extensively rewritten with excerpts from those texts. At this point the references merely support this as an essay. And if this is something that's already covered in Game design, I fail to see the point for a seperate article at this point. freshacconci talktalk 22:28, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
          • Abstract from the title. Pretend that the title doesn't exist. Read the content and then read the references. The references support the claims made in the article, namely the interplay between conceptual and instrumental design, the explanation of the scope of "game design" and the discussion of "state space" in the last section (and others). Like I said in my original keep 'vote', we could move this content to Game design and the game design article would be improved. This is verifiable, sourced content and we should be editing to improve it rather than deleting it. Protonk (talk) 23:06, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment Apparently Software design document is what this article means to talk about. If it gets merged, it should be merged there, as a smerge would be an unambiguous improvement. Protonk (talk) 08:04, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • My impression is that the article means to be titled "Game Design Brief" quite literally, describing the document that outlines a game's design from the outset. In this case Software design document would be a possible broad parent, as would game design. Protonk (talk) 19:02, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was Keep. I realize that this close is not consistent with some similar AFD's that have been closed (some by me?) in the past week or so. Please do not badger me about that. This closing only takes into account the contributions to this discussion, and not some ultimate goal of being globally consistent. Perhaps discuss the issue with the participants on their talk pages if you want to understand any reason for the difference in the outcome. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:25, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Tara Street, Dublin (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)
  • Delete Non-notable street Balloholic (talk) 15:25, 19 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep - I would think any major street in the center of Dublin would be notable and is bound to have many sources (probably from books) describing its history. Even one of Dublin's major train stations is named after it, Tara Street railway station. --Oakshade (talk) 19:31, 19 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete There is no inherent notability for streets. A street can, potentially, demonstrate enough notability to merit its own separate page, but the fame of a city isn't inherited by its individual thoroughfares. Until some significant content can be added, maybe this and the other articles can be merged into someting called "Streets of Dublin". Mandsford (talk) 20:12, 19 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep. Stations tend to be named after the most important roads in a city. With a notable newspaper located there, the article presents more than just map information and a major road in a big city is bound to have paper sources. Deletion would not help that process. (WP:DEADLINE) Send this to the Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Ireland or Knowledge (XXG):WikiProject Roads (or move to project space) for improvement and renominate in a month if no improvement occurred. - Mgm| 00:06, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Comment. As above station not on this street at all. A quick check will show that. Newspaper claims to have moved here two years ago and before that was elsewhere.If this newspaper changed address every few years would we give all fifty addresses their own article? Surely a list would be better. OR better still just include the most historic streets like where it was during the easter rising or civil war. What has happened on this street this past few years to make it notable more than all its othere addresses in its 150+ year existence?
Comment - Do they? I don't think so. Just because John Street Florists is located in Tralee doesn't mean the street is notable. As for the newspaper, no, this does not make a street notable. The paper may be notable, the railway station may be but it certainly does not make the street notable. --Balloholic (talk) 13:44, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
  • :/ I really don't think Subway outlets are more notable than florists. It doesn't matter how many flowers or sandwiches that are sold, such things rarely make a street notable. You can buy a sandwich in John's Megastore down the road or Hammyland across the street. These aren't notable. --Balloholic (talk) 15:29, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
By subway, he's referring to the railway station nearby, not the sandwich chain. It also has the headquarters of a major newspaper there - I think Talbot Street is where Independent Newspapers has theirs. Autarch (talk) 15:38, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Dublin has a subway??? When was the last time you people were in Dublin? Those subway signs are for the sandwich chain not an underground train system! I smell fiction makers. --Balloholic (talk) 17:37, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Presumably I'm talking about subway and railway stations refers to the DART. Please do not make comments like I smell fiction makers as it can create ill feeling. Autarch (talk) 20:37, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
The DART is a relic. Surely we cannot have every single small stop on wikipedia? Never mind a street that happens to have a stop. By that theory every single street that has a rail or bus station in every little nook and cranny in Ireland should have an article. Even if there is nothing else to say. Again this is not a travel guide. I remind everyone that this is an encyclopedia and appeal to the COMMONSENSE of those non-Dubliners and possibly even non-Irish who aren't protecting their own personal creations. --Balloholic (talk) 22:18, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

See the following -WP:50k. --Balloholic (talk) 01:14, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

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  • Keep - stubbish, to be sure, but the article seems to be about a notable street. Lots of source material is available. WilyD 17:22, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep, google books reveal source material including a major part in the Irish Rebellion, a noteworthy firestation, and a noteworthy bathhouse. Pulsaro (talk) 17:28, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
    • A noteworthy firestation?????!!!!!! How on earth can a firestation be noteworthy? A bathhouse? Surely one mention in a book does not make such a thing notable! I could write a book tomorrow about John's Megastore. Would that be notable then? --Balloholic (talk) 17:35, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
      • If you don't know how a firestation can be noteworthy maybe this is the wrong place for you. Pulsaro (talk) 18:11, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
      • Depends on who published it. If Cambridge University Press did, then yes. If John's Vanity Publishing House and Pizzaria did, then no. I don't have a complete list. WilyD 17:36, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
        • I see. So if Cambridge University Press (which very conveniently and coincidentally has its own article) mentions Tara Street in some sort of case study about an non-notable pregnant teenager in 1742 it automatically gets its own article."Tara Street is a Dublin street where the 15 year old human Beyoncé Aguilera became pregnant in 1742." Oh please spare me the crap. --Balloholic (talk) 18:12, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
          • Of course, if you didn't insist on misrepresenting the reality of the situation, your explanation might make more sense. WilyD 18:16, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
            • The reality of the situation is that all of you want to keep something very obviously not notable because it was once mentioned in a Cambridge book. The book might have been published by a university in a different country but the writer may have irish interests or may have lived in Tara Street while she was a young child. The prestige of the brand doesnt make it notable. Thank you. --Balloholic (talk) 18:22, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
              • This is not true at all. There are a huge stack of books here, from many different publishers. I picked one at random as an example of notable publisher, it's not sacrosanct. The street is transparently notable in our jargon. It would behoove you to acquaint yourself with the facts before commenting on the situation. The link I gave listed 627 books which discuss Tara Street to some extent or another. Some are trivial mentions, some are not. But there are still dozens or hundreds of nontrivial discussions of it. WilyD 20:05, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
        • According to this webpage on the Dublin Fire Brigade website, the station in question was headquarters of said fire brigade from 1907. Also, this street was where artillery that bombarded Liberty Hall during the Easter Rising fired from. Autarch (talk) 20:28, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • The link doesn't work I'm afraid and I think people need to realise that that part of the easter rising (which was a massive event) is insignificant. Every street in Dublin was affected by and streets in other towns. They would not get articles so why should this? --Balloholic (talk) 01:09, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
Link should work now. Autarch (talk) 18:26, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
  • DeleteOh please... Not every street is notable just because someone, somewhere once mentioned it in a publication. Trusilver 17:45, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Speedy Keep More pointy disruption without the slightest effort per WP:BEFORE - there isn't even a discussion page for this topic yet. A simple search of Google Scholar shows that there are numerous sources for this topic. Colonel Warden (talk) 23:11, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Please delete. This page was created by a user who has a habit of creating Dublin streets and then doing his best to ensure every one of them, even ones that happen to connect two more notable ones and have no other purpose. Again we are not a source for tourists to plan their treks to the Dáil or Guinness brewery. --Balloholic (talk) 23:24, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep Looking at this article on the merits, it does seem that many streets in a major historic capital city which has been a focus for literature for centuries will be significant. It is not the width of the pavement that makes a street notable (usually), but the things that happen there, the places there, and the amount that ha been written about it. I'm glad someone is writing the articles, and I wish the same were done form any similarly important cities. The main thing this article needs is further expansion. DGG (talk) 06:20, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
As for railroad stations and the like, there are two possibilities: usually a station is located in a place of considerable notability and named accordingly, or sometimes a notable neighborhood grows up or a street becomes important primarily because a station happens to have been built there with commerce and local transportation developing around it. Either way, the name of the station is usually a good indication about the street. DGG (talk) 06:37, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
The following makes no sense to me (and it's about one third of the entire article): "The station gives its' name to Tara Street railway station, though the station is on Georges Quay, near the northern end of Tara Street." This particular station mentioned three times in that sentence is never mentioned before and never mentioned again. The keep side of this debate seems tohinge on this and I have to say it is a very dubious statement. According to itself this mystery station which gives its name to another station isn't even located on this street! Neither is the station it gives its name to. We have two stations that don't even have any relevance to the subject being used as an argument for keeps. --Balloholic (talk) 15:58, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Keep - Snappy (talk) 07:37, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

  • And if that is not a vote I'll eat my hat. I really don't need to say anymore. I actually mistook it as "Keep per Snappy" and was looking about searching for this Snappy before I realised. Definite crossing out here. --Balloholic (talk) 18:42, 27 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep per DGG. John254 00:29, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
    • Dgg's point relates to the station which is one of two stations which aren't even on this street and cannot be verified to be named after it. Tara is a fairly popular name by my estimation, eg. Tara Television, Hill of Tara and there is another Tara Hill in Wexford to give some examples which just spring to mind because I know lots of Taras. Why would the station automatically be named after the street? Thanks. --Balloholic (talk) 01:41, 28 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was redirect to Llanon with no prejudice to restoring if new sources are found or there is a strong consensus to do so (non-admin closure) Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:20, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Plas morfa (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable location. If the hotel itself passes notability requirements then that should have an article, but notability is not inherited; the rest of of the place is, well, a beach. Ironholds (talk) 17:23, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

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  • Note: This debate has been included in the list of Wales-related deletion discussions. -- • Gene93k (talk) 05:41, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Strong keep. Clearly the nominator is not taking into account factors such as the fishing pools mentioned which can be expanded and have historical significance. No need to focus on one hotel. --Balloholic (talk) 16:33, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Merge to Llanon. The beach, currently part of the village, can easily be included there, including the information on said ancient fishing pools. Although I did not find any sources about these fishing pools. Merger should consider that. Sleaves talk 13:49, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Weak keep I think many beaches will be notable on their own--they are essentially parks, and all state parks at least are considered notable --there being inevitably sufficient documentation. But I am not quite sure this beach is prominent enough for that. I am surprised that anyone should have written an article of this sort without giving sources, especially since at least part of the article is clearly asked on them. I added what English sources I could find quickly on google (there are also some in Welsh, but I was forced to ignore them) . The BBC source has information of the pools. DGG (talk) 22:46, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
Comment Oh yes beaches can be notable on their own (at least I hope so, I wrote an article about one!), but as with anything else, there has to be enough citable material to make it worth having an article. nature reserve beaches, major tourist and historic beaches are all notable. The thing is, is this beach worth an article, or can it be combined with Llanon? The BBC page you mention is about Llanon, which seems to undermine the case for notability (nice find though). Totnesmartin (talk) 23:30, 26 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was keep. John254 00:14, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Baby Ranks (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable artist, per WP:MUSIC. This page has been deleted at least twice, along with the article for his only album. Please add salt. SummerPhD (talk) 18:02, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

Yeah it's relevant. Primera Hora is roughly like the New York Post for Puerto Rico, not the newspaper of record, but a top seller and clearly reliable. Thanks!--Cerejota (talk) 06:01, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
  • The album, for which he gets co-billing with Luny Tunes, Mas Flow 2, was reviewed in The New York Times, was one of the top charting Latin albums of the year, and a single from it won him a Billboard Latin Music Award. I suspect those things were not noted on the previous version of the article, but I've now reliably sourced them. All of the sources I added confirm that Baby Ranks has co-billing. It's a keep. Paul Erik 22:26, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 04:25, 26 December 2008 (UTC)

Inactive decision making (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Just as with Responsible decision making, which I just nominated for deletion, I believe this is not a notable term in any academic field; though this one additionally also looks like a neologism. Korny O'Near (talk) 21:24, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

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The result was delete. — Aitias // discussion 02:12, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

Responsible decision making (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This doesn't seem to be a notable term in any field. Korny O'Near (talk) 21:17, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

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But why have multiple articles when you can have just one? This is original research at its worse. Thanks! --Cerejota (talk) 01:32, 25 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was Delete. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:20, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Reactive decision making (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

This is the third in a trifecta of articles, which also includes responsible decision making and inactive decision making, all created by the same user, which I think are pointless and non-notable terms. Korny O'Near (talk) 21:33, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Fortunately, Knowledge (XXG) is not an encyclopaedia of things that individual editors subjectively consider to be pointless and non-notable, and Knowledge (XXG)'s concept of notability is not subjective. You are not making an argument for notability here, and your rationale is a poor one.

    And even if you were applying Knowledge (XXG)'s criteria for notability, your opinion would be ill-founded, given that their are plenty of sources on business management that discuss types of decision making such as this, and the reasons that one is used over the other. One such is ISBN 9780787976361 (an entire book on the subject of decision making) which discusses reactive decision making and the problems that it engenders for a business, in detail on pages 16–17 in a section entitled "Reacting Versus Responding". Another such is ISBN 9780803955110 which has a section explicitly entitled "reactive decision making" on pages 355–356. A third is ISBN 9780805847154, which has a section entitled "Proactive and Reactive Decisions" on pages 5–6. There are even papers dealing with these and related subjects on-line on the World Wide Web, such as this one.

    By policy, we are supposed to look for sources ourselves before nominating articles for deletion on grounds of notability or verifiability. Had you done so here, you would have turned up the above and many others. Your nomination was an exceedingly poor one.

    I've restored Proactive decision making, previously deleted via Proposed Deletion, on the grounds that it actually covers the obverse of this coin, and contains useful content that can be built upon. Both of these subjects, the one being the obverse of the other, satisfy the Primary Notability Criterion. They might be better dealt with together (as on-line and off-line are), but that doesn't require deletion in any way. (Even if Knowledge (XXG)'s treatment of the subjects is merged, these original titles are sensible redirect titles.) Keep. Uncle G (talk) 23:16, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Keep per Uncle G. John254 07:06, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete no substantial content. The articles don't attempt to be more than a paragraph appropriate to a very elementary textbook, making superficial unsourced value judgments and not giving sources. I don't see them as plausible bases for an article. DGG (talk) 13:45, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
    • So you don't see Knowledge (XXG) discussing proactive and reactive decision making despite the existence of sources explicitly discussing those very things, some of which are cited above? Uncle G (talk) 15:26, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Delete all three, and leave Proactive decision making deleted too. No one disputes the fact that such decision making modes exist and are discussed in the literature, but having an article dedicated to the phrase "Responsible decision making" makes as much sense as having one for the term "Driving with your eyes open". Uncle G: If you want to add a section in Decision making to discuss these terms, it may make more sense. It currently has a poorly-written section called "Styles and methods of decision making" which definitely needs some serious editing. Owen× ☎ 17:58, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
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  • Delete all three Non-encyclopedic. OwenX says it best, we don't need articles for every possible phrase, even if the phrase is used frequently. This does not fit any criteria for inclusion under Knowledge (XXG)'s guidelines. Anything here that may need to be kept should be moved to Decision making, but I don't see anything other than essay content, or explanation of an essay really, in any of the three articles. Clear delete of all three, and I am copying this to each one. I would also remind Uncle G to assume good faith when dealing with other editors. Theseeker4 (talk) 01:13, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
Comment - I also find OwenX's argument persuasive: even if the content would prove to be notable, they would be better in Decision making as a subsection, or even unified in a sourced Decision making concepts if Decision making becomes to large (as per WP:SUMMARY). Uncle G is being WP:OWNy and not seeing that while this content might have value, it doesn't have value as single articles, and that the community already has had successful experiences, such as WP:SUMMARY, to deal with related concepts with an article. Thanks!--Cerejota (talk) 05:22, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was Redirect to EPM. Jerry delusional ¤ kangaroo 00:05, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Epm (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Non-notable file format, created this December. Delete. (Contested WP:PROD.) - Mike Rosoft (talk) 21:53, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

Does not appear to be notable given that it was created this month. Redirect to EPM. --Itub (talk) 16:33, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was redirect to Centralia,_Pennsylvania#Mine_fire. where the content is already discussed. Content under the re-direct if someone wants to add more. If he's "soley responsible" for why Centralia is notable, then it's all the more reason for him to be merged -- since census designated places will be kept. It's a case of BLP1E that doesn't require being kept to discuss a merge elsewhere when there's consensus here (with the first keep becoming a merge) to merge it. StarM 01:57, 29 December 2008 (UTC)

Todd Domboski (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

Person is notable for only one event and per WP:1E this is insufficient to warrant an entire article. Nouse4aname (talk) 23:24, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Keep This person is solely responsible for why Centralia, PA is notable. He is not responsible for only one event (falling into sinkhole), as WP:1E states, but was the springboard and catalyst for everything surrounding Centralia and the media attention given to such. If the references in his article are read, it clearly identifies Domboski for his initial incident and subsequent media attention garnered after the prior attention. Mrmcdonnell (talk) 22:30, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
    • That makes no sense. This person is only referred to in the context of falling into a hole in Centralia. This is one event, and can be covered in the main Centralia article. Nouse4aname (talk) 12:17, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
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The result was delete. Malcolmxl5 (talk) 00:49, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

Frarority (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View AfD)

An unnotable WP:NEOLOGISM. It "has not established widespread use in established media to describe coeducational fraternal and cooperative living groups and organizations" Tavix (talk) 23:57, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

  • Delete as a non-notable WP:NEO due to lack of significant worldwide usage as a term as well as zero gNews hits. The 1st hit also comes up as an UrbanDictionary entry, which is never a good sign. MuZemike (talk) 00:22, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
  • Keep or Merge I added the one source. There seemed to be other evidence of its usage. I think a merge somewhere would be reasonable, but a deletion would be unfortunate. It's not just a word, but also part of cultural change. Fraternities are historic institutions that have been very controversial. How to, and whether to, integrate social instutions will continue to be an issue. This term reflects that and there's some substance and sourcing to be had to reflect that. Again, it's not STRONG, but I think it's worth including at least as part of a merger to Fraternity or somewhere else. It's possible that someone would look up this term and want to know what it's about. That's what an encyclopedia is all about. ChildofMidnight (talk) 01:44, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
Indeed a web search and a google news search indicates the term is fairly well established and has a significant cultural and historical meaning that goes beyond a dicdef. ChildofMidnight (talk) 01:49, 20 December 2008 (UTC)
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